DB Cooper

[FLYJACK 654]

georger

******
MR Flyjack the money was sadly planted. I'm sorry but like I told Jarry T that I was not the person that put it there.

He asked me if I remember the name of the girl that found the money not the boy. He was shocked that I did. He asked if I was there I said no! GC 148

Can you prove that it wasn't happily planted,,

I have a picture, I believe could be related from my suspect, it is of a steel truss bridge, it has a position drawn on it, a box shape with a w squiggle, at least it sort of looks that way. At first I thought it was Bridge of the Gods based on the mountains in the back but I am not that familiar with the bridges in the area in the 1970s. Maybe it is one of the other bridges, It is possible that the money was stashed at one of the truss bridges closer to where the money was found, it became dislodged, floated downstream and was found on the sand bar.

This picture looks like it has a fence and some lights, like lamp posts.. hard to tell could be a parking area or storage.. but it might not be accurate today.

There is no major bridge near where it was found!

Above water, or below water, or in Spain either!

JHC! Has this thread gone mushugannah?

I originally thought Bridge of the Gods, are there any closer ones to compare??

I am sure it sounds crazy but I have picture of a confirmed Dan Cooper at a steel truss bridge with an object marked on it, and it shows mountains in the background. I figured it was the North side..

[BruceSmith 3]

I'd like to give my heartiest Cooper Vortex Howdy to the new guys on the block - Special Agent Jimmie, and Special Agent Jake.

Welcome to the Good Ship Lollipop as we sail the seas of the Cooper Ocean, complements of Skipper Sailshaw himself!

Welcome aboard, fellows. You can just call me Cousin Brucie. Uncle Brucie also works. We really can't decide here.

Tell Ckret w'all say hello. Does he have an email address? I've tried the three that I know about and none of them worked. They all bounced back, something about a Daemon-or-something.

[GreyCopGC148 0]

FLYJACK

***
MR Flyjack the money was sadly planted. I'm sorry but like I told Jarry T that I was not the person that put it there.

He asked me if I remember the name of the girl that found the money not the boy. He was shocked that I did. He asked if I was there I said no! GC 148

Can you prove that it wasn't happily planted,,

I have a picture, I believe could be related from my suspect, it is of a steel truss bridge, it has a position drawn on it, a box shape with a w squiggle, at least it sort of looks that way. At first I thought it was Bridge of the Gods based on the mountains in the back but I am not that familiar with the bridges in the area in the 1970s. Maybe it is one of the other bridges, It is possible that the money was stashed at one of the truss bridges closer to where the money was found, it became dislodged, floated downstream and was found on the sand bar.

This picture looks like it has a fence and some lights, like lamp posts.. hard to tell could be a parking area or storage.. but it might not be accurate today.

I can hardly believe it someone with humor sadly happaly thank you Sir. I'm from earth to. It been along time.

The bridge of the Gods is up the Gorge on Hy 14,it is very tall.
But the money was planted for sure 100 percent. It was confirmed to me.

And the location of the money before it was put there.It's in my book DB COOPER CASE SOLVED 6 13 13. But I see you don't want to cloud your judgment with with books. Sounds good. You want fact's only. Well

The ticket is fact 1971 that night

the letter's are fact 1971 1972

Letter's to FBI are Fact 1971 1972

And the DNA under the stamps fact

It matches KENNETH P C on 6 13 13 by Paul Geivett of Vancouver WA fact

This case is solved as of 6 13 13 by Paul Geivett fact Call Curtis ENG FBI SEATTLE WA FACT

DB Cooper into the Funnel of Darkness the movie starring Nicolas Cage, Jennifer Anniston and Woody Harrellson... a Jerry Bruckheimer film

Written by Paul Geivett

[BruceSmith 3]

Quote

"...JHC! Has this thread gone mushugannah?..."

Mushugannah? Nu? Vat mushugannah? Just tell 'em "Gay kakken affem yam."

Speaking of which, if Cooper landed in the Columbia at Tianenmen Bar, would his bowels have released over the money as he expired? This could be a real good source of DNA, or has this topic already been covered in the thread?

[GreyCopGC148 0]

GreyCopGC148

******
MR Flyjack the money was sadly planted. I'm sorry but like I told Jarry T that I was not the person that put it there.

He asked me if I remember the name of the girl that found the money not the boy. He was shocked that I did. He asked if I was there I said no! GC 148

Can you prove that it wasn't happily planted,,

I have a picture, I believe could be related from my suspect, it is of a steel truss bridge, it has a position drawn on it, a box shape with a w squiggle, at least it sort of looks that way. At first I thought it was Bridge of the Gods based on the mountains in the back but I am not that familiar with the bridges in the area in the 1970s. Maybe it is one of the other bridges, It is possible that the money was stashed at one of the truss bridges closer to where the money was found, it became dislodged, floated downstream and was found on the sand bar.

This picture looks like it has a fence and some lights, like lamp posts.. hard to tell could be a parking area or storage.. but it might not be accurate today.

I can hardly believe it someone with humor sadly happaly thank you Sir. I'm from earth to. It been along time.

The bridge of the Gods is up the Gorge on Hy 14,it is very tall.
But the money was planted for sure 100 percent. It was confirmed to me.

And the location of the money before it was put there.It's in my book DB COOPER CASE SOLVED 6 13 13. But I see you don't want to cloud your judgment with with books. Sounds good. You want fact's only. Well

The ticket is fact 1971 that night

the letter's are fact 1971 1972

Letter's to FBI are Fact 1971 1972

And the DNA under the stamps fact

It matches KENNETH P C on 6 13 13 by Paul Geivett of Vancouver WA fact

This case is solved as of 6 13 13 by Paul Geivett fact Call Curtis ENG FBI SEATTLE WA FACT cool stuff I solved it.

DB Cooper into the Funnel of Darkness the movie starring Nicolas Cage, Jennifer Anniston and Woody Harrellson... a Jerry Bruckheimer film

Written by Paul Geivett

[FLYJACK 654]

GreyCopGC148

******
MR Flyjack the money was sadly planted. I'm sorry but like I told Jarry T that I was not the person that put it there.

He asked me if I remember the name of the girl that found the money not the boy. He was shocked that I did. He asked if I was there I said no! GC 148

Can you prove that it wasn't happily planted,,

I have a picture, I believe could be related from my suspect, it is of a steel truss bridge, it has a position drawn on it, a box shape with a w squiggle, at least it sort of looks that way. At first I thought it was Bridge of the Gods based on the mountains in the back but I am not that familiar with the bridges in the area in the 1970s. Maybe it is one of the other bridges, It is possible that the money was stashed at one of the truss bridges closer to where the money was found, it became dislodged, floated downstream and was found on the sand bar.

This picture looks like it has a fence and some lights, like lamp posts.. hard to tell could be a parking area or storage.. but it might not be accurate today.

I can hardly believe it someone with humor sadly happaly thank you Sir. I'm from earth to. It been along time.

The bridge of the Gods is up the Gorge on Hy 14,it is very tall.
But the money was planted for sure 100 percent. It was confirmed to me.

And the location of the money before it was put there.It's in my book DB COOPER CASE SOLVED 6 13 13. But I see you don't want to cloud your judgment with with books. Sounds good. You want fact's only. Well

The ticket is fact 1971 that night

the letter's are fact 1971 1972

Letter's to FBI are Fact 1971 1972

And the DNA under the stamps fact

It matches KENNETH P C on 6 13 13 by Paul Geivett of Vancouver WA fact

This case is solved as of 6 13 13 by Paul Geivett fact Call Curtis ENG FBI SEATTLE WA FACT

Well, I wouldn't bash others theories, everyone is a suspect until they can be eliminated..

Was there any DNA found on the ticket?? Is there any DNA from the hijacker?? other than cigarettes that may be missing

[GreyCopGC148 0]

FLYJACK

*********
MR Flyjack the money was sadly planted. I'm sorry but like I told Jarry T that I was not the person that put it there.

He asked me if I remember the name of the girl that found the money not the boy. He was shocked that I did. He asked if I was there I said no! GC 148

Can you prove that it wasn't happily planted,,

I have a picture, I believe could be related from my suspect, it is of a steel truss bridge, it has a position drawn on it, a box shape with a w squiggle, at least it sort of looks that way. At first I thought it was Bridge of the Gods based on the mountains in the back but I am not that familiar with the bridges in the area in the 1970s. Maybe it is one of the other bridges, It is possible that the money was stashed at one of the truss bridges closer to where the money was found, it became dislodged, floated downstream and was found on the sand bar.

This picture looks like it has a fence and some lights, like lamp posts.. hard to tell could be a parking area or storage.. but it might not be accurate today.

I can hardly believe it someone with humor sadly happaly thank you Sir. I'm from earth to. It been along time.

The bridge of the Gods is up the Gorge on Hy 14,it is very tall.
But the money was planted for sure 100 percent. It was confirmed to me.

And the location of the money before it was put there.It's in my book DB COOPER CASE SOLVED 6 13 13. But I see you don't want to cloud your judgment with with books. Sounds good. You want fact's only. Well

The ticket is fact 1971 that night

the letter's are fact 1971 1972

Letter's to FBI are Fact 1971 1972

And the DNA under the stamps fact

It matches KENNETH P C on 6 13 13 by Paul Geivett of Vancouver WA fact

This case is solved as of 6 13 13 by Paul Geivett fact Call Curtis ENG FBI SEATTLE WA FACT

Well, I wouldn't bash others theories, everyone is a suspect until they can be eliminated..

Was there any DNA found on the ticket?? Is there any DNA from the hijacker?? other than cigarettes than may be missing

The ticket has KENNETH's writing on it the name DAN COOPER ONLY.and the letter's match KENNETH'S writing that were sent to the new's papers ,FBI and MAX GUNTHER Have his hand writing on them 1971 1972

The stamp's have his DNA under them and that's when Curtis
said solved and Paul you can go to the media. You did it I will call LARRY CARR right now. Paul Geivett VAN 9 same as the VAN 9 Letter

99 what are the odd's of that Van 9 and Van 9 it scared me the first time.

The RENo Letter has Kenneth's name in it this is my own video
All me on my own but71 not 74 I was corrected GC 148 .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atTJ_aEA8WQ

DB Cooper into the Funnel of Darkness the movie starring Nicolas Cage, Jennifer Anniston and Woody Harrellson... a Jerry Bruckheimer film

Written by Paul Geivett

[GreyCopGC148 0]

RobertMBlevins

'Tina Bar Money Answers Lots of Questions' I have seen in the title of posts. Really? What questions does it answer, and I mean any of the important questions. Let's look at the facts.

Does it answer any of these:

1) Does it establish identity of the hijacker? (Nope.)

2) Prove Flight 305 overflew Tina Bar? (Nope. The money alone does not prove 305 was over Tina Bar.)

3) Can you say for sure HOW the money arrived at the spot it was found? Key words: 'For Sure HOW'. (No. You can guess. If you are sure you're right, then prove it. That job is tougher, of course.)

4) Does it prove where Cooper actually jumped? (Since no one can say HOW the money arrived, no.)

5) Does it establish that Cooper lived to walk away from his jump? (Nope. Not enough evidence to say, based solely on the found money.)

6) Did it assist the FBI in any way in solving the case? (Nope. Thirty-three years later, they are still stymied.)

7) Does it provide a starting point for a search in which other evidence was discovered at the same location? (YES. Starting point established. But nothing was found.)

In reality, the discovery of the money answers very few questions and there are some good reasons why it doesn't. Here's a couple of quickies: First, because it was found away from the established flight path. If were found down the center of V-23, you could establish WHERE Cooper jumped. Second, since it was found near water, and not on land NOT surrounded by water, it can't even give you a decent search point. Don't understand that part? Here's a better explanation:

If the money had been found on land, and not in close proximity to a lake or river, you could do a heavy search in that area. Finding nothing else, such as parachutes, more money, a body...you could safely assume chances are greater than Cooper walked away from the jump.

No that's why I didn't focus on it when I meet with Curtis.I waited 2 week's to tell him.

I told Larry Carr if I bring you 200 thousand dollars and it matches and the cute and it matches it still doesn't tell you who it is,or if he lived.

Larry when I get there you will know who Cooper is in 15 min. or less.

All the evidence is in your own evidence room from 1971 1972

I was in the FBI office in 3 hours talking to Curtis and he said that I had solved the case.

After the speeding ticket on the way LOL $600 even Curtis said ouch I did not ask him to take care of it. GC 148

Bye for now THE GRAY COP JAN 1 14 approaches

DB Cooper into the Funnel of Darkness the movie starring Nicolas Cage, Jennifer Anniston and Woody Harrellson... a Jerry Bruckheimer film

Written by Paul Geivett

[FLYJACK 654]

GreyCopGC148

************
MR Flyjack the money was sadly planted. I'm sorry but like I told Jarry T that I was not the person that put it there.

He asked me if I remember the name of the girl that found the money not the boy. He was shocked that I did. He asked if I was there I said no! GC 148

Can you prove that it wasn't happily planted,,

I have a picture, I believe could be related from my suspect, it is of a steel truss bridge, it has a position drawn on it, a box shape with a w squiggle, at least it sort of looks that way. At first I thought it was Bridge of the Gods based on the mountains in the back but I am not that familiar with the bridges in the area in the 1970s. Maybe it is one of the other bridges, It is possible that the money was stashed at one of the truss bridges closer to where the money was found, it became dislodged, floated downstream and was found on the sand bar.

This picture looks like it has a fence and some lights, like lamp posts.. hard to tell could be a parking area or storage.. but it might not be accurate today.

I can hardly believe it someone with humor sadly happaly thank you Sir. I'm from earth to. It been along time.

The bridge of the Gods is up the Gorge on Hy 14,it is very tall.
But the money was planted for sure 100 percent. It was confirmed to me.

And the location of the money before it was put there.It's in my book DB COOPER CASE SOLVED 6 13 13. But I see you don't want to cloud your judgment with with books. Sounds good. You want fact's only. Well

The ticket is fact 1971 that night

the letter's are fact 1971 1972

Letter's to FBI are Fact 1971 1972

And the DNA under the stamps fact

It matches KENNETH P C on 6 13 13 by Paul Geivett of Vancouver WA fact

This case is solved as of 6 13 13 by Paul Geivett fact Call Curtis ENG FBI SEATTLE WA FACT

Well, I wouldn't bash others theories, everyone is a suspect until they can be eliminated..

Was there any DNA found on the ticket?? Is there any DNA from the hijacker?? other than cigarettes than may be missing

The ticket has KENNETH's writing on it the name DAN COOPER ONLY.and the letter's match KENNETH'S writing that were sent to the new's papers ,FBI and MAX GUNTHER Have his hand writing on them 1971 1972

The stamp's have his DNA under them and that's when Curtis
said solved and Paul you can go to the media. You did it I will call LARRY CARR right now. Paul Geivett VAN 9 same as the VAN 9 Letter

99 what are the odd's of that Van 9 and Van 9 it scared me the first time.

The RENo Letter has Kenneth's name in it this is my own video
All me on my own but71 not 74 I was corrected GC 148 .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atTJ_aEA8WQ

it is not fact that the writing on the ticket is the hijacker.
Hand writing analysis is not fact, more art. Actually the writing on the ticket suggests one person wrote all.
The hand writing on those letters match Kenny in some places and don't in others, randomness of patterns.
It is not fact that the DNA matches the stamp, but assuming it does, and that info is being withheld that puts Kennys saliva on a stamp not on the hijacked plane.. So, your suspect is circumstantial, as is mine and maybe 1000 others..

It falls short of proof, unless you "believe" that there is a cover up, but there is no proof of that.

I wouldn't suggest that Kenny isn't the guy,, everyone is a suspect until they can be eliminated

but my process is to try to eliminate my suspect, while it seems most are trying to include their suspect.

The facts of this case are actually very thin which forces a lot of speculation, but you need "theory" until you can put somebody on the plane.. My gut feeling is he died in the jump, but I have to rule out my suspect.

[Robert99 38]

RobertMBlevins

'Tina Bar Money Answers Lots of Questions' I have seen in the title of posts. Really? What questions does it answer, and I mean any of the important questions. Let's look at the facts.

Does it answer any of these:

10) The money at Tina Bar also does not answer the question of why Blevins refuses to reveal what his "real estate expert" found in his researching KC's real estate dealings. Assuming that Blevins, or his "expert", researched those dealings in the first place.

Nevertheless, Blevins continues to sell, if possible, or give away, if he can't sell it, a book that contains claims that have been proven untrue.

11) The money also does not explain where Blevins "established flight path" originated or anything related to that flight path.

12) Blevins, dream on.

Robert99

[Robert99 38]

GreyCopGC148

The area has a lot of steel, scrape,rail road bridge, I5 bridge.
Both were built by the same man that built the Eiffel tower.

There are a lot of steel (iron) bridges on the west and northwest side of Portland primarily on the Willamette and other secondary streams. The steel I5 bridge over the Columbia has a drawbridge if I remember correctly.

However, it is very unlikely that Gustave Eiffel (1832-1923) had anything to do with these bridges. His crowning achievement was the Eiffel tower which was completed in 1889 as part of the preparations for the 1889 World's Fair (or Universal Exposition) in Paris.

After the Eiffel tower, Gustave seems to have devoted his interests to other scientific matters instead of engineering structures.

Robert99

[Robert99 38]

BruceSmith

I'd like to give my heartiest Cooper Vortex Howdy to the new guys on the block - Special Agent Jimmie, and Special Agent Jake.

Welcome to the Good Ship Lollipop as we sail the seas of the Cooper Ocean, complements of Skipper Sailshaw himself!

Welcome aboard, fellows. You can just call me Cousin Brucie. Uncle Brucie also works. We really can't decide here.

Tell Ckret w'all say hello. Does he have an email address? I've tried the three that I know about and none of them worked. They all bounced back, something about a Daemon-or-something.

Nephew Brucie,

In view of your interest in "remote viewing" and such, can you arrange a seance with J. Edgar Hoover? It concerns a matter which was of interest to him. Let me know and I'll send you some good questions to discuss with him.

Unfortunately, since I don't believe in such things, I will not be able to attend personally.

Robert99

[MarkBennett 5]

Robert99

***I'd like to give my heartiest Cooper Vortex Howdy to the new guys on the block - Special Agent Jimmie, and Special Agent Jake.

Welcome to the Good Ship Lollipop as we sail the seas of the Cooper Ocean, complements of Skipper Sailshaw himself!

Welcome aboard, fellows. You can just call me Cousin Brucie. Uncle Brucie also works. We really can't decide here.

Tell Ckret w'all say hello. Does he have an email address? I've tried the three that I know about and none of them worked. They all bounced back, something about a Daemon-or-something.

Nephew Brucie,

In view of your interest in "remote viewing" and such, can you arrange a seance with J. Edgar Hoover? It concerns a matter which was of interest to him. Let me know and I'll send you some good questions to discuss with him.

Unfortunately, since I don't believe in such things, I will not be able to attend personally.

Robert99

Hey, I don't believe in Santa Claus, but that doesn't stop me from getting up early on Christmas morning and looking for gifts!

[Robert99 38]

MarkBennett

******I'd like to give my heartiest Cooper Vortex Howdy to the new guys on the block - Special Agent Jimmie, and Special Agent Jake.

Welcome to the Good Ship Lollipop as we sail the seas of the Cooper Ocean, complements of Skipper Sailshaw himself!

Welcome aboard, fellows. You can just call me Cousin Brucie. Uncle Brucie also works. We really can't decide here.

Tell Ckret w'all say hello. Does he have an email address? I've tried the three that I know about and none of them worked. They all bounced back, something about a Daemon-or-something.

Nephew Brucie,

In view of your interest in "remote viewing" and such, can you arrange a seance with J. Edgar Hoover? It concerns a matter which was of interest to him. Let me know and I'll send you some good questions to discuss with him.

Unfortunately, since I don't believe in such things, I will not be able to attend personally.

Robert99

Hey, I don't believe in Santa Claus, but that doesn't stop me from getting up early on Christmas morning and looking for gifts!

I'll keep an open mind about Santa Claus, at least through next Wednesday, but I don't believe in the tooth fairy anymore.

[377 21]

Robert99 wrote

Quote

It is very unlikely that the T-33 had radar equipment. However, the fighter aircraft did.

Some T 33s used by the USAF in 1971 had weather radar NONE had air intercept radar. Weather radar is pretty useless for finding other aicraft. Ask anyone who has used it.

There was a development of the T 33 airframe into a radar interceptor called the F 94, but no F 94s chased Coopers 727. The last F94s were retired in 1960.

From Wikipedia

Quote

Built to a 1948 USAF specification for a radar-equipped interceptor to replace the aging F-61 Black Widow and North American F-82 Twin Mustang, it was specifically designed to counter the threat of the USSR's new Tupolev Tu-4 bombers (reverse-engineered Boeing B-29). The Curtiss-Wright XF-87 Blackhawk had been designated to be the USAF first jet night fighter, but its performance was sub par, and Lockheed was asked to design a jet night fighter on a crash program basis.[2] The F-94 was derived from the TF-80C (later T-33A Shooting Star) which was a two-seat trainer version of the F-80 Shooting Star. A lengthened nose area with guns, radar and automatic fire control system was added. Since the conversion seemed so simple, a contract was awarded to Lockheed in early 1949, with the first flight on 16 April 1949. The early test YF-94s used seventy-five percent of the parts used in the earlier F-80 and T-33As.[3]

The fire control system was the Hughes E-1, which incorporated an AN/APG-33 radar (derived from the AN/APG-3 which directed the Convair B-36's tail guns) and a Sperry A-1C computing gunsight.[4] This short-range radar system was useful only in the terminal phases of the interception. Most of the operation would be directed using ground-controlled interception as was the case with the earlier aircraft it replaced.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 21]

Bradley Collins obviously has a sincere belief that his late father Jack was DB Cooper. Jack isn't a bad suspect actually IF everything Bradley writes is true. Jack was a seasoned skydiver, knew the Pacific NW area, was a pilot and had a brother Bud who was a Northwest Airlines 727 captain.

Jack had money problems and wasn't averse to a few scams to keep his cash flow coming, e.g. taking out disability insurance policies and then having a series of bone breaking minor skydiving landing accidents that got the insurance money coming in.

Bradley also writes that his Dad disappeared for five days spanning the Nov 24 1971 DB Cooper skyjack date. It would be interesting to see if this absence can be independently verified.

According to the author, Jack was promptly questioned by the FBI after the skyjack but nothing further happened. It would be interesting to know why the FBI apparently ruled him out as a suspect.

BUT... the author publishes an alarming series of incorrect or twisted facts that even a cursory Google search would have caught, so it makes the reader question the accuracy of everything in the book. Much is made of Bradley's recollection of conversations with his Dad and overheard conversations involving his Dad. Are these recollections accurate? The reader is left to wonder...

Examples:

1. The author writes that Howard Hughes headed NWA and cites Hughes's death as a loss of possible forgiveness for DB Cooper, whose caper Bradley imagines would have amused "Uncle Howard". Howard Hughes owned Air West, not NWA. Air West never became NWA. Hughes played major roles in TWA and Air West but had no ownership or control of NWA ever. The author even fantasizes about Hughes playing cards with his friends and chuckling about the skyjack caper.

2.The author publishes a vivid account of a conversation with his father just prior to the skyjack in which his father discusses an upcoming unusual night jump and demonstrates a wrist watch that with the press of a button becomes an illuminated altimeter. To the best of my knowledge no such watch existed in November of 1971, the date of the skyjack. Either the author imagined it or he misdescribed it.

3. The author writes about a WW 2 surplus AT6 aircraft flown by his father and brother and writes that it could fly nearly 400 mph and climb to 30,000 feet. Even with postwar engine upgrades and mods no T6 could match these specs or even come close. Nobody knows more about squeezing performance out of T6s than Reno air racers do and none of them have even come remotely close to 400 mph. The record is about 247 mph. Ceiling is roughly 21,000 ft.

4. The author recounts a skydive demonstration jump in bad weather where his father ended up caught in power lines above a body of water. He describes his father using a knife to cut all the lines and then drop into the water below. Bradley is confusing the term "cutaway", which describes a skydivers release of the main canopy by activating mechanical riser releases with an actual cutting of lines with a knife to accomplish the same purpose. It's probably an innocent mistake in which vague childhood memories and the passage of time have blurred the facts but it calls into question how accurate the author's recollections are.

The author speculates that his father Jack recruited Bud to be the ground man who would meet him on the ground after parachuting from the skyjacked NWA 727. Its a long story but the author implies that Bud's later suicide was a direct result of his involvement in the crime. Why a well paid NWA airliner captain would risk a felony conviction and loss of his prestigious career for $100,000 (half the loot) is puzzling to say the least.

The author's account of how Jack would find Bud after jumping from the 727 at night is naively simplistic. Bud would simply blink his car headlights, Jack would see them, and they would meet up and drive away. Since Cooper had no direct control over the flight path and only a rough idea of his location from visual clues such a rendezvous would be highly improbable. Miracles do happen though, look at how close some other skydiving skyjackers landed to their intended destination, e.g. Richard McCoy and Rob Heady.

Sure I am nit picking, but accuracy is very important in non fiction. That said, the story is both interesting and entertaining. Jack was quite a character and it's fun to read about his life. In spite of all the book errors Jack Collins seemed to have the skills needed to be Cooper. Does the author present any probative evidence to support the title: My father Was DB Cooper? The answer is no. It's all circumstantial and speculative.

Bradley Collins needs to clean up the errors and republish the book if he expects his claim to be taken seriously. Can I rule out Jack Collins as DBC? No, I can't, but he joins a long list of fathers, husbands, brothers etc whose surviving relatives are convinced that DB Cooper was a family member.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[FLYJACK 654]

Robert99

***

The area has a lot of steel, scrape,rail road bridge, I5 bridge.
Both were built by the same man that built the Eiffel tower.

There are a lot of steel (iron) bridges on the west and northwest side of Portland primarily on the Willamette and other secondary streams. The steel I5 bridge over the Columbia has a drawbridge if I remember correctly.

However, it is very unlikely that Gustave Eiffel (1832-1923) had anything to do with these bridges. His crowning achievement was the Eiffel tower which was completed in 1889 as part of the preparations for the 1889 World's Fair (or Universal Exposition) in Paris.

After the Eiffel tower, Gustave seems to have devoted his interests to other scientific matters instead of engineering structures.

Robert99

I searched google maps and my picture with a "Dan Cooper" in it resembles the train bridge EDIT (WEST) of I5, there is a road right there, I assume that bridge was there in 1971,,

Has anybody searched around the bridge/shore area... it is a short float to TBar from there.

here is the google image..

edit, it could also be on the other side of Hayden island crossing the Columbia,,

[ParrotheadVol 70]

Nice post and nice review of the book.

I have a question for you, that I'm sure has been covered many time in the forum, but I will ask anyway. At 10,000 feet, how much time did Cooper have to deploy his chute?

"They were saying he was never gonna make it now, now that daylight had set in. But later that night, they were shining those lights back down on that mountain again." - Todd Snider

[377 21]

He could have pulled the ripcord while standing on the stairs facing forward or he could have made a freefall.

If you want to be hyper accurate: http://keisan.casio.com/exec/system/1224830797

John Rich has a decent rough estimate approach:

Quote

Rule of thumb calculation:

Freefall time: 12 seconds for the first 1,000 feet, then 6 seconds per 1,000' thereafter (belly flying).

Canopy time: 1 minute per 1,000 feet (if you're not spiraling).

The plane’s air speed, and the wind speed are irrelevant.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[georger 199]

377

Bradley Collins obviously has a sincere belief that his late father Jack was DB Cooper. Jack isn't a bad suspect actually IF everything Bradley writes is true. Jack was a seasoned skydiver, knew the Pacific NW area, was a pilot and had a brother Bud who was a Northwest Airlines 727 captain.

Jack had money problems and wasn't averse to a few scams to keep his cash flow coming, e.g. taking out disability insurance policies and then having a series of bone breaking minor skydiving landing accidents that got the insurance money coming in.

Bradley also writes that his Dad disappeared for five days spanning the Nov 24 1971 DB Cooper skyjack date. It would be interesting to see if this absence can be independently verified.

According to the author, Jack was promptly questioned by the FBI after the skyjack but nothing further happened. It would be interesting to know why the FBI apparently ruled him out as a suspect.

BUT... the author publishes an alarming series of incorrect or twisted facts that even a cursory Google search would have caught, so it makes the reader question the accuracy of everything in the book. Much is made of Bradley's recollection of conversations with his Dad and overheard conversations involving his Dad. Are these recollections accurate? The reader is left to wonder...

Examples:

1. The author writes that Howard Hughes headed NWA and cites Hughes's death as a loss of possible forgiveness for DB Cooper, whose caper Bradley imagines would have amused "Uncle Howard". Howard Hughes owned Air West, not NWA. Air West never became NWA. Hughes played major roles in TWA and Air West but had no ownership or control of NWA ever. The author even fantasizes about Hughes playing cards with his friends and chuckling about the skyjack caper.

2.The author publishes a vivid account of a conversation with his father just prior to the skyjack in which his father discusses an upcoming unusual night jump and demonstrates a wrist watch that with the press of a button becomes an illuminated altimeter. To the best of my knowledge no such watch existed in November of 1971, the date of the skyjack. Either the author imagined it or he misdescribed it.

3. The author writes about a WW 2 surplus AT6 aircraft flown by his father and brother and writes that it could fly nearly 400 mph and climb to 30,000 feet. Even with postwar engine upgrades and mods no T6 could match these specs or even come close. Nobody knows more about squeezing performance out of T6s than Reno air racers do and none of them have even come remotely close to 400 mph. The record is about 247 mph. Ceiling is roughly 21,000 ft.

4. The author recounts a skydive demonstration jump in bad weather where his father ended up caught in power lines above a body of water. He describes his father using a knife to cut all the lines and then drop into the water below. Bradley is confusing the term "cutaway", which describes a skydivers release of the main canopy by activating mechanical riser releases with an actual cutting of lines with a knife to accomplish the same purpose. It's probably an innocent mistake in which vague childhood memories and the passage of time have blurred the facts but it calls into question how accurate the author's recollection are.

The author speculates that his father Jack recruited Bud to be the ground man who would meet him on the ground after parachuting from the skyjacked NWA 727. Its a long story but the author implies that Bud's later suicide was a direct result of his involvement in the crime. Why a well paid NWA airliner captain would risk a felony conviction and loss of his prestigious career for $100,000 (half the loot) is puzzling to say the least.

The author's account of how Jack would find Bud after jumping from the 727 at night is naively simplistic. Bud would simply blink his car headlights, Jack would see them, and they would meet up and drive away. Since Cooper had no direct control over the flight path and only a rough idea of his location from visual clues such a rendezvous would be highly improbable. Miracles do happen though, look at how close some other skydiving skyjackers landed to their intended destination, e.g. Richard McCoy and Rob Heady.

Sure I am nit picking, but accuracy is very important in non fiction. That said, the story is both interesting and entertaining. Jack was quite a character and it's fun to read about his life. In spite of all the book errors Jack Collins seemed to have the skills needed to be Cooper. Does the author present any probative evidence to support the title: My father Was DB Cooper? The answer is no. It's all circumstantial and speculative.

Bradley Collins needs to clean up the errors and republish the book if he expects his claim to be taken seriously. Can I rule out Jack Collins as DBC? No, I can't, but he joins a long list of fathers, husbands, brothers etc whose surviving relatives are convinced that DB Cooper was a family member.

377

I can accept just about everything you say here, because Im in a hurry. Nice review! The paragraph below stands out:

Sure I am nit picking, but accuracy is very important in non
fiction. That said, the story is both interesting and entertaining.
Jack was quite a character and it's fun to read about his life. In
spite of all the book errors Jack Collins seemed to have the skills
needed to be Cooper. Does the author present any probative
evidence to support the title: My father Was DB Cooper? The
answer is no. It's all circumstantial and speculative.

Good work!

[georger 199]

RobertMBlevins

'Tina Bar Money Answers Lots of Questions' I have seen in the title of posts. Really? What questions does it answer, and I mean any of the important questions. Let's look at the facts.

Does it answer any of these:

1) Does it establish identity of the hijacker? (Nope.)

2) Does it prove 305 overflew Tina Bar? (Nope. The money alone does not prove 305 was over Tina Bar.)

3) Can you say for sure HOW the money arrived at the spot it was found? Key words: 'For Sure HOW'. (No. You can guess. If you are sure you're right, then prove it. That job is tougher, of course.)

4) Does it prove where Cooper actually jumped? (Since no one can say HOW the money arrived, no.)

5) Does it establish that Cooper lived to walk away from his jump? (Nope. Not enough evidence to say, based solely on the found money. In fact, the FBI's position shifted to 'he probably died' after the money was discovered.)

6) Did it assist the FBI in any way in solving the case? (Nope. Thirty-three years later, they are still stymied.)

7) Does it provide a starting point for a search in which other evidence was discovered at the same location? (YES. Starting point established. But nothing was found.)

8) Does the money evidence show it was planted, thereby establishing that Cooper is/was alive or it was done by someone who found his body? (No. It's as good a theory as any, but not enough evidence to say.)

9) Is the amount of money found significant? (Believe it or not, YES.) This is because it is much harder to explain an amount MORE than one bundle of the cash, than it is to explain a single bundle amount or less...or MOST of the cash being found. Single bundle or less...could have washed down or whatever from miles away. MOST of the cash, or a great deal of it...start looking for the body. More than one bundle, but far less than the total, that far off the flight path? How the hell did they stay together for the long trip and end up in the same spot? Start scratching your head.

In reality, the discovery of the money answers very few questions and there are some good reasons why it doesn't. Here's a couple of quickies: First, because it was found away from the established flight path. If it were found down the center of V-23, you could probably establish WHERE Cooper jumped, or at least where he landed. Second, since it was found near water, and not on land NOT surrounded by water, it can't even give you a decent search point. Don't understand that part? Here's a better explanation:

If the money had been found on land, and not in close proximity to a lake or river, you could do a heavy ground search in that area. Finding nothing else, such as parachutes, more money, a body...you could safely assume chances are greater that Cooper walked away from the jump. But since the money was discovered right on the banks of a major river, there will always be doubt.

It's all circumstantial and speculative.

[georger 199]

RobertMBlevins

******

Wasn't Kaye on this program BEFORE he was allowed access to the actual bills, and before he and his team ran the water tests, etc? He tells Geoff Gray a different story entirely. My guess is he changed his mind after he and Citizen Sleuths did their fanning/water tests and saw the condition of the bills up close and personal.

Amazing!

Why would Kaye be on a NatGeo special BEFORE he had tested,
met Larry etal and run tests at T-Bar, etc etc etc? For NatGeo
to report on what hadnt even happened yet !!!!! ?????

The Tuesday bus does not leave on Monday from two weeks
from now, or on Thursday from three weeks before! To get
Granny home tomorrow!

Don't be a smart ass. I haven't actually had the pleasure of seeing this show. Believe it or not, I don't DVR every Cooper reference on Tee Wee.

Then why does Kaye say one thing for NatGeo and another to Geoff Gray? Instead of harping on ME...maybe you should direct your question to Tom Kaye, shouldn't you? He's the one with the discrepancy going here, obviously.

He tells NatGeo program (as you say) the money came down the Lewis River. Later, his CZ website and statements for the Gray book give a different story. Stop coming down on ME for HIS stuff. You know his email. Ask him.

Blevins, you deficit in math and keeping time really is a
deterrent to a normal life.

I understand your frustrations.

[georger 199]

RobertMBlevins

Quote

'JHC! Has this thread gone mushugannah?'

If so...you definitely shoulder some of the blame. Not all, but SOME. You're still doing the same things you were doing four years ago over at The Science Forum. Saw your posts there. They got seriously tired of you and The 'Tude within two weeks...

Maybe you should return to your CIA-NSA Super Secret Squirrel discussions via PM.

It's all circumstantial and speculative.

I know you don't like me.

Go have a banana split.

[MarkBennett 5]

377

Bradley Collins obviously has a sincere belief that his late father Jack was DB Cooper. Jack isn't a bad suspect actually IF everything Bradley writes is true. Jack was a seasoned skydiver, knew the Pacific NW area, was a pilot and had a brother Bud who was a Northwest Airlines 727 captain.

Jack had money problems and wasn't averse to a few scams to keep his cash flow coming, e.g. taking out disability insurance policies and then having a series of bone breaking minor skydiving landing accidents that got the insurance money coming in.

Bradley also writes that his Dad disappeared for five days spanning the Nov 24 1971 DB Cooper skyjack date. It would be interesting to see if this absence can be independently verified.

According to the author, Jack was promptly questioned by the FBI after the skyjack but nothing further happened. It would be interesting to know why the FBI apparently ruled him out as a suspect.

BUT... the author publishes an alarming series of incorrect or twisted facts that even a cursory Google search would have caught, so it makes the reader question the accuracy of everything in the book. Much is made of Bradley's recollection of conversations with his Dad and overheard conversations involving his Dad. Are these recollections accurate? The reader is left to wonder...

Examples:

1. The author writes that Howard Hughes headed NWA and cites Hughes's death as a loss of possible forgiveness for DB Cooper, whose caper Bradley imagines would have amused "Uncle Howard". Howard Hughes owned Air West, not NWA. Air West never became NWA. Hughes played major roles in TWA and Air West but had no ownership or control of NWA ever. The author even fantasizes about Hughes playing cards with his friends and chuckling about the skyjack caper.

2.The author publishes a vivid account of a conversation with his father just prior to the skyjack in which his father discusses an upcoming unusual night jump and demonstrates a wrist watch that with the press of a button becomes an illuminated altimeter. To the best of my knowledge no such watch existed in November of 1971, the date of the skyjack. Either the author imagined it or he misdescribed it.

3. The author writes about a WW 2 surplus AT6 aircraft flown by his father and brother and writes that it could fly nearly 400 mph and climb to 30,000 feet. Even with postwar engine upgrades and mods no T6 could match these specs or even come close. Nobody knows more about squeezing performance out of T6s than Reno air racers do and none of them have even come remotely close to 400 mph. The record is about 247 mph. Ceiling is roughly 21,000 ft.

4. The author recounts a skydive demonstration jump in bad weather where his father ended up caught in power lines above a body of water. He describes his father using a knife to cut all the lines and then drop into the water below. Bradley is confusing the term "cutaway", which describes a skydivers release of the main canopy by activating mechanical riser releases with an actual cutting of lines with a knife to accomplish the same purpose. It's probably an innocent mistake in which vague childhood memories and the passage of time have blurred the facts but it calls into question how accurate the author's recollections are.

The author speculates that his father Jack recruited Bud to be the ground man who would meet him on the ground after parachuting from the skyjacked NWA 727. Its a long story but the author implies that Bud's later suicide was a direct result of his involvement in the crime. Why a well paid NWA airliner captain would risk a felony conviction and loss of his prestigious career for $100,000 (half the loot) is puzzling to say the least.

The author's account of how Jack would find Bud after jumping from the 727 at night is naively simplistic. Bud would simply blink his car headlights, Jack would see them, and they would meet up and drive away. Since Cooper had no direct control over the flight path and only a rough idea of his location from visual clues such a rendezvous would be highly improbable. Miracles do happen though, look at how close some other skydiving skyjackers landed to their intended destination, e.g. Richard McCoy and Rob Heady.

Sure I am nit picking, but accuracy is very important in non fiction. That said, the story is both interesting and entertaining. Jack was quite a character and it's fun to read about his life. In spite of all the book errors Jack Collins seemed to have the skills needed to be Cooper. Does the author present any probative evidence to support the title: My father Was DB Cooper? The answer is no. It's all circumstantial and speculative.

Bradley Collins needs to clean up the errors and republish the book if he expects his claim to be taken seriously. Can I rule out Jack Collins as DBC? No, I can't, but he joins a long list of fathers, husbands, brothers etc whose surviving relatives are convinced that DB Cooper was a family member.

377

Thanks, 377,
I got the gist of this talking to Bradley Collins of this story. I'm glad you reviewed it because listenening to his story verbally raised red flags and it's nice you can give an account not tainted by that (as I might if I read the book).

His verbal presentation was remarkably canned (he started with a poem and proceeded in as if it were scripted). He didn't not want to be challenged or questioned (as Bruce can attest) and introducing his wife as his "agent" was also a little odd.

Plus not staying for the symposium in a room full of Cooper fans also made me wonder at little bit.

But his fairly emotional response to Bruce questioning him leads me to think that he really does believe it (as you suggest) and that's why he takes any questions as a personal affront.

Thanks for the report!

[FLYJACK 654]

There is also a steel truss rail bridge that crosses the Columbia Slough, i searched this forum for info on possible activity in the Slough prior to 1980 that may dislodge the cash,, nothing here,, but I did find an internal proposal with specific options dated 1975 for work in the Slough.. Were any of these carried out,,

http://www.ccrh.org/comm/slough/primary/jamiehart.htm

"July 25, 1975
From xxxxx xxxx

To Commissioner xxxxxx

Addressed to
Subject Columbia Slough Flood Control Project

The study of the Columbia Sough began in 1966 with the DMJM plan for Rivergate and the North Portland Peninsula sponsored by the Port of Portland, the city and the county. From 1968-69, the Corps of Engineers completed recognizance studies of the Rivergate/North Portland Area, but suspended work until a separate study was completed by a special task force made up of members of the North Portland Peninsula Study in December of 1972 and recommended the closure of Columbia Slough for flood control and the development of the banks of the slough and Smith and Bybee Lakes for recreation. The work of the task force was adopted by the Port. The Corps of Engineers then began detailed recreational development which were presented at a public hearing on June 19, 1974. At that hearing, representatives of the city, the Port and the county presented position papers. All three of the agencies gave public support to Plan 1 as proposed by the Corps of Engineers. The Corps of Engineers has completed its report on the project and has selected Plan #1 as the proposed action."

Proposed Action
For purposes of discussion, the slough has been divided into the lower slough and the upper slough. The lower slough is the western end from Kelly Point Park to the Peninsula Drainage Canal. The upper slough is that area encompassed by the Multnomah County Drainage District. Essentially, the upper features of this proposed action are flood control, recreational development, and cultivation of fish and wildlife.

The primary element in the proposed action is the closure of Columbia Slough at its juncture with the Willamette River just south of Kelly Point Park. The closure would necessitate a 170,000 GPM capacity pumping plant which would be provided at the closure site so that interior drainage could be evacuated during high stages in the Willamette River. In addition, the three gaps in the Port of Portland's landfill would be closed by the Bonneville Way Levee, the North Portland Harbor Levee Flood Wall, and a closure embankment in the Columbia Slough. In addition, modifications to existing flood control facilities would be made in three drainage districts. The sewer outfalls and the levee flood wall of the Peninsula Drainage District #1 would be closed off, and part of the levee of the Peninsula Drainage District #2 along Marine Drive would be reinforced. Levees along the Columbia Slough in three drainage districts would not then be reinforced because high flood stages would not occur in the slough.