DB Cooper

[TomKaye 1]

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Tom is contending (behind the scenes) this!

Just so everyone is clear, I have not made any comments on the markings on the tie clip. I only provided a higher res picture for everyone else to look at.

We didn't see anything of significance when we examined the tie clip under a magnifier. The marks everyone is talking about I would guess are processing marks from the stamping machine used to mass produce them.

Tom Kaye

[georger 199]

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Quote

Tom is contending (behind the scenes) this!

Just so everyone is clear, I have not made any comments on the markings on the tie clip. I only provided a higher res picture for everyone else to look at.

We didn't see anything of significance when we examined the tie clip under a magnifier. The marks everyone is talking about I would guess are processing marks from the stamping machine used to mass produce them.

Tom Kaye

You are the man with the microscope who examined the actual clip.
Good enough for me.

Microscope?

He says "we examined the tie clip under a
magnifier."

How do you get from magnifier to microscope?
Do you Knoss the difference? How and to whom,
does your opinion count?

[georger 199]

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Quote

Tom is contending (behind the scenes) this!

Just so everyone is clear, I have not made any comments on the markings on the tie clip. I only provided a higher res picture for everyone else to look at.

We didn't see anything of significance when we examined the tie clip under a magnifier. The marks everyone is talking about I would guess are processing marks from the stamping machine used to mass produce them.

Tom Kaye

Since we dont communicate at all I only report what
others report to me - you sent your photo to 'him',
he came back with the photo and commentary
supposedly from you?

I dont like the way you do business, through back
doors?

So, it would appear these "may be" actual markings
on the clasp? Not optical reproductions from the wove
in the tie as you allegedly told another ? I could not
figure out how the wove geometry got to a new form
reflecting? off the clasp?

Any markings are potentially significant?

Die cast markings? Whose die? Stamping machine?

Do you have any information about where and from
whom the clasp came from? (That is the point of this
whole exercise.)

[BobKnoss 0]

"We didn't see anything of significance when we examined the tie clip under a magnifier. The marks everyone is talking about I would guess are processing marks from the stamping machine used to mass produce them. "

Tom Kaye

Example of the week on how to introduce fuzzy evidence on a guess. 'Nobody saw anything, but I GUESS if you see something it is probably significant.' Leading statement with foul odor. They saw nothing. Carr said, "No markings." 'Caballo de mierda muertos.' 'Hilahin ang aking daliri.'

[BobKnoss 0]

'How do you get from magnifier to microscope?
Do you Knoss the difference? How and to whom,
does your opinion count?'

LOVE IT! Matt cares. It's:


Crew Training I.
M-W-F, 4-5AM RMBlevins. lab. 3 cr.
prereq. Eng. 101, Finger Pt., Beg.Troll.
class limit (1). Petition instructor.


.

[mrshutter45 21]

Quote

Quote

Tom is contending (behind the scenes) this!

Just so everyone is clear, I have not made any comments on the markings on the tie clip. I only provided a higher res picture for everyone else to look at.

We didn't see anything of significance when we examined the tie clip under a magnifier. The marks everyone is talking about I would guess are processing marks from the stamping machine used to mass produce them.

Tom Kaye

I have never seen "processing Marks" on a piece of jewelry, the basic stamp consist of the company name or initial followed by carat value, cars have a "Vin number"

I have emailed dozens of people and talked with different companies about this clip and nobody has seen any marks on the clip what so ever!

all of the clips that did have a box with the company name on it also emailed back that no markings were on the piece, in my questions to them I asked the following, Is there any marks, numbers, carat value or company name on the clip you are selling? this is very important to me for research purposes, end message.


Dear clourim,

Hi
Thank you for your question. I am very sorry but this item has been sold. The clip & cufflinks are not stamped, just the box.
Many thanks
Emma

Dear clourim,

I don't see anything that has #'s on it..The only reason I know they are from the late 60's , these were from a relative that passed away..I know how long they had them..Sorry I can't be of anymore help than that..

Dear clourim,

It is not marked. Suzette

Dear clourim,

nothing is not printed on the tie clip or the cufflinks. It is printed on the inside of the shell they are displayed in.


- storeon44

Dear clourim,

No one signed the set. So no I do not know.
Diane


- *dkeyburn

Vintage Mother of Pearl Cuff Link Tie Clip Set Silvertone, listing #35938193

Hi- Of course this was sold, so I can't have a second look at it. I think I would have mentioned it in my description if it had a brand. I don't believe this set had any marking. Sorry, I can't help you.
Helen

Anson Product reply from seller,
Dear clourim,

Hi. There are no hallmarks so I can not know if they are gold-coloured or gold-plated.
This is a full 4-piece set in its original box, that's why its more expensive.
A
- a1-cufflinks

Now, the reason no markings are on the piece would be that they were mass produced and sold out wholesale to hundreds of jewelry companies all over the United States and beyond, based on what I have learned about this piece through many emails and phone conversations that this could be the plausible reason why no marks are found, plus the fact of no Gold value to mark. If the Cooper piece has numbers on it, I find this troubling from what has been found in above comments, we would have heard some of them stating numbers on the piece, since the piece can still be found and yet nothing is on them marking wise, I find it hard to believe Coopers clip has them!

The only known companies I can recall having numbers on the jewelry is Rolex, I worked in a pawn shop in the late 80's and remember learning about Rolex watches because of the imitations that were going around, you can take off the band and it would be on the rim of the watch.

to match the serial number on a rolex http://www.bobswatches.com/rolex-watches/blog/rolex-serial-number-date-year.html

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

[georger 199]

Quote

'How do you get from magnifier to microscope?
Do you Knoss the difference? How and to whom,
does your opinion count?'

LOVE IT! Matt cares. It's:


Crew Training I.
M-W-F, 4-5AM RMBlevins. lab. 3 cr.
prereq. Eng. 101, Finger Pt., Beg.Troll.
class limit (1). Petition instructor.


.

ok I will bite.

What's your connection to military service or friends/
relatives in the military? What is the origin of
military jargon in your exigesis? MAC this, MAC that.

[georger 199]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Tom is contending (behind the scenes) this!

Just so everyone is clear, I have not made any comments on the markings on the tie clip. I only provided a higher res picture for everyone else to look at.

We didn't see anything of significance when we examined the tie clip under a magnifier. The marks everyone is talking about I would guess are processing marks from the stamping machine used to mass produce them.

Tom Kaye

I have never seen "processing Marks" on a piece of jewelry, the basic stamp consist of the company name or initial followed by carat value, cars have a "Vin number"

I have emailed dozens of people and talked with different companies about this clip and nobody has seen any marks on the clip what so ever!

all of the clips that did have a box with the company name on it also emailed back that no markings were on the piece, in my questions to them I asked the following, Is there any marks, numbers, carat value or company name on the clip you are selling? this is very important to me for research purposes, end message.


Dear clourim,

Hi
Thank you for your question. I am very sorry but this item has been sold. The clip & cufflinks are not stamped, just the box.
Many thanks
Emma

Dear clourim,

I don't see anything that has #'s on it..The only reason I know they are from the late 60's , these were from a relative that passed away..I know how long they had them..Sorry I can't be of anymore help than that..

Dear clourim,

It is not marked. Suzette

Dear clourim,

nothing is not printed on the tie clip or the cufflinks. It is printed on the inside of the shell they are displayed in.


- storeon44

Dear clourim,

No one signed the set. So no I do not know.
Diane


- *dkeyburn

Vintage Mother of Pearl Cuff Link Tie Clip Set Silvertone, listing #35938193

Hi- Of course this was sold, so I can't have a second look at it. I think I would have mentioned it in my description if it had a brand. I don't believe this set had any marking. Sorry, I can't help you.
Helen

Anson Product reply from seller,
Dear clourim,

Hi. There are no hallmarks so I can not know if they are gold-coloured or gold-plated.
This is a full 4-piece set in its original box, that's why its more expensive.
A
- a1-cufflinks

Now, the reason no markings are on the piece would be that they were mass produced and sold out wholesale to hundreds of jewelry companies all over the United States and beyond, based on what I have learned about this piece through many emails and phone conversations that this could be the plausible reason why no marks are found, plus the fact of no Gold value to mark. If the Cooper piece has numbers on it, I find this troubling from what has been found in above comments, we would have heard some of them stating numbers on the piece, since the piece can still be found and yet nothing is on them marking wise, I find it hard to believe Coopers clip has them!

The only known companies I can recall having numbers on the jewelry is Rolex, I worked in a pawn shop in the late 80's and remember learning about Rolex watches because of the imitations that were going around, you can take off the band and it would be on the rim of the watch.

to match the serial number on a rolex http://www.bobswatches.com/rolex-watches/blog/rolex-serial-number-date-year.html

Good work, Pawn Star!

Until further notice Imsiding with it being a reflection
of the wove, possibly a surface imprint of the wove
(chemical imprinting of the surface of the clasp by
chemistry in the fabric) ... but no mfg no.s which
is too bad.

When will there ever be a break in our favor that
doesnt require ten research teams and five labs?
Something ordinary@!

I could do a rain dance if it helps.

[georger 199]

Quote

Quote

Just so everyone is clear, I have not made any comments on the markings on the tie clip. I only provided a higher res picture for everyone else to look at.

We didn't see anything of significance when we examined the tie clip under a magnifier. The marks everyone is talking about I would guess are processing marks from the stamping machine used to mass produce them.

Tom Kaye

I said that Kaye looked at it under a microscope. Okay, fine. MAGNIFIER.

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I have never seen "processing Marks" on a piece of jewelry, the basic stamp consist of the company name or initial followed by carat value, cars have a "Vin number"

I believe Kaye is referring to rough spots, very tiny ones, left behind during the machining/stamping process. That's what I got from his statement. And if he says there are no numbers...I still believe him.

and someone here says he believes the Chinese
will be cloning and selling you at Walmart within five
years - just in case any duplicates show up at your
door wanting to talk your ear off and meet Gayla,
and have a BIG symposium with lots of look-alikes
all giving speeches and advice -

[BobKnoss 0]

'When will there ever be a break in our favor that
doesnt require ten research teams and five labs?
Something ordinary@!

I could do a rain dance if it helps.'

Can we 'pretty please with sugar' make an equal effort on researching the early references and relative sequence of events concerning McCoy's BYU pin?? It is only fair. McCoy now has the pin in his hands. There WAS written FBI documentation on the pin. Where did that go? FBI Agent reports in old books describe the pin. The internet has 'copy' on it. TV films of McCoy's story describe it. When was the pin replaced with the tie clasp...?? WHEN did facts change? When did the Rahleigh's disappear? Drinking cup? What else? Lax security in Evidence handling?? Carr kept the damned tie clip on his desk!!

I will support this claim as truth, without exception, forever. It is fact and there is a trail, there are living footprints, and there is written word. There are also those who would profess an untruth, hard as that might be to comprehend! MAC-MAC-MAC-MAC-AFLAC!

[Amazon 7]

Can we take people out to the DZ and throw them from a plane????

[hangdiver 1]

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Can we take people out to the DZ and throw them from a plane????

I actually used to get paid to do it...some here I'll do for free...

On the marks...it looks to me like some kind of stamping to give the solder a better grip at the attachment point...FWIW

hangdiver

"Mans got to know his limitations"
Harry Callahan

[Robert99 38]

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Can we take people out to the DZ and throw them from a plane????

Start with Blevins. He could benefit from the experience.

[Amazon 7]

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Can we take people out to the DZ and throw them from a plane????

Start with Blevins. He could benefit from the experience.

I think it would be cool to also have a reunion for the MK Ultra project at the same time.

[377 21]

Remember BK's insisting that Cooper wore a "front chute" on his back when he made the Norjack jump?

Maybe he can demo that for us at Amazon's DZ.

We can give him a knife and some suspension line to do his impromptu unconventional rigging.

Oh, and then do a 10 second delay on a 170 knot exit, as he claims Cooper did.

Yes, I admit I am violating my own suggestion about disengaging with Mr. Knoss.

I wish Tom Kaye wold talk some more here about the non alloyed titanium residue and aluminum curls and what he thinks it means.

I wondered if it came from the main chutes and Norman's machine shop but Bruce inquired and Norman was not using titanium in his shop prior to the Norjack jump. (Thanks Bruce).

If Cooper was a manager type in a titanium processing plant that would sure narrow down the list.

I've been working around commercial vessels since I was 11. I saw no routine use of titanium in the 60s or early 70s. It was too hard to work with, expensive and the weight reduction wasnt needed. When we needed corrosion resistant metals we used stainless steel, bronze and hot dipped galvanized steel.

Maybe Sailshaw can chime in. Sailboats, especially racing types, are always on the cutting edge for using exotic materials if they save weight and are strong.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 21]

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Can we take people out to the DZ and throw them from a plane????

Start with Blevins. He could benefit from the experience.

I think it would be cool to also have a reunion for the MK Ultra project at the same time.

Well Amazon, if you are gonna have an MK Ultra day at the DZ you'll need hookers and LSD, both of which were employed by the CIA. Drug procurement won't be an insurmountable problem at a DZ, but hookers? DZ sex is traditionally free.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[mrshutter45 21]

Pawn Star...Good one
I guess I kind of jumped the gun this morning, I was thinking Tom was referring to numbers vs process markings, I had just woken up and went on a typing binge!

I was also hoping something could be on the clip to identify it's source, Bob seems to have this answer as well, I think we should all pack it in because Knoss has all of the answers to every question asked! AMAZING!

Parachute (ask Knoss)
Tie Clip (ask Knoss)
Flight path (ask Knoss)
Make-Up (ask Knoss)
Proof (don't ask Knoss)
reveal Mac (don't ask Knoss)
Flip Jo's story (ask Knoss)
Draft Conviction (don't ask Knoss)

If the Vietnam War draft is a guide, the odds favor people who resist. Most of the people who resisted illegally -- especially those who never registered -- were never caught. They weren't drafted, they didn't go to prison, and they were never even charged in court. Even of the 210,000 men who were formally accused of violating the draft laws, only 4,000 went to prison. Another 5,000 got probation, and 41,000 avoided prosecution by submitting to induction. The rest -- more than 75% -- were either never caught, never went to trial, won in court, or flunked their induction physicals! and ONE was able to be part of a Government cover up for dodging! AMAZING! what are the odds

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

[georger 199]

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Pawn Star...Good one
I guess I kind of jumped the gun this morning, I was thinking Tom was referring to numbers vs process markings, I had just woken up and went on a typing binge!

I was also hoping something could be on the clip to identify it's source, Bob seems to have this answer as well, I think we should all pack it in because Knoss has all of the answers to every question asked! AMAZING!

glad you saw te humor - no problem.

[skyjack71 0]

[RED]NOTE PICTURE ATTACHED:
TAKEN OF OLD DUANE AND I.
NO MAKE UP NEEDED. REMEMBER HE IS VERY OLD IN THIS PIC AND NOTE - I HAVE MEDIUM TO FAIR OLIVE COMPLEXION.[/RED]

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[smokin99 0]

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Can we take people out to the DZ and throw them from a plane????

With or without a chute??

Sigh.....

but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

[BobKnoss 0]

".....Bob seems to have this answer as well, I think we should all pack it in because Knoss has all of the answers to every question asked! AMAZING!"

Everyone has some kind of answer to anything you want to discuss. The PROBLEM is not that they do not have a right to have an opinion, it is giving proper weight to what was presented. A wild-assed guess is just a possibility based on questionable logic. An educated guess is also just a possibility, but based on reasonable logic. Reasonable logic does not apply in this case as it was designed by a dislexic pilot. Everything is illogical.

Yes, I usually have an answer to most anything based on what first hand information I have. Some of that was pre-jump, some was post-jump. It is all REAL and from the mouths of the REAL people involved. You can scoff and tease all you want, but when someone offers false information it is like, WHOA! that ain't right at ALL! The longer this story goes, the more crap gets added 'til there is no truth left. The truth is still the truth and misinformation may block it's view, but little gold nuggets of truth still shine through the haze and blue clouds of BS.

I will sweep home base so you can judge the bad pitches, or good pitches that are not 'on the money'. I just want one of the optional stories to be honest facts. Tease all you want, I will have told the truth. Jo knows most of what I say is right. She has some weird idea for protecting the living conspirators but ratting on the FBI. Well, Ralph and Nick are living, Jo. She won't give up McCoy, or the other guy, just call them 'footprints'. Geoff had to tell it to get it said.

So, yes, I know most of the answers, but 'the Crew to protect the other guy' will ALWAYS post a strong and opposing accusation, threat or troll/flame, or scheme to discount my input. Jo will ALWAYS contest what is not consistent with her half-true concoction of whatever it is that she determines is a good reading 'Duane' story. I have yet to see the FBI weigh in on anything! Especially the BYU pin. Take this opportunity to research the BYU pin with me and see if obvious truth doesn't lay beneath that thin web of subtrafuge and deception that can be exposed. I KNOW it and can SHOW it, but YOU need to SEE it. Proof is in the PUTTIN'.

[mrshutter45 21]

when did you get your draft notice in the mail? should be easy for you given the fact that you remember so well

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

[BobKnoss 0]

"...and ONE was able to be part of a Government cover up..."

One that you know about. There may have been scores. That hypnosis outfit was no Mickey Mouse affair. That was an expensive rig that had "big operator" written all over it. Opposition to the draft was not a safe position to hold. It generated retaliation. Remember? I do. All of it.

[mrshutter45 21]

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"...and ONE was able to be part of a Government cover up..."

One that you know about. There may have been scores. That hypnosis outfit was no Mickey Mouse affair. That was an expensive rig that had "big operator" written all over it. Opposition to the draft was not a safe position to hold. It generated retaliation. Remember? I do. All of it.

When did you get yout draft notice in the mail? I don't need the "Corporate double talk"

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

[BobKnoss 0]

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when did you get your draft notice in the mail? should be easy for you given the fact that you remember so well

Spring of 68 probably mid March 68. I drove a light blue 54 Ford 2dr to 2nd St. and 3rd Ave. I parked on the west side of the street (3rd) facing south, about in the middle of the block and walked up a long flight of cement stairs to the building. Nobody else around until I got to the right room. I presented my letter from Doctor Thayer of Fairmont, MN. and went right to the front of the procession to be examined by a Doctor who told me to leave.

Two FBI Agents then made a call on Doctor Thayer in person. Thayer called me to advise that he had been given a stern warning and to apologize for causing me any trouble. I told him it was all taken care of, which totally baffled him.

And THAT is the truth about THAT.