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QuoteQuote>A lot of "D" license holders seem to be killing themselves (and others)
>under canopy these days. Did two night jumps help them to "know their
>stuff"? Apparently not! Wouldn't a CRW requirement or advanced canopy
>requirement be far more useful and relevant?
Why? What if you have a jumper who was planning to never swoop and land his Raven II straight in for the rest of his life - why should you force him to do something he doesn't want to do and has no bearing on his style of skydiving?
And this is different from requiring somebody to do night jumps that never plans to do night jumps because.........?????
Well, at least one person here got Billvon's point!
QuoteQuote...
There is all this talk on retention in this sport and to make it easier for up jumpers to achieve licenses.
I don't believe all of that.
Used to be D needs 200 jumps. Now it's 500 as of oh, about mid-2003.
Focus has been on training...better training makes better skydivers which makes it easier to achieve the licenses.
I would definitely agree that better training makes better skydivers. I would also say that the focus has definitely been on MORE training. What we all want is BETTER traing, not necessarily more training. This is why I think NickDG's hit this issue right on the head; because what is happening over the years is that we are making it easier for there to be MORE skydivers in the sport who are neither BETTER nor safer.
I think the night jump requirement should stay based on my belief that having to voluntarily do it is likely to make one a better skydiver for many reasons (which others have already given). I don't like doing intentional night jumps either, but I feel that the [training] benefits of going through the process of fulfilling the requirement outweigh the risks.
QuoteQuote
Focus has been on training...better training makes better skydivers which makes it easier to achieve the licenses.
There are 'Skydivers' out there that WON'T JUMP without an ADD!!!
Removing an RSL 'all by yer $tupid $elf' makes one of the most popular rigs today...'UNjumpable'!
....
It makes you commit to something you have to take the time to LEARN to do the right way...just like flaring a downwind, stall turns, entering 10th and spotting for a head down...
Yeah ... THAT's what I've been trying to say!
Instead of removing the night jump requirement, we should instead be adding a requirement to do at least ten intentional RW jumps without an AAD on your rig, no helmet, no goggles (waiverable), and no altimeter.
stitch 0
I here by make the motion that we change the requirments to "5" night-jumps, "2" of which have to be made under a Para-Comander or similar round.QuoteWell....heres the reason why.....it filters out the fuckin' pussies.
Somebody had to say it.
That should bring out the studs.
All in favor??
"No cookies for you"- GFD
"I don't think I like the sound of that" ~ MB65
Don't be a "Racer Hater"
"I don't think I like the sound of that" ~ MB65
Don't be a "Racer Hater"
Quote
All in favor??
AYE!
~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~
QuoteI here by make the motion that we change the requirments to "5" night-jumps, "2" of which have to be made under a Para-Comander or similar round.
That would mean 1. people would have to make more round jumps so they can, 1-a learn to fly them.(again) 2-a learn to spot. (again).
QuoteThat should bring out the studs.
If you say so. Nothing studly about it really, more skill then anything. (see 1-a & 2-a above)
QuoteAll in favor??
Ok, I have extra rigs if anyone needs a loner, sorry the Jumbos are spoken for already by the old fat guys,
Jim you can use the red and black one......you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo
No problem.
----------------------------------------------
You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.
You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.
billvon 2,400
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>"2" of which have to be made under a Para-Comander or similar round.
Would a Paradactyl count?
Would a Paradactyl count?
QuoteWould a Paradactyl count
No, wrong shape and to much forward speed that is cheating.
you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo
Glitch 0
Aye! 
Randomly f'n thingies up since before I was born...
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Ok, I have extra rigs if anyone needs a loner, sorry the Jumbos are spoken for already by the old fat guys,
.............But I get to pack it! "pack your own rig,you'll get out,
What you put in it"
~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~
rehmwa 2
QuoteA license is supposed to tell you who is ALLOWED to do what. I don't think a "D" ever told you much about who WAS ABLE do what.{ad nauseum}.
So, you don't see any casual relationship with meeting defined qualifications vs ability and how that should be used to defined what one is allowed to do.
interesting
...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants
kallend 1,623
QuoteQuoteA license is supposed to tell you who is ALLOWED to do what. I don't think a "D" ever told you much about who WAS ABLE do what.{ad nauseum}.
So, you don't see any casual relationship with meeting defined qualifications vs ability and how that should be used to defined what one is allowed to do.
interesting
Why did you snip off the explanatory part of my post?
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
winsor 186
QuoteI here by make the motion that we change the requirments to "5" night-jumps, "2" of which have to be made under a Para-Comander or similar round.QuoteWell....heres the reason why.....it filters out the fuckin' pussies.
Somebody had to say it.
That should bring out the studs.
All in favor??
Responses:
A) You bet!
B)
I definitely favor adding CRW to the requirements for a D.
Doing stacks at night under ParaCommanders just makes the process that much more fun.
Moonlit skies,
Winsor
QuotePro Rating...and to get to jump air shows!
Show Off!
I agree the requirements should be stiffened and eliminate the "Good ol' Boy" mentality of signing off what "did not" happen...
. I want to know that when I get my "D", I have earned it and didn't cheat or lie to get it. As far as the night jumps go, I see it as a "Rite of Passage" and it should STAY as it is!
If you choose to waiver out for health reasons, go for it, you may turn out to be one of the best instructors the world has seen(I said might...).
Just don't spoil the fun/terror for the rest of us!!!
Anvil Brother #69
Sidelined with a 5mm C5-C6 herniated disk...
Back2Back slammers and 40yr old fat guys don't mix!
Sidelined with a 5mm C5-C6 herniated disk...
Back2Back slammers and 40yr old fat guys don't mix!
champu 1
If having a license is supposed to demonstrate a certain level of experience, and "experience is what you get when you don't get what you want," I think we should remove the, "planned and executed a successful whatever-way" requirement from licenses.
I think instead you should have to have been on 10 dives where the plan went drastically wrong.
I think instead you should have to have been on 10 dives where the plan went drastically wrong.
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If you choose to waiver out for health reasons...
Spineless is NOT a health reason!
~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~
rehmwa 2
QuoteWhy did you snip off the explanatory part of my post?
I didn't see that it added to a point you made clearly in the first two sentences. I didn't find it explanatory at all - merely elaborative. You did a good job already. However, repetition is a valuable part of learning - repetition is a valuable part of learning - repetition is a valuable part of learning
...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants
And we would all be qualified for funnelfish awards from the flying Hellfish. I got a silver for a 6 way that was spectacularly wrong.
."If it wasn't easy stupid people couldn't do it", Duane.
My momma said I could be anything I wanted when I grew up, so I became an a$$hole.
My momma said I could be anything I wanted when I grew up, so I became an a$$hole.
QuoteI here by make the motion that we change the requirments to "5" night-jumps, "2" of which have to be made under a Para-Comander or similar round.QuoteWell....heres the reason why.....it filters out the fuckin' pussies.
Somebody had to say it.
That should bring out the studs.
All in favor??
Okay, but... to get your "D"... lets also ADD:
1) Must perform at least 5 wingsuit jumps.
2) Must perform at least 5 jumps on a canopy loaded at 1.9:1 or more.
Note: 1 & 2 & the Night Jump requirement can be combined, but not recommended.
Quote
Spineless is NOT a health reason!
What about hemroids?
Quote
Okay, but... to get your "D"... lets also ADD:
1) Must perform at least 5 wingsuit jumps.
2) Must perform at least 5 jumps on a canopy loaded at 1.9:1 or more.
Note: 1 & 2 & the Night Jump requirement can be combined, but not recommended.
***
Can either be substituted for "Jumping The Shark"!
~ "Pack Fast, Pull Low... and Date Your Riggers WIFE!" ~
QuoteQuote
I agree the requirements should be stiffened and eliminate the "Good ol' Boy" mentality of signing off what "did not" happen...
Is that how you got your B??Some day I will have the best staff in the world!!!
QuoteQuote
Okay, but... to get your "D"... lets also ADD:
1) Must perform at least 5 wingsuit jumps.
2) Must perform at least 5 jumps on a canopy loaded at 1.9:1 or more.
Note: 1 & 2 & the Night Jump requirement can be combined, but not recommended.
***
Can either be substituted for "Jumping The Shark"!
Yeah, yeah, I know, I'm stirin' the pot...
But seriously. If they're going to remove the night jump requirement from the D-License... or... lets say they come up wiht an E-License... then why not add something "new" that has emerged in recent years in the sport? Like Wingsuits or piloting a highly loaded high performance canopy??
OBTW... I still think the night jump requirement to get a D-License should stay.
So that you will learn why you don't need to make a low hook turn in order to miss your own shadow
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