DougH 270 #4951 August 9, 2021 10 hours ago, metalslug said: In an innocuous mistake and, yes, Trump has done worse, but this wasn't merely 'misread' twice; The leader of the free world doesn't seem to be aware of the population of his own country. For what it's worth; I'm not entirely anti-Dem; I have huge respect for both Clinton and Obama, but this man's health status is becoming more obvious Maybe, maybe not. Trump also repeatedly demonstrated potentially impaired mental capacity, in addition to sever character flaws, and a possible amphetamine habit. The difference to me is that Trump surrounded himself with yes men that doubled down on his frequent errors and miscalculations. Retractions by his staff were frequently walked back, his staff were skewered for trying to correct his errors, because his actions and initial comments were never wrong. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DougH 270 #4952 August 9, 2021 7 hours ago, Westerly said: Covid vaccination status should be a question on a health insurance application. Like smoking, no covid vaccination? No problem, we'll just apply a standard 2.2 multiplier to your rate. I will be very surprised if this doesn't become the norm. I think some health insurance companies have already started working this in to the premium calculations, and they should. They should also factor in obesity and being sedentary, but I won't hold my breath. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,683 #4953 August 9, 2021 A recent Monmouth University poll found that “among those who admit they will not get the vaccine if they can avoid it, 70 percent either identify with or lean toward the Republican Party while just 6 percent align with the Democrats.” All last year Trump delayed, dithered and denied the seriousness of the virus. Meanwhile even now DeSantis and Abbott continue to double down on their anti-mandate agenda. There are people dead today — a lot of them — who should still be alive and who would be if people in the heights of government and the heights of the conservative media had not fed them lies about the virus. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
murps2000 86 #4954 August 9, 2021 3 hours ago, kallend said: A recent Monmouth University poll found that “among those who admit they will not get the vaccine if they can avoid it, 70 percent either identify with or lean toward the Republican Party while just 6 percent align with the Democrats.” All last year Trump delayed, dithered and denied the seriousness of the virus. Meanwhile even now DeSantis and Abbott continue to double down on their anti-mandate agenda. There are people dead today — a lot of them — who should still be alive and who would be if people in the heights of government and the heights of the conservative media had not fed them lies about the virus. My sister lives in Florida and likes to point out that the number of people dead from covid in her state far exceeds the number of votes DeSantis won by in the last gubernatorial election. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,083 #4955 August 9, 2021 20 minutes ago, murps2000 said: My sister lives in Florida and likes to point out that the number of people dead from covid in her state far exceeds the number of votes DeSantis won by in the last gubernatorial election. Hi murps, And to follow-up on that: Funeral for Florida man killed by COVID turns into vaccination event - oregonlive.com Jerry Baumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,412 #4956 August 9, 2021 NYT: The U.S. military will mandate Covid-19 vaccine for troops. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,155 #4957 August 9, 2021 5 hours ago, kallend said: A recent Monmouth University poll found that “among those who admit they will not get the vaccine if they can avoid it, 70 percent either identify with or lean toward the Republican Party while just 6 percent align with the Democrats.” All last year Trump delayed, dithered and denied the seriousness of the virus. Meanwhile even now DeSantis and Abbott continue to double down on their anti-mandate agenda. There are people dead today — a lot of them — who should still be alive and who would be if people in the heights of government and the heights of the conservative media had not fed them lies about the virus. It was a politically calculated move. Trump's team believed that the damage of the pandemic and the reaction to it would be more damaging to states and cities with Democrat leaders. That the damage to the economy in those areas would be worse than the death toll in areas with Republican leaders. A gamble that is now very much turning against them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,683 #4958 August 9, 2021 1 hour ago, SkyDekker said: It was a politically calculated move. Trump's team believed that the damage of the pandemic and the reaction to it would be more damaging to states and cities with Democrat leaders. That the damage to the economy in those areas would be worse than the death toll in areas with Republican leaders. A gamble that is now very much turning against them. Trading off the deaths of a few thousand supporters to make a political gain overall. Makes sense. "Freedom isn't free", right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,412 #4959 August 9, 2021 (moRon) DeSantis threatens to withhold salaries in school mask-mandate dispute It seems like even a GOP-controlled state govt could see its time to impeach the idiot. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
headoverheels 292 #4960 August 9, 2021 Florida court rules that cruise ships can require vaccinations. https://www.miamiherald.com/news/business/tourism-cruises/article253309823.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billeisele 123 #4961 August 10, 2021 A six minute listen from a practicing physician specially trained in immunology and inflammation regulation. He refutes many common beliefs about managing COVID. - some of the CDC recommendations are contrary to the scientific evidence, some of the studies providing that info were sponsored by the CDC - you can't make respiratory viruses go away, they circulate all year long, they can not be filtered out, COVID has animal reservoirs so it can't be eliminated like smallpox - vaccination changes nothing, it does not make one immune - masks don't work, respiratory viruses are spread by respiratory particles and the particles can easily pass thru the mask - treatment with commonly available inexpensive medications work - no vaccine stops infection, vaccinated people usually have lessened symptoms or don't have symptoms but they shed pathogens, they become the source of spread - vaccines will not make COVID go away - Vit D levels of 25 or greater significantly reduce your risk - people that had COVID get no benefit from a vaccine, no reduction in symptoms or hospitalization rates, and suffer 2-4X the rate of side effects if vaccinated afterward As a minimum this should make one wonder. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,083 #4962 August 10, 2021 49 minutes ago, billeisele said: A six minute listen from a practicing physician specially trained in immunology and inflammation regulation. He refutes many common beliefs about managing COVID. - some of the CDC recommendations are contrary to the scientific evidence, some of the studies providing that info were sponsored by the CDC - you can't make respiratory viruses go away, they circulate all year long, they can not be filtered out, COVID has animal reservoirs so it can't be eliminated like smallpox - vaccination changes nothing, it does not make one immune - masks don't work, respiratory viruses are spread by respiratory particles and the particles can easily pass thru the mask - treatment with commonly available inexpensive medications work - no vaccine stops infection, vaccinated people usually have lessened symptoms or don't have symptoms but they shed pathogens, they become the source of spread - vaccines will not make COVID go away - Vit D levels of 25 or greater significantly reduce your risk - people that had COVID get no benefit from a vaccine, no reduction in symptoms or hospitalization rates, and suffer 2-4X the rate of side effects if vaccinated afterward As a minimum this should make one wonder. Hi Bill, Do you believe him? Jerry Baumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,355 #4963 August 10, 2021 23 minutes ago, billeisele said: A six minute listen from a practicing physician specially trained in immunology and inflammation regulation. He refutes many common beliefs about managing COVID. - some of the CDC recommendations are contrary to the scientific evidence, some of the studies providing that info were sponsored by the CDC - you can't make respiratory viruses go away, they circulate all year long, they can not be filtered out, COVID has animal reservoirs so it can't be eliminated like smallpox - vaccination changes nothing, it does not make one immune - masks don't work, respiratory viruses are spread by respiratory particles and the particles can easily pass thru the mask - treatment with commonly available inexpensive medications work - no vaccine stops infection, vaccinated people usually have lessened symptoms or don't have symptoms but they shed pathogens, they become the source of spread - vaccines will not make COVID go away - Vit D levels of 25 or greater significantly reduce your risk - people that had COVID get no benefit from a vaccine, no reduction in symptoms or hospitalization rates, and suffer 2-4X the rate of side effects if vaccinated afterward As a minimum this should make one wonder. 56 minutes ago, billeisele said: A six minute listen from a practicing physician specially trained in immunology and inflammation regulation. He refutes many common beliefs about managing COVID. - some of the CDC recommendations are contrary to the scientific evidence, some of the studies providing that info were sponsored by the CDC - you can't make respiratory viruses go away, they circulate all year long, they can not be filtered out, COVID has animal reservoirs so it can't be eliminated like smallpox - vaccination changes nothing, it does not make one immune - masks don't work, respiratory viruses are spread by respiratory particles and the particles can easily pass thru the mask - treatment with commonly available inexpensive medications work - no vaccine stops infection, vaccinated people usually have lessened symptoms or don't have symptoms but they shed pathogens, they become the source of spread - vaccines will not make COVID go away - Vit D levels of 25 or greater significantly reduce your risk - people that had COVID get no benefit from a vaccine, no reduction in symptoms or hospitalization rates, and suffer 2-4X the rate of side effects if vaccinated afterward As a minimum this should make one wonder. It only makes me wonder how you can be taken seriously on any topic. For example, yes, virus particles are itsy bitsy tiny and can pass through masks all by their lonesome. But they aren't just out there, hanging in the air, waiting for you to walk by. They are in water droplets. Hence the utility of masks. Also, your expert ain't one. Seriously Bill, this was bad. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,412 #4964 August 10, 2021 Again. How masks work: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nwt 131 #4965 August 10, 2021 1 hour ago, billeisele said: A six minute listen from a practicing physician specially trained in immunology and inflammation regulation. He refutes many common beliefs about managing COVID. - some of the CDC recommendations are contrary to the scientific evidence, some of the studies providing that info were sponsored by the CDC - you can't make respiratory viruses go away, they circulate all year long, they can not be filtered out, COVID has animal reservoirs so it can't be eliminated like smallpox - vaccination changes nothing, it does not make one immune - masks don't work, respiratory viruses are spread by respiratory particles and the particles can easily pass thru the mask - treatment with commonly available inexpensive medications work - no vaccine stops infection, vaccinated people usually have lessened symptoms or don't have symptoms but they shed pathogens, they become the source of spread - vaccines will not make COVID go away - Vit D levels of 25 or greater significantly reduce your risk - people that had COVID get no benefit from a vaccine, no reduction in symptoms or hospitalization rates, and suffer 2-4X the rate of side effects if vaccinated afterward As a minimum this should make one wonder. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Westerly 61 #4966 August 10, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, billeisele said: He refutes many common beliefs about managing COVID. Only to the naive. Most of what he said is false. There is only one point he made that is mostly accurate and that is that the virus is never going away. That is true. The rest is total bafoonary. Edited August 10, 2021 by Westerly Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,477 #4967 August 10, 2021 Quote Some of the studies providing that info were sponsored by the CDC That's one of the CDC's jobs. They sponsor studies to improve public health. That's what they do. Quote Vaccination changes nothing, it does not make one immune It makes one much more immune. Quote Masks don't work, respiratory viruses are spread by respiratory particles and the particles can easily pass thru the mask Masks work. Here are 49 peer reviewed studies demonstrating that they do: https://www.kxan.com/news/coronavirus/do-face-masks-work-here-are-49-scientific-studies-that-explain-why-they-do/ Quote Treatment with commonly available inexpensive medications work Nope. There's no evidence so far that they make a significant difference. (Hint here - note that hundreds of people a day are still dying in the US, even though they regularly try all those "commonly available inexpensive medications.") Quote No vaccine stops infection, vaccinated people usually have lessened symptoms or don't have symptoms but they shed pathogens, they become the source of spread Vaccinated people are 4x more likely to not get infected at all. Quote vaccines will not make COVID go away Vaccines don't make a disease "go away." They keep you from dying from it. If used over decades, along with other public health measures, they CAN render the disease extinct. This doesn't happen with most pathogens and probably won't happen with SARS-CoV-2. Quote Vit D levels of 25 or greater significantly reduce your risk So does eating a healthy plant-based diet, quitting smoking, getting plenty of exercise, wearing a mask, distancing, avoiding crowded interior spaces and avoiding people likely to become infected. And of course the #1 way to reduce your risk is to get vaccinated. Quote people that had COVID get no benefit from a vaccine, no reduction in symptoms or hospitalization rates, and suffer 2-4X the rate of side effects if vaccinated afterward That's not just false, it's a malicious anti-vaxx lie. People are 2.3x times less likely to get infected at all, and are 90-95% less likely to die or have a serious illness. Overall they suffer far fewer side effects than the unvaccinated. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,280 #4968 August 10, 2021 5 hours ago, billeisele said: A six minute listen from a practicing physician specially trained in immunology and inflammation regulation. He refutes many common beliefs about managing COVID. He's a family doctor with a subspecialty in complementary medicine. You may know complementary medicine as that spiritual stuff that isn't medicine. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stumpy 256 #4969 August 10, 2021 Unfortunately, the easily led listen to this stuff and share it on the bloody internet. A bachelors degree, even an A-Level in biology will tell you that most of what he said is complete nonsense. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,683 #4970 August 10, 2021 8 hours ago, billeisele said: A six minute listen from a practicing physician specially trained in immunology and inflammation regulation. He refutes many common beliefs about managing COVID. There are charlatans in every profession. You appear to have found one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billeisele 123 #4971 August 10, 2021 7 hours ago, ryoder said: Again. How masks work: thanks for the good info Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billeisele 123 #4972 August 10, 2021 8 hours ago, JerryBaumchen said: Hi Bill, Do you believe him? Jerry Baumchen Hey Jerry - It's interesting info. There are a couple informative posts below mine that provide quality info on N95s and discuss/refute his claims. Education is a good thing. The mask info is especially helpful. The two problems I see with masks is how they are worn (incorrectly), and the N95s with exhaust ports. I've always said that one issue with COVID is the lack of consistent and quality info and guidance from the government and other "so called" experts. This guy is obviously passionate about what he believes. Some of it is correct, some of it is not. If there was full disclosure and more clarity from "our leaders" it would help to manage COVID, and it would lessen the believability of these type folks. There are plenty of folks that are confused by the differing opinions and will easily point to this type passionate speech as accurate. One specific point is disclosure of the data on side effects from the vaccine. Lack of easy access to that data can lead some to believe it's being purposefully hidden. It would also be helpful to have easy access to the list of pre-existing conditions that could make taking the vaccine risky. People are scared of COVID and some are scared of the vaccine. The lack of a quality consistent message, and easy access to data doesn't help that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,280 #4973 August 10, 2021 3 minutes ago, billeisele said: I've always said that one issue with COVID is the lack of consistent and quality info and guidance from the government and other "so called" experts. This guy is obviously passionate about what he believes. Some of it is correct, some of it is not. If there was full disclosure and more clarity from "our leaders" it would help to manage COVID, and it would lessen the believability of these type folks. How specifically do you think there has been a lack of consistent and quality info from actual scientific leaders on Covid? Quote There are plenty of folks that are confused by the differing opinions and will easily point to this type passionate speech as accurate. Apart from banning republican congressmen from opening their mouths what exactly can you do to stop confusing, differing opinions from being spread? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,178 #4974 August 10, 2021 The hotshot swooper who tells newbies to downsize aggressively and that speed is their friend is probably a licensed current skydiver. And yes, your flare can be improved by additional speed; it’s physics. But do you listen to him (it’s just about always a him), and recommend him to other newbies? There are about a million licensed practicing physicians in the US. They probably don’t all say exactly the same thing, but if 999,000 of them are saying one thing, and 1000 are saying something else, consider the odds Wendy P. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stumpy 256 #4975 August 10, 2021 59 minutes ago, jakee said: How specifically do you think there has been a lack of consistent and quality info from actual scientific leaders on Covid? Apart from banning republican congressmen from opening their mouths what exactly can you do to stop confusing, differing opinions from being spread? He didn't say "scientific leaders" he said "the government and so called experts". The previous incumbent of the WH was not terribly accurate when it came to scientific advice. I'm still suffering from my last bout of windmill cancer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites