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(edited)

Conference call scheduled today with AB of Seattle staff on the upcoming Cooper movie. I will make a post about it later, and tell you what I can...or at least what I am allowed to say under the confidentiality agreement. Will update around 8-9PM Seattle time. 

UPDATE: Hmm...nothing much I can actually tell you. Script has side notes added and is being edited. Final version will take about 90 days to complete. But it's easier to work with an existing script than have no script at all. A studio head is waiting, wants to see it. That's all I can say. My apologies for even saying I would provide an update. 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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On 2/5/2020 at 12:23 PM, RobertMBlevins said:

...or at least what I am allowed to say under the confidentiality agreement.

You keep mentioning the confidentiality agreement, and say that it will be lifted once the movie starts production. I would think that they would want that in place until the movie is released.  ??

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5 hours ago, dudeman17 said:

You keep mentioning the confidentiality agreement, and say that it will be lifted once the movie starts production. I would think that they would want that in place until the movie is released.  ??

There are certain things I CAN discuss, and others I cannot. The main no-no's are revealing the names of the two studios involved in the picture, the exact nature of the script, and names of the production staff or cast members. 

8 hours ago, CooperNWO305 said:

Robert: When do you think the movie will be coming out?  When is that HBO doc coming out, July?

I have no idea on the idea on the Minnow Films movie, but I will guess early 2021. The HBO thing? I dunno. I was told spring was likely on that. Ten hours of footage...movie is 84 minutes long I'm told. Seeing the director's other work, it is hard to say how the movie will turn out. His previous movies include My Scientology Movie and the movie about the fight between Muhammad Ali and Joe Frazier in Manila. 

MinnowAnnoucement.jpg.ff91c631444f61f663ec77b7ac61c21b.jpg

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(edited)

Oops...I must have been tired when I put up that post...the part about the two films upcoming. Let me correct myself:

The HBO doc is Minnow Films, the one directed by John Dower. On THAT one, the exec producer said it should appear on HBO this spring...NOT 2021. Then it goes to the BBC, and probably will end up on BBC America as well. 

The film about KC..there IS a script and just today I converted it and moved it into Celtx (a screenwriting program) since it was sent to me in a PDF format. I am working on it now, and then other people will be making notes and changes as well. But they wanted me to adjust it here and there and I start on that this weekend. 

At some point over the next six to eight weeks....a final version will be created. There is a major studio, and a smaller studio involved in all this, and it will be the major studio putting up most of the budget. The head of this studio is a big Cooper fan. I can tell you that much, and he has requested to see the final version as soon as it is ready. If he likes it, the studio will green light the picture and a budget will be assigned to it. 

After that, they do the Hollywood stuff. Pre-production, final casting, then shooting. Because the people involved in all this, including some of the cast, are fairly major players in Hollywood, I see no problem in the movie being green lighted for production. The head of the major studio we are working with WANTS to do the Cooper movie. Not only is he from the Northwest, but like I said, he's a big Cooper fan. I would guess shooting will begin this summer, or toward the fall, and the picture will be released in 2021 to coincide with the 50th anniversary of the hijacking. 

Side Note:  I hate to harp on a previous subject, but Bruce Smith could have, and SHOULD have been involved in all this. But he's too busy with his Ramtha School of Enlightenment studies right now. I have seen his recent posts at the Cooper Forum and they are ridiculous. The founder of that organization in Yelm, WA is one of the biggest scammers on Planet Earth.

A reporter? Bruce? In my opinion it's a poor joke at best. How he could fall for such an obvious money-making scam is beyond my understanding. 

People in Cooperland believe he's the greatest thing to happen in the Cooper case since Swiss cheese and sliced bread. The REALITY is that he has alienated some of the most important witnesses in the case with his One Stop Shopping interview technique where he simply angers witnesses so badly that they will talk to neither HIM...or ANYONE ELSE...ever again. 

(Readers ask...okay, Robert. Name THREE.) Fine, I will. The Dormuth family in Shelton, WA. Lee Dormuth is a retired FBI agent married to Tina Mucklow's sister. I had the Dormuth family *this* close to talking to Tina about looking at pictures of Kenny Christiansen, and then Bruce slams them SO badly in his Mountain News article that they refused to speak to anyone again about the case. 

I can't think of the other two by name off hand, but you can find them wherever Bruce published a nasty article about them on his news blog. Almost everyone he's ever interviewed ended up saying they wouldn't speak to anyone again. That's why I call him Mister One Stop Shopping interviewer. If he doesn't get what he wants from people, and RIGHT NOW, the FIRST INTERVIEW OR NOTHING, he slams the shit out of them on the internet knowing that these same people know where to go to see what he wrote about them. He even does this on cold-call interviews, which is pretty foolish because almost no one is going to trust you and tell you everything they know on a first cold call. You have to build a rapport with them and get a SECOND or even a third interview to get to the heart of the matter. I never could get Bruce to understand or accept this concept. He wants it all and right now or god help you. 

In reality, he's caused a lot more damage than anything positive he's done in the case. On top of that, he allows any anonymous folks to post up trash about other people right on his own website. 

EDIT: I will give Bruce one thing positive. His BOOK. Except for the parts where goes off into La La Land with Ramtha-supported 'remote viewing' and the like, he does cover some aspects of the Cooper case pretty well. He also has a slough of reviews at Amazon done by people who actually know him personally. This is generally a no-no these days at Amazon, but whatever...I guess if you can't get the legit reviews you want, you go for the shill reviews. I didn't review the book at Amazon myself because well...I know Bruce personally and I already have a Word copy of his book he sent me before it was published. 

Edited by RobertMBlevins
One positive note. Sort of.

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(edited)

KwaiCOVER.jpg.19e48f25aa974729f03a02f9bb2279b4.jpg

The final 'DB Cooper Campout' sponsored by AB of Seattle has been scheduled for Friday, June 5th until Sunday morning, June 7th, 2020. Location: Spider Lake, WA. (You can find it on Google Maps)

This will be the only announcement at Dropzone about it, although two weeks prior to the event I will post an Event Notice at Craigslist. Because of the fact that CL Event Postings tend to reach thousands of people, I have no idea how many people will show up for this one. Maybe nobody. Maybe a LOT of Cooper fans. Maybe a lot of people who are just curious about the whole thing. 

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If and when we reach the maximum number of people allowed to camp in a group (Forest Service rules) anyone coming after that will have to find their own camping spot nearby, and are welcome to attend the festivities. YES...you CAN request to be put on a preferred list of people who are guaranteed a spot...but I am not allowed to say that at Craigslist or they will red flag the Event Notice and remove it. 

So...if you want a guaranteed site at the main camp spot, you should arrange that in advance. Otherwise, you drive up there and take your chances.

ONE WARNING: Spider Lake is about twenty miles from the nearest main highway, and about twenty-five miles from the nearest store. Yes, you can drive to the lake in a regular car. Bring everything you think you will need for the time you will be there...and that includes fresh water for drinking or showering. Otherwise you will have to haul in your bathing water from the lake. We DO provide emergency bottled water for people, just in case. 

CampfireDark.jpg.791f61474a744d7d08d06560b26f8dbd.jpg

Amenities at the main site:

Portable flush toilet and hot water shower inside a special shower tent. 

showertentNEW.jpg.96662465afc5ed02555a30af89038432.jpg

Free BBQ unit with gas is provided for your use, but you have to bring your own food. (Because we can't be sure how many people will show up, we have to suspend the free BBQ dinner this time, although frankly we usually bring more food than we can eat ourselves.) 

Public shelter using 20x40 tarps, ropes, and extendable poles. 

Professional-grade First Aid Kit for public use. We include some over the counter meds, such as Tums, aspirin, ibuprofen, and the like. 

Ten-foot wide display screen and high-def media projector that accepts most media, including DVD players and video game systems. Feel free to bring any movies, game systems, etc you wish. 

32" Samsung Smart TV, run separately in case the media projector is in use.  

Portable stereo for music. 

Cell service is available there, if you have at least 4G on your phone, otherwise you probably won't get a signal. You can drive up the hill away from the lake about a half mile and get signal there, though. 

Small gas generator set about 200 feet from the main campsite, (to keep the noise out) with power line to the site. The line is hooked into two surge-protected power strips with AC power, DC, and USB port charging functions. Help yourself. 

12V LED bulbs strung up here and there for nighttime light, powered by deep cycle batteries. 

In case there are fire restrictions, we bring THIS gas-powered campfire setup we picked up from Amazon. 

We do NOT bring chairs! If you show up, make sure to include chairs for everyone in your group. 

Since we are inviting the public without any restrictions, and people often bring alcohol on camping trips, there will also be a certain amount of security, although we expect everything will be fine and people will have fun. By 'security' this just means a couple of my friends are attending to help with everything, do the shelter setups, power, and bath facilities. I cannot do all this alone, or haul all the necessary gear on my own. 

NO MOTORHOMES are allowed at the main site. Trucks with campers and camper vans are okay. On previous campouts, some folks even slept in the back of their car or truck. I use a tent. 

There is no charge for anything, ever. For more details, and advice on what you might want to bring with you, or if you want to come out early to assist with setup, just drop me a line. 

Questions go to Robert at adventurebooksofseattle AT Gmail.com

spiderlk1.jpg.66edfbacd51e3f352c1b0f31872e7fb3.jpg

1229946775_SpiderLake.jpg.057d24f5dca469a064c1e9beb05fd071.jpg

Edited by RobertMBlevins
Final version of announcement and all information.

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1 hour ago, CooperNWO305 said:

This day in history: 1980: The FBI announces that about $5,800 of the $200,000 ransom paid to hijacker “D.B. Cooper” before he parachuted from a Northwest Orient jetliner in 1971 was found by an 8-year-old boy on a riverbank of the Columbia River in Washington state.

I think I heard something about that boy... ^_^

Wow. Forty years since Brian dug his little campfire and up pops the money. Happy 40th anniversary of the find, Brian. 

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4 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

I think I heard something about that boy... ^_^

Wow. Forty years since Brian dug his little campfire and up pops the money. Happy 40th anniversary of the find, Brian. 

Find was 40 years ago on Monday the 10th (he found it on a Sunday) today is the anniversary of the FBI announcing it.  I went on Newspapers.com and found some old articles.  

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Tom Kaye has Id'd the diatom as a winter variety...

That indicates the money arrived from the water in winter.

 

The caveat is that the Ingram's may have washed the money in the river when they found it.. this is unlikely, the money packets were tight and diatoms would only be exposed to the outer bills..

 

So, what serial number is 377's Cooper bill,, was it likely an internal bill.

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2 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

Tom Kaye has Id'd the diatom as a winter variety...

That indicates the money arrived from the water in winter.

The caveat is that the Ingram's may have washed the money in the river when they found it.. this is unlikely, the money packets were tight and diatoms would only be exposed to the outer bills..

So, what serial number is 377's Cooper bill,, was it likely an internal bill.

When exactly was the Statute of Limitations due to run out on the hijacking? :pointright:  November 24, 1976.

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NO Georger, I didn't claim Kaye found only one diatom, he clearly stated he found many, I can read. I was referring to the question of whether Asterionella was the winter or summer variety, that is the context.

The real point was,, where was the bill in the packet.

 

I don't know if you genuinely lack contextual discrimination due to a disorder or are just being a troll, but many people are really fed up with your nonsense. You continue, without fail, to discredit yourself. You are more a hinderance than an asset to the Cooper case and your toxic behaviour toward others doesn't elevate your relevance. 

You were caught lying and you refuse to admit when you are wrong which is often. You spend more time copying and pasting my comments with added disinformation than doing any of your own research. You can choose to be a positive influence.

 

 

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3 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

NO Georger, I didn't claim Kaye found only one diatom, he clearly stated he found many, I can read. I was referring to the question of whether Asterionella was the winter or summer variety, that is the context.

The real point was,, where was the bill in the packet.

I don't know if you genuinely lack contextual discrimination due to a disorder or are just being a troll, but many people are really fed up with your nonsense. You continue, without fail, to discredit yourself. You are more a hinderance than an asset to the Cooper case and your toxic behaviour toward others doesn't elevate your relevance. 

You were caught lying and you refuse to admit when you are wrong which is often. You spend more time copying and pasting my comments with added disinformation than doing any of your own research. You can choose to be a positive influence.

I second that emotion, as Smokey Robinson once said. And it doesn't stop there with Georger, aka the former university instructor whose classes I once compared to the Pink Floyd video, The Wall.

Ha...he got really mad at me on that one. He talks bad about Dropzone, but copies your posts here (Flyjack) and addresses them over at the Cooper Forum. His activities there have brought the Cooper Forum almost to a standstill, with the admin (Shutter) suggesting he might pull the plug on the site once and for all. They used to pick on me...now it is Flyjack. 

Except for internet spider bots, most of the 'real' Cooper traffic is now coming to either Dropzone or the Everything D.B. Cooper site at Quora, with an additional 10,000 hits a month or so going to the Cooper WordPress articles. People aren't even commenting much anymore over at Bruce Smith's news blog, ever since he banned me from the place. That was a lot like being told by your cable company that they will no longer allow you to pay any bills for your cable service. In other words, you discover being banned from that is a bonus, and you get used to the idea pretty quickly. B)

The more the Shutter and Smith sites try exclusion...and picking on people by sniping at them from behind a rock...the more the public and the media ignore them. I told Shutter and Bruce this would eventually happen, but of course...they didn't listen. They actually believe they are the be-all and end-all of everything D.B. Cooper, when in reality they have become the third string bench warmers in a junior high football game. If they ever get the idea that maybe a group effort by everyone involved in this case is better than the way they are going now...they will become more of a force in the case, and much more effective in their efforts. 

It is doubtful this will ever happen. A more stubborn group of folks I have never known. 

cooperate.jpg.3d5f851da0bebbc1ab1e3db759505db4.jpg

 

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13 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

I second that emotion, as Smokey Robinson once said. And it doesn't stop there with Georger, aka the former university instructor whose classes I once compared to the Pink Floyd video, The Wall.

Ha...he got really mad at me on that one. He talks bad about Dropzone, but copies your posts here (Flyjack) and addresses them over at the Cooper Forum. His activities there have brought the Cooper Forum almost to a standstill, with the admin (Shutter) suggesting he might pull the plug on the site once and for all. They used to pick on me...now it is Flyjack. 

Except for internet spider bots, most of the 'real' Cooper traffic is now coming to either Dropzone or the Everything D.B. Cooper site at Quora, with an additional 10,000 hits a month or so going to the Cooper WordPress articles. People aren't even commenting much anymore over at Bruce Smith's news blog, ever since he banned me from the place. That was a lot like being told by your cable company that they will no longer allow you to pay any bills for your cable service. In other words, you discover being banned from that is a bonus, and you get used to the idea pretty quickly. B)

The more the Shutter and Smith sites try exclusion...and picking on people by sniping at them from behind a rock...the more the public and the media ignore them. I told Shutter and Bruce this would eventually happen, but of course...they didn't listen. They actually believe they are the be-all and end-all of everything D.B. Cooper, when in reality they have become the third string bench warmers in a junior high football game. If they ever get the idea that maybe a group effort by everyone involved in this case is better than the way they are going now...they will become more of a force in the case, and much more effective in their efforts. 

It is doubtful this will ever happen. A more stubborn group of folks I have never known. 

cooperate.jpg.3d5f851da0bebbc1ab1e3db759505db4.jpg

 

Robert: Let's be serious here.  Shutter's site is not going anywhere, and it is still the best site out there for DB Cooper, and the most popular.  Those same arguments come up all the time where people threaten to leave or shut the site down.  Bruce's site picks up more comments when he puts a new article out.  He just has not written one in a while.  Quora is not getting people with a lot of knowledge of the case.  DZ really just has a few of us who comment: you, me, Flyjack, Parrothead, and an occasional drop in from one or two others.  A few of us comment on Shutter's site, a few don't.  I would be real disappointed to see Shutter's site go away.

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Quote

'Robert: Let's be serious here.  Shutter's site is not going anywhere, and it is still the best site out there for DB Cooper, and the most popular.  Those same arguments come up all the time where people threaten to leave or shut the site down.  Bruce's site picks up more comments when he puts a new article out.  He just has not written one in a while.  Quora is not getting people with a lot of knowledge of the case.  DZ really just has a few of us who comment: you, me, Flyjack, Parrothead, and an occasional drop in from one or two others.  A few of us comment on Shutter's site, a few don't.  I would be real disappointed to see Shutter's site go away...'

I am not advocating that Shutter's site be closed, not in any way. I think it serves a good purpose, but it is heavily slanted as far as anything really news in the Cooper case. I see them as the Faux News of Cooperland. As far as Bruce, anytime he puts up a Cooper article, here come the anonymous folks and their nasty comments. I doubt many people actually check in there anymore. Because of this negative activity, (done by just a few folks anyway) it takes away from what Bruce is trying to do in the case. Where he once got a thousand comments on an article, he's lucky these days to get a half-dozen. 

I have learned from this stuff. This is why I screen all comments coming into the AB videos, because I know the same thing will happen there. This negativity back and forth, sometimes anonymously, seems to be unique to Cooperland. For example, you don't see this behavior nearly as much on websites that discuss Scorpio or Jack the Ripper, or even the Unabomber. I think the reason is because there is a lot of competition in Cooperland where several groups are trying to reach the finish line first on Cooper. The competition is expected. The anonymous negativity is NOT, and sometimes has reached levels you would not believe. This activity has a way of both polarizing people into groups, and to drive away public discussion at the same time. I have actually been told by some media and a few Hollywood types that they avoid the Cooper Forum, as well as Bruce's website because of these things. One of their main complaints about the Cooper Forum is that you are forced to register to see any links, almost any pictures presented...and many of the TV and movie researchers just aren't going to bother to do that. They will hit Google and go elsewhere. 

To be fair about it though....the negativity against others involved in the exploration of the Cooper case has diminished quite a bit since it reached its height a few years ago. So that is good, I suppose. 

You are right when you say 'Cooper experts' don't really come on board at the EDBC site at Quora. But the site is reaching more people with every post than both Smith's site and the Cooper Forum combined. Probably by a lot...although I can't say for sure if this includes Dropzone, which is a really big community. But any new post at Quora Cooper goes out to nearly 1,800 people simultaneously by email, in its entirety pictures and all, and all of these people voluntarily signed up to get the feed. The purpose of the site is not to reach Cooper researchers, (I already know where they hang out anyway) but the public, the ones interested in the case. 

The only place where everyone is represented and where you can find the Real Deal on Cooperland is our WordPress column on the case with its 50+ illustrated articles. And this is why some folks in Cooperland absolutely hate the place. B) Hardly anyone comments to the articles, but lurkers and readers add up to around 10,000 in visits (monthly), although I cannot say for sure how many are internet spiders. 

It is too bad that people cannot work together for the Common Cooper Good, though. Perhaps the Ariel Store would have reopened by now. Perhaps the Cooper Conventions would actually get decent attendance and the attention they deserve. Perhaps this, perhaps that. I will be more than happy to retire from Cooperland, which is coming no later than April 2021. Frankly, it has nothing to do with any possible movie on Cooper. It happens to be April/May of that year when two things happen. A certain portion of a trust fund is turned over to me, and Gayla comes into her generous pension. She didn't always 'scrub toilets', as Georger likes to say about her. We decided a while ago that would be it for us living in Washington state, and whether any Cooper movie is made or not made, we are putting the whole thing behind us. Remember...we first got on the Cooper road twelve years ago. It had to come to an end sometime. And that is the date we have set to get off that road and go in a new direction. 

On a side note, I cannot give exact details but I received an email reply to a recent notice I sent to the Ariel Store's Bryan W. He is not doing that well right now and has some personal issues. Let's just say he has a health issue going and leave it at that. And that he is dedicating all his attention right now to that problem. For the details, you should contact him on your own or maybe there is something at his Facebook page. I wished him the best of luck. 

 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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On 1/25/2020 at 6:23 AM, FLYJACK said:

Tom Kaye found a diatom on 377's Cooper bill, Georger Id'd it as Asterionella.

Asterionella is common in the Columbia River..

However, Asterionella japonoca is a spring and summer species while Asterionella formosa is a winter species...

So which one is it? 

 

Coulmbia River diatoms...

columbiardiatom.jpeg.5c9d4bd3ffdc53dc667874e3794f3e4e.jpeg

No Georger it wasn't a guess. The point was there is seasonal variability of Asterionella species in the Columbia. The species was not identified when I posted this.

It is right here.. in "Columbia River Dredged Disposal Site Designation: Environmental Impact Statement" RE: (Anderson, 1972)

https://books.google.ca/books?id=j-00AQAAMAAJ&pg=SA3-PA28&lpg=SA3-PA28&dq=Asterionella+formosa+columbia+river&source=bl&ots=hdV2QH92IP&sig=ACfU3U1lsxZVkyaxff5TJhHBhiFHMseZ7Q&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjssoSDxdHnAhXSKH0KHUlTBu04ChDoATADegQICRAB#v=onepage&q=Asterionella formosa columbia river&f=false

Edited by FLYJACK

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(edited)

Message to Georger:  If you want to quote over Flyjack's research and pick on it...why don't you MAN UP and come to Dropzone to do it...instead of doing it by proxy? Just saying. 

Other News:  I get a fair number of emails from people regarding the Cooper case, although more come from interested people, rather than known Cooper investigators. One guy this week asked me about possible incompetence by the King County (Seattle) Sheriffs' Department concerning their failure to solve Cooper parachute packer Earl Cossey's murder. What has it been now, seven years since the poor guy was beaten to death in his own garage? And nobody has a clue who did it? He also asked my views on the famous Amboy Chute from 2008.

Regarding possible incompetence by KCSD in this case, (and the Amboy chute) this was my reply by email:

Quote

'Incompetent police? Ha...if you mean the King County Sheriffs' Department, you are right. The year after Cossey was killed, there was a short bit, almost a 'nothing' report on Seattle's Channel 4 KOMO news. The announcer said:
"Today, Department of Justice officials in Seattle criticized the King County Sheriffs' Office for their failure to solve 'major cases...'

I guess you could count Cossey's murder as a 'major case'. Basically this term means large robberies, armed robbery, or murder. The big crimes, as they say. It was only a fifteen or twenty second bit on the news, but I never forgot it. The DOJ in Seattle is located in the same multi-story building downtown where the Seattle FBI has its HQ. All the Feds work there, basically. The King County Sheriffs' Dept are responsible for the solving of the Cossey murder. It is their case, even today. 

As far as the Amboy chute goes, I think either the Seattle FBI was incompetent on that investigation, or they are keeping secrets on it from the public. That whole thing was a pile of baloney. I was really surprised when Seattle media refused to press the Seattle FBI spokesperson for more of a dismissal reason beyond her statement:  "By a preponderance of the evidence..."  (why they dismissed it as Cooper's) Really? That's why? Okay...WHAT evidence exactly? would have been my very next question. They never gave a single one. Not one. 

I did get one phone call in to them about the Amboy chute after the dismissal, and then they cut me off from anything else except, "We cannot discuss it further. It is evidence in an ongoing case." The media officer admitted that their so-called experts who were consulted were not allowed to actually SEE the chute, only Cossey. And that these experts were only consulted by telephone. And the one guy allowed to see it claimed he knew it wasn't Cooper's (to media) 'in less than ten seconds." (a quote from Cossey) And HE told media in phone call interviews that it was because the chute they brought to him was silk, and the ones he gave Cooper were ripstop nylon. That is bullshit because the FBI released pictures of the chute and every chute expert who has seen them say the chute is NOT silk, but IS nylon. 

Why would Cossey claim that? Well, one reason is because if he says the chute could be Cooper's, then sooner or later it might come out that he was less than truthful in his interviews to media for all those years, saying he owned them and delivered them to SeaTac. And the FBI might be happy to go along with this line because if THEY admit the chute could be Cooper's....they would also have to admit that Cooper did NOT die in the jump as they claimed since the the Tina Bar money discovery. They would have to admit Cooper lived and beat them. Takes a live person to bury a chute, and where the hell did the container and harness go? And a body? A briefcase, the money? 

As Martin Sheen once said (paraphrased) in the movie, Apocalypse Now
"There was so much bullshit in Vietnam, (Cooper case) you needed wings to stay above it..."

Yeah. 
Sincerely, Robert'

Below: (again) the chute acquisition and delivery report issued by FBI agent John Detlor, shortly after the hijacking:
HaydenCosseyFBIExcerpt2.jpg.165ae3e540166678d6903202410e0e64.jpg

A graphic I created below that helps take out any confusion about the document shown above:

ChuteDeliveryGraphic.jpg.832dd9a82f23d4ae11df4f8dd21db11d.jpg

Edited by RobertMBlevins
Seven years, not five since Cossey was killed.

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8 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Regarding possible incompetence by KCSD in this case, (and the Amboy chute) this was my reply by email:

Below: (again) the chute acquisition and delivery report issued by FBI agent John Detlor, shortly after the hijacking:
HaydenCosseyFBIExcerpt2.jpg.165ae3e540166678d6903202410e0e64.jpg

A graphic I created below that helps take out any confusion about the document shown above:

ChuteDeliveryGraphic.jpg.832dd9a82f23d4ae11df4f8dd21db11d.jpg

I have one criticism of your summary of the chute document..

While it clearly states that the two front "chest chutes" were sent to the plane it doesn't state that both of Hayden's back chutes were sent to the plane.

 

It says that Hayden sent in two back chutes "in order to secure" and they were "furnished to Northwest Airlines". It doesn't claim/confirm both of Hayden's chutes went to the hijacker. IMO, this doc is precise in its vagueness.

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3 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

While it clearly states that the two front "chest chutes" were sent to the plane it doesn't state that both of Hayden's back chutes were sent to the plane.

It says that Hayden sent in two back chutes "in order to secure" and they were "furnished to Northwest Airlines". It doesn't claim/confirm both of Hayden's chutes went to the hijacker. IMO, this doc is precise in its vagueness.

Yes. I understand you have reason to believe a fifth parachute may have been provided. But Detlor doesn't mention one, and if there was, it would have had to come from a third source. No third source is mentioned. 

Then you have Hayden himself, whom I questioned very closely after the report was first released...without telling him I had that report in front of me while we were on the phone. His version of events matched what is in the report, at least HIS end of things. (He was aware of the two reserves that came from Issaquah, but we didn't discuss that part much except he confirmed Cossey delivered neither of them, and wasn't the owner of the chutes anyway.) <<< Hayden found these things out later, not the night of the hijacking<<<from the news reports, since he had a personal stake in the whole thing by 'renting' out chutes to NWA he had paid good money for. 

Let's assume for a moment that you are right and that Cooper actually jumped with a different chute. Hayden would have gotten two chutes returned to him. He claimed in his interview (and to the FBI) that the chutes he sent to the airport were strictly a rental to NWA and that he was paid by check. The FBI only returned ONE of the chutes, and it is safe to assume they would have returned both if both still existed. But one was gone. So where did it go? If it was left at SeaTac Airport and not brought on board the jet, Hayden would have gotten it back within a few days after the hijacking. He did not get it back, and he wanted those chutes returned. He knew where they were sent, and who had them. 

The key to all this is Hayden, who had no reason to lie about anything. If that so-called 'other' chute supposedly mentioned in Reno reports is real, then who provided it? Not Hayden, and not Sky Sports. Then who? No one else has ever come forward saying another chute, from another source, was provided to NWA that night. Only four, and those are accounted for. 

My take on all this is that the report is basically correct. Four sent to the airport, four brought on board. One used by the hijacker. One popped open for the paracord, a reserve that is still evidence since the hijacker handled and worked with it. One returned to Hayden later, now in a museum. One missing reserve, a trainer...probably tossed out the back of the jet just before the jump. 

My guess is that Cooper tossed it out along with the briefcase and (probably now-empty) paper bag in an effort to throw off the ground search should these items be found. And guess what...they are still hiding out there somewhere in the woods of the Pacific Northwest. My guess is they came to rest somewhere between the spot they found the placard, and the spot where the Amboy chute was found...but not SOUTH of the Amboy chute find. North of it somewhere. 

AmboyAndOtherItems.jpg.5089720b323ad34bf15f6e13530ac3e0.jpg

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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No, there is no "fifth" parachute..

 

Hayden is not lying, 

Hayden's account is 100% accurate from his perspective. Hayden has zero knowledge about the chutes after he sent them in. He doesn't know if one or both went to Cooper. Further, Hayden disputes the description of the chutes by the FBI and Barry Halsted claimed Hayden's chutes were identical. Why, because one was Cossey's and one was his and nobody kept track.

 

Hayden would not necessarily have had two chutes returned to him, there is zero evidence that the chute he got back was on the plane. In fact the evidence is that the chute left on the plane was NOT the chute he got back. 

 

" Norman emphatically declares that he never spoke directly to the FBI during the parachute delivery nor subsequent investigation, yet, the Bureau’s document claims that their detailed parachute information comes from Norman."

"In addition, Barry supports Norman’s claim that as far as they know, both back chutes were identical.  In fact, Norman seemed a bit dismayed about bureaucratic in-accuracies when I read aloud the FBI description of the two back parachutes and their many differences."

https://themountainnewswa.net/2011/10/25/db-cooper-case-heats-up-again-with-controversy-over-parachutes/

 

Two back chutes were sent in by Hayden and two back chutes sent in by Cossey.. Both sets of two arrive by cab, only two are grabbed and sent to the plane. One was Cossey's and one was Hayden's.

That is the only way Hayden got back his chute which did not match the year and serial number of the one left on the plane.

This means that Cooper used Cossey's chute. One of Hayden's was left on the plane and one sent back to him. Cossey claimed he got one back as well. 

 

How can the discrepancy be rationalized.. Hayden's chute left on the plane wasn't the one he got back. Deltors opinion or FBI notes do not matter... the fact is they didn't match.

Two similar back chutes were sent from Hayden. Both packed by Cossey the same date.

1) Packed by Cossey May 21/71 manufactured 1960 S/N 60-9707. This was left on the plane confirmed by card found in chute.

2) Packed by Cossey May 21/71 manufactured 1957 S/N 226. Confirmed by packing card. This was returned to Hayden then went to museum.

 

 

 

 

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(edited)

Okay...STOP. 

STOP now. Toss out any reference that may have been provided to you by Bruce Smith. 

When it comes to interviews, he is not all that reliable. I believe Hayden's version of things because even though Hayden was unaware of the newly-released document by agent Detlor on the chutes...Hayden's story matches it. 

You are basing much of this on a Bruce Smith claim? You have got to be kidding. 

He's the same guy who said I threatened to beat him up at the last Ariel Store party, when in reality he simply foisted off a pack of lies on everyone in Cooperland.

And then was foolish enough to stick to that story, even when other witnesses confirmed he was lying. Such as Meyer Louie, who was suckered by Bruce into taking him to Ariel that day...even when Bruce had already been told he was banned from the store by owner Bryan W. 

First he lies to Meyer Louie to get a ride down to Ariel. Then Bruce is denied entrance and goes and sits on a guardrail a hundred yards up the road to fume about it. Then Meyer Louie gets his day ruined and misses the party because he has to drive Bruce out of there. Then, Bruce...in his anger...just starts lying to everyone. 

This is a guy whose word you would take that day is light and night is dark? A guy who allows filthy comments about others to be posted anonymously on his own Mountain News website? Even today?

You will have to do better than that. On a side note, Bruce is also the guy who believes JZ Knight and her demigod Ramtha are not a scam, and who claims to have been 'psychically abducted by aliens' more than thirty times. B) And speaking of interviews, the very first time I had any contact with Bruce Smith was many years ago when he got a telephone interview with me by claiming he worked for a local paper. Turns out he either was fired, or quit that job some time previous, and the only place the interview appeared was at Dropzone. 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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31 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Okay...STOP. 

STOP now. Toss out any reference that may have been provided to you by Bruce Smith. 

When it comes to interviews, he is not all that reliable. I believe Hayden's version of things because even though Hayden was unaware of the newly-released document by agent Detlor on the chutes...Hayden's story matches it. 

You are basing much of this on a Bruce Smith claim? You have got to be kidding. 

He's the same guy who said I threatened to beat him up at the last Ariel Store party, when in reality he simply foisted off a pack of lies on everyone in Cooperland.

And then was foolish enough to stick to that story, even when other witnesses confirmed he was lying. Such as Meyer Louie, who was suckered by Bruce into taking him to Ariel that day...even when Bruce had already been told he was banned from the store by owner Bryan W. 

First he lies to Meyer Louie to get a ride down to Ariel. Then Bruce is denied entrance and goes and sits on a guardrail a hundred yards up the road to fume about it. Then Meyer Louie gets his day ruined and misses the party because he has to drive Bruce out of there. Then, Bruce...in his anger...just starts lying to everyone. 

This is a guy whose word you would take that day is light and night is dark? A guy who allows filthy comments about others to be posted anonymously on his own Mountain News website? Even today?

You will have to do better than that. 

This is not based on Bruce.. that is completely wrong.

It is really based on the back chute identification cards not matching. 

I really don't think you grasp the situation here. If both of Hayden's chutes are accounted for then Cooper didn't use either. It must have been Cossey's.

The packing card info for the chute Hayden got back doesn't match the one left on the plane. There is no way around this, no matter what Hayden, Bruce, Deltor or anyone else expresses.

You keep citing Hayden's version,, Hayden has zero knowledge of events after he sent in the chutes. His opinion for events after that is meaningless. He sent in two chutes and thought they were both sent to the plane, that doesn't mean they both were. He isn't lying, he is just expressing a belief. Hayden has no way to know if both his chutes were sent to Cooper.

The packing cards not matching carries far more weight than the opinions and speculation of the people involved. 

I think Bruce's interview with Hayden is completely credible but that isn't even needed. The packing card date/serial numbers don't match..

 

 

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(edited)

Then where did this other back chute come from? It had to come from somewhere. No one knew about Cossey on the afternoon of the hijacking. No one at the airport or the FBI anyway. And Cossey lived clear out in Woodinville, which is one heck of a drive to the airport in Seattle traffic...way out in the east side...across the bridge, and out of the city.  Just getting to Woodinville (even back then) on an afternoon before Thanksgiving, and back...is a nightmare.

The window between the time people at SeaTac got the requests for the money and the chutes, and the time they were actually delivered to the plane is a relatively small window. No one has said any back chutes came from Sky Sports. So where did this Cossey chute come from? He says he owned it. That means it would have to come from either Sky Sports or Cossey's house. There is no record of anyone going to Cossey's house, and no record of anything but two reserves being delivered from Sky Sports. 

Hayden claims the two mains are his, and he ID'd them. I guess what you have to do is prove there were THREE main chutes actually taken to SeaTac that evening, and where the one extra chute came from. 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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1 hour ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Then where did this other back chute come from? It had to come from somewhere. No one knew about Cossey on the afternoon of the hijacking. No one at the airport or the FBI anyway. And Cossey lived clear out in Woodinville, which is one heck of a drive to the airport in Seattle traffic...way out in the east side...across the bridge, and out of the city.  Just getting to Woodinville (even back then) on an afternoon before Thanksgiving, and back...is a nightmare.

The window between the time people at SeaTac got the requests for the money and the chutes, and the time they were actually delivered to the plane is a relatively small window. No one has said any back chutes came from Sky Sports. So where did this Cossey chute come from? He says he owned it. That means it would have to come from either Sky Sports or Cossey's house. There is no record of anyone going to Cossey's house, and no record of anything but two reserves being delivered from Sky Sports. 

Hayden claims the two mains are his, and he ID'd them. I guess what you have to do is prove there were THREE main chutes actually taken to SeaTac that evening, and where the one extra chute came from. 

Cossey claimed he sent in two back chutes by cab and Cossey claimed the chute Cooper took was his NB8..   but you don't even need that..

The packing cards didn't match,, that is all you need. Once those chutes don't match there had to be more than two back chutes involved.

The chute Hayden got back wasn't the chute left on the plane. 

 

 

 

 

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(edited)
Quote

'Cossey claimed he sent in two back chutes by cab and Cossey claimed the chute Cooper took was his NB8..   but you don't even need that..'

No wonder Hayden outright called Cossey a liar, and after our interview...when I told him about the John Detlor report...he asked me to send him a copy to put in a frame in his office. Now it makes sense. He says he spoke to Cossey maybe once or twice over the years, and Hayden made it plain he didn't like Cossey and thought he was a liar. Obviously, Cossey tried to take credit for providing chutes that weren't actually HIS. Why? Probably to try and do the same thing Norman Hayden ended up doing:  Somehow getting the FBI to return the Pioneer to HIM...instead of the real owner...Norman Hayden. 

Cossey lied. It is as simple as that. He tried to steal credit from Norman Hayden. And years later, Hayden gets vindicated when the FBI starts releasing the files. Hayden is further vindicated when he finally has a lawyer send a request letter for return of the Pioneer...and the FBI hands it right over to him in a parking lot. Hayden is further vindicated when instead of trying to make a buck on a famous parachute...simply donates it to the Washington State History Museum. 

The fact that two packing cards may or may not match is not proof of the physical nature...or the ownership...or the origination...of the backpack (main) chutes given to Cooper. That in itself could be explained in a number of ways. An extra card, a wrong card, whatever. All the other evidence, all the other testimony points to both Hayden being correct, and Detlor's report accurate. 

Cossey packed the chutes. Doesn't mean he owned any of them, or provided them personally on the night of the hijacking. If he was going to lie, it was pretty foolish of him to simply try copying Hayden's version of events...which by the way is backed up by the FBI's original report. 

It's too bad Cossey isn't around anymore to answer some of these questions, or the other folks involved in all this. It also calls into question Cossey's ridiculous claim to Seattle media that he knew the Amboy chute wasn't Cooper's 'in less than ten seconds' because 'the ones I gave Cooper were made of ripstop nylon and that chute is made of silk...'

Another load of baloney from Cossey. Practically every chute expert who has examined pictures the FBI released of the parachute found in Amboy in 2008 agree on one thing. That chute was NOT made of silk, but nylon. 

In case some readers haven't seen them, a few pictures of the Amboy chute are shown below. 

amboychute1.jpg

amboychute2.jpg

amboychute3.jpg

amboychute4.jpg

AmboyChuteLG.jpg

The FBI agent in the picture above reminds of actress Laura Linney in the movie, Breach. Like Linney, she looks frustrated. Who do they have to depend on to ID the chute honestly? EARL COSSEY. A guy who made lying into a science when it came to the Cooper chutes. 
breachLinney.jpg.7b19c1afa059bc1e5961fc4e7d7e3397.jpg
Quote from Linney in the movie, which you could sort of apply to Earl Cossey from time to time, or perhaps even Cooper himself. (As it turns out, Cossey was more of a hindrance than a help to the FBI in the Cooper case.)

Quote

"He was smarter than all of us. Actually, I can live with that part. It's the idea that my entire career has been a waste of time. That's the part I hate. Everything I've done since I got to this office, has been a waste of time, everything we've been paid to do, he was undoing it. We all could have just stayed home..."

 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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