nbblood 0 #26 February 3, 2004 QuoteLast fall at our DZ a person was getting on the plane (super otter) and did not have a rig on. In all the hustle and bustle they simply forgot to put their rig on and someone pointed it out to the LO (Load Organizer). They were actually climbing up the ladder to get in the otter.. Holy crap.. That's exactly what happened on the one I caught. Different DZ though. NathanBlues, Nathan If you wait 'til the last minute, it'll only take a minute. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John4455 0 #27 February 3, 2004 I caught a mis-routed leg strap before. How do ya like it Johnny? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
koz2000 1 #28 February 3, 2004 I was up at Skydive Chicago for summerfest and they did a quick gear inspect as you got on the plane. They caught several and if you didn't have a chest strap fastened they wouldn't let you board the plane. Pretty good idea D______________________________________________ - Does this small canopy make my balls look big? - J. Hayes - Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jmidgley 0 #29 February 3, 2004 QuoteQuoteDo you think the AFF instructor should have forced the guy to stay in the plane Not sure about your rules, over here, that AFF instructor has no power over any jumper besides his student. Unless that guy was also the S&TA or DZO. ... At Empuriabrave, they have a big sign at manifest that says 'If we catch you with your chest strap undone, you're grounded for the day'. Most AFF instructors there are on the staff. Regards John M Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pds 0 #30 February 3, 2004 very common.namaste, motherfucker. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Falko 0 #31 February 3, 2004 QuoteI go through the catch and back (correctly) then stow the excess through the bungy bit. then I go back round the outside of the catch and stow any remainder underneath the bungy bit inside the chest strap. Same here. I didn't like the flapping around of the (standard size) chest strap in freefall. This way, it stays where it should be, especially on deployment. BTW, I also had my chest strap misrouted one time, and discovered it on the way to the plane. Ich betrachte die Religion als Krankheit, als Quelle unnennbaren Elends für die menschliche Rasse. (Bertrand Russell, engl. Philosoph, 1872-1970) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
boxingrrl 0 #32 February 3, 2004 I know of a couple instances at my DZ, and I caught a twisted up leg strap once, too. The latter happened when the jumper was rushing and gearing up on the way to the plane to make the load. Not the best idea... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #33 February 3, 2004 "Check your chest strap, you are now dead" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The instructor said the wrong thing for the right reason. Deliberately scaring people in the airplane is never a bright practice. He could have gotten the same message across in a more subtle manner. For example, when I get bored during the airplane ride, my eyes wander over other people's gear. If I notice anything unusual, I ask "How's your chest strap Bill?" and continue asking until he takes a serious look at his chest strap. Most of the time the guy with the loose gear is embarrassed and will not repeat his mistake for hundreds or thousands of jumps. Grounding would not have accomplished anything in the first scenario. The guy recognized the gravity of his error. 'nuf said! Grounding should be limited to arrogant young pups who repeat mistakes without understanding the consequences of their actions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyyhi 0 #34 February 3, 2004 I am a student and not really qualified to answer here but I always ask for a gear check and if someone in the loading area comes up to me and wants to check my gear. . .they can go for it. I don't think I will ever get tired of people checking my gear. Of course, I double and triple check it before going up, but the other eyes just make me feel better. On a side note, one day I saw a two-way team in the load area on a now call practicing their exit. One of the teammates did not have his rig on. The guys grabbed it for him, checked it and he put it on. . .they were all checking his rig before boarding. I see this all the time and it makes me feel good to know that others will look out for me.________________________________________ Take risks not to escape life… but to prevent life from escaping. ~ A bumper sticker at the DZ FGF #6 Darcy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelel01 1 #35 February 3, 2004 QuoteI've noticed 2 chest straps looped around the outside of the tension bar and through the bungy I keep hearing this terminology, but I can't picture it. Could someone explain this to me? How could this go unnoticed? Kelly Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pds 0 #36 February 3, 2004 QuoteQuoteI've noticed 2 chest straps looped around the outside of the tension bar and through the bungy I keep hearing this terminology, but I can't picture it. Could someone explain this to me? How could this go unnoticed? Kelly put the end of your strap through the buckle as usual. then omit the step where you insert the end of the strap in front of the tension bar and proceed to fold and place under elastic keepers. most instances are detectable by sight, some are not as in the case of extra long straps folded and covering buckle. HTHnamaste, motherfucker. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallnAngel 0 #37 February 3, 2004 QuoteI did it! Right off AFF and doing solos. I was in the process of asking one of my instructors for a gear check. He was talking to another student when he looked at me, stopped in mid sentence and asked, "Are you ready to skydive?" I said "Yes" He grabbed onto my chest strap and pulled...It took twice but the thing came loose. What he may have lacked in "tact" he made up for by illustrating what could and probably would of happened on deployment. Needless to say now I gear check constantly. I wake up at night and look over at my rig and think, "gear check". I really don't want to die lying "next" to my perfectly good rig...Yes I got him a case of beer. I was there that day! I was gearing up right near where you were standing and I heard him ask you if you were ready to skydive right before he yanked that thing off of you! I have to tell you, that made such an impression on me as well. It can happen to anyone as soon as we let our guard down. Blue skies, Karen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JKT 0 #38 February 3, 2004 QuoteI am a firm believer in Check, Check, and reCheck. Learned this lesson on my 98th jump, when, after being checked both on the ground and in the air I went to dump at about 3k to find my hacky still tucked into the sleave. Dug it out, all was well, but learned a valuable lesson. I now do a six point check, in this order......Cutaway, Reserve, Leg strap, Leg strap, Chest, Hacky. Much better to overCheck than to underCheck just once. I am now a compulsive toggle checker as the last thing I do when I stand up (or sit up) to exit... having seen someone's dummy rip-cord pull go zinging out the aircraft because they managed to sit on it and somehow tug it out as they set themselves up in the door (you know who you are ), it seems like the most sensible thing on earth to do. ----- Official 100 jump wonder Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TribalTalon 0 #39 February 3, 2004 lol... i've had buddies run out to catch up to us to get on the plane, (camera guys) and i'm like... "so dude... you're kinda forgetting something." it takes them a minute before they realize that they're forgetting something quite vital. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skygirl1 1 #40 February 4, 2004 I am still a student..........so all I can say on this is that I want to know my gear is safe before I put it on......then in the plane I keep doing my checks......and If my instuctor fails to do a last minute gear check on me I ask him too........... I have been at a DZ where I saw jumpers getting on the plane with rigs in hand or just on and no straps hooked up.............I don't get that......... I learned to pack before I jumped.......and I was told as a packer how important checks are......and I was told if I ever became a skydiver to always look at other peoples gear.........I hope that if forget someday someone will tap me on the shoulder to save my life or save me a pack job on my reserve..... skygirl1" Mean people SUCK!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #41 February 4, 2004 What happened to the "check of threes?" It sounds like this is such a common thing. Disappointing since it was so thoroughly drilled into me. I guess I havent' jumped enough to forget this basic thing. My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
carbonezone 0 #42 February 4, 2004 QuoteHow many people make a concious check of those around them on every lift? Many - Many people do check others gear in the plane. I know I certainly do. But the bottom line here skydonkey "dont count on anyone but yourself...even as a student"!! Asking people to gear check you is GREAT! Getting geared up should be thought of as the first part of your skydive. You know all that muscle memory stuff your hearing....Get into the habit of the right safety steps and it will become natural: 1. Check Gear Before You Put It On 2. Check Gear Before You Get On The Plane 3. Check Gear "Before" Jumprun As long as you keep doing this is will just come natural before every jump "its so easy" Almost 1000 Jumps and thats my process and always will be! To answer your ? regarding how often I have caught chest straps mis-routed....4X <> And Have Fun!!! Tami Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aero04 0 #43 February 4, 2004 I too have misrouted my chest strap as exactly as described in this thread. Jump 20 something and the guy who's rig I was borrowing saw the misrouting as I was waiting to board the Otter. He asked me if everything was correct with the gear and I said yes. So (in a very serious manner) he says there is a problem, check again. I still don't see it. Then in front of everyone, he pulls the chest strap all the way until it catches on the buckle. Needless to say, I haven't repeated that mistake. Take a couple of extra seconds and MAKE SURE your geared up properly. A couple of seconds could save your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skylord 1 #44 February 4, 2004 QuoteWhat happened to the "check of threes?" That's what I was taught, right there at Elsinore. I ALWAYS check my chest strap, leg straps, shoulders, handles, and I gave a tandem master a thumbs up after he hooked up to his passenger on the jump run. He smiled and gave me a thumbs up right back. I've done two gear checks on others during my spectacular, long running freefall career. No problems, and I always check everyone I can see, just in case. While the responsibility lies with me alone for me, there is an obligation to make sure we all live. If I see something I think isn't right, I don't care if it is a 2 bajillion jump person, I'm saying something. One of my JMs on an AFF jump asked me to check his gear. Cool. He lived, and so did I (I learned)so there was no harm. Let's all keep an eye on each other. BobBob Marks "-when you leave the airplane its all wrong til it goes right, its a whole different mindset, this is why you have system redundancy." Mattaman Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanglesOZQld 0 #45 February 4, 2004 Never done it myself , but had one experienced guy that I picked up on before we got on board and also another guy with about 20 jumps still using our student gear off AFF status doing a fun jump. In the latter's case I asked him if he was good to go and when he said he was I pulled his chest strap and it came flying off. The look on his face was priceless and I doubt he will ever make that mistake again. BSBD! -Mark. "A Scar is just a Tattoo with a story!!!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Newbie 0 #46 February 4, 2004 we humans are not infallible - this stuff does and will continue to happen as you can see from the reponses here. Winsor and Tami both have good advice. As do the others that say "check the 3's" - don't do it just on jump run though. Do it on the ground, in the plane, at 2000ft, and 10,000ft AND jump run if you want - you have one life, make sure everything is in place, as Tami said, it's your responsibility. I check 3's probably excessively by some standards but it makes me happy and it's part of my routine to check things regularly. Peace of mind = a good skydive. Look over other's gear and SAY something if you see something that doesn't look right - i look out for others as i would like them to look out for me. Don't feel embarrassed, especially if the jumper has more jumpers than you. We are not infallible. Do NOT be scared to ask someone for a gear check, more so in places like Empuria. If you think it's seen as not cool to do it - so what? If it puts your mind at a little more ease do it - just remember it's not a substitute for your own checks - visual and otherwise. Gearing up a few mins early, especially at busy DZ's can give you a few more mins to check things over without rushing. We are not infallible. A simple exercise for chest straps - put your thumb under the strap facing away from your chest and push it away from your body hard - if it gives, it's misrouted. I do this before i get a gear check, before i board and several times on the plane to complement my visual check of the routing. PS good to see another Sibson jumper on here! Roll on next month and the LET "Skydiving is a door" Happythoughts Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve1 5 #47 February 4, 2004 The gear I had in the 70's had quick eject hardware on leg straps and chest strap. When I started up again I wasn't used to the chest straps you had to thread through. I bought a rig that had velcro on the chest strap to hold the extra slack. One day I went up to jump and was sitting student, when an older jumper noticed how I had threaded it through wrong and just fastened the slack on the velcro. Yes, I could have fallen out. They say you only have to do this once and you'll always remember to check it in the future....not true! I was climbing for altitude in the plane when I happened to glance down and I'll be damned if I hadn't done it again. Threaded it through once and fastened the velcro. So I cut the velcro off and haven't had any trouble with chest straps since. I wish more gear checks were given. Older more experienced jumpers may not need them, but people who are new to the sport do. I also try to make a habit of looking over my buddies gear for any obvious mistakes. Some may be covered by closing flaps though and I'm not going to start digging around back there, Unless they ask. A lot of people don't want anyone messing with the routing of their bridals, and I can see this point also. I've got one rig that if the bridal is shoved in too far will hang up on a rigid flap and possibly cause a pilot chute in tow. So I don't want anyone giving it an extra little shove during a gear check....Steve1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
heftee 0 #48 February 9, 2004 We had one this weekend. We got the 2 minute call, we got door call, the camera guy of the first group is checking the spot and getting ready for climb-out when the pilot calls back that there is air traffic and we're going to do a go around. We all sit down and wait. Get another two minute call, and Robin (AKA Zone Rat here on DZ.com) takes a harder look at his camera guy, points at him and says "your chest strap is mis routed!" - he fixes it, gives him a huge hug, and out we all go. I got on the ground, gave Robin a hug and a "great catch!" and went to the other person to check on him - a bit frazzled of course and very thankful. Great job, Robin! Robin and I were on a team last year, and our whole team made a habit of checking this on every single person on our load - I think this habit really helped in this situation. We should constantly be eyeballing everyone around us - you never know when you'll find something. Thank God for that go around too! ------------------------- "If you've never jumped out of a plane, the best way I can describe it is it feels as if you've just jumped out of a freakin' plane." David Whitley (Orlando Sentinel) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 7 #49 February 9, 2004 I climbed out once with it undone....I had maybe 30 jumps. I was pulled back in, and yelled at for a while while a guy did it and CRANKED it down...I was then told to get the fuck out of the plane and not screw up the 10way. I have caught several jumpers without it on, and last year I was coahing a 4way team and a guy jumped without it on...You can very clearly see it in the video flapping around. He didn't even know till the video guy told him after he landed. I check everyones gear I can on the plane...I never touch it, but I scan it with my eyes."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Unstable 8 #50 February 9, 2004 QuoteI guess I'm a goofy bastard, but if you're sitting near me, I'm giving your gear a visual once over in the plane. You may not know I'm doing that, but I am, if I see something that looks amiss, I'll mention it to you. Goofy or not - I always appreciate those who keep an eye on things like that. Bonus points for those who can correct an error without being condescending. A little along that subject - I had an interesting experience with something Like this about 50 jumps ago. A quick Gear check for the load, we do a Dirt Dive for about 30 seconds then Load the Cessna for a 4way. rolling down the runway, i Realize that I left my F*##Ing helmet laying on the ground when I began the Dirt Dive. I'm feeling like an absolute Dumbass, But I had my goggles in my jumpsuite so I proceed with the dive anyway. On the Next load, same 4 people, same dive - we load again (this time I'm damn sure I have my Helmet) and at 5,000 I realize AGAIN that My helmet is not with me. EVERYBODY is giving me the most shit I've ever had for doing that twice in a row - I'm absolutly freaking out. At 9,000 feet, the pilot (who had taken it after take off and hid it on his lap) gives it back. Lesson learned: make a gear check the last thing before boarding - Dirt Dive, Gear Check, board.=========Shaun ========== Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
