What is so evil about requiring id to vote?

[cvfd1399 0]

Yes I see, but would that not have given him a Consular Report of Birth Abroad DS-1350(new form FS-240) which would have been his birth certificate?

[rehmwa 2]

just not invested in the debate - I'm here for my personal entertainment.

But if I gave you an answer, how do you propose we take our fantastically cooperative Rehmdekker solution and get it implemented? I'm aquiver with anticipation.

Frankly, maybe locals could figure it out for themselves, but then sporadic abuse would still abound - in favor of whatever group is in charge....

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[cvfd1399 0]

Quote

One major problem in a lot of your "ID should be no issue..." examples is you're forgetting there's a lot of inertia in the system. Just because someone doesn't have ID doesn't mean they never had ID. I've been registered to vote, employed, housed, and have had bank accounts in California for over a decade. In the last decade I've renewed my driver's license twice (online, mind you) and I've used ID for those above things one time (I bought a house, which is pretty easy to not do.)

I'm not someone who jumps through hoops to use ID as infrequently as possible (in fact, as I wrote earlier I use it all the time) and I think the people trying to convince you that theoretically you too could get by without ID are going about the argument all wrong, but it really shouldn't be that confounding that some people don't have ID.

I am sure everyone can come up with a story about how they NEVER have to use ID. I can name you ones I have NEEDED it for from recent memory.
-Buying alcohol
-Cashing check
-Getting into bar
-Refi-House
-Got a signature loan
-FAA Medical exam
-Drive personal vehicle
-Drive firetruck
-Renew EMT license
-Got my Technician Ham license
-Verified who I was to be able to pick daughter up from school
-Shoot at the gun range
-Bought a ruger 10/22
-Bought rilfe/pistol ammo at walmart
-Got meds at CVS (yvyance ADD meds)
-Got decongestant form CVS
-Got chlorine tablets at walmart for inflatable pool (the computer poped up to ask for id)
-New doctor visit(to verify I was a covered pt)
-Rent car
-Fly on plane
-Rent hotel
-Vote....

Most of these things are not going to be done by a poor/elderly person I understand that but about 3-4 of them are.

That aside I do not see how a fully functioning member of society can not go without id despite this voter ID argument. Im not rich, im a firefighter that has a 7 year old, and I still manage to run into situations where I would need an ID.

[jcd11235 0]

cvfd1399

Ever cashed a check?

Not for a few years. I just deposit them. No ID required. I even had a couple checks deposited on my behalf while I was out of state vacationing this summer. If I need cash, I get it from ATM or the cashier at a store when I buy something.

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[cvfd1399 0]

Ever done any of these things? Anyone person here would agree that in a normal circumstance these actions would require ID.
-Buying alcohol
-Getting into bar
-Refi-House
-Got a signature loan
-FAA Medical exam
-Drive personal vehicle
-Bought a weapon
-Bought rilfe/pistol ammo
-Got decongestant form CVS
-New doctor visit(to verify I was a covered pt)
-Rent car
-Fly on plane
-Rent hotel

[DanG 1]

Which 3 or 4 of those is ever going to be done by a rural elderly person, or even urban elderly person?

- Dan G

[jcd11235 0]

cvfd1399

Ever done any of these things? Anyone person here would agree that in a normal circumstance these actions would require ID.
-Buying alcohol
-Getting into bar
-Refi-House
-Got a signature loan
-FAA Medical exam
-Drive personal vehicle
-Bought a weapon
-Bought rilfe/pistol ammo
-Got decongestant form CVS
-New doctor visit(to verify I was a covered pt)
-Rent car
-Fly on plane
-Rent hotel

Of your list, I've recently got into a bat and purchased alcohol, without ID. I went to the ER while vacationing and produced my ID, but it's not as though I would have been turned away without it.

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[SkyDekker 1,141]

Quote

just not invested in the debate - I'm here for my personal entertainment.

Ahh ok, so you are just thinking out of the box and doing some synergistic brainstorming on a highly engagable solution.

Ie. just throwing around some "motherhood statements" to sound important....gotcha, you betcha.

[billvon 2,426]

>he said they were meant to help Republicans win elections, and in the process,
>many blacks and others were disenfranchised. That's not a "nutty" claim, it's
>clearly supported by the data he cites.

And admitted to by people who try to implement such policies.

[kawisixer01 0]

Hmmm three more times today. Had to present an ID when I went to take a drug test for a new job I've just accepted. Then had to include copies of my ID AND my passport for the background check paperwork. Then had to present ID for a copy at the metal recycling place when I dropped off a couple hundred pounds of waste copper from electrical replacement jobs I recently did. (ID required at scrappers by state law)

[cvfd1399 0]

-Driving to dr/store/family
I had a call last week a 91 year old ww2 vet fall while getting to the the telephone, and his wife told me he had just gotten back from driving himself to walmart. My 66 year old father in law has been on a kidney transplant list for 8 years, is medically retired , cant see well, still has a valid license, and despite all our attempts to stop him he still drives to the store. Cant say old people dont drive.

-New dr vists
They go to the doctor alot, and also get switched around when insurances change, and the are forced to move to new doctors who are "in network"

-Refi-house to pay med bills
In laws had to liquidate equity in his old house and buy a smaller one they could afford due to medical bills

-Picking up prescription pain pills/decongestants.
Old people are on pain pills its a fact I see it every day. You have to provide ID when getting these meds per law.

-Alcohol
I could not tell you how many time we have a possible "diabetic" call or "man down on the side of the road" and it ended up being a drunk old person. The diabetic part was because of the "sweet" smell on his breath was not the tell tale sign of a diabetic emergency but ETOH

[cvfd1399 0]

Ooh yea, add in a trip to the landfill for me too. It was an old couch, and some rotten wood. You get 2 free trips to the landfill, and they track it via your DL. Thanks!

Like he said due to copper and aluminum theft you have to provide ID when turning this in for scrap. That is something I KNOW poor and elderly people do. I have put out old freezers, and washing machines to be picked up by people in beat up trucks and trailers.

[muff528 3]

billvon

>he said they were meant to help Republicans win elections, and in the process,
>many blacks and others were disenfranchised. That's not a "nutty" claim, it's
>clearly supported by the data he cites.

And admitted to by people who try to implement such policies.

Democrats admit that they want to give illegal aliens the right to vote without having to bother with that "citizenship" nonsense.. Oh, wait ...you folks are *for* that. Never mind.

[kelpdiver 2]

cvfd1399

Ever done any of these things? Anyone person here would agree that in a normal circumstance these actions would require ID.

Can we put this nonsense to bed, already? I did several of these without ID (I had been out of the country and removed my driver's license from my wallet, didn't reinsert for 2 weeks)

I know someone's actual example didn't phase you, so no doubt this won't register either.
http://www.fairelectionsnetwork.com/blog/true-or-false-you-need-photo-id

As for why your points on absentee ballots are irrelevant - no one has tried to argue that you can or cannot get mail in ballots without an original ID (thought I'm pretty sure you're wrong again), but rather are pointing out that any election day policies that check for ID at the polling stations will do nothing to protect the sanctity of the 50% of votes that mailed in.

It's about as effective as a shark cage that covers 2 of the 4 sides.

[muff528 3]

cvfd1399

Ooh yea, add in a trip to the landfill for me too. It was an old couch, and some rotten wood. You get 2 free trips to the landfill, and they track it via your DL. Thanks!

Like he said due to copper and aluminum theft you have to provide ID when turning this in for scrap. That is something I KNOW poor and elderly people do. I have put out old freezers, and washing machines to be picked up by people in beat up trucks and trailers.

Well, to be fair, they are driving trucks so they must have a DL.

[cvfd1399 0]

I agree im tired of arguing this anymore, but to be fair despite what that link said I have provided evidence of 2 major banks that state online ID is required. Im not saying there IS ABSOLUTELY no way to do these things without ID, its just that most do either by law or by custom, and how the hell do you legally function in America without it.

[kelpdiver 2]

cvfd1399

I agree im tired of arguing this anymore, but to be fair despite what that link said I have provided evidence of 2 major banks that state online ID is required. Im not saying there IS ABSOLUTELY no way to do these things without ID, its just that most do either by law or by custom, and how the hell do you legally function in America without it.

you show it right here - "Im not saying there IS ABSOLUTELY no way to do these things."

So stop arguing with yourself, FFS. If you don't even believe your bullshit claims, just admit it and find some new way to try to defend the disenfranchisement of so many to prevent a non existent problem.

[cvfd1399 0]

Come on man!......You cant tell me you have NOT needed an ID in the past year for legal or customary reason....Do you drive?

This isn't going to go anywhere with the types of attitudes we have here in SC. People from one side will post real world experiences where any common sense person would say yes an ID would be needed. The people from the other side will post some grand story about how they lived on a beach and ate crabs they caught with their own hands and drank coconut water while never driving or needing any services that require ID. I dont buy it, and im over talking about the subject of needing an ID for day to day life.

Resume normal GOP/RACE/GUN rants....

[jakee 1,257]

Quote

Cant say old people dont drive.

I don't think you realise which way around this works. You don't make your point by showing that some old people drive. Of course they do, that's never been in question. Your point is only made if you can show that all old people drive.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[cvfd1399 0]

Read above im done talking about the day to day need for ID discuss it with someone else if you want but dont reply to me about it pls.

Quote

Your point is only made if you can show that all old people drive.

The only point made here is any point is not good enough for you.

[jcd11235 0]

jakee

Quote

Cant say old people dont drive.

I don't think you realise which way around this works. You don't make your point by showing that some old people drive. Of course they do, that's never been in question. Your point is only made if you can show that all old people drive.

It's a lost cause. Some people just don't understand formal logic. And some of those people choose to remain ignorant.

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[jakee 1,257]

cvfd1399

I agree im tired of arguing this anymore, but to be fair despite what that link said I have provided evidence of 2 major banks that state online ID is required.

Yeah... so without ID you don't bank at those two.

Quote

Im not saying there IS ABSOLUTELY no way to do these things without ID,

Then what the hell is your point?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[jakee 1,257]

Quote

The only point made here is any point is not good enough for you.

Not at all. I'm quite happy with points that work. You, apparently, are happy with points that don't work. It's a difference in worldview.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[cvfd1399 0]

Just move on dude I made my point that there are legal things and customary things that you need ID for.

Quote

Then what the hell is your point?

My point was in reply to all the people that had these grand stories of living without needing a license. Sure you can ilegally drive without ID, you can find that store that sells you alcohol illegally without ID, you can bum a ride way out of your way to find that bank that does not make you have id, you could illegally bribe some one to register you to vote, you can not go to a doctor thats asking for you to verify who you are for benefits reasons, you can not buy a house and rent from someone who is dumb enough not to get a copy of your ID,etc. Yea it can happen...... Seriously move on its not going anywhere for either side, and im done talking about it, and Im sure everyone else is also.

[okalb 79]

wmw999

What he's saying is that if he could let all of his ID lapse because he didn't need it, it's not that hard to imagine that someone else, particularly living a somewhat hand-to-mouth lifestyle, also could let all of their ID lapse. And not have the certificated copy of their birth certificate, or whatever.

Wendy P.

Thank you, I thought that was pretty clear but I guess not

Time flies like an arrow....fruit flies like a banana