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Yes. It's so easy to observe that it wasn't seen coming. It causes me to think that there is more behind everyone here on SC that I interact with than I can ever truly know. I need to think about that truth.

Why just the last couple of pages? There's 51 pages of death and injury. Those are/were people who had families and friends. I understand that it 'hits home' harder when it's someone you actually know (I never met Billy in person, but you know what I mean).

Things were obviously not right in his head. It's fucking tragic and sad for everyone involved, including Billy

Who could understand doing such a thing? I think the mental illness trope is a crutch we use to steady ourselves not to explain away horrendous actions committed by others. We need to believe such things cannot be hiding away in ourselves; that we all might be ticking time bombs or capable of being somehow triggered into committing the unimaginable worst humans can do to each other.

Being as careful as possible then, it’s a sad indictment of American gun culture and gun messaging that a person who was fully aware of their own tendencies towards depression, bipolar and stress, their bad financial situation, suicidal thoughts etc…. Still genuinely thought the safest thing to do was bring multiple loaded weapons into the house he shared with his family. And there’s an enormous lobbying and media industry pushing that message onto more people every day.

True skydiver takeaway….try to take a lesson from the tragedy, and a damn good lesson we could all do to relearn on occasion

I blame him 100% for the deaths of his family. And if you read the news story it makes it clear that he did as well and that he decided to end his life rather than face the consequences. There is nothing we know of that indicates any mental illness. Men kill for many reasons and domestic violence is common and often hidden. We will never know what was happening within that family. The witnesses were all murdered.

I have obtained unknown "Cooper" images that came from a witness and it is huge...

Blue skies. For a guy that murdered his family?????

It's why the right loves the poorly educated. They are easier to sway.

So the deadly combination of a deteriorated mental condition and guns has struck SC and DZ. Everything that Billy worked and dreamed of in 1/2 a century is now gone. Without doubt he faced challenges in his life and thought he could control the darker thoughts in his mind. But in the end he could not. In the space of a minute or two he faced a monster from within. The result was his whole beautiful family was destroyed. When he finally called out for help it was too late. He realized what he and he alone had done to his family. That agonizing realization was too much for his mind to deal with. In the absence of a gun perhaps some sort of physical altercation would have resulted. Perhaps a verbal showdown that ended in divorce. Nobody knows of such possibilities. Very sad.

You're right, it's not technically any more or less of a tragedy than any of the others - I never bother clicking the links so didn't even realise it was Billy until more people had commented and added context. I guess it's just more the emotional whiplash of logging in here each day, seeing someone make the calm argument that a big part of their reasoning for having firearms (relatively recently) at home was for protection, then not even a week later using them against the people they were supposed to protect. It's just so, so, SO dumb.

The stupid is strong in that one.

I would say that the fact that people knew him does not mean that he deserves anything at all from us. But I also believe that WE deserve better than having him turn into a go-to argument.

Federal Appeals Court Says Insurrectionists Can Still Be Barred From Holding Office A Federal Appeals Court has responded to a North Carolina case in which Representative Madison Cawthorn’s candidacy was challenged for his support of the attempted insurrection on January 6th, saying that a lower court was wrong to rule that the insurrection clause of the 14th Amendment no longer applies. Damned right!

Isnt the Half A an advanced onesie? I thought the wahoo was the beginner one piece. Intrudair is also something that I am considering. As for the mutation, it is also slightly more advanced than say, the sausage which I was also considering but the high lead times mean I wont get it time for a planned year end BASE trip.

"the mental disorder defense, is an affirmative defense by excuse in a criminal case, arguing that the defendant is not responsible for their actions due to an episodic or persistent psychiatric disease at the time of the criminal act. This is contrasted with an excuse of provocation, in which the defendant is responsible, but the responsibility is lessened due to a temporary mental state.[1]: 6" I personally would have a very difficult time convicting a mother of a crime who killed her children due to Postpartum psychosis/depression. In the absence of other information/evidence I would not blame Billy whatsoever. Suicide by gun is not uncommon. Without going further in the direction of killing your parents, siblings, family, discussions. IMO the presence of a deadly weapon which requires little action to initiate. Is the gas in the equation. Discussion of mental health is for many a taboo subject. Especially for men. The macho male who can handle any discomfort, any challenge, is the very identity of many men. It defines them as a man.

On the other hand Ts and Ps are the traditional and completely useless response which also benefits no one. We don't actually know and probably can never know the motivation for these crimes so we speak of "mental illness". What does that even mean?

Please tread very carefully on this topic. There is nothing wrong with the OP in this thread, but just as actual participants on dz.com cannot be attacked, let’s not get too sanctimonious about this event. It’s sad, shocking, and personal to lots of people here. I never met BV in person, but yeah, he worked hard for his life. Wendy P.

Everything you need to know about GOP responsibility and policy about abortion. Discussion over.

Oh, thank you for clarifying that. When it comes to protecting abusers, the largest American Protestant denomination is in the same vile category as the Catholic Church But abortion - rather like "but her emails".

Thank you Squeak saying that and thank you DFWAJG for starting this thread. That thing that did that was not the Billy we used to know. Let this be a place to celebrate whom he was previously, not what he became and did at the end. Blue Skies… asstrumpet. ☹️

Since the Democratic party doesn't have "resist change" as one of its central tenets, it's not surprising that most of the changes come from that direction. Wendy P.

God made young girls attractive to preachers for a reason. It’s not always their fault that they make mistakes sometimes. The church must be protected, ask any bishop.

I don't disagree that USPA is going to keep this person from being a TI pretty much no matter what. But USPA doesn't have 'absolute authority' over the rating. The board, through the Compliance Group, has procedures and rules that they have to follow. You know, that 'due process' thing. They can't just arbitrarily pull someone's license because they want to. The fact that they took the step of pretending the medical was not valid to use as an excuse to pull the license tells me that they know this too. The fact that they are apparently making shit up and doing whatever they feel like bothers me a lot.

I've had 3 Michigan suits over a few decades. My second one is almost 20 years old and is still in good shape. Plus Mike is a standup guy and been in the sport for decades.

I love it! "Yes, your son was shot during combat, but he didn't die of being shot. He was alive for several minutes afterwards, and died to an unrelated malady. The doctors are calling it exsanguination, which is different. Why should we be on the hook for some sort of disease that his carelessness caused?"

Merlin suits that are made in Deland.. https://www.merlinsuits.com/ By Ulla....

Symbiosis Suits Love them and getting even better!

Naw, then we'd just have to outlaw spray paint, and righteous gun totin' women would knit covers for the guns

Congratulations. You qualify for an AR-15.

I spoke with my friend again, and apparantly no direct email communication was made. He was instead just referring to stuff he read from past posts. I am dreadfully sorry for having misstated the facts before double checking. I realize my comments were inappropriate for this forum and appologize for bringing such personal issues to a nonrelavant thread. I was simply reacting to the heat of the moment. Tinkerbelle Rehab is for quitters.

D3331, and all of my DeLand gang, good luck on your jumps! Nice to have escaped the hurricane back home for the golden rollin hills of California! I love the pops crowd! I have a couple years yet before I join the ranks of the "Rockers". I will be prayin' for you guys and sending you good vibes! Tink Rehab is for quitters.

If I am wrong about this I will definitely appologize publically, but you spoke with a friend of mine Scott Flatman, a nonjumper from oregon. Perhaps this had better be taken to PM. I do not wish to air dirty laundry. Rehab is for quitters.

Hey bitch, whoever you are! Where do you get off emailing bad stuff about me and trying to discredit me to a friend of mine who you don't even know and who was just trying to find me after 20 years?! That was mean, uncalled for, cruel, hurtful, wicked evil, and just downright wrong! Who the hell do you think you are and What in hell were you trying to accomplish?! Yes I am writing this publically so everyone who reads this can know what a sadistic, mean spirited, evil, manipulative, two faced back stabber you are! And you don't even know me nor anything about me! Rehab is for quitters.