Creator of the Planned Parenthood videos!

[quade 3]

rushmc

he framed no one


That is your lie

I'm pretty sure when one person interviews another person, takes surreptitious video of that conversation, edits it out of context so the person being interviewed looks like they're saying things they never intended . . .

What's the word for that?

Oh yeah a frame.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[kallend 1,648]

SkyDekker

***************Looks to be in quite the pickle

dumbass.


"Daleiden also faces a misdemeanor count related to the “prohibition of the purchase and sale of human organs."
Funny when you try to set someone up for breaking the law you just broke.

Why the obsession?

We get it. You love abortions.

Enough already.



Why do you hate liars unless the tell lies you agree with? No one is obsessed like anti-choicers and others who feel the need to control women are.

Opinion, not fact.

You got it
This is a long way from over but, they will use this to destroy this person and then scare the hell out of anyone else who may try something that is a holy alter to the left

I predict, in the end, this person will win and get retribution

But it will take years and have a great cost.

Of course you were the first here to post about how these videos were absolute proof that all kinds of illegal things were happening.

When you finally figured out that you were wrong again, as usual, you went very quiet on the thread.

Oh, I think the video was proof that all kinds of illegal things WERE happening. It's just that they were not the things that Marc was referring to.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[JerryBaumchen 1,066]

Hi Sky,

Quote

When you finally figured out that you were wrong again, as usual, you went very quiet on the thread.

Isn't it interesting who he always seems to be doing that.

Jerry Baumchen

PS) He never did come up with any posting in which John Kallend was wrong on the facts.

[wmw999 2,149]

Here's a whole abortion thread without a single woman commenting

Personally, I think your position is valid. I might disagree on a complete ban on partial birth abortions -- in the case where the fetus is already dead, it's way easier on the mother.

But there's a lot of room for differences of opinion; there just isn't when people draw tiny little boxes and say that anything that disagrees is wrong-wrong-wrong.

I can understand feeling that all abortion, under any circumstances, is murder. I don't agree with it, but it's a position that can be logically consistent. As long as: you understand that the majority of conceptions/pregnancies end in miscarriage, stillbirth, failure to implant, or spontaneous abortion, and you understand that since only a God would know that one is pregnant before conception, it probably takes believing in God to be against the pre-implantation abortifacients.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[quade 3]

wmw999

Here's a whole abortion thread without a single woman commenting

I'm not sure this is actually an abortion thread.

To me it's more of a Republican Dirty Tricks thread.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[wmw999 2,149]

I actually don't find it offensive that a woman should discuss a possible abortion with the father, and weigh his input very seriously in the final decision. It's a big decision. But yes, ultimately, the woman is going to suffer nearly all of the consequences, particularly if the sex was outside of marriage.

For all of the guys who say "we were pregnant," it doesn't really work that way . We women might share some of the discomfort and hormone load, but there's a vast trove of it to share from

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[normiss 622]

The "we" in my case was we.
We decided to be together and have a family, then we decided it was entirely wrong at that time.
Then we had 3 beautiful children when it was right.
It was a joint effort and a joint decision.

I understand what you mean, but discrediting half the team (when it IS a team venture) is disrespectful to half the team.
I wouldn't want to be in a situation where the abortion decision didn't include the father, but I fully understand that is not always the case, and rightly so in some of those situations.

[gowlerk 1,926]

I largely agree. Discussion with the potential father is entirely appropriate. But not mandatory. The offensive part to me was the giving and signing of a permission paper.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[wmw999 2,149]

Illegal acts to support a cause in which you believe are still illegal. And his were illegal.

As far as all people who favor freedom to choose abortion not respecting life, that's bullshit. And the contention that as long as a single woman had fun having sex there shouldn't be abortions (or whatever flavor of "irresponsible" is in vogue), that's bullshit, too. Otherwise, as long as a single person uses guns, cars, or anything else irresponsibly (even bananas), they should be illegal.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[wmw999 2,149]

The "we" in my case was also "we." I wasn't trying to discredit half the team, just saying that in the event of deep disagreement, maybe the person who is actually pregnant should have the final say. I know I did more talking in my case.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[turtlespeed 212]

wmw999

Here's a whole abortion thread without a single woman commenting

Personally, I think your position is valid. I might disagree on a complete ban on partial birth abortions -- in the case where the fetus is already dead, it's way easier on the mother.

But there's a lot of room for differences of opinion; there just isn't when people draw tiny little boxes and say that anything that disagrees is wrong-wrong-wrong.

I can understand feeling that all abortion, under any circumstances, is murder. I don't agree with it, but it's a position that can be logically consistent. As long as: you understand that the majority of conceptions/pregnancies end in miscarriage, stillbirth, failure to implant, or spontaneous abortion, and you understand that since only a God would know that one is pregnant before conception, it probably takes believing in God to be against the pre-implantation abortifacients.

Wendy P.

I have trouble rationalizing the thought that it is not OK to remove, by taking the life, a truly deadly and dangerous menace to society, but perfectly acceptable to flippantly abort a life for convenience.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[quade 3]

turtle speed

... abort a life for convenience.

Emphasis mine.

What a load of bullshit. It's never been a trip to 7/11. Never.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[wmw999 2,149]

I understand you feel that way. I don't think it's (or should be) flippant, but on the other hand, I also don't think that a six-week fetus is the same as a fully developed human. That is as deeply held and believed for me as your thoughts are for you.

This is a messy area; making a decision affects the mother, regardless of whether she took precautions (they can fail), and don't necessarily affect the father. Maybe in an ideal world it would, but that's not our world. Sex is used as play, diversion, procreation, release, and as a weapon of domination, violence, and anger. All of those reasons can result in a pregnancy.

And, in many cases, the man only has consequences if he chooses to. Not all, and it's not to say that most don't choose to take the consequences (they do). But the fact remains that only the woman gets pregnant, bears a child, and generally has to raise the child.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[RonD1120 58]

gowlerk

I largely agree. Discussion with the potential father is entirely appropriate. But not mandatory. The offensive part to me was the giving and signing of a permission paper.

It was required by the physician and the hospital.

Now that I am revisiting that very sad period and decision, I recall that my wife became pregnant a month before the divorce was final. Their reasoning was a protection against lawsuit by me.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[turtlespeed 212]

quade

***... abort a life for convenience.

Emphasis mine.

What a load of bullshit. It's never been a trip to 7/11. Never.

How can you intellectually, honestly say, or believe that?

Never? Really? NEVER?

Bah - you know better. I would have given you more credit until you typed that.

How many hookers have aborted to keep working? That is convenience.
How many couples got drunk and created a child, and then, conveniently, aborted the kid to make their lives easy and more convenient?
How many permissions women have showed up to hide and dispose of their societally imposed shame, because it is more convenient?

Or do you really think that every aborted child is a product of rape and molestation?

It was stated earlier in this thread that a poster here took the convenient way out.
Things didn't match his and his partner's view, so they took the convenient way out.

Honestly.

. . . . People with blinders and willful ignorance.

What ever you let yourself think, to let yourself live with what you have done, is up to you.

I consider that thinking exactly like what it takes to believe in a book written by people supposedly being guided by a God, his son, and a Holy Ghost, all one and the same.

It's all shades of what it takes to justify what you want to believe.

Its killing - pure and plain and simple.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[rehmwa 2]

wmw999

I actually don't find it offensive that a woman should discuss a possible abortion with the father, and weigh his input very seriously in the final decision. It's a big decision.

Absolutely agree - because in the end, all decisions are made by one person and they have the right to get whatever input they wish.

As far as I'm concerned, that person (in this case the mother) holds the final decision. She can consult with ANYONE she chooses to (the father, the doctor, a stranger, parents, cousins) - it's really only her business.

I'm fully pro-choice. But with one caviat - that many seem hard to wrap their heads around. The person making 100% of the decision must also be 100% responsible for their choice.

In general, I think this is fundamental to any philosophy that values the individual - we make our own decisions, and that comes with responsibility. You can't give up one or the other - it has to be both or the system fails.

So this doesn't really fit either party biases.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[SkyDekker 1,145]

Quote

How many hookers have aborted to keep working? That is convenience.
How many couples got drunk and created a child, and then, conveniently, aborted the kid to make their lives easy and more convenient?
How many permissions women have showed up to hide and dispose of their societally imposed shame, because it is more convenient?

How many?

[quade 3]

turtlespeed

******... abort a life for convenience.

Emphasis mine.

What a load of bullshit. It's never been a trip to 7/11. Never.

How can you intellectually, honestly say, or believe that?

Never? Really? NEVER?

Bah - you know better. I would have given you more credit until you typed that.

On the flip side, I don't think I can give you any credit at all for understanding it is NOT a "convenient" thing for any woman to go though.

You have so many assumptions about things and people you've never personally experienced and yet you trot out a list of them as if you had.

Seriously. Ever been a "hooker"? Neither have I but I can't believe any part of it is a convenience unless you have some completely different definition of the word than is in the dictionary.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[gowlerk 1,926]

This is a good example of the problem. YOU put yourself in a position where YOU judge if a woman deserves the "convenience" of the option to have an abortion. You would allow it for "good" girls, those who meet your standard of behavior. But those who don't? Those you would punish by forcing them to carry through with an unwanted pregnancy.

It's just NONE OF YOUR FUCKING BUSINESS. This attitude towards women is despicable.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[gowlerk 1,926]

Quote

There is something about killing babies that is hurtful and disgusting.

There is no denying that many people honestly view abortion through this lens. And I know you see it as such. I can relate to your pain. But in the end I find it necessary to allow women the right to choice in the matter.

You will probably never completely lose this scar. It belongs in your permanent collection.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[turtlespeed 212]

gowlerk

This is a good example of the problem. YOU put yourself in a position where YOU judge if a woman deserves the "convenience" of the option to have an abortion. You would allow it for "good" girls, those who meet your standard of behavior. But those who don't? Those you would punish by forcing them to carry through with an unwanted pregnancy.

It's just NONE OF YOUR FUCKING BUSINESS. This attitude towards women is despicable.

Damn - the text didn't post -

I'll retype:

So, you feel the need to scream over text -
Very emotional.

Huh.

Evidently my opinion is despicable, while yours is what, righteous?
Have you been carrying this superiority complex around long, or is it just a liberal thing?

The mindset you have of others opinions reeks of the same mind set of people like Reverend Wright, Reverend Oral Roberts, Joel Olsteen, and just about any other large venue religious preacher.

But HEY, it's ok, because you are right, and you Know it!

What makes you think your opinion is so much more valid than mine?

What makes you righteous?

What makes you so hypocritical?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[jakee 1,259]

Quote

You got it
This is a long way from over but, they will use this to destroy this person and then scare the hell out of anyone else who may try something that is a holy alter to the left

I predict, in the end, this person will win and get retribution

Let's let Turtlespeed answer you on this one:

I simply agree that a person caught breaking and entering should be charged and convicted, if they are guilty.

I simply agree that a drunk driver should pay for his crimes if caught breaking the law.

Why don't you want people to follow the law?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[turtlespeed 212]

jakee

Quote

You got it
This is a long way from over but, they will use this to destroy this person and then scare the hell out of anyone else who may try something that is a holy alter to the left

I predict, in the end, this person will win and get retribution

Let's let Turtlespeed answer you on this one:

I simply agree that a person caught breaking and entering should be charged and convicted, if they are guilty.

I simply agree that a drunk driver should pay for his crimes if caught breaking the law.

Why don't you want people to follow the law?

Agreed - if he broke the law - prosecute him.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[billvon 2,434]

>I have trouble rationalizing the thought that it is not OK to remove, by taking the life, a truly deadly and
>dangerous menace to society, but perfectly acceptable to flippantly abort a life for convenience.

I do as well. Similarly, I have trouble rationalizing the thought that it is abhorrent to end the pregnancy of a fetus that has congenital defects and will likely not survive to adulthood, but perfectly acceptable to kill an unarmed teen who someone is afraid of.

Of course, the vast majority of both shootings and abortion fall well between those two extremes.

[rehmwa 2]

billvon

Of course, the vast majority of both shootings and abortion fall well between those two extremes.

Unless you're debating it on Facebook (or pretending to debate it in order to insult people you don't know).

Then those are the ONLY four examples people use.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants