Altimeters and reaction times

[pincheck 0]

This is a question that was reawakened from another thread. I had this conversation with experienced rigger/jumper.

We where talking about digitial alti's v's analogue. He brought a interesting point that never really occured to me. if you look at analogue face with a needle you can pretty much see when its pull time as its reinforced by knowing where the needle needs to be ?. If you look at digital (forget about alarms just visual) you dont have this reinforced view as it constantly changes and by the time your brain processes the number shown its already passed your pull time. Does this makesense ? it would be interesting to hear other points of view.
This isn't a question about digi v's analogue its about how we see and process information

Billy-Sonic Haggis Flickr-Fun

[sid 1]

Quote

This isn't a question about digi v's analogue its about how we see and process information

I think it's more about perception of information. If you train and practice with an analogue, eventually you instictively recognize trigger points for action - cognitive awareness - as you transition to a digital display you will revert to the same kind of reaction times that you experienced with an analogue display.

This will seem (and in fact will be) slower initially, but eventually you will recognize trigger displays and react to them without "reading" them.

After a few jumps you will be back to the same reaction times as with your analogue display.

Pete Draper,

Just because my life plan is written on the back of a Hooter's Napkin, it's still a life plan.... right?

[IanHarrop 37]

Quote

This is a question that was reawakened from another thread. I had this conversation with experienced rigger/jumper.

We where talking about digitial alti's v's analogue. He brought a interesting point that never really occured to me. if you look at analogue face with a needle you can pretty much see when its pull time as its reinforced by knowing where the needle needs to be ?. If you look at digital (forget about alarms just visual) you dont have this reinforced view as it constantly changes and by the time your brain processes the number shown its already passed your pull time. Does this makesense ? it would be interesting to hear other points of view.
This isn't a question about digi v's analogue its about how we see and process information

On a Neptune they have a thing refered to as the "fun meter" . Its a horizontal line under the digital altitude that gets shorter as you approach 3000 feet. When the "fun meter" is empty you are at or below 3000'.

"Where troubles melt like lemon drops, away above the chimney tops, that's where you'll find me" Dorothy

[riggerrob 558]

It depends upon the individual.
Some people are number oriented while others are angle oriented.
For example, I suffer from dyslexia every time I stare at a number. On the other hand, I can read the angle of an altimeter needle at a glance.
Ergo, digital altimeters are gibberish to me.
The only digital altimeter that made any sense to me was the Para-Sport Italia model that displayed "pie slices."

[faulknerwn 36]

Exactly. I'm the opposite - I grew up with all digital clocks and all digital watches. I have to actively concentrate to read a clock, and I have to think to understand an analog altimeter - while digitals just tell ya what you need to know! "Its 3.5" not- hmmm the needle is clockwise of the 3 so that means its greater than 3 and less than 4..

[MrBrant 0]

I'm the same way.

I actually had this discussion with some people at my DZ last year.

As a general rule the younger guys seemed to be more comfortable with digital displays, while the.... um.... experienced ones tended to go more for the analogue point of view.

I grew up with digital clocks. I'm the same way - i really have to think about the arm positions to tell time, instead of just a quick glance. I sometimes find myself doing that in freefall too - taking that extra half second to think and figure out just where I am.

While other guys, can just see that needle and know exactly where they are, but would have to think about it with a digital readout.

I think this is one of those cases where there is no right answer. It will be different for everybody.

[Scoop 0]

I dont trust electronics. Too many variables for things to go wrong. If you cant see how it works then it must be witchcraft.

I type this on my voodoo powered computer

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

As a general rule the younger guys seemed to be more comfortable with digital displays, while the.... um.... experienced ones tended to go more for the analogue point of view.

I grew up with digital clocks. I'm the same way - i really have to think about the arm positions to tell time, instead of just a quick glance. I sometimes find myself doing that in freefall too - taking that extra half second to think and figure out just where I am.

I think that generalization is closer to a stereotype - iow, vaguely factual at best. In most of life I prefer digital clocks and for hiking I'd rather have a digital altimeter. Same underwater. When the number doesn't change rapidly, precision is top wish.

But for speed of reading in the sky, I much prefer the analog altimeter. I used a Neptune for a dozen jumps and perhaps I would eventually adapt, but I think the altittrack (if the damn thing ever ships) is more suitable for me.

[BigSky 2]

I think the years of starring at the clock in school have trained my eyes for analog. I dont even think I would need numbers on it. On the other hand my buddy has a Barigo altimeter and the 12 and 0 are not straight up. I think this would be very counter productive for me.

“Sometimes when I reflect back on all the beer I drink I feel ashamed. Then I look into the glass and think about the workers in the brewery and their hopes and dreams. If I didn’t drink this beer, th

[shermanator 3]

what about a digital alti with an analog view? do they make one such alti? i think it would be a great idea, because you would still get the analog view, and keep the digital recordings like the neptune takes *pull alti, speed, ect.*

CLICK HERE! new blog posted 9/21/08
CSA #720

[Dougiefresh 0]

Sweet, huh?

http://www.l-and-b.dk/altitrack.html

Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so. --Douglas Adams

[BigSky 2]

Ya except it is $300 dollars. You can get a protrack for about $200 and an analog alti for about $150. So for a little bit more you can have an audible and a visual, plus the log.

“Sometimes when I reflect back on all the beer I drink I feel ashamed. Then I look into the glass and think about the workers in the brewery and their hopes and dreams. If I didn’t drink this beer, th

[labrys 0]

I'm sort of the same except that I grew up with analog but I still find it much easier to process the digital display. I have to think about what the analog display means when I look at it, but I see the first 2 digits on the digital and know right away what my altitude range is.

For some reason my brain always wants to read the analog dial on the wrong side of the significant number. I've broken away from formations at 5500 instead of 4500 a significant number of times because of that. That's not good

I agree that it depends on the person.

Edit to add: It occured to me right after I posted that one of the reasons I have "trouble" with the analog might be because I grew up with analog and started jumping at a fairly "old" age.

I think my particular brain expects to see the "hands" on the dial rotating clockwise when I look at my left wrist and gets a little thrown when it's going backwards.

If you put your altimeter on upside-down will you go up when you exit? Just a thought.

Owned by Remi #?

[agent_lead 0]

im new to skydiving and i usedanalogs for myy aff exclusivly...after i finished aff i went and got myself a
skytronix gfx and i wear that one on my right wrist and i still rock my analog on my left...this way regardless if which way im looking i pretty much always see my altitude with minimal eye/arm movement...

--------------------------------------------
www.facebook.com/agentlead

[bob.dino 0]

Quote

I think the years of starring at the clock in school have trained my eyes for analog. I dont even think I would need numbers on it. On the other hand my buddy has a Barigo altimeter and the 12 and 0 are not straight up. I think this would be very counter productive for me.

It's pretty trivial to make either the 12 or the 0 straight up. Take the altimeter out of the metal case/strap, and put it back in at the angle you want.

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

Ya except it is $300 dollars. You can get a protrack for about $200 and an analog alti for about $150. So for a little bit more you can have an audible and a visual, plus the log.

financially, it's not a good deal. Having the protrack gives you both the logging and the audible, and you still have an unpowered altimeter.

But I like the asymetrical guage going to 18, and what about this sport makes sense financially, anyhow?

[BigSky 2]

Quote

Quote

I think the years of starring at the clock in school have trained my eyes for analog. I dont even think I would need numbers on it. On the other hand my buddy has a Barigo altimeter and the 12 and 0 are not straight up. I think this would be very counter productive for me.

It's pretty trivial to make either the 12 or the 0 straight up. Take the altimeter out of the metal case/strap, and put it back in at the angle you want.

Yes but the 12 and 0 are not in the same upright position no matter how you move it. they are separated.

“Sometimes when I reflect back on all the beer I drink I feel ashamed. Then I look into the glass and think about the workers in the brewery and their hopes and dreams. If I didn’t drink this beer, th

[bob.dino 0]

Above 12k it's not usually a big deal as to how high you are...

[tbrown 26]

Quote

I dont trust electronics. Too many variables for things to go wrong.

Analog needles can get hung up too. I've seen people pull way low because they were waiting for a hung up altimeter to give them "permission" to pull.

Whatever kind of an altimeter you use, you should not be watching it for the exact pull altitude. You should be looking around you for other people and you should be looking at the ground to get an idea of how big the ground looks at pull time.

So here's an idea. If you're pulling at 3000 - 3500 ft, go ahead and check your alti down to 4 grand. At 4 grand forget the alti, take a good look around for traffic and a good look at the ground and throw it out. When you're open, you can check your alti again to see what your altitude under canopy is.

Because if you're wearing an altimeter on your wrist, you're not going to be able to read it at all while you track. You'll need to learn how to give it a quick look at breakoff and then track for 5 or several seconds, wave off and pull. Your alti is an aID, it's not a task master.

Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity !

[rasmack 0]

Am I the only one who thinks that you should have a feel for your fall rate? I keep track of my altitude to help adjust my inner clock enough so that I don't have to look at the altimeter when break-off comes.

HF #682, Team Dirty Sanchez #227
“I simply hate, detest, loathe, despise, and abhor redundancy.”
- Not quite Oscar Wilde...

[BigSky 2]

Quote

Above 12k it's not usually a big deal as to how high you are...

Ya but Im not talking about knowing where 12 grand is. Im talking about glancing at the altimiter and knowing where Im at just by the needle. You know, If some one says to you "You got a bandit on you six" you know he is right behind you, at your six o'clock. If some one says " check out the hottie at 3 o'clock then you know to look 90deg right. If you just move the 12 on the barigo up to the center then 1,000 is in the 2 o'clock position and so on.

“Sometimes when I reflect back on all the beer I drink I feel ashamed. Then I look into the glass and think about the workers in the brewery and their hopes and dreams. If I didn’t drink this beer, th

[nate_1979 9]

I just proved to myself last weekend that I have a much faster reaction time to digital (neptune) alti's now than analog ones.... I jumped an analog one for the first time since around jump 30 last weekend, and, well, screw that.

FGF #???
I miss the sky...
There are 10 types of people in the world... those who understand binary and those who don't.