mpohl 1 #126 January 16, 2015 Dude, you claim to be a law-abiding citizen, but can't accept the authority of Billvon? He is the law of the land here. I rest my case. Anvilbrother Yea that's totally the same as -Your life is worth less than mine -Go beat your head on a hard piece of metal. -On a much broader philosophical note. Which I don't expect an Anvilbrother to even remotely grasp. Don't even try! -Let me guess.I Have-No-Clueistan? - I do think that US cops are poorly trained, and that they are a rather stupid bunch. (directed outright to 3 cops) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #127 January 16, 2015 mpohl Seems that this thread has basically been reduced to 5-10 participants. Of course, we can be at each others throat until the cows come home. Ultimately, the American people will decide. And there is less and less support for law enforcement as it is administered/discharged today. Let's keep in mind that I and my fellow citizens, regardless of color/race/ethnicity, are paying for LE, for your salaries. It doesn't make any sense to shoot the ones paying you!!!! End of Story! No one here is at anyone else's throat, but you. That is right. Its all about you. You are all that matters in your world. Happy now? Of course not, you are one of those that are never satisfied.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BillyVance 34 #128 January 16, 2015 turtlespeed *** Seems that this thread has basically been reduced to 5-10 participants. Of course, we can be at each others throat until the cows come home. Ultimately, the American people will decide. And there is less and less support for law enforcement as it is administered/discharged today. Let's keep in mind that I and my fellow citizens, regardless of color/race/ethnicity, are paying for LE, for your salaries. It doesn't make any sense to shoot the ones paying you!!!! End of Story! No one here is at anyone else's throat, but you. That is right. Its all about you. You are all that matters in your world. Happy now? Of course not, you are one of those that are never satisfied. Like a male Kim Gibbs? "Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #129 January 16, 2015 BillyVance ****** Seems that this thread has basically been reduced to 5-10 participants. Of course, we can be at each others throat until the cows come home. Ultimately, the American people will decide. And there is less and less support for law enforcement as it is administered/discharged today. Let's keep in mind that I and my fellow citizens, regardless of color/race/ethnicity, are paying for LE, for your salaries. It doesn't make any sense to shoot the ones paying you!!!! End of Story! No one here is at anyone else's throat, but you. That is right. Its all about you. You are all that matters in your world. Happy now? Of course not, you are one of those that are never satisfied. Like a male Kim Gibbs? I was thinking more like a Male Courtney LoveI'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #130 January 16, 2015 skycopHow many other occupations have sites dedicated to their mistakes. If you work in the space industry and you make a mistake it tends to garner a lot of publicity. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skycop 0 #131 January 16, 2015 Yes, But are individual names listed? Do "activists" come and protest at your house. Do people follow you around work, and while you are attempting to torque a bolt to a correct value. Then attempt to provoke you into a confrontation? Those are just a few examples, I realize I'm comparing apples to oranges to a point, but I'm sure you get my meaning. In the last two "incidents" the officers were cleared of wrong doing and this still happened. They still face civil suits. "Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,123 #132 January 16, 2015 skycopOkay, You're point is? This had been discussed ad-nauseam, when a cop does something wrong it's front page news. How many other occupations have sites dedicated to their mistakes. 800,000 cops in the US, millions of contacts yearly, many under extremely difficult circumstances. This is the best you can do? Plus the free thought project, photography is not a crime, and counter current news aren't exactly objective sources. Like I've said, the internet makes everyone an expert.............. Just the other side of the coin. Few other professions get so much recognition when they are killed on the job either. Not too many contruction workers get called heroes when falling off scaffolding. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #133 January 16, 2015 It all depends on the nature of the mistake, of course, but you're right it's much less personal. People may get fired, companies lose contracts, etc. the whole industry tends to get subjected to another round of "Whitey on the moon" complaints and it becomes harder to fund anything. Also, similarly, it's difficult to draw the public's attention to successes. As an aside, it's funny you mention people following around those tightening bolts and harassing them. You've got quality engineers pretty well pegged. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 622 #134 January 16, 2015 IMO, some "mistakes" made by cops should carry a much harsher penalty for cops than for citizens due to their job. Misdemeanors? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mcordell 2 #135 January 17, 2015 normissIMO, some "mistakes" made by cops should carry a much harsher penalty for cops than for citizens due to their job. Misdemeanors? It would be misdemeanor battery if you did it. I agree officers should be held to a higher standard in the eyes of the public but I don't think it's possible to make a whole separate charging scale. Of course you could always consider adding an additional charge in the place of increased penalties...something along the lines of misdemeanor battery and official misconduct. It is also worth noting that laws vary greatly from state to state. In some states it may be a felony for the officer to have battered a handcuffed suspect. As an example, in Oklahoma any battery to a law enforcement officer is a felony, regardless of severity. In Kansas simple battery to a LEO is a misdemeanor unless the officer suffers an injury in which case it becomes a felony, however battery to a police dog is always a felony. Also battery to a corrections worker is a felony. If I arrest someone and in the process of walking them into the jail they begin to resist and they kick me, a corrections worker, and my fellow deputy's dog, they would have committed 1 misdemeanor and 2 felonies for doing the exact same thing to 3 different victims. Point being, there are qualifying factors in the statutes that make some actions more prohibited than others.www.facebook.com/FlintHillsRigging Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
funjumper101 15 #136 January 17, 2015 Monitor bad cop no donut yourself. Count up the new posts every day that link to new stories about badLEOs. Filter out the non-USA LEOs. I figure about nine new reports show up each day. Multiply that by 365. That is what shows up on that one site. There are quite a few site like BCND. The heinous actions of LEOs now gets greater coverage than the pre-Internet days. Given my own personal experience with corrupt cops and judges who believe them, I believe that BCND shows a tiny percentage of what happens. I am sure that the victims of the bad LEOs that you pass off as being a "tiny percentage" of the LEO population are comforted by that dismissal of the issue. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #137 January 17, 2015 QuoteIt would be misdemeanor battery if you did it. Is it still a misdemeanor in your jurisdiction if I did it to a cop? - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #138 January 17, 2015 mcordellI agree officers should be held to a higher standard such a crap cliche - If we held everybody to a decent standard that we'd also expect from ourselves, then we'd have a better society. tell me, do you have a list of demographics of people to a "lower standard"? Would you be fine holding yourselves and those close to you to 'lower' standards? it's all relative. Which people are 'better' than others such that higher and lower standards make sense for society? maybe those better people should also get to make choices for those dirty lower people. etc etc etc (I know it's just a 'saying' that people use, but I wanted to make the point again) ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skycop 0 #139 January 17, 2015 QuoteIs it still a misdemeanor in your jurisdiction if I did it to a cop? It is in my state, unless there is an injury to the officer, or a bodily fluid is used (ya, welcome to my world). "Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #140 January 17, 2015 QuoteIt is in my state, unless there is an injury to the officer, or a bodily fluid is used (ya, welcome to my world). Seems fair to me. If it's a misdemeanor for a cop to punch me, it should be a misdemeanor for me to punch a cop. Not that I've ever punched a cop... But I have been punched by one. I was not injured, and he did not arrest me. This was for having an open container in Times Square on New Years Eve. A plainclothes cop was walking through the crowd, grabbing people's le's beers and throwing them on the ground. He did not identify himself, and when some guy grabbed my beer from behind, I had the audacity to try to hold onto it. He punched me in the arm, and then silently pulled his coat open to reveal his badge. The lunch was totally unnecessary, but whatever, I didn't make a stink, and neither did he. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aphid 0 #141 January 19, 2015 An op/ed on the ethics of police body-cameras. And a specific and very real example of how some police interactions can turn deadly very quickly. http://seattletimes.com/html/nationworld/2025487644_policevideoxml.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,384 #142 January 19, 2015 I just watched one of the videos posted to YouTube. Holy shit, I would never have guessed that guy would go violent!"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mcordell 2 #143 January 19, 2015 DanGQuoteIt would be misdemeanor battery if you did it. Is it still a misdemeanor in your jurisdiction if I did it to a cop? Yeswww.facebook.com/FlintHillsRigging Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mcordell 2 #144 January 19, 2015 rehmwa***I agree officers should be held to a higher standard such a crap cliche - If we held everybody to a decent standard that we'd also expect from ourselves, then we'd have a better society. tell me, do you have a list of demographics of people to a "lower standard"? Would you be fine holding yourselves and those close to you to 'lower' standards? it's all relative. Which people are 'better' than others such that higher and lower standards make sense for society? maybe those better people should also get to make choices for those dirty lower people. etc etc etc (I know it's just a 'saying' that people use, but I wanted to make the point again) I think the people we trust to uphold the law SHOULD be held to a higher standard. If you are caught drinking and driving you will get a hefty fine, lose your license for a while, and it goes on your record, but unless you drive for a living you won't lose your job. We will. If you get into a fight with your wife and push her, you will get arrested for DV battery but won't lose your job. We will. I can go on but that is a higher standard and I agree with it. In general people make mistakes and sometimes those mistakes involve poor decisions in which they violate the law. Officers are charged with upholding the laws and shouldn't make those same poor decisions. So yes, officers should be held to a higher standard. No, it's not just a saying and it's not cliché.www.facebook.com/FlintHillsRigging Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 622 #145 January 19, 2015 In Florida there is an "aggravated" charge available that makes it a felony. Apparently all you need is any type of uniform with some sort of badge on it, not just a certified LEO. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
funjumper101 15 #146 January 23, 2015 Today's info from the links at Bad Cop No Donut. Feel free to go directly to the site and look at the links. New ones are posted every day. http://www.reddit.com/r/Bad_Cop_No_Donut/ For this one, funny how LEOs can kill and main civilians with impunity, but when civilians react to no knock raids like good NRA members, they are prosecuted and convicted, in spite of have been "standing their ground" and defending their home against armed invaders. http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/01/this-is-what-happens-when-a-civilian-kills-a-cop-during-a-no-knock-drug-raid/#.VMHeYDhl_oo.reddit Can any of the LEO defenders come up with why holding bad cops accountable for their crimes is wrong? http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/crime/fl-anthony-caravella-dna-7-million-20150122-story.html I hope that this person has the resources to hold the bad cops in this video accountable for the assault and battery that was performed for no valid reason. http://filmingcops.com/ufc-fighter-attacked-by-police-tased-for-asking-them-to-identify-themselves/ How many civilians could commit the crimes that this LEO did, and be able to avoid jail? http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/01/tenn-deputy-could-avoid-jail-despite-taking-nude-photos-and-fondling-female-suspect/#.VMFudPFi7g8.reddit I am confident that there are far more stories about bad cops that don't get posted on the BCND site. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Anvilbrother 0 #147 January 23, 2015 On the topic of no knock warrant, are you equally mad at the judge that gave them the warrant? The authrorization to do these entries are usually given by a higher authority. Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along, Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GeorgiaDon 340 #148 January 23, 2015 AnvilbrotherOn the topic of no knock warrant, are you equally mad at the judge that gave them the warrant? The authrorization to do these entries are usually given by a higher authority.However the authorization is given based on information the police put in the warrant application. The judge has no resources to go out and independently verify all the claims in the application, and (in theory) no-knock warrants should only be used when there is a high likelihood that the evidence or person sought is in danger of being lost if action is not taken quickly, leaving the courts no time to conduct a separate investigation even if they did have the resources. It is up to the police to do the "due diligence" and ensure the statements in the application are as accurate as possible. In an environment where there are rarely any consequences that attach to the police for failure to do that, it seems to be an all to common event that such warrants are served on innocent people. Even if a lawsuit results, that is paid by the municipality (and so ultimately local taxpayers) and does not come out of the negligent police officer's pay or the departments budget. Don_____________________________________ Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996) “Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Anvilbrother 0 #149 January 23, 2015 The use of no knock warrants are hardly ever intended to be used to keep someone from flushing evidence. It's mostly used to keep whoever is inside from being ready for the entry in a high risk situation where you are most likely to encounter an armed person. Which is exactly what funjumper linked a convicted felon who was in a home with a firearm and killed a cop. This is most likely what got him convicted. Not because he shot because he thought he was being robbed, he was a convicted felon still participating in felonious activities, and the jury saw that. But funjumper would never give all those details. Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along, Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 622 #150 January 23, 2015 Just being in possession of the weapon is 10 years minimum, isn't it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
