Intervention Participation Refusal

[LuckyMcSwervy 0]

I reached out to someone's best friend to garner support to try to put together some kind of "we love you, you need help" get together and I was totally rebuffed.

I reached out to someone's sister to garner support to try to put together some kind of "we love you, you need help" get together and I was totally rebuffed.

The two people closest to this person I'm concerned about both said in a roundabout way the person didn't have a bad problem with alcohol because he gets up and goes to work every day.

I asked both of them if they're worried about pissing him off? Worried the parties with free lobsters, filet mignon, freeflowing booze and wine in a luxury home would end? Aren't you worried the example he's setting for his kids?

I told them both he's a highly functioning alcoholic. He's going to die an early death if he doesn't stop drinking. This person seemed proud to tell me he goes through 5 handles of Tito's Vodka per week. PER WEEK.

If no else else cares, why should I, right? After all, this person raised his voice to me to tell me he "can handle his fucking liquor. Fuck you!" when I suggested he had a problem. He also has absolutely no recollection of a couple of events a couple of hours long that he participated in the previous nights. Total blackouts of long conversations. His oldest son (14 years old) is crying out for help with Facebook posts about feeling unloved and stuff like that. His exWife takes him to court for extra money at least 4 times a year and he's extremely hateful about her, so she's out as a resource for help.

I know some people around here have been on the receiving end of some help or have helped someone get help. Am I out of line? I think I should probably just walk away and sever all ties. I hate to see someone slip farther down that hole.

I'm waiting for all hell to break lose when his friend and sister tell him what I had in mind. BTW - This is the second time I've tried to bring up the backing off alcohol thing. The first time was ignored by all.

Always be kinder than you feel.

[roostnureye 2]

good luck!!!
my father is an alcoholic, i have tried every trick in the book. they have to want to quit.

Flock University FWC / ZFlock
B.A.S.E. 1580
Aussie BASE 121

[david3 0]

I wish you all the luck in the world. You are going to need it. I lost a good friend to alcohol. He died in his mid thirties (yes his thirties). His alcohol of choice was also vodka. Finished a bottle every day, went to work every day. Until one day his body began to shut down. I had no idea it was that bad. More like I couldn’t imagine somebody could drink that much. I still ask myself what I could have done and would it have made a difference. It haunts me.

[craigbey 0]

Quote

they have to want to

That's it, right there.

Whatever the problem may be, it comes down to the addict making the 'program' work. Others can jump in and help guide the addict to rehab or other forms of help, but the addict MUST take ownership of their recovery.

Friends and family are not counselors or therapists and their love and support should not be required or expected for an addict to recover.

Best of luck to you and the OP. I hope you have been able to get help for yourself if needed.

[Chiquita 12]

Unfortunately, until something happens and they get arrested for a dui or hurt someone somehow, they probably won't see it as an issue.

You could do some research into the long term effects of drinking, like alcoholic dementia, pancreatitis (sp?), etc. But even that may not help. I have known many people that drink/drank to varying degrees and seen several different effects of most everything, things that have worked and things that have not. Alcoholism is a demon that most don't seem to be able beat.

I know a few people that have said they will not quit drinking because they don't like their life without it, even though they have been in the hospital with alcohol related issues. And a few of them the doctor said they will die if they keep drinking, but they still drink

"Ego is the anesthesia that deadens the pain of stupidity"

[turtlespeed 212]

LuckyMcSwervy

I'm waiting for all hell to break lose when his friend and sister tell him what I had in mind. BTW - This is the second time I've tried to bring up the backing off alcohol thing. The first time was ignored by all.

Sometimes, you just cant't fix stupid.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[wmw999 2,121]

An addict only wants to quit when their life gets bad enough that stopping drinking seems like an improvement.

If you can't make his life that bad, then the best you can do is to help the son with support, and help him to find out about al-anon.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[oldwomanc6 38]

IMO, "interventions" don't work.

People don't like being told they're doing it wrong. It doesn't matter what the issue is.

I just got back from visiting my elderly mother, and I will vent in the next few days about it (please don't ask till then,I'm still processing), but I see no difference.

No one wants to hear how screwed up they (or their living conditions) are.

lisa
WSCR 594
FB 1023
CBDB 9

[JohnMitchell 14]

wmw999

If you can't make his life that bad, then the best you can do is to help the son with support, and help him to find out about al-anon.

That sounds like a really good idea here.

Wow, 5 bottles a week? I thought I could toss back a lot of drinks. No way could I handle that.

[Amazon 7]

oldwomanc6

IMO, "interventions" don't work.

People don't like being told they're doing it wrong. It doesn't matter what the issue is.

I just got back from visiting my elderly mother, and I will vent in the next few days about it (please don't ask till then,I'm still processing), but I see no difference.

No one wants to hear how screwed up they (or their living conditions) are.

I know this sounds heartless and harsh.. but walk away... you tried.. and it sound like the other friends are more invested in the good times. Those will end... don't let that drag you down as the whole party comes crashing down.

An Addict is an addict and has the ability to take a lot of people down with them. I sacrificed a year of my life trying to bring an addict to reality... According to his mom... my favorite cousin... her son is now doing better since he got out of prison. I am skeptical I am glad he is back in Florida a full country away.

[quade 3]

Prior to asking anyone else to join you, how much advice had you sought out about interventions in general?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[davjohns 1]

Karen, you have a huge heart. It's very endearing. It probably causes you a lot of problems as well.

He is not ready. He may never be ready. Even if you were able to confront him with a completely rational, airtight argument, he thinks he is ok...partially because he can hold a job...just like his friend and sister argue. As long as he has support from people like that...and long after as well, he will not change.

I do not advise you to walk away. But you may have to. Your decision.

If you are willing to help him at your own risk, you would have to keep some form of contact and monitor him until he is ready. That means he will hit bottom. He will be without family, friends, money, and whatever else he considers valuable outside a bottle. Watching this without walking away could be very harmful to you. And even when you think he is ready...even when he appears to have hit bottom...he could be one of those whose bottom is lower than you think. There are also those who hit bottom over and over and never get it. Worse, having someone like you standing by could mean he never truly hits bottom.

The best analogy I can find is to liken and addict to a drowning person. Jumping in to save someone when they are still strong and thrashing about will usually end up in two people drowning. Even after they have given up or are unconscious, it is hard to help unless you are enormously stronger than they are with great endurance. The best rescuers stay out of the water and extend a pole or rope that they can drop if they need to. Even then, the person in trouble has to realize they are in trouble. Otherwise, they get mad because you are poking them with a pole or hitting them with a rope.

So, weigh the potential outcomes. Weigh how valuable he is to you; your strength; how hard he will fight; who will be around to help if / when he crashes; how much energy you will have left to help him when it comes; your preparedness to wait an undetermined amount of time, help when others have abandoned him, and fail because he is not ready...over and over.

I am not saying give up. I am not saying he is hopeless. I'm saying that you need to evaluate whether you are able to fight the battle and win...and at what cost.

I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet..

But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course.

[Nataly 38]

My father is a functioning alcoholic. His father (my grandfather) died at 45 of alcoholism - he was non-functioning, losing his job all the time, et cetera. His brother (my late-uncle) shot himself in the head on Xmas eve when he was in his early twenties because of a drug addiction.

And because my dad got to a high position, in a job that was very high-profile and very challenging, he kids himself that he doesn't have a problem. To him, his father, a total fuck-up, was an alcoholic, but he, a highly educated/successful/respected person, is not. Even though he drinks himself stupid almost every day.

My mother, I am sorry to say, is an enabler. In a last-ditch effort to get him to clue in, I had a big talk with him when my parents spent Christmas with me last year. I have since had almost no communication with either of my parents, in the hope that this will send a strong message to both my parents that until he gets help I want nothing to do with either of them (yes, I have told them very clearly this is the number one reason why I will not communicate with them). My hope is that it will hurt my mom enough that it will hurt him as well, and that he will eventually realise what he is doing to all of us (never mind what it is doing to him).

But no. Somehow, I am the evil/selfish brat who is throwing my teddy in the corner. My guess: he will realise when he is dead that he had a problem. (ie: never)

"There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse."
- Chris Hadfield
« Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. »
- my boss

[weaverd 0]

They have to want the help, hate to say it you could always give an anonymous tip to the police that so and so is driving drunk, that might be a harsh wake up lesson.

[normiss 622]

Narking on someone to the cops, possibly ruining their life and costing them thousands of dollars sure seems like a puss move to me.

Sometimes people's life problems are simply nunya.

[LuckyMcSwervy 0]

roostnureye

good luck!!!
my father is an alcoholic, i have tried every trick in the book. they have to want to quit.

Thanks. I'm sorry you're experiencing that hell.

Always be kinder than you feel.

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

normiss

Narking on someone to the cops, possibly ruining their life and costing them thousands of dollars sure seems like a puss move to me.

Sometimes people's life problems are simply nunya.

If he's routinely driving drunk and ends up killing someone, was it still "nunya"?

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[LuckyMcSwervy 0]

david3

I wish you all the luck in the world. You are going to need it. I lost a good friend to alcohol. He died in his mid thirties (yes his thirties). His alcohol of choice was also vodka. Finished a bottle every day, went to work every day. Until one day his body began to shut down. I had no idea it was that bad. More like I couldn’t imagine somebody could drink that much. I still ask myself what I could have done and would it have made a difference. It haunts me.

Thanks. I'm sorry for your loss. I hadn't been around this person in 25 years so I had absolutely no idea how their life was going downhill with the alcohol. I've asked him in the morning about hangovers. He said they "hurt so good" and he "loves the pain". Sounds like some self loathing to me.

I don't want to be left with the same thoughts you have about your friend that you lost so early.

Always be kinder than you feel.

[jimmytavino 16]

Man,,, what a tough situation
You have a good heart, McSwervey and it's evident that you CARE for others.

somehow, society tends to look at the "prosperous" alcoholic Soooo much differently
than the "down and out and livin' in the streets " alcoholic...

both are tragic. and are a REAL medical issue.

approaching someone,,, or the someones "peeps" are about all you can Do..
and then hope ( often to no avail ) for the best..
Denial... is a HUGE symptom of the disease..especially when the enablers also deny the truth. Vodka, straight out of the freezer, can become an eventual death sentence

May your friend awaken to the severity of these circumstances well before some calamity slaps him in the face with it.

ps...to the well meaning poster who suggests it......... "sic'-ing " the cops on ANYONE is overintrusion,
in my opinion..wouldn't EVER do it...
EVER have to DEAL with what's involved in a DWI or DUI charge?????? it sux.

sending good vibes, that your friend can be saved.
jmy

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

jimmytavino

...ps...to the well meaning poster who suggests it......... "sic'-ing " the cops on ANYONE is overintrusion,
in my opinion..wouldn't EVER do it...
EVER have to DEAL with what's involved in a DWI or DUI charge?????? it sux.

sending good vibes, that your friend can be saved.
jmy

To somewhat repeat what I replied above, have you EVER had to DEAL with someone you know getting killed by a drunk driver?

It really sucks.

If the drunk person wishes to drink, that's their problem.
It is horrible for the family and friends.

BUT...

If the drunk person chooses to get behind the wheel of a car and put the rest of the world in danger...

That's a different situation.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[normiss 622]

Agreed.

That's not what the thread is about.

[jimmytavino 16]

I HEAR you,,,,wrjoe..

ah... IF Only,,, we could cure all the worlds' ills...

hopefully when Anyone drinks and drives they will promptly run into a Roadside checkpoint,,,,
then it's on THEM... as it should be.

practice alert and defensive driving, at all times...and encourage your loved ones and friends to DO the same...

[Amazon 7]

Nataly

My father is a functioning alcoholic. His father (my grandfather) died at 45 of alcoholism - he was non-functioning, losing his job all the time, et cetera. His brother (my late-uncle) shot himself in the head on Xmas eve when he was in his early twenties because of a drug addiction.

And because my dad got to a high position, in a job that was very high-profile and very challenging, he kids himself that he doesn't have a problem. To him, his father, a total fuck-up, was an alcoholic, but he, a highly educated/successful/respected person, is not. Even though he drinks himself stupid almost every day.

My mother, I am sorry to say, is an enabler. In a last-ditch effort to get him to clue in, I had a big talk with him when my parents spent Christmas with me last year. I have since had almost no communication with either of my parents, in the hope that this will send a strong message to both my parents that until he gets help I want nothing to do with either of them (yes, I have told them very clearly this is the number one reason why I will not communicate with them). My hope is that it will hurt my mom enough that it will hurt him as well, and that he will eventually realise what he is doing to all of us (never mind what it is doing to him).

But no. Somehow, I am the evil/selfish brat who is throwing my teddy in the corner. My guess: he will realise when he is dead that he had a problem. (ie: never)

CRAP

This whole discussion SUCKS ASS, it is dredging up some issues I put so far into my memory that I had nearly forgotten them. My step-father was a high functioning drunk, his choice of poison was JB Scotch. He did not like drinking alone so mom became a "social drinker". They always had a very well stocked booze cabinet and because of his work as a CBS cameraman he spent many weekends covering sporting events for CBS Sports all over the upper Midwest and sometimes further afield for the biggies. I got to go to a few of the iconic games of the NFL, NHL or things like the Kentucky Derby all thru the 1960's. Most of those weekends though I stayed home and my brothers (who could do absolutely nothing wrong, while it seemed I could do nothing right) got to go to almost every weekend events.

Luckily I was fortunate enough to get into the booze cabinet at age 15 when all of them were away for the weekend. I drank half a bottle of Southern Comfort and about all I can remember was sleeping in the bathroom and praying to the porcelain goddess at length. To this day I can not even stand the smell of Southern Comfort in a room. That episode pretty much saved me from the path that my step-brothers took.
All of them are drunks. My step-father trained them well to follow in his footsteps. The middle brother, the only one who I got along with fairly well, died of an alcohol overdose( VODKA) in his early 20's while being a macho little shit and trying to drink some asshole under the table. Usually he could do that but not when the barkeep was feeding the other asshole watered down drinks while Donnie got strait Vodka. . Until that happened I had never heard about anyone dying of alcohol poisioning.
I try really hard not to remember that portion of my life, since I have done well putting it behind me. Mom and I have discussed all the bad things 20 years ago after he passed and we are both better now.

[Doug_Davis 0]

My dad was an abusive drunk Irish asshole.

Dont worry about the father who doesnt want your help anyway. Get some help for the kid before it wrecks his life.

[weaverd 0]

normiss

Narking on someone to the cops, possibly ruining their life and costing them thousands of dollars sure seems like a puss move to me.

Sometimes people's life problems are simply nunya.

I bet you wouldn't be saying that if it was your loved one killed by a drunk driver. Why don't you go somewhere else.