When did you first try out an elliptical canopy?

[jkwon 0]

I'm in the negotiation process of purchasing a new complete rig. The rig comes with an elliptical and I'm no where near ready to try to fly it. (BTWI'm still looking for a spectre 170) My dilema is do I keep the elliptical and jump until I feel comfortable to downsize to a 150 and do I leap to the elliptical canopy at the same time. Or Do i downsize to a 150 spectre...see how I like flying that...and then try out a larger sized elliptical canopy???

I know things like this are on a per person basis...but any feedback that may or may not sway me from selling this canopy or keeping it for later use would be greatly appreciated.

--joekwon

--joe
HISPA #69
The Best Band in the WORLD!!!
The new full length album "See What You Can Find"

[piisfish 135]

really depends on many things...
what is mostly said is not to downsize and pass to eliptical at the same time...
but keep the main, and jump it later.
take advice from what instructors say at your DZ.
Stay safe. Have fun

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[NeedToJump 0]

I'm guessing that there is an elliptical 150 in the container now? I'd say buy the rig, sell the main canopy and put a 170 Spectre in there. When you're ready to downsize try a lot of different canopies. The 150 elliptical in there might not be what you want to jump when you're ready for it. Don't buy something now that you think you might like or be ready for later, buy something now that you like now.

Wind Tunnel and Skydiving Coach http://www.ariperelman.com

[Jimbo 0]

Keep looking, someone out there has a rig for sale that will fit you and contains the proper equipment.

To answer your question - at about 200 jumps or so I put around 20 jumps on a Cobalt 170. I kept my Safire for another 250 jumps after that.

-
Jim

"Like" - The modern day comma
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.

[grega 0]

Well i tried my first eliptical at around 210 jumps. i went from PD 9-cell 210 (wl 1:1) to Impulse-alpha 135 (wl 1.55)

I also tried spark 190, cobalt 170, impulse 150 a couple of times before, but i was regularly jumping square 210 and transferred to elliptical 135 which was my regular from then on.

And that was instructors idea not mine. he encouraged me for about 3 times. before i finally gave up and tried that impulse 135.
I'm still alive jumping cobalt comp 120 (1.75) but am still wondering if i made the right choice
I don't recommend you to do the same, hell no!!
i just answered to your question (title in the thread)

"George just lucky i guess!"

[DancingFlame 0]

No instructor will allow you to go elliptical before you made your 300 or even 500 jump. Large elliptical is for heavy-weighted professionals and not for light novice skydivers. I would recommend you to sell elliptical canopy.

[piisfish 135]

Quote

No instructor will allow you to go elliptical before you made your 300 or even 500 jump. Large elliptical is for heavy-weighted professionals and not for light novice skydivers. I would recommend you to sell elliptical canopy.

depends on the canopy...
for example, the Omni from Icarus is a 7cell elliptical... Not radically, not high aspect ratio... but still elliptical...

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[karlm 0]

Here's my two cents worth.

I had about 220 jumps before going to an elliptical. And Spent the next 50 trying not to kill myself (ok it was not that bad).

As said before don't down size and change from square to elliptical at the same time .... rather fly the 170 and get the numbers up, and then try a 170 elliptical, if you like it then look at down sizing once you have put a few on the 170 elliptical.

The main thing is, a 170 Square vs 170 Elliptical with your weight under. The elliptical will not fly faster (could be effected by angle of attack, aspect ratio etc). The only real benefit from a elliptical is the faster turning and more radical maneuvers, due to the lack of drag during a turn.

Also look at where you want to be in the sport in 2yrs, if camera work is something you like, then stay square, if swooping is your calling move to elliptical.

Better never to have met you in my dream than to wake and reach for hands that are not there.

[skybytch 259]

Quote

No instructor will allow you to go elliptical before you made your 300 or even 500 jump.

I think that depends on where you are. I know quite a few people who've gone to "fully elliptical" canopies (i.e. Stiletto, Crossfire) prior to 300 jumps. Some of them were perfectly capable of handling it, some weren't (aren't).

If a jumper has spent a lot of time on their first couple hundred jumps working canopy control, gotten coaching, has a desire to go faster and (imho the most important part) understands the risks they are taking by going elliptical I see no reason they should wait until they have 500 jumps.

On the other hand there are jumpers out there who should never go elliptical regardless of jump numbers and others who have no desire to go elliptical - I put myself in the second group.

To answer the original question, I jumped a Diablo at around 700 jumps.

[piisfish 135]

that's why I said to keep the elliptical, but not jump it yet...
Would certainly try to discourage anyone from jumping a potentially "vicious" canopy to people with few jumps, and that's also why I recommended to check that out with instructors who know how that person flies...

BTW my 1st elliptical jumps were on a Saphire2 145 at around 150 jumps, then ordered my Saphire2 139 (loaded approx 1.3-1.4) and received it at around 220 jumps...
Haven't jumped anything more elliptical or performant. Not that I don't want to... But I want to be able to do it many times...

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[Stacy 0]

At about 200 jumps I tried out a Crossfire (big) and a cobalt (not so big).

Definitely a bad idea. I was no where near ready for those canopies at that time, but unfortunately the demo reps at the DZ were convincing *everyone* they were OK for the canopies, it seemed. Yep, I landed, landed alive, and without incident, but that's just not enough comfort level for me to buy a canopy.

I waited another 200 jumps of so (on my spectre 150) before going elliptical.

__

[bbarnhouse 0]

I'm a wuss! Not really just conservative
I put 200 jumps on a Triathalon, then went to a semi-elliptical for another 300 jumps. I then tried an elliptical one size larger than my semi for 30 jumps before moving to an elliptical the same size of my semi.
I put 1,000+ jumps on that elliptical before downsizing.

[riggerrob 558]

I waited until I had one thousand jumps before trying an elliptical canopy.
Oh! Wait a minute! I am an old fart who had a thousand jumps before ellipticals were invented.
Silly me!
Hee! Hee!
Seriously, I pm'd you about a slightly used Spectre 170 for sale in Vancouver.
To be on the safe side, only down-size one size (15 or 20 square feet) or one class of canopy at a time. Then do a few dozen jumps - including all of BillVon's exercises - before considering down-sizing again.

[MajorDad 0]

I had about 500 jumps before I went to a Stilleto 150.

I agree with the advice from others in you have a heart to heart with the senior instructors and the better canopy pilots who know you as to what would be an appropriate canopy for your style and ablilities.

Most people on the list can quickly list off 5-10 names of people who went too quickly to too small of a canopy and ended up seriously/permanently hurt out of the deal.

Regards.

Major Dad
CSPA D-579

[panzwami 0]

At about 220 jumps, but I spent a good amount of time on the ground beforehand talking to instructors and other people about what to expect, what the differences were about ellipticals, how to get accustomed to it, etc. I then opened high a bunch of times and practiced all the various inputs (toggles, rears, fronts, etc.) to get used to how it reacted. Landings were done very conservatively, with long straight finals and plenty of extra room.

At 35 jumps (if your profile is correct), I'm not sure it's the best idea to move over to an elliptical, esp. if it's a downsize, too. But, if you put in the proper amount of time to learn about your canopy and become accustomed to it's flight characteristics, I don't know that it's necessary to wait until 500 jumps, either.

Matt
-----

[AggieDave 6]

I went elliptical at about 150 jumps, bought one (Heatwave) at 200 jumps, spent the next 600 jumps having to learn how to really fly it. Man I got lucky.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[billvon 2,400]

>The rig comes with an elliptical and I'm no where near ready to try to
> fly it. (BTWI'm still looking for a spectre 170)

A spectre is a lightly elliptical 7 cell.

I'd keep jumping whatever you have now (something like a Spectre 170?) until you can do everything with it, and that includes flat turns at 50 feet, flare turns, downwind and crosswind landings, rear riser flares etc. Once you can do that, go to either a more heavily ellptical 170 or a Spectre 150 and do the same thing. After that you'll be ready for the elliptical 150.

(BTW I jumped my first elliptical around jump 1200.)

[skydiver51 0]

My first canopy was an eliptical, an Omega 190. I was only loading it 1.1:1. It's a 7 cell so it's pretty forgiving and docile. It's the only one I would suggest to a jumper with low number of jumps.

[Conquest150 0]

i started jumping a stiletto 135 at 100 jumps am still jumping it, still plannin on jumping it for awhile. i have tried a fx 120 and it was nice and all but ill stick to my stiletto for awhile.

[dragon2 0]

Not yet... I have 465 jumps and have a Diablo 120 lying around, but it is gonna have to wait a while yet

Right now I'm jumping a Lightning 126 (Canopy Formation), Triathlon 120 (going to be/is my regular main) and Spectre 135 (was regular main, now is my BirdMan canopy).

The Diablo is for when I hit 500 jumps and am really really current. Probably will give it a go in a couple months. For the time being, I'll lend it to experienced jumpers who say this is a fun canopy (which makes me go hmmmmm )

ciel bleu,
Saskia

[jkwon 0]

I'm only at 52 jumps now...I just realized I didn't even put the kind of elliptical it was. It's a vengeance 150. I agree with what everyone is saying...I know also that every case is different. I've been asking around my DZ the rigger mostly asking about the flight characteristics and openings etc...just trying to get a feel for how this canopy flies. I've also asked the opinion of the people who know how I fly under canopy for recommendations. Everyone pretty much says the same thing...wait wait wait until you're 1000% sure you can fly the spectre 170 like a pro and then downsize from there. And to be honest with you I 100% agree with them. I'm a little chicken$hit when it comes to my life...which I think keeps me in the shape I'm in.

My dilema will be now...to sell or not to sell...this particular main only has 20 jumps on it so it's pretty spanking brand new. So i'd be hard pressed to NOT get rid of it at this point considering It may be a few months/years before I can even fly this canopy.

We'll see what they say when I get the new rig in. I trust the people who have flown with me most, because they know how I progressed over the time in my jumping life when my learning curve is at it's steapest. So I'm definitely not jumping this canopy for a while...Now "To sell or not to sell."

Thank you all for your opinions. I consider the forums to be my personal Gurus.

Thanks,
joe

--joe
HISPA #69
The Best Band in the WORLD!!!
The new full length album "See What You Can Find"

[jkwon 0]

Quote

I waited until I had one thousand jumps before trying an elliptical canopy.
Oh! Wait a minute! I am an old fart who had a thousand jumps before ellipticals were invented.
Silly me!
Hee! Hee!
Seriously, I pm'd you about a slightly used Spectre 170 for sale in Vancouver.
To be on the safe side, only down-size one size (15 or 20 square feet) or one class of canopy at a time. Then do a few dozen jumps - including all of BillVon's exercises - before considering down-sizing again.

I'll be getting in touch with you soon about this 170. I'm Bogged down with work today. Thanks though.

--joe

--joe
HISPA #69
The Best Band in the WORLD!!!
The new full length album "See What You Can Find"

[Ron 7]

1st jump on an elliptical.. was around 100. It was one jump a high pull and I was given a very good block of instruction. (Thanks Winsor).

I didn't jump an ellitical again until around jump # 260ish. It was a 97 Stiletto...Not smart, but I didn't die.

I bought a ST120 and jumped it on jump # 370...I hooked it in on jump # 373.

I would hope that you don't follow my stupid example.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[jkwon 0]

Trust me...I'm don't down size unless I'm not afraid to. If I feel a small twinge of fear I know I'm not ready. That's my best judgement. I understand what you're saying though.

At this point it's looking like I'm going to sell it.

I'll ask my riggers at my home DZ for the final words.

--joe
HISPA #69
The Best Band in the WORLD!!!
The new full length album "See What You Can Find"

[GravityGirl 0]

And the #1 thing to consider when shopping for a rig:

BUY WHAT YOU WANT TO FLY NOW AND QUIT TRYING TO PREDICT THE FUTURE!

Too much thought is put into "where I'm gonna be in 100 jumps" when people buy gear. If you base your purchasing decisions this train of though you may very well never get those 100 jumps.

If you buy a good modern used system at a fair price that is suitable for you, then it should maintain good value in 100 jumps when you want to sell it and downsize/upsize/trade across. 170s and 190s are the easiest rigs to sell. So the resale value rocks!

Sorry if I sounded like I was venting, but I was.

Carry on....

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Peace and Blue Skies!
Bonnie ==>Gravity Gear!