Loose chest strap/Cypres fire.

[tristansdad 0]

I think he learned his lesson, or at least I hope so. I actually had a miss routed chest strap before but caught it on the ride up. I think it was becasue I wasnt distracted by my GoPro

[CSpenceFLY 1]

tristansdad

I think he learned his lesson, or at least I hope so. I actually had a miss routed chest strap before but caught it on the ride up. I think it was becasue I wasnt distracted by my GoPro

Some of you can joke all you want about the camera issue. In many cases I agree that they probably play no part in an incident. In this case however the time he spent turning on his camera should have been used checking his chest strap.

[skymama 35]

Quote

In this case however the time he spent turning on his camera should have been used checking his chest strap.

Even if he was rushing to get on the plane (who amongst us hasn't?) and maybe he missed it, he still had 20 minutes till altitude to do a gear check. I can't even understand why that thought didn't cross his mind. How does one NOT do at least one gear check before getting out of the damn plane? It's not that hard or time consuming!

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[labrys 0]

Quote

In this case however the time he spent turning on his camera should have been used checking his chest strap.

I don't think that it's that simple. It makes more sense to say that he should have incorporated the camera into his routine. It's entirely possible for a mature jumper to decide to check priority gear and then check optional gear.

That's what the jump minimum to fly a camera means to me. Give someone time to develop good basic gear habits. That takes some time and experience. *Then* introduce another factor, and give it time.

Owned by Remi #?

[tristansdad 0]

Yes it was a joke but people have been mis routing chest straps long before gopros were around. I didnt even have a gropro when I discovered my issue. He failed long before it was time to turn that camera on. He failed when he put the gear on, climbed on the plane and during the ride to altitude.

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

Hi Moms,

Quote

How does one NOT do at least one gear check before getting out of the damn plane?

If one was around back then, most of us will never forget the incident with Ivan in North Carolina who filmed a tandem without wearing his rig.

Cameras can be very distracting.

JerryBaumchen

[DSE 3]

labrys

Quote

In this case however the time he spent turning on his camera should have been used checking his chest strap.

I don't think that it's that simple. It makes more sense to say that he should have incorporated the camera into his routine. It's entirely possible for a mature jumper to decide to check priority gear and then check optional gear.

That's what the jump minimum to fly a camera means to me. Give someone time to develop good basic gear habits. That takes some time and experience. *Then* introduce another factor, and give it time.

This is my takeaway too.
It's unfortunate to read the comments from some with the attitude of "that'll never happen to me."

In my short time in this sport, I've seen a lot of "never" turn into "no shit, there I was..."

[unkulunkulu 0]

Quote

If one was around back then, most of us will never forget the incident with Ivan in North Carolina who filmed a tandem without wearing his rig.

Cameras can be very distracting.

Can you please extend on this as my understanding of the language and what is written here makes me imagine things that I cannot even comprehend.

[SecondRound 0]

I am way way new, but my instructor has already repeatedly drilled into me the jump run check of three threes. Three ring releases, three attachment points (chest strap and both leg straps, and the three handles in order of use (ripcord, cutaway, and reserve) reading this thread makes me appreciate the quality instruction I am getting.

[wildcard451 0]

unkulunkulu

Quote

If one was around back then, most of us will never forget the incident with Ivan in North Carolina who filmed a tandem without wearing his rig.

Cameras can be very distracting.

Can you please extend on this as my understanding of the language and what is written here makes me imagine things that I cannot even comprehend.

No - you're imagining it correctly.

[ryoder 1,384]

unkulunkulu

Quote

If one was around back then, most of us will never forget the incident with Ivan in North Carolina who filmed a tandem without wearing his rig.

Cameras can be very distracting.

Can you please extend on this as my understanding of the language and what is written here makes me imagine things that I cannot even comprehend.

http://www.aintnowaytogo.com/noChute.htm

Search for his name in Google, and you can find the video.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[cruelpops 0]

After "gearing up" I inspect and pull on my own chest strap at least 5 to 10 times before and during climb to altitude. It's hard to explain but it's an OCD thing. I always have someone give me a pin-check and I'm constantly reviewing and feeling for any irregularities with my harness, handles, 3-ring, RSL, etc. The camera configuration (helmet mount) is checked before I get on the plane and forgotten until after I get on the ground and packed.

The video should be used as a valuable training tool. This would be appropriate for both new and experienced "cool" skydiving kids. The guy obviously lost sight of his priorities and he is damn lucky a battery operated gizmo saved his ass. Eventually Darwin will smile and catch up to those that aren't paying attention.

[airtwardo 6]

DSE

***

Quote

In this case however the time he spent turning on his camera should have been used checking his chest strap.

I don't think that it's that simple. It makes more sense to say that he should have incorporated the camera into his routine. It's entirely possible for a mature jumper to decide to check priority gear and then check optional gear.

That's what the jump minimum to fly a camera means to me. Give someone time to develop good basic gear habits. That takes some time and experience. *Then* introduce another factor, and give it time.

This is my takeaway too.
It's unfortunate to read the comments from some with the attitude of "that'll never happen to me."

In my short time in this sport, I've seen a lot of "never" turn into "no shit, there I was..."

Then those people didn't understand what commitment to perfection really means.

I say 100% it will never happen to me because I've commitment myself to go the mile and do whatever it takes to not allow for failure.

When ya allow for a 2% 'screw up factor' you will because of that internally, never reach 100% perfection.

I was taught never go near the aircraft until everything is on 'Tight & Right'...I then do three checks of 3's on board.

It is a practiced routine. Same thing - same way - same time - same order - every single time, no exceptions.

In almost 40 years in the sport I've never forgotten anything or not had my gear rigged right...and yes - - I never will!

Your priorities establish the motivation for your performance.

If you put a high enough priority on something, you will do what it takes to succeed...it's human nature.

Most of us can only commit to that level on a small handful of things. Two of mine are~

I will not die because I fucked up putting my parachute on...

I will not hurt a spectator in the course of performing a demo or I will never do another demo.

The motivational factor is obviously pretty high for me to take whatever steps are necessary to make it happen.

Like Broadway Joe once said ~ I guarantee it!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[FlyingRhenquest 1]

skymama

Even if he was rushing to get on the plane (who amongst us hasn't?) and maybe he missed it, he still had 20 minutes till altitude to do a gear check. I can't even understand why that thought didn't cross his mind. How does one NOT do at least one gear check before getting out of the damn plane? It's not that hard or time consuming!

Or you know, the FOUR guys looking at him!

I check my shit repeatedly. Almost obsessively, really. Kinda like, I dunno, my life depends on it! I also look at chest straps, shoe laces and altimeters (in particular) on nearby skydivers. And for signs that anything else is out of place. At the very, very least, that guy across the plane going splat will ruin your day's fun . I assume if you're jumping with them, you're kind of friends. So FFS take some responsibility for their well being! We're all in this together!

Can you imagine what would have happened if that guy hadn't activated his AAD? He'd have died is what! Slammed into the ground on his back panicking over his chest strap! At least someone had the presence of mind to turn that thing on!

I'm trying to teach myself how to set things on fire with my mind. Hey... is it hot in here?

[davelepka 4]

Quote

I check my shit repeatedly. Almost obsessively, really. Kinda like, I dunno, my life depends on it! I also look at chest straps, shoe laces and altimeters (in particular) on nearby skydivers. And for signs that anything else is out of place. At the very, very least, that guy across the plane going splat will ruin your day's fun Unsure. I assume if you're jumping with them, you're kind of friends. So FFS take some responsibility for their well being! We're all in this together!

It's shocking that this is something you have to say, that's it's not the thought on everyone's mind on every load, but it's not.

My question for those people, is what else are they doing that's so important? There's not that much going on in the plane that's so entertaining, and all of the people you're wedged into the noisy cabin with are the people you spend all day hanging out on the ground with, so the chit-chat isn't all that important or necessary.

One of the things I like about jumping is that it's 'all-encompassing'. I find it very had to think about much else when I'm on a skydive, so the rest of the world sort of 'melts away' (this is even true to a degree just being at the DZ, but with cell phones and texting it's not quite as 'all encompassing' as it used to be). In either case, the point is that it's an activity that requires your 100% focus, and I can't understand people who don't carry a degree of that through to areas outside of the actual jump. If you could apply that focus to the planning of the jump, to include the packing and gear-up, and the ride to altitude, to include gear checks and aircraft safety, and the after-jump, to include a solid debrief, everyone would do a better job, be safer, and get more out of their jumps.

Don't get me wrong, it's a fun sport. There's plenty of time for cocking around at the DZ with your pals in between all the 'serious stuff', but there really does need to be all the 'serious stuff' first and foremost. On a good day when everything goes right, the serious stuff makes you a better skydiver. On a bad when things go wrong, the serious stuff makes you live to see another day.

[FlyingRhenquest 1]

Heh well the video does redouble my resolve to continue to watch out for myself and those around me, so if no other good comes of it at least there's that.

I hope this guy learns from his mistakes. I'd think long and hard about continuing in the sport after a series of errors of that magnitude. If he decides to stick with it, he damn well better turn off that camera and resolve to become a better skydiver or next time he might not be so lucky.

I'm trying to teach myself how to set things on fire with my mind. Hey... is it hot in here?

[BIGUN 1,053]

tdog

***I will ask anyone who doesn't already have to plan of action to deal with an undone chest strap in freefall come up with one now and discuss it here.

Assuming the chest strap must be undone at pulltime... I see two options. I don't know which one I like better?

1) Cross arms, grab opposite side of body.

2) Best box-man belly to earth pull.

The goal needs to be to keep both main lift webs across your chest.

Option two widens your shoulder area. Option one holds them in place, but rounds your shoulders which might make matters worse...

I had option 1 as my plan should the shit hit the fan... But, I wonder if I am wrong????

(Edit - I was typing as Dave posted... While typing, I sat in my chair looking at my arms and thought about the MLW sliding down my arms... I still wonder if crossing arms might actually promote the MLW sliding off rounded shoulders. No proof, just a thought.)


Place both arms across the MLW first; then leaving your left arm in place... pull.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[JackC1 0]

gowlerk

What this video really shows is the danger of flying camera before you are ready.

Cameras, cameras, cameras. It's all we hear around here these days.

This guy's screw up was getting on a plane when he wasn't geared to jump out of it. A proper flight line check would have caught this and fixed it before it became an issue. The camera is incidental rubbish; it does not distract you continually from the 20 min call all the way to exit, 40 mins later.

Before you get on any jump plane, put your fucking rig on. Do it properly, do it before you board and get a flight line gear check. Make it part of your pre-flight procedure and do it every time. Failure to do that is what caused this incident, not a fecking GoPro.

[tdog 0]

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Place both arms across the MLW first; then leaving your left arm in place... pull.

With a few thousand jumps and nearly a decade in the sport - I never have seen any true "scientific" study to support this... I tend to agree it makes sense and always has been my plan and what I told other people I would do when coaching.

Do you have data? Another poster suggested not to grab before pulling as it promotes head down.


I just tried on my rig, and looked at how easy it was for the MLW to slide off my shoulder without a chest strap... There was a major difference between arms crossed and rounded corners vs arms wide in boxman... Clearly the worst is hands to your side uncrossed... Arms crossed, the MLW wanted to slide off your shoulder, but your armpits catch it... Shoulders wide in boxman, it did not want to slide at all.....

I guess short of having someone hang upside down from a rig, we may never know....

[normiss 622]

THIS.

My gear on fun jumps - no clue how many times I check everything, but I do. Usually three times BEFORE boarding and at least that many again before exit.
Same with tandem gear, more so with student rigs and tandem harnesses.
I'm constantly scanning other jumper's gear too.

I also check Andrea's gear multiple times!!


I also have never found that video of the vidiot with no rig....I have searched.

[cpoxon 0]

normiss

I also have never found that video of the vidiot with no rig....I have searched.

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=2871072#2871072

Skydiving Fatalities - Cease not to learn 'til thou cease to live

[theonlyski 3]

chemfx

could the hook knife be a factor in loosening his chest strap?
i was looking at the jumper across from him and seemed like his was doing just that?

(I don't see anyone responding to this)

Ever wonder what the purpose for that fold over at the end of the chest strap is? Even if the strap were to work it's way loose, the fold over at the end does a pretty damn good job of keeping the strap in the hardware.

I'm willing to bet that this guy had his chest strap misrouted when he geared up.

"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly
DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890
I'm an asshole, and I approve this message

[tkhayes 126]

distractions can kill you, that's the lesson. He sacrificed altitude for what, in the end, was not a real malfunction, or even a serious enough situation to warrant an AAD fire.

[jumpwally 0]

+1 i remember jumping being a lot more fun when only a small base went out and everyone flew to the formation,,did everyone forget how much fun flying is ? We have become too chunk and point obsessed,,,,

smile, be nice, enjoy life
FB # - 1083

[CazmoDee 3]

That^.
Threaded improperly, then through the hook knife strap. I bet it looked okay. Maybe even had just enough resistance when tugged on.
Who knows?

Replying to the comment by theonlyski

I'm behind the bar at Sloppy Joe's....See ya in the Keys!

Muff 4313