loumeinhart 0 #51 December 9, 2008 QuoteI think Venezuela would've been an easier target. Or Canada? U.S. imports more than twice has much than from Iraq in 2007. Plus they are right next door. Easy target, no hot desert and most Canadians won't readily chop off your head. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #52 December 9, 2008 QuoteQuote NONSENSE - the war was started under false pretenses, there is absolutely no doubt about that. False or not, the world is better off without Sadam. The news does not portray it, but the majority of people in Iraq are happy that we "liberated" them. They may or may not not agree with everything we have done, or how we accomplished it, nonetheless. Either way, my view from what I have seen and places I have been, is that the world is better off more now than before. Doesn't matter. If those Kurds couldn't protect themselves from Saddam's gas attacks they deserve to die. Same with those kids that were tortured in front of their parents. Screw 'em if they can't take a little bit of pain.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,649 #53 December 9, 2008 QuoteQuoteTo quote Oliver Hardy; "This is another fine mess you've gotten us into!" That's about all I can say about 'Dub-ya'. Now, Obama gets to clean it all up! It's not going to be an easy row to hoe.Let's hope that the Southside of Chicago isn't Obama's example of how to handle an out of control situation. What exactly do you know about the south side of Chicago?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stitch 0 #54 December 9, 2008 Which head ? "No cookies for you"- GFD "I don't think I like the sound of that" ~ MB65 Don't be a "Racer Hater" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #55 December 9, 2008 Quote Quote Quote To quote Oliver Hardy; "This is another fine mess you've gotten us into!" That's about all I can say about 'Dub-ya'. Now, Obama gets to clean it all up! It's not going to be an easy row to hoe. Let's hope that the Southside of Chicago isn't Obama's example of how to handle an out of control situation. What exactly do you know about the south side of Chicago? Leroy Brown got his ass kicked there. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,435 #56 December 9, 2008 >What exactly do you know about the south side of Chicago? There was a song about it. Bad Bad Leroy Brown was from there, if I recall. Why isn't Obama talking about Bad Bad Leroy Brown? Is it because he was palling around with him? Don't we have a right to know this stuff? How can we trust a president who won't tell us the TRUTH about Leroy? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #57 December 9, 2008 Quote >What exactly do you know about the south side of Chicago? There was a song about it. Bad Bad Leroy Brown was from there, if I recall. Why isn't Obama talking about Bad Bad Leroy Brown? Is it because he was palling around with him? Don't we have a right to know this stuff? How can we trust a president who won't tell us the TRUTH about Leroy? Because his wife, Michelle, was the woman Leroy got thumped over. Yep, that's right...her real name is DORIS! They can't have the word get around that Obama met her in a pool hall while two other guys were fighting over her, especially since knives, razors, and guns were involved.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
leroydb 0 #58 December 9, 2008 Quote Quote Quote Quote To quote Oliver Hardy; "This is another fine mess you've gotten us into!" That's about all I can say about 'Dub-ya'. Now, Obama gets to clean it all up! It's not going to be an easy row to hoe. Let's hope that the Southside of Chicago isn't Obama's example of how to handle an out of control situation. What exactly do you know about the south side of Chicago? Leroy Brown got his ass kicked there. ooooahLeroy ..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,649 #59 December 9, 2008 Quote >What exactly do you know about the south side of Chicago? There was a song about it. Bad Bad Leroy Brown was from there, if I recall. Why isn't Obama talking about Bad Bad Leroy Brown? Is it because he was palling around with him? Don't we have a right to know this stuff? How can we trust a president who won't tell us the TRUTH about Leroy? I just watched a rather bad movie called "Wanted" with Morgan Freeman and Angelina Jolie, set in "Chicago". The most recent "Batman" was there too, as well as "The Blues Brothers". I think the same people who learn their history from Hollywood also learn their geography the same way.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks2065 0 #60 December 9, 2008 QuoteQuoteQuote NONSENSE - the war was started under false pretenses, there is absolutely no doubt about that. False or not, the world is better off without Sadam. The news does not portray it, but the majority of people in Iraq are happy that we "liberated" them. They may or may not not agree with everything we have done, or how we accomplished it, nonetheless. Either way, my view from what I have seen and places I have been, is that the world is better off more now than before. Are the tens of thousands of dead Iraqis better off? How about the 4500 dead Americans? How about the taxpayers who will have shelled out $1 trillion before it's all over? The ends justify the means is a very dangerous argument. Quoteletting Sadam continue would have been worse, so the the ends DO justify the means. Sadam killed alot of people over his years in control, and alot more would have been killed if he had stayed in power. now I know you are going to say that us killing is no better than Sadam killing and that our soldiers would not have died, but think for a minute and tell me who would you rather still be alive? the good guys that sadam killed or the bad guys that we killed? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites wmw999 2,149 #61 December 9, 2008 What makes the good guys good and the bad guys bad? I have a feeling that some of the folks that Saddam would have killed had he had time are the same people that we killed. Being friendly with the US does not make someone good. Being friendly with someone we don't like doesn't make them bad. "The end justifies the means" was commonly said to be used by the Communists during the cold war. Personally, I think we should carefully think about both before we do something as a country. Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nerdgirl 0 #62 December 9, 2008 Quoteletting Sadam continue would have been worse, so the the ends DO justify the means. Sadam killed alot of people over his years in control, and alot more would have been killed if he had stayed in power. now I know you are going to say that us killing is no better than Sadam killing and that our soldiers would not have died, but think for a minute and tell me who would you rather still be alive? the good guys that sadam killed or the bad guys that we killed? This suggests a couple questions that have been posed before and are good ones to keep bringing up (imo). They don’t have easy answers for some of us; for isolationists, there is an easy answer: metaphorically build a wall. Challenging questions are the most interesting one, again im-ever-ho. (1) Given that arguably the single most brutal and repressive regime of the 20th century -- measured in estimated lives lost, length, and suppression of civil & human rights and that was a strategic threat to the United States and allies -- fell without military invasion, should the US have invaded the Soviet Union? That’s the extreme case. Hundreds of millions killed. Brutal repression of civil liberties. (2) If one argues that foreign policy should be based on an “ends justifies the means” rationale and one argues from normatives (i.e., preventing people from people killed is the ultimate moral good that should drive foreign policy and not doing everything that the US can to achieve that goal is morally bad) … what does that say with respect to current and past US foreign policy toward other states, e.g., China/Tibet, Myanmar (nee Burma), Sudan, Rwanda, East Timor, most of Central America in the 1980s, Chile under Pinochet, Argentina's dictators ... ? What is the US responsibility toward the rest of the world? Should the US assume a Wilsonian foreign policy driven by humanitarian intervention? VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 3 #63 December 9, 2008 QuoteThat’s the extreme case. Hundreds of millions killed. Brutal repression of civil liberties. "Hundreds of millions killed." "Hundreds of millions" Source?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nerdgirl 0 #64 December 9, 2008 Good question: I ‘back of the enveloped’: 9M Russian civil war 4M-10M under Lenin 20M-60M Stalin’s regime forced labor and Gulags 6M-11M famines under Stalin 6-10M post-Stalin I did not include 20M WWII deaths (10M military & 10M civilian), which one can build an argument either way. (Some estimate higher: 27M military/19M civilian.) Also didn't include 1921 famine (5M). A hundred million would have been more precise & more accurate. VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites shropshire 0 #65 December 9, 2008 Are you seriously saying that the removal of one man and his crew was worth the slaughter of thousands of INNOCENT Iraqi men, women and Children? Who makes you the world police? Who gave you the right to kill innocent people? (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites FreeflyChile 0 #66 December 9, 2008 Quote Quote >What exactly do you know about the south side of Chicago? There was a song about it. Bad Bad Leroy Brown was from there, if I recall. Why isn't Obama talking about Bad Bad Leroy Brown? Is it because he was palling around with him? Don't we have a right to know this stuff? How can we trust a president who won't tell us the TRUTH about Leroy? I just watched a rather bad movie called "Wanted" with Morgan Freeman and Angelina Jolie, set in "Chicago". The most recent "Batman" was there too, as well as "The Blues Brothers". I think the same people who learn their history from Hollywood also learn their geography the same way. You mean the concept of being able to bend a bullet as if it was a curveball did not appeal to you????? I liked that Batman used Chicago as Gotham. If only the El worked as well as the public transport shown in the movie.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites quade 3 #67 December 9, 2008 QuoteA hundred million would have been more precise & more accurate. I think a hundred million is still subjective, imprecise and probably on the high side. The other bit about this is that it happens over such a long period of time and a number of events. The initial impression you gave was that hundreds of millions had all been wiped out in a single event during which some exterior entity could have put a stop to the entire affair. I just don't think that's right at all. The US certainly didn't have the ability to do much of anything before say . . . 1947. Shortly afterward the Soviets would have had the ability to resist as much as we would have had the ability to press them on the issues. The Cold War sets in and no side is going to be the first one to press the button.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nerdgirl 0 #68 December 9, 2008 QuoteQuoteA hundred million would have been more precise & more accurate. I think a hundred million is still subjective, imprecise and probably on the high side. Okay, I provided the sources and some ranges, within those sources there are more sources. Those are just the estmates available. One can find much higher estimates and much lower on the internet. Those are also standard estimates of death. Estimating deaths from wars, famines, autocratic dictatorships, etc *is* inherantly an imprecise task. While some regimes have kept horrifically precise records (e.g., the Nazis and the Gautemalan police), not all regimes have followed that model. There are fairly robust and substantianted methods to obtain best estimates in situations in which regimes have not kept records. QuoteThe other bit about this is that it happens over such a long period of time and a number of events. The initial impression you gave was that hundreds of millions had all been wiped out in a single event during which some exterior entity could have put a stop to the entire affair. If that was the interpretation you made, it was not intended. Please look at what I wrote: "Given that arguably the single most brutal and repressive regime of the 20th century -- measured in estimated lives lost, length, and suppression of civil & human rights and that was a strategic threat to the United States and allies -- fell without military invasion, should the US have invaded the Soviet Union?" I'm not sure how you came up with "a single event" from that statement. VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks2065 0 #69 December 9, 2008 QuoteAre you seriously saying that the removal of one man and his crew was worth the slaughter of thousands of INNOCENT Iraqi men, women and Children? Who makes you the world police? Who gave you the right to kill innocent people? Quote it was not one man, it was sadam's entire governing body and his army and his family. what makes me the world police? nothing and nobody, just my opinion and that happens to be along the lines of the popular opinion that voted for war in Iraq. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites shropshire 0 #70 December 9, 2008 How do you feel about the slaughter of countless innocents? How could we ever justify that? P.S The invasion was never voted for over here - we were suckered into it by BLiar (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mnealtx 0 #71 December 9, 2008 QuoteHow do you feel about the slaughter of countless innocents? How could we ever justify that? P.S The invasion was never voted for over here - we were suckered into it by BLiar "Slaughter of countless innocents"? Hyperbole much, Tony? The military takes LARGE steps to prevent needless casualties wherever possible - that is a well-known fact. Do you accuse your Grandpa of "slaughtering countless innocents" at Dresden, too, or is that honor reserved for the USA?Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites shropshire 0 #72 December 9, 2008 Hi Mike - you know I doI'm not for a moment suggesting that our militaries killed innocents on purpose and not picking on the US - we're there too. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #73 December 9, 2008 QuoteWho makes you the world police? Who gave you the right to kill innocent people? Rest assured it is not HIM or any of his fellow travellers... they prefer for OTHERS who have actually volunteered for service to their country to do their dirty work. They will be the first to point out that the military is all volunteer and should be used to enrich those they support at the whim of those in power. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Royd 0 #74 December 9, 2008 QuoteWhat exactly do you know about the south side of Chicago? Only that I would hate to run the gauntlet through all of those colored stick pins in the map, indicating gun crimes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mnealtx 0 #75 December 9, 2008 Quote Hi Mike - you know I doI'm not for a moment suggesting that our militaries killed innocents on purpose and not picking on the US - we're there too. Just wanted to make sure, because that's exactly what it sounded like.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 Next Page 3 of 5 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. 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wmw999 2,149 #61 December 9, 2008 What makes the good guys good and the bad guys bad? I have a feeling that some of the folks that Saddam would have killed had he had time are the same people that we killed. Being friendly with the US does not make someone good. Being friendly with someone we don't like doesn't make them bad. "The end justifies the means" was commonly said to be used by the Communists during the cold war. Personally, I think we should carefully think about both before we do something as a country. Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nerdgirl 0 #62 December 9, 2008 Quoteletting Sadam continue would have been worse, so the the ends DO justify the means. Sadam killed alot of people over his years in control, and alot more would have been killed if he had stayed in power. now I know you are going to say that us killing is no better than Sadam killing and that our soldiers would not have died, but think for a minute and tell me who would you rather still be alive? the good guys that sadam killed or the bad guys that we killed? This suggests a couple questions that have been posed before and are good ones to keep bringing up (imo). They don’t have easy answers for some of us; for isolationists, there is an easy answer: metaphorically build a wall. Challenging questions are the most interesting one, again im-ever-ho. (1) Given that arguably the single most brutal and repressive regime of the 20th century -- measured in estimated lives lost, length, and suppression of civil & human rights and that was a strategic threat to the United States and allies -- fell without military invasion, should the US have invaded the Soviet Union? That’s the extreme case. Hundreds of millions killed. Brutal repression of civil liberties. (2) If one argues that foreign policy should be based on an “ends justifies the means” rationale and one argues from normatives (i.e., preventing people from people killed is the ultimate moral good that should drive foreign policy and not doing everything that the US can to achieve that goal is morally bad) … what does that say with respect to current and past US foreign policy toward other states, e.g., China/Tibet, Myanmar (nee Burma), Sudan, Rwanda, East Timor, most of Central America in the 1980s, Chile under Pinochet, Argentina's dictators ... ? What is the US responsibility toward the rest of the world? Should the US assume a Wilsonian foreign policy driven by humanitarian intervention? VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 3 #63 December 9, 2008 QuoteThat’s the extreme case. Hundreds of millions killed. Brutal repression of civil liberties. "Hundreds of millions killed." "Hundreds of millions" Source?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nerdgirl 0 #64 December 9, 2008 Good question: I ‘back of the enveloped’: 9M Russian civil war 4M-10M under Lenin 20M-60M Stalin’s regime forced labor and Gulags 6M-11M famines under Stalin 6-10M post-Stalin I did not include 20M WWII deaths (10M military & 10M civilian), which one can build an argument either way. (Some estimate higher: 27M military/19M civilian.) Also didn't include 1921 famine (5M). A hundred million would have been more precise & more accurate. VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #65 December 9, 2008 Are you seriously saying that the removal of one man and his crew was worth the slaughter of thousands of INNOCENT Iraqi men, women and Children? Who makes you the world police? Who gave you the right to kill innocent people? (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FreeflyChile 0 #66 December 9, 2008 Quote Quote >What exactly do you know about the south side of Chicago? There was a song about it. Bad Bad Leroy Brown was from there, if I recall. Why isn't Obama talking about Bad Bad Leroy Brown? Is it because he was palling around with him? Don't we have a right to know this stuff? How can we trust a president who won't tell us the TRUTH about Leroy? I just watched a rather bad movie called "Wanted" with Morgan Freeman and Angelina Jolie, set in "Chicago". The most recent "Batman" was there too, as well as "The Blues Brothers". I think the same people who learn their history from Hollywood also learn their geography the same way. You mean the concept of being able to bend a bullet as if it was a curveball did not appeal to you????? I liked that Batman used Chicago as Gotham. If only the El worked as well as the public transport shown in the movie.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 3 #67 December 9, 2008 QuoteA hundred million would have been more precise & more accurate. I think a hundred million is still subjective, imprecise and probably on the high side. The other bit about this is that it happens over such a long period of time and a number of events. The initial impression you gave was that hundreds of millions had all been wiped out in a single event during which some exterior entity could have put a stop to the entire affair. I just don't think that's right at all. The US certainly didn't have the ability to do much of anything before say . . . 1947. Shortly afterward the Soviets would have had the ability to resist as much as we would have had the ability to press them on the issues. The Cold War sets in and no side is going to be the first one to press the button.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nerdgirl 0 #68 December 9, 2008 QuoteQuoteA hundred million would have been more precise & more accurate. I think a hundred million is still subjective, imprecise and probably on the high side. Okay, I provided the sources and some ranges, within those sources there are more sources. Those are just the estmates available. One can find much higher estimates and much lower on the internet. Those are also standard estimates of death. Estimating deaths from wars, famines, autocratic dictatorships, etc *is* inherantly an imprecise task. While some regimes have kept horrifically precise records (e.g., the Nazis and the Gautemalan police), not all regimes have followed that model. There are fairly robust and substantianted methods to obtain best estimates in situations in which regimes have not kept records. QuoteThe other bit about this is that it happens over such a long period of time and a number of events. The initial impression you gave was that hundreds of millions had all been wiped out in a single event during which some exterior entity could have put a stop to the entire affair. If that was the interpretation you made, it was not intended. Please look at what I wrote: "Given that arguably the single most brutal and repressive regime of the 20th century -- measured in estimated lives lost, length, and suppression of civil & human rights and that was a strategic threat to the United States and allies -- fell without military invasion, should the US have invaded the Soviet Union?" I'm not sure how you came up with "a single event" from that statement. VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks2065 0 #69 December 9, 2008 QuoteAre you seriously saying that the removal of one man and his crew was worth the slaughter of thousands of INNOCENT Iraqi men, women and Children? Who makes you the world police? Who gave you the right to kill innocent people? Quote it was not one man, it was sadam's entire governing body and his army and his family. what makes me the world police? nothing and nobody, just my opinion and that happens to be along the lines of the popular opinion that voted for war in Iraq. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites shropshire 0 #70 December 9, 2008 How do you feel about the slaughter of countless innocents? How could we ever justify that? P.S The invasion was never voted for over here - we were suckered into it by BLiar (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mnealtx 0 #71 December 9, 2008 QuoteHow do you feel about the slaughter of countless innocents? How could we ever justify that? P.S The invasion was never voted for over here - we were suckered into it by BLiar "Slaughter of countless innocents"? Hyperbole much, Tony? The military takes LARGE steps to prevent needless casualties wherever possible - that is a well-known fact. Do you accuse your Grandpa of "slaughtering countless innocents" at Dresden, too, or is that honor reserved for the USA?Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites shropshire 0 #72 December 9, 2008 Hi Mike - you know I doI'm not for a moment suggesting that our militaries killed innocents on purpose and not picking on the US - we're there too. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #73 December 9, 2008 QuoteWho makes you the world police? Who gave you the right to kill innocent people? Rest assured it is not HIM or any of his fellow travellers... they prefer for OTHERS who have actually volunteered for service to their country to do their dirty work. They will be the first to point out that the military is all volunteer and should be used to enrich those they support at the whim of those in power. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Royd 0 #74 December 9, 2008 QuoteWhat exactly do you know about the south side of Chicago? Only that I would hate to run the gauntlet through all of those colored stick pins in the map, indicating gun crimes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mnealtx 0 #75 December 9, 2008 Quote Hi Mike - you know I doI'm not for a moment suggesting that our militaries killed innocents on purpose and not picking on the US - we're there too. Just wanted to make sure, because that's exactly what it sounded like.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 Next Page 3 of 5 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
shropshire 0 #70 December 9, 2008 How do you feel about the slaughter of countless innocents? How could we ever justify that? P.S The invasion was never voted for over here - we were suckered into it by BLiar (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #71 December 9, 2008 QuoteHow do you feel about the slaughter of countless innocents? How could we ever justify that? P.S The invasion was never voted for over here - we were suckered into it by BLiar "Slaughter of countless innocents"? Hyperbole much, Tony? The military takes LARGE steps to prevent needless casualties wherever possible - that is a well-known fact. Do you accuse your Grandpa of "slaughtering countless innocents" at Dresden, too, or is that honor reserved for the USA?Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #72 December 9, 2008 Hi Mike - you know I doI'm not for a moment suggesting that our militaries killed innocents on purpose and not picking on the US - we're there too. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #73 December 9, 2008 QuoteWho makes you the world police? Who gave you the right to kill innocent people? Rest assured it is not HIM or any of his fellow travellers... they prefer for OTHERS who have actually volunteered for service to their country to do their dirty work. They will be the first to point out that the military is all volunteer and should be used to enrich those they support at the whim of those in power. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Royd 0 #74 December 9, 2008 QuoteWhat exactly do you know about the south side of Chicago? Only that I would hate to run the gauntlet through all of those colored stick pins in the map, indicating gun crimes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #75 December 9, 2008 Quote Hi Mike - you know I doI'm not for a moment suggesting that our militaries killed innocents on purpose and not picking on the US - we're there too. Just wanted to make sure, because that's exactly what it sounded like.Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
