ltdiver 3
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Maybe Weber suddenly left CO and his 'good' job because he was embezzling the firm he was working for (which is why he seemed to be doing so well) and realized he was about to be found out, and needed to get out of there fast.
Skyjack has already slightly backtracked on her conviction it was Duane anyway, it now includes "or at least knew who Cooper was" (or words to that effect). Which I presume comes from the "that's where cooper walked out of the woods" comment. But if there is a corpse under the canopy they found, then he never did walk iout of the woods...
Maybe Weber suddenly left CO and his 'good' job because he was embezzling the firm he was working for (which is why he seemed to be doing so well) and realized he was about to be found out, and needed to get out of there fast.
Skyjack has already slightly backtracked on her conviction it was Duane anyway, it now includes "or at least knew who Cooper was" (or words to that effect). Which I presume comes from the "that's where cooper walked out of the woods" comment. But if there is a corpse under the canopy they found, then he never did walk iout of the woods...
I will clarify ONE more time - this is the second or third time I have had to repeat this for you.
1. Duane did not handle money and this Company rehired Duane 2 yrs later and made him the State manager. He was always the leader in sales of everything he did - he just had to keep looking over his shoulder because ex-cons cannot hold an insurance license.
2. I have never "BACKTRACKED". The expression "if he wasn't Cooper he sure as hell knew who Cooper was." is a tooth and nail expression - because of the negative stance the FBI has taken with the DNA that was not maintained by the chain of possession and the fact that the cigarette butts are missing is proof of that.
I do not want to repeat this again. Go back and re-read the posts on the other thread. Please stop making "assumptions" and there was no reason to make a malicious "dig".
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber
QuoteSomething I didn't know was that the aft stairs were 'shredded' by the time they landed in Reno.
They were shredded because they were down when they landed - this damage was NOT caused while they were in flight. The crew and authorities decided that it was too dangerous for someone to go back and raise the aftstairs.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber
Orange1 0
Quote
I will clarify ONE more time - this is the second or third time I have had to repeat this for you.
You may be confusing me with someone else, I have never before put that assumption down in writing, so you can't possibly have clarified it for me before.
Sorry for taking your other sentence literally, I honestly thought what you said was what you meant.
I also fail to see where i made a malicious "dig". The first was simply an example that there is sometimes more than one explanation for an event, the second bit as i said...just taking at face value what you said. Sorry if that somehow came across as malicious.
Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.
ltdiver 3
QuoteQuoteSomething I didn't know was that the aft stairs were 'shredded' by the time they landed in Reno.
They were shredded because they were down when they landed - this damage was NOT caused while they were in flight. The crew and authorities decided that it was too dangerous for someone to go back and raise the aftstairs.
Obviously.
Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon
novalis 0
i would like to thank those of you who replied to my message. gave me some interesting insights for me to think over.
i realize that since none of us know the man (or if any of you do, you're not admitting it) that any conjectures on him remain just that. i am also aware that even if something seems to me, you, most, or all of us to be "likely" or "probable" we still do not know.
the hypothesis which governs my thought is that he was not a novice jumper. i think this because all other aspects of his "day in the air" seem to me to indicate that he thought things through. i see no reason why this personality changes and becomes the man who, on a jump is going to "play it by ear". i assume he was quite experienced. why do some others think he was a novice? i think because he took such a chance on the jump.
but i would tend to put that down to over boldness. after all, in attempting the hijacking at all, he seems to have had an overabundance of self-confidence, a strong desire to "show" the airline (or "the world") that he could take on a whole lot of people in a test of cunning and will and emerge vidtorious.
now if that hypothesis of his character can be accepted for a moment, i do not think that he jumped out of the plane as a novice. i see no reason why, with the jump, he suddenly becomes a person who does not prepare for the "fight". ( this does not mean he succeeds of course.)
as the answers to my note point out a lot can go wrong and to break a foot under the weather and geographical conditons that obtained could have been fatal. and here, perhaps his overconfidence or high opinion of himself made him think that he could succeed where others would fail?
i think he put considerable planing into the jump, including where.
as i say, these are my hypotheses, i am making no claims.
one reason that i think he would have known that he could not get to mexico is the following: if a person prepares for a hijacking, down to knowing things like fuel loading times and, the matter about flap angles, won't he ask the question: can the thing reach the destination i want?
that raises the question: did he really want to go to mexico? is there any reason for the altitude he wanted to fly at, other than that he planned to jump "somewhere" before he got to mexico in any case?
as far as the radio is concerned: i confess i assume that he did not have a bomb. (i think this because i believe he had a lot of faith in himself and even if the authorities had called his bluff, he would have wanted to live and fight another day. he strikes me as the type who whould take jail as a challenge to "jump out of" too.) if he does not have a bomb, the question is whether he made use of that space for something else? how small were walkie talkies etc? could they, or a radio, have been packed into his fake bomb?
unfortunately some of the technical details of the jump, which i thought were facts, have been contested.
assuming he did ask for one type of parachute in preference to another, one with a ripcord?, does that say anything about him or his intentions? why would the other parachute not suit him as well?
thanks.
novalis
i realize that since none of us know the man (or if any of you do, you're not admitting it) that any conjectures on him remain just that. i am also aware that even if something seems to me, you, most, or all of us to be "likely" or "probable" we still do not know.
the hypothesis which governs my thought is that he was not a novice jumper. i think this because all other aspects of his "day in the air" seem to me to indicate that he thought things through. i see no reason why this personality changes and becomes the man who, on a jump is going to "play it by ear". i assume he was quite experienced. why do some others think he was a novice? i think because he took such a chance on the jump.
but i would tend to put that down to over boldness. after all, in attempting the hijacking at all, he seems to have had an overabundance of self-confidence, a strong desire to "show" the airline (or "the world") that he could take on a whole lot of people in a test of cunning and will and emerge vidtorious.
now if that hypothesis of his character can be accepted for a moment, i do not think that he jumped out of the plane as a novice. i see no reason why, with the jump, he suddenly becomes a person who does not prepare for the "fight". ( this does not mean he succeeds of course.)
as the answers to my note point out a lot can go wrong and to break a foot under the weather and geographical conditons that obtained could have been fatal. and here, perhaps his overconfidence or high opinion of himself made him think that he could succeed where others would fail?
i think he put considerable planing into the jump, including where.
as i say, these are my hypotheses, i am making no claims.
one reason that i think he would have known that he could not get to mexico is the following: if a person prepares for a hijacking, down to knowing things like fuel loading times and, the matter about flap angles, won't he ask the question: can the thing reach the destination i want?
that raises the question: did he really want to go to mexico? is there any reason for the altitude he wanted to fly at, other than that he planned to jump "somewhere" before he got to mexico in any case?
as far as the radio is concerned: i confess i assume that he did not have a bomb. (i think this because i believe he had a lot of faith in himself and even if the authorities had called his bluff, he would have wanted to live and fight another day. he strikes me as the type who whould take jail as a challenge to "jump out of" too.) if he does not have a bomb, the question is whether he made use of that space for something else? how small were walkie talkies etc? could they, or a radio, have been packed into his fake bomb?
unfortunately some of the technical details of the jump, which i thought were facts, have been contested.
assuming he did ask for one type of parachute in preference to another, one with a ripcord?, does that say anything about him or his intentions? why would the other parachute not suit him as well?
thanks.
novalis
novalis 0
dear mr sluggo,
thank you for your note.
i have perhaps naively trusted wikapedia and a crime site. at one of these i read that cooper was irritated at what he took to be slow refueling.
could you please give me a reference to the transcripts and i will no longer be dependent on secondary sources?
thanks.
novalis
ps
on the relationship to the crew:
as a pilot are you aware of any sop during a hijacking; for example the pilot does not leave the cockpit to talk to the hijacker: his place is in the cabin, it would upset the passengers to see it etc.? again if my sources are right, not all the passengers knew there was a hijacking going on. this can be attributed to conduct of the crew and the hijacker? nobody wanted panic.
after the passengers have left communication continues through the stewerdess. was this a demand of the hijacker? did he feel more secure with a young woman than with a pilot's presence? a pilot might be able to overwelm him etc.
thank you for your note.
i have perhaps naively trusted wikapedia and a crime site. at one of these i read that cooper was irritated at what he took to be slow refueling.
could you please give me a reference to the transcripts and i will no longer be dependent on secondary sources?
thanks.
novalis
ps
on the relationship to the crew:
as a pilot are you aware of any sop during a hijacking; for example the pilot does not leave the cockpit to talk to the hijacker: his place is in the cabin, it would upset the passengers to see it etc.? again if my sources are right, not all the passengers knew there was a hijacking going on. this can be attributed to conduct of the crew and the hijacker? nobody wanted panic.
after the passengers have left communication continues through the stewerdess. was this a demand of the hijacker? did he feel more secure with a young woman than with a pilot's presence? a pilot might be able to overwelm him etc.
nigel99 144
QuoteQuote......
Him allegedly describing how hang gliders steer.
........................
i got the impression that he knew about paragliding (groundlaunching)
I don't think there was any paragliding in those days. AFAIK that sport started when people started using square parachutes to launch off mountains with - i have never heard of any paragliding under rounds, ever. (So he may have known about paragliding, but that would have years later?)
Hang-gliders steer through weight shifting, whereas round parchutes that are vaguely steerable do not. Paragliding has no relevance to this jump. With all due respect I think that any confusion between hang-gliding/paragliding and a round parachute jump is purely based on a "whuffo" misunderstanding that they are all made of fabric and enable humans to be off the ground.
A side note on the experience angle is that around that time you did not need many jumps to be "experienced" - it may be in the scary stories thread where at least once a person with 6 jumps was jump master. I am not familiar with the equipment in question, but I have jumped T10's and C9's and I don't believe it would be very difficult for a whuffo to kit up and understand the basic stuff - ripcord big silver handles, capewells would have no relevance, and then fairly simple leg straps and chest strap. This does not mean that I believe an inexperienced person would actually pull. Throughout history there have been idiots who believed they were able to do the impossible.
However IF Cooper specified "back" parachute then it implies knowledge - a whuffo would automatically assume a parachute is a parachute. However this still does not need to be a jumper, perhaps a packer, lurker at a dz, or maybe even a storeman at a military establishment involved with paras?
Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.
novalis 0
i have a question concerning the money: maybe this is the wrong board, but you seem to have looked into many aspects of the case.
when we read that the bills never turned up, how significant is this, IF they were spent? does every $20 at the end of its usefulness turn up in some central federal facility, and is every $20 bill looked at and checked against, god knows how many, lists of serial numbers that for one reason or the other--kidnappings, bank robberies etc.-- are of interest to some federal or state police force?
(this sounds like a very big job to me. my suspicion is that the bills could have been spent without necessarily turning up in such a check--assuming there is such a check at the end of a bank note's road. ) do you know anything about this angle?
on the other hand, what do i do as an individual with so many $20 bills which i am pretty sure the feds are looking for? i can't just use them one at a time at the local stores for fear that they turn up that way and pin point me. do i take trips to other cities and buy big items with a wad of 20s? that might raise suspicions too.
i suppose i am asking are $20s far enough below the "radar screen" that i can get rid of them without them necessarily being noticed, even if a fed. agency is interested in them?
when we read that the bills never turned up, how significant is this, IF they were spent? does every $20 at the end of its usefulness turn up in some central federal facility, and is every $20 bill looked at and checked against, god knows how many, lists of serial numbers that for one reason or the other--kidnappings, bank robberies etc.-- are of interest to some federal or state police force?
(this sounds like a very big job to me. my suspicion is that the bills could have been spent without necessarily turning up in such a check--assuming there is such a check at the end of a bank note's road. ) do you know anything about this angle?
on the other hand, what do i do as an individual with so many $20 bills which i am pretty sure the feds are looking for? i can't just use them one at a time at the local stores for fear that they turn up that way and pin point me. do i take trips to other cities and buy big items with a wad of 20s? that might raise suspicions too.
i suppose i am asking are $20s far enough below the "radar screen" that i can get rid of them without them necessarily being noticed, even if a fed. agency is interested in them?
labrys 0
Quotei suppose i am asking are $20s far enough below the "radar screen" that i can get rid of them without them necessarily being noticed, even if a fed. agency is interested in them?
I've wondered the same thing about how carefully money is really checked. One thing to remember is that a $20.00 wasn't as far below the radar as it is now. It would have been more like a $100.00 back then.
Owned by Remi #?
You're close on the value of the $20, which is one reason I think their useful life was longer than what they are now (2 yrs).
The odds of discovery would go as follows:
(Total number of spent Cooper bills divided by total number of 20s in US circulation) x total number of times every bill changed hands before destruction x probability of someone checking a bill against the ransom list = odds of discovery
This is total fudging the numbers... I'm putting this just to illustrate the above equation. We know for fact that Cooper did not spend all of the money, but I will use 10k for the number of bills anyway.
10,000 divided by 1 billion 20s in circulation
This equals 0.00001
The average bill may change hands say twice a week for two years (most of these were already two years old when given to Cooper) or 104 x 10,000 = 1,040,000.
0.00001 x 1,040,000 = 10.4
Times the probability that someone was checking 20s against the ransom list.
This is the hard part to quantify. Let's put it this way, the odds were not that great unless he spent the money in the Northwest and he did it less than a year after the crime. The only ones who would have checked would have been bank tellers. Dispute that contention if you want, but think it through... banks were pretty much the only ones who had a ransom list. It's not like a corner grocer was whipping out his Cooper ransom list (that has 10,000 numbers on it) and checking every 20 against it....
Probability will work like this: 100 tellers check ALL 20s against the ransom list (I doubt it was this high), and the total number of places money can change hands would be in the billions. We'll just make it easy and use 1 billion.
100 divided by 1 billion = 0.0000001
Probability:
10.4 x 0.0000001 = 0.00000104
Or
1 in 961,538
That's not very good odds of discovering a spent Cooper bill in circulation.
The Feds only check for counterfeit bills and did not record S/Ns as they destroy.
Knowing that Cooper, at the very most, spent less than the full amount would reduce those odds. If Skyjack71's theory of money were close to what really happened (and that theory aspect is extremely strong) then we'd expect Cooper to leave behind a substantial amount of the ransom. The probability of discovery would get lower and lower as he spent less.
The odds of discovery would go as follows:
(Total number of spent Cooper bills divided by total number of 20s in US circulation) x total number of times every bill changed hands before destruction x probability of someone checking a bill against the ransom list = odds of discovery
This is total fudging the numbers... I'm putting this just to illustrate the above equation. We know for fact that Cooper did not spend all of the money, but I will use 10k for the number of bills anyway.
10,000 divided by 1 billion 20s in circulation
This equals 0.00001
The average bill may change hands say twice a week for two years (most of these were already two years old when given to Cooper) or 104 x 10,000 = 1,040,000.
0.00001 x 1,040,000 = 10.4
Times the probability that someone was checking 20s against the ransom list.
This is the hard part to quantify. Let's put it this way, the odds were not that great unless he spent the money in the Northwest and he did it less than a year after the crime. The only ones who would have checked would have been bank tellers. Dispute that contention if you want, but think it through... banks were pretty much the only ones who had a ransom list. It's not like a corner grocer was whipping out his Cooper ransom list (that has 10,000 numbers on it) and checking every 20 against it....
Probability will work like this: 100 tellers check ALL 20s against the ransom list (I doubt it was this high), and the total number of places money can change hands would be in the billions. We'll just make it easy and use 1 billion.
100 divided by 1 billion = 0.0000001
Probability:
10.4 x 0.0000001 = 0.00000104
Or
1 in 961,538
That's not very good odds of discovering a spent Cooper bill in circulation.
The Feds only check for counterfeit bills and did not record S/Ns as they destroy.
Knowing that Cooper, at the very most, spent less than the full amount would reduce those odds. If Skyjack71's theory of money were close to what really happened (and that theory aspect is extremely strong) then we'd expect Cooper to leave behind a substantial amount of the ransom. The probability of discovery would get lower and lower as he spent less.
novalis 0
you have gone into some detail. thank you. that was my feeling too: if you don't go spending the money right away down the block, you have a chance of gettin through-- apparently a pretty good chance.
that would explain why he wanted 20s.
can we assume that he asked for the sum of $200,000 in 20s because he knew something about parachuting from a plane carrying a load with him? that is my assumption.
that would explain why he wanted 20s.
can we assume that he asked for the sum of $200,000 in 20s because he knew something about parachuting from a plane carrying a load with him? that is my assumption.
"back in the day" rigging practices were not (how shall i say?)as precise as they are today.even tho the faa had a 22 lb pull force rule, rarely did anyone use a fishscale to check it.i myself was victim to what ya mite call neanderthal rigging( the reserve that i wore on my first jump could not be pulled even by 2 people on the ground.seems that when the rigger who assembled it installed the power ripcord handle for the sentinal auto opener, they did not make the ripcord pocket bigger to accommodate the bulk of the power r/c cylinder.anyway i had a partial mal on my first jump,BUT managed to clear it.lucky me.)
but it would be interesting to find out just why this particular chute(s) was chosen .
but it would be interesting to find out just why this particular chute(s) was chosen .
NickDG 23
>>I don't know what it was - it was 1978 somewhere around Boulder Colorado up in the hills and these guys were jumping off the cliffs
Hi Joe,
I spent 1978 living in Denver and was jumping at a small DZ in Littleton which is just south of Denver. And I recall hearing something similar to the above.
I don't think most skydivers were aware of paragliding until PARACHUTIST Magazine ran an article on it later in about 1982. But it actually has a rather long history as you can see here:
http://www.circlinghawk.com/history.html
We tried it for the first time in 1980 with Strato Stars and spent a day laughing our butts off as we tumbled down some local hills in balls of flapping nylon and flailing limbs . . .
However, even the guys who had it somewhat figured out weren't doing much "gliding up in the air" as these flights were mostly what's called "sled rides" as the canopies of the time didn't generate much lift.
NickD 
that would explain why he wanted 20s.
He didn't ask for twenties. That's myth. He only requested the ransom in cash and to be in a knapsack. The bills were already set aside for this type of situation (ransom demands), so they just used what they had.
He didn't ask for twenties. That's myth. He only requested the ransom in cash and to be in a knapsack. The bills were already set aside for this type of situation (ransom demands), so they just used what they had.
i kindof just skipped to the end here so i missed if you guys actually think that the parachute was DB cooper's.
you should probably think that the parachute, being left out for 35 ish years would not be in any condition to handle, let alone there be anything left of it, recognisable as a parachute.
my idea, is that someone living in a fantasy world
, thinking that they are DB cooper, got a hold of an old parachute, from about the same era, plants it in a field to be plowed, and waits for someone to discover it and create some hype in the community or to prove to himself in some sick way that he is DB cooper. OR maybe someone affiliated with the media did it, so we wont have to keep talking about celebrity news. which i agree is a worthy reason to do such a thing, fake, interesting news is better than caleb new any day.
anyways. just thinkin.
We choose to do these things not because they are easy but because they are hard, to push the envelope, to break free, to make what was once impossible possible.
i kindof just skipped to the end here so i missed if you guys actually think that the parachute was DB cooper's.
I think I put my own view as 80% not Cooper's, 20% Cooper's... but I just can't shake the location of the find. There's not really a DZ there. Like Ckret said, highly coincidental if it's not one of the parachutes. Therefore, I'm going to adjust my thinking up some... 60% not Cooper's, 40% Cooper's.
Technically you can say that I do not think it's Coopers, but a big part of me thinks this is it.
I can't speak for the others, but many seem to think it would be the dummy chute if it were Cooper's.
I think I put my own view as 80% not Cooper's, 20% Cooper's... but I just can't shake the location of the find. There's not really a DZ there. Like Ckret said, highly coincidental if it's not one of the parachutes. Therefore, I'm going to adjust my thinking up some... 60% not Cooper's, 40% Cooper's.
Technically you can say that I do not think it's Coopers, but a big part of me thinks this is it.
I can't speak for the others, but many seem to think it would be the dummy chute if it were Cooper's.
http://a-list.msn.com/
Today's hot topic on MSN? Yep.
If you visit the link beyond today, it will change. But if you happen to view the page before it goes away, then you'll see what I was referring to last week... they still insist on using the original sketch, even though it was revised not once but twice!
I still say, if he got away with it or if he is never identified, then using the Bing Crosby sketch will be a big part of why. Personal opinion, but that's what I think.
FYI, the unsolved history is airing tonight on Discovery. I looked this up two weeks ago (because I wanted to watch it) and it was scheduled back then, so it's just coincidence that they're running this particular episode tonight.
Check your local listings for the time. This is the one where they did the FRS test and a simulated jump. They also, if I remember correctly, went over to USC's diving pool and tested how well a bag of money would float. Skyjack71 makes a cameo appearance.
Today's hot topic on MSN? Yep.
If you visit the link beyond today, it will change. But if you happen to view the page before it goes away, then you'll see what I was referring to last week... they still insist on using the original sketch, even though it was revised not once but twice!
I still say, if he got away with it or if he is never identified, then using the Bing Crosby sketch will be a big part of why. Personal opinion, but that's what I think.
FYI, the unsolved history is airing tonight on Discovery. I looked this up two weeks ago (because I wanted to watch it) and it was scheduled back then, so it's just coincidence that they're running this particular episode tonight.
Check your local listings for the time. This is the one where they did the FRS test and a simulated jump. They also, if I remember correctly, went over to USC's diving pool and tested how well a bag of money would float. Skyjack71 makes a cameo appearance.
Orange1,
I think she was refering to my post from yesterday.
It was actually a friendly recognition that we have some differences in what the jump time was. The target was my friend and colaborator SafecrackingPLF.
Let's face it, we all have our beliefs.
Jo,
Sorry you took it that way.
Sluggo_Monster
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NORJAK Forum
I think she was refering to my post from yesterday.
It was actually a friendly recognition that we have some differences in what the jump time was. The target was my friend and colaborator SafecrackingPLF.
Let's face it, we all have our beliefs.
Jo,
Sorry you took it that way.
Sluggo_Monster
Web Page
Blog
NORJAK Forum
Yes, I knew it was a dig on me... I'm pretty much the only one that gripes about changing the timeline. It's just friendly jestering amongst friends.
I was going to call Himmelsbach this week and get a better feel for why the FBI was so adamant about the timeline. I will still make this phone call, but with everything that happened this week, I decided not to make the call because I was sure his phone was ringing off the hook!
Stay tuned. I will do my best to figure out more regarding the timeline.. but it will have to wait for some of the media frenzy to die down.
I was going to call Himmelsbach this week and get a better feel for why the FBI was so adamant about the timeline. I will still make this phone call, but with everything that happened this week, I decided not to make the call because I was sure his phone was ringing off the hook!
Stay tuned. I will do my best to figure out more regarding the timeline.. but it will have to wait for some of the media frenzy to die down.
ltdiver 3
Quote
you should probably think that the parachute, being left out for 35 ish years would not be in any condition to handle, let alone there be anything left of it, recognisable as a parachute.
You're most likely correct on this idea, however IF the canopy was the dummy chest reserve it was sewn shut and inside the container it most likely could have withstood many years of being buried without significant damage to the canopy. If the father's tractor ripped it apart as he was grading his property for the road that's the first direct exposure the canopy had to the elements since Cossey packed it. Something to consider.
ltdiver
Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon
Orange1 0
QuoteOrange1,
I think she was refering to my post from yesterday.
Indeed? I wonder if she could be bothered apologising for jumping down my throat that way then.
Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.
Ckret 0
I can't discuss the chute at this time, but will tell you about it in a few days.
The issue I have and will continue to have with posting here is that perception is reality no matter the fact. When someone has the ability to shape perception as he or she desires regardless to fact, I have issue with that from the stance of what and who I represent. I am sure you can see how this can be a big problem, lets try this one more time.
We have some breaks in the case to go over and actually I am surprised none of you caught it. Now more than ever I believe Cooper lost his money in the air and screwed into the ground without ever pulling.
I believe this for all of the reasons I have posted in the past that I don't have the energy to repost and the following:
Cooper had a choice when he picked which chutes to use in his jump, two belly reserves and two back reserves. Which one he chooses speaks volumes to his experience and knowledge of what he was getting himself into.
When faced with which belly reserve he was going to use and which he was going to cut up, he chose to cut up the good one. The other belly reserve was marked with X's and would have been "soft" to the touch when handled.
The agent who originally interviewed Cossey mistakenly reported it was sewn shut. it was not sewn shut, the canopy was cut in half and the panels then sewn together. This was done so that when students practiced deploying the emergency canopy they could easily gather it and quickly stuff it back in the container for another practice throw.
Anyone with any amount of experience would have know the x's on the container meant, "you might not want to use this one when jumping out of a plane." Also, when he picked it up it would have been very obvious, if you have any amount of experience, (by that I mean how tight containers are packed) that something was wrong because it would have been "squishy" (not my word but from someone who would know what the belly reserve would have felt like). If he deployed it, it would have been like one of those guns you pull the trigger and a flag comes out of the barrel that says, "bang."
Of course the counter to this is he did know and threw it out of the plane. If he took the time to throw one he would have thrown all. It makes no sense to throw only one.
Now the choice of the back chute and this is where I am surprised no one caught this. He had two choices, an NB6 with no padding and no sleeve or a fully padded Pioneer sport chute with a sleeve. If you had any knowledge of the challenges you were facing with the jump you were about to make, why would you choose the NB6, you wouldn't.
Also, the pull on the NB6 would have been challenging, not just from the 28' canopy put into it, but from where the handle was positioned. If Cooper wore his jacket his lapel would have covered it. it also had to be deployed by pulling in two directions, out and up. If Cooper would have just pulled in one direction the chute would not have deployed.
So here is my theory, nothing new juts more proof.
Cooper was in the military during the time frame of 1946 to 1951, give or take a few years. He was stationed out of McChord or Ft Lewis. He served on an air crew in some capacity and received cursory training in emergency exit (which is why he chose the military chute over the obvious choice, it was all he knew).
After leaving the military, he was employed in the airline industry but not in any fashion that would give him detailed knowledge but general knowledge of a planes. Most likely as a contractor for Boeing.
At some point in the late 60's or early 70's Cooper was fired or laid off and left the area. Cooper, where ever he went, never assimilated into his new life, no friends no wife no family. He formulated his plan not too long before November 71 and sold or threw out all he owned, because he was starting a new life.
He made his way to Portland's airport, no one missing him from where he came and no one missing him from his time in the northwest and airline industry.
I'll skip ahead (you know or have access to all the details):
He jumps and the pressure bump is felt by the crew, but not at 8:11 more around 8:15 to 8:20. The bag of money Cooper tied to him is instantly ripped from his waist as he tumbles. Cooper, not expecting the forces of the jump, desperately tries to pull the handle but he can't find it, panics and no pulls.
The theory on the money and it's discovery by natural means in 1980 go here and I do believe it is the most solid.
Now what?
We have to find the farthest northwest location that the bag could have landed and emptied into the Washougal Water Shed, keeping in mind the 77 flood.
next we have to drop a canvass bag of money from 10,000 feet and see how far it travels under conditions. Then we have to take that data and extrapolate it to 11/24/71.
With these two items we can find a new flight path and location of the pressure bump. With that, we can come up with a new AB line and if cooper did a no pull locate his resting place at the new point A.
To find out who he was, we need a list of all who served on flight crews out of McChord from 46 to 51. I think we can rule out pilots, even if they were not jumpers they have to much awareness of the forces at play and would have thought better of the jump or did it like McCoy.
Once we have that list, find all from 5'10 to 6'1 brown hair, brown eyes. Then a quick background, if they were alive after 11/71 they can be ruled out. If they disappeared after 1971 then we have a suspect.
The first part is do-able, the second will take some huge effort and the cooperation of those who have other things to worry about right now.
The issue I have and will continue to have with posting here is that perception is reality no matter the fact. When someone has the ability to shape perception as he or she desires regardless to fact, I have issue with that from the stance of what and who I represent. I am sure you can see how this can be a big problem, lets try this one more time.
We have some breaks in the case to go over and actually I am surprised none of you caught it. Now more than ever I believe Cooper lost his money in the air and screwed into the ground without ever pulling.
I believe this for all of the reasons I have posted in the past that I don't have the energy to repost and the following:
Cooper had a choice when he picked which chutes to use in his jump, two belly reserves and two back reserves. Which one he chooses speaks volumes to his experience and knowledge of what he was getting himself into.
When faced with which belly reserve he was going to use and which he was going to cut up, he chose to cut up the good one. The other belly reserve was marked with X's and would have been "soft" to the touch when handled.
The agent who originally interviewed Cossey mistakenly reported it was sewn shut. it was not sewn shut, the canopy was cut in half and the panels then sewn together. This was done so that when students practiced deploying the emergency canopy they could easily gather it and quickly stuff it back in the container for another practice throw.
Anyone with any amount of experience would have know the x's on the container meant, "you might not want to use this one when jumping out of a plane." Also, when he picked it up it would have been very obvious, if you have any amount of experience, (by that I mean how tight containers are packed) that something was wrong because it would have been "squishy" (not my word but from someone who would know what the belly reserve would have felt like). If he deployed it, it would have been like one of those guns you pull the trigger and a flag comes out of the barrel that says, "bang."
Of course the counter to this is he did know and threw it out of the plane. If he took the time to throw one he would have thrown all. It makes no sense to throw only one.
Now the choice of the back chute and this is where I am surprised no one caught this. He had two choices, an NB6 with no padding and no sleeve or a fully padded Pioneer sport chute with a sleeve. If you had any knowledge of the challenges you were facing with the jump you were about to make, why would you choose the NB6, you wouldn't.
Also, the pull on the NB6 would have been challenging, not just from the 28' canopy put into it, but from where the handle was positioned. If Cooper wore his jacket his lapel would have covered it. it also had to be deployed by pulling in two directions, out and up. If Cooper would have just pulled in one direction the chute would not have deployed.
So here is my theory, nothing new juts more proof.
Cooper was in the military during the time frame of 1946 to 1951, give or take a few years. He was stationed out of McChord or Ft Lewis. He served on an air crew in some capacity and received cursory training in emergency exit (which is why he chose the military chute over the obvious choice, it was all he knew).
After leaving the military, he was employed in the airline industry but not in any fashion that would give him detailed knowledge but general knowledge of a planes. Most likely as a contractor for Boeing.
At some point in the late 60's or early 70's Cooper was fired or laid off and left the area. Cooper, where ever he went, never assimilated into his new life, no friends no wife no family. He formulated his plan not too long before November 71 and sold or threw out all he owned, because he was starting a new life.
He made his way to Portland's airport, no one missing him from where he came and no one missing him from his time in the northwest and airline industry.
I'll skip ahead (you know or have access to all the details):
He jumps and the pressure bump is felt by the crew, but not at 8:11 more around 8:15 to 8:20. The bag of money Cooper tied to him is instantly ripped from his waist as he tumbles. Cooper, not expecting the forces of the jump, desperately tries to pull the handle but he can't find it, panics and no pulls.
The theory on the money and it's discovery by natural means in 1980 go here and I do believe it is the most solid.
Now what?
We have to find the farthest northwest location that the bag could have landed and emptied into the Washougal Water Shed, keeping in mind the 77 flood.
next we have to drop a canvass bag of money from 10,000 feet and see how far it travels under conditions. Then we have to take that data and extrapolate it to 11/24/71.
With these two items we can find a new flight path and location of the pressure bump. With that, we can come up with a new AB line and if cooper did a no pull locate his resting place at the new point A.
To find out who he was, we need a list of all who served on flight crews out of McChord from 46 to 51. I think we can rule out pilots, even if they were not jumpers they have to much awareness of the forces at play and would have thought better of the jump or did it like McCoy.
Once we have that list, find all from 5'10 to 6'1 brown hair, brown eyes. Then a quick background, if they were alive after 11/71 they can be ruled out. If they disappeared after 1971 then we have a suspect.
The first part is do-able, the second will take some huge effort and the cooperation of those who have other things to worry about right now.
Something I didn't know was that the aft stairs were 'shredded' by the time they landed in Reno.
CBS Newscast November 25, 1971
ltdiver
Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon
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