USPA - Jan Meyer Impeachment??

[jlmiracle 7]

Chris Welker was the Southern Regional Director. Mike Mullins in a National Director. Mike and another jumper are the ones that opened Tullahoma. Mike was never a regional director. After the first weekend Tullahoma opened, was when they figured out "someone" had "stole" Chris Martin's 800#.

The only reason some have joined the GM program was to not have to pay multiple times if you have more than one ratings course throughout the year.

Probably about 5-6 years ago we attended the USPA meeting. We went to try to get the GM program removed because we wanted to have a AFF course at our dz and Glenn, who was just an employee at the time, told us no way would it ever happen. We went to fight for it. We won the battle but lost the war. We had support from several board members, including Don Yarling, may he rest in peace. Don was pretty much the "head of the AFF program at that time. He explained how he has held courses, in hotels, and venues, which were not USPA GM DZ's. We got our ratings course, BUT at the next meeting they impleminted an "extortion" fee for non-GM dz that want to hold a ratings course. Apparently, according the USPA, ratings course are NOT for the individual skydiver, but for the DZ's.

j

Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

[DSE 3]

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Anyone still think that the only reason we had to settle were Jans Actions and that she alone should pay for the Loss?

If one continues to repeat a bullshit story, does the veracity of the story/opinion eventually become true?

It's the "I think I can, I think I can..." may help personal endeavors. but "This is is true, this is true" doesn't make it any more accurate. No honorable person in this thread, nor in any communication I've recieved has said that "the only reason the EC settled was because Jan said this or that or Jan did this or that." Jan (along with others) contributed before, during, and after litigation. As an individual, she (like yourself, BillyVance, and so many others) are entirely entitled to speak their mind in any way shape or form.
If they're not on the USPA Board of Directors at the time they are speaking.
Like it or not, whenever one becomes a policy maker, administrator, or representative of a body, rights to "free speech" are considerably curtailed.

I hope Jan runs again regardless of the outcome of this situation.

[jlmiracle 7]

oh geez. I hope I didn't come of as being defensive with you. That was not my intention at all. I was just pointing out that their information is incorrect and no one from either side even called.

In other words, people didn't do their jobs.

My husband is no longer on the bod and I thank god every day for that. Unless you are on the EC, you really don't count. The EC will change anything they want to at pretty much any time.

j

Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

[CSpenceFLY 1]

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Like it or not, whenever one becomes a policy maker, administrator, or representative of a body, rights to "free speech" are considerably curtailed

I would like to see a show of hands of people that really believe this.

If I am elected to be a county commissioner on a platform of stopping XYZ company from building a quarry in my county does that mean after I am elected I can no longer speak out about the quarry?

[skydived19006 4]

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The EC will change anything they want to at pretty much any time.

j

As I understand it, the EC is in place to decide policy when something can not wait until the BOD meeting. They obviously break this rule on a regular basis. Is there any way to hold their feet to the fire? Maybe "remove for cause"?

Experience is what you get when you thought you were going to get something else.

AC DZ

[bbarnhouse 0]

I have sat quiet on this and another issue for quite sometime. I may be pissing off my lawyer but I can and will say
without reservation that the allegation in item 3 of the complaint is false. It never happened and I challenge anyone to provide any evidence that it did. I should know.

Additionally, I think it interesting to note that the EC made the decision to settle the skyride case without conferring with the BOD. The BOD was informed after the fact of the decision.
Perhaps a read of the Governance Manual is in order as to what is and is not allowed.
The decision could have waited unitl after the BOD meeting in February.

Additionally, as I read it, the EC is required to contact the BOD on any matters decided in the interim so that the BOD has an opportunity to say yay or nay. This didn't happen.

I will also add that several of the DZOs that sit on the BOD have always excused themselves from voting on the skyride issue. Larry Hill included.
So tell me why bother to have rules if they aren't followed?!

Again...people are free to say what they will... but you don't know what you don't know.

[billvon 2,426]

>I would like to see a show of hands of people that really believe this.

It is literally incorrect. Jan (and myself, and other directors, and governmental leaders) are free to say whatever they choose. At a certain level, though, there are consequences to the actions you take, even if it's just speaking your mind and maligning a competitor, your own organization, a partner etc.

>If I am elected to be a county commissioner on a platform of
>stopping XYZ company from building a quarry in my county does that
>mean after I am elected I can no longer speak out about the quarry?

You can still speak however you so choose. However, you are now speaking for the government, not as a private citizen - and you may be held responsible for your words. For example, if you say "I'll only agree to that quarry if I get something out of it" there may be legal consequences, since there are laws against bribery of public officials. Those consequences would not ensue if you were just a private citizen posting on an Internet board.

[chriswelker 0]

***You can still speak however you so choose. However, you are now speaking for the government, not as a private citizen - and you may be held responsible for your words.***

Can you back this up with case law?

On second thought, who really gives a rats fart anyway.

All we do as skydivers most of the time regarding USPA politics(myself included) is bitch, moan and complain with usually no results.

The only reason I ever became an AFF I and got INVOLVED with USPA's bod's was because we had a death at WTS(non gm dz) in 1999. Glennduh Bangsus,when he was director of S&T,made the death report sound like the death wouldn't have occurred if the jumper had been at a gm dz vs a non-gm dz.

I called him up to express my displeasure at his unprofessionalism, lack of cl/ass, character and general disrespect for the deceased's family and friends.We did get into a pissing contest.

I requested to hold an AFF cert course at WTS( a non gm dz at the time.) Glennduh told me no and when I asked why he said because the bod said so. I called his bluff. My wife and I went to the next bod meeting and got the course. It was worth the 2k plus all the other fess associated with the the AFF course(x's2 for me) to see the smoke rolling out of Glennduh's ears.I was sitting next to him when the bod said yes to us.

The bod was very disfunctional in 1999 and things haven't really changed much since then because of LACK OF INVOLVEMENT by the USPA membership.

If you want to know what the heck is going on with the USPA start questioning your RD and ND's.If the answers don't jive, find out why by asking someone else.I still haven't found anyone in 9 years involved with the bod or hq that can give you all the correct answers all the time, so sometimes you have to ask a bunch of people to come up with the correct answers.You might even have to get off your mouth or keyboard and do something.

The whole Jan thing is a bunch of fertlizer.Glennduh is using Jan as a smoke screen to devert the attention away from the real problem, himself. I was on the bod 1 term. After my first meeting I was wondering why the heck I was needed there or anyone else for that matter since Glennduh runs the bod like a dicktatership.

Yes, the system is broke. It will stay that way until more people are willing to take the effort to fix it.

Have fun, I am.

Chris Welker

[labrys 0]

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I may be pissing off my lawyer but I can and will say
without reservation that the allegation in item 3 of the complaint is false

I might be misunderstanding your post but item three of the complaint against USPA appears to be a claim that they were trying to monopolize the skydiving business and it was dismissed before the settlement.

Owned by Remi #?

[skydived19006 4]

I have to wonder if a short and factual little email disclosing a bit of the wrongdoing of the BOD with names, and circulated to and through skydivers at election would have any affect on the outcome of the next election.

It'll have to be short because the attention span is that of a kindergartener, and it'll have to inspire a few people to actually take the time to vote. They do need to be informed voters, since uninformed voters tend to simply vote name recognition, and there's no change in that!

There are a handful of people here, but the 10 +/- of us can not affect the outcome of an election without "getting out the vote."

Oh, I just had a thought, maybe these emails should come over the course of a couple of weeks, and a couple days between. It may maintain more interest if people are "hit" with them like a Burma Shave advertisement!

Experience is what you get when you thought you were going to get something else.

AC DZ

[rushmc 18]

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I have to wonder if a short and factual little email disclosing a bit of the wrongdoing of the BOD with names, and circulated to and through skydivers at election would have any affect on the outcome of the next election.

It'll have to be short because the attention span is that of a kindergartener,Hey, I resemble that remark and it'll have to inspire a few people to actually take the time to vote. They do need to be informed voters, since uninformed voters tend to simply vote name recognition, and there's no change in that!

There are a handful of people here, but the 10 +/- of us can not affect the outcome of an election without "getting out the vote."

Oh, I just had a thought, maybe these emails should come over the course of a couple of weeks, and a couple days between. It may maintain more interest if people are "hit" with them like a Burma Shave advertisement!

Seriosly though, I agree, good post.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[genfreefly 0]

"I requested to hold an AFF cert course at WTS( a non gm dz at the time.) Glennduh told me no and when I asked why he said because the bod said so. I called his bluff. My wife and I went to the next bod meeting and got the course. It was worth the 2k plus all the other fess associated with the the AFF course(x's2 for me) to see the smoke rolling out of Glennduh's ears.I was sitting next to him when the bod said yes to us."

alright chris, you reeled me in on that one.
LOL i'm shocked (LOL) that President Bangs (LOL) would do such (LOL) a thing (LOL)

in my term on the BOD, i've never felt (LOL) that President Bangs (LOL) ran things like (LOL) a (LOL) dictator (LOL)

sorry, i guess i have the giggles today.

that's my story, i'm stickin to it

:-)
max

[BillyVance 34]

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alright chris, you reeled me in on that one.
LOL i'm shocked (LOL) that President Bangs (LOL) would do such (LOL) a thing (LOL)

in my term on the BOD, i've never felt (LOL) that President Bangs (LOL) ran things like (LOL) a (LOL) dictator (LOL)

sorry, i guess i have the giggles today.

that's my story, i'm stickin to it

:-)
max

I seem to remember you being in bed with skyride at one point in the recent past.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[chriswelker 0]

in my term on the BOD, i've never felt (LOL) that President Bangs (LOL) ran things like (LOL) a (LOL) dictator (LOL)

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Were you asleep?

Bangsus answers to nobody but his own reflection.

If you don't do it his way he will attempt to disccredit you or remove you from your committies.

Jan is very intelligent and Glennduh can't stand it that a woman is smarter than him.

Chris

• Quote

[peek 20]

"Jan is very intelligent and Glennduh can't stand it that a woman is smarter than him."

Man, you're getting right to the point there, huh?

Hey wait, is that Judy there behind you twisting your arm? Ha, ha, ha!


Now, that just might be a good thing that you have done, because the average USPA member who thinks Mr. Bangs is a normal standup guy would wonder why he would not like another BOD member. That is a realistic explanation that a normal person might understand.

[genfreefly 0]

hey chris,
nah, i was awake :-)
i was more commenting on how i liked your story.
its funny in one respect (calling glenn's bluff on the AFF course example and busting him on it like that).

of course, on the same note, its tragic that bs like that goes on (and on and on and on)

i agree Jan is very intelligent. IMO, she is one of the most knowledgeable members on the BOD regarding the governance manual (the manual w/ all the procedures, rules, disiplinary stuff, etc..)

I don't know all the facts, but i find it hard to believe that there is grounds for impeachment (based soley on the facts that Jan could probably quote the Governance manual and Robert's Rules of Order and i never felt she had supported other's vested interests or folded to political pressure.

my opinion (with just knowing a little more of the BOD from being on it for a term) is this is a waste of the USPA members time and resources.

I'm somewhat comforted that not all the BOD memebers are crooked, and those who are really looking to represent the membership are probably getting more than annoyed at the secrecy and cover-ups by some of the EC.

i can only hope that this situation might create a positive by BOD members and USPA members alike not getting pushed around and kept in the dark.

[chriswelker 0]

hey chris,
nah, i was awake :-)
i was more commenting on how i liked your story.

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Max,

I am sorry for snapping. My father just passed and I am still a little edgey and not thinking 100%. I apologize.

Your Friend
Chris

• Quote

[bbarnhouse 0]

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I might be misunderstanding your post

Why yes...you did.

[genfreefly 0]

hi chris, sorry to hear about your father.
perhaps my sarcasm was a bit over the top, no need to apologize man.

hope things are ok w/ you.
max

[packerboy 3]

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I have to wonder if a short and factual little email disclosing a bit of the wrongdoing of the BOD with names, and circulated to and through skydivers at election would have any affect on the outcome of the next election.

I thought I asked for this before, but not in the same manner.

I agree.. I want to know what is going on with my money.

[email protected] put me on the list.

--------------------------------------------------
In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock. ~ Thomas Jefferson

[shermanator 3]

Quote

Quote

I have to wonder if a short and factual little email disclosing a bit of the wrongdoing of the BOD with names, and circulated to and through skydivers at election would have any affect on the outcome of the next election.

I thought I asked for this before, but not in the same manner.

I agree.. I want to know what is going on with my money.

[email protected] put me on the list.

I too, would want to be on that list.

CLICK HERE! new blog posted 9/21/08
CSA #720

[mnealtx 0]

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Max,

I am sorry for snapping. My father just passed and I am still a little edgey and not thinking 100%. I apologize.

Your Friend
Chris

Chris -

Not to hijack the thread, but I'm very sorry for your loss.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[gjhdiver 0]

The cool thing about this thread is that in a year, pretty much none of this will be remembered, and none of the ideas here will be followed up on. Hell, in two years, with the influx of new jumpers, the general reaction will probably be "Jan who ?".

It's in the nature of skydivers to really not follow through politically once the weather improves and we're all jumping a lot. We kind of blow it all off until it's more convenient to deal with it all, which approximates to never. USPA elections roll around, and the involvement by the membership is usually minimal at best, incumbents are re-elected and the odd fresh face comes in and does one term before realizing that the work is thankless and for the most part, procedural and deathly dull, and bails out at the first available opportunity.

The general populace doesn't even pay attention in general elections, so it's not really a wonder is it ?

All I really want from USPA is insurance, a deep pocket to fight for airport access, and a voice at a governmental level to intercede with the FAA. I'll take care of the rest myself.

[packerboy 3]

Lol.... I don't think that it will ever be "Jan who?"

I personally don't know her, and to be honest, I don't really pay attention to a whole lot, but I've heard the name quite a few times before the Skyride issue blew up.

--------------------------------------------------
In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock. ~ Thomas Jefferson

[Scrumpot 1]

1. How many of you have ever been to any BOD, S&TA, Gen Membership, DZO, or group membership meeting held by the USPA? Been to several
2. Have you read the lawsuit that was brought against the USPA by Skyride? No
3. Have you ever contacted your RD for any reason? Yes
4. Do you even vote in the USPA elections? Yes
-----------------------

Post on DZ.com? - Nope. Not any more. Haven't probably in @ several seasons now.

Jan - If you are lurking, you have my support. Drop a dime if there is anything at all I can possibly do.

Blues,
-Grant

coitus non circum - Moab Stone