fear of clouds

[jojo69 0]

How do i get over my fear of clouds. I hate to jump anywhere near them. I find myself tracking away from them during free fall. This scares me because it may put me off the jump run and I do not want to become a problem for other jumpers.

Last week I did not make a jump because when the light went green, I could not see the ground. I had no problem stepping down and letting the tandems out but felt funny getting off the plane on the ground.

Is my fear of clouds unusual?

[skybytch 259]

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Last week I did not make a jump because when the light went green, I could not see the ground.

Good for you! I generally won't jump if I can't see the ground too. Besides the fact that there might be something I don't want to hit hiding inside them (ie airplane) and the fact that pilots and GPS' aren't perfect (so we might not be over the dz), there's also (in the US anyway) the fact that there is an FAR that specifically states that skydivers aren't supposed to jump through clouds.

[jojo69 0]

I felt fine about sitting down. My fear is I will get below other jumpers because I am avoiding clouds.

[FlyinseivLP2 0]

It sounds like you are just trying to be safe and there is nothing wrong with that. If you don't feel comfortable with the jump don't go. I have rode the plane down when others got out and I have also gotten out when others wouldn't. As the saying goes "it is better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air, than to be in the air wishing you were on the ground." If you jump DO NOT track to avoid clouds, you are only putting yourself and others in danger. Dive your plan, if you run into a cloud just hang out until you punch though it. If you have to open in a cloud do a slow sprial until you come out, this way you are not flying into other groups. Also when you are climbing to altitude watch where the clouds are and how thick they are. A 500 foot layer at 10000 feet is less to deal with than a 3000 ft layer that extends down below your pull altitude. Of course try to avoid jumping into clouds in the first place.
I said all this assuming that your fear was not of the clouds, but what was beneath it and not being able to see where you are. If you fear is actually of the cloud itself in that it might swallow you or something, then yes that is unusual!

[jojo69 0]

Thank you. This makes me feel better. I think I do track to get away from them. This is what has me the most worried. I have worked with a coach for months so that I would not be a hazard to myself or other jumpers and here I go tracking away from a cloud.

When I am in a cloud, I get an irrational fear that my altimeter will suddenly stop working and the cloud goes to the ground. I am also terrified that other jumpers are in there with me and I can not see them.

[JaredX 0]

What's it liking going through a cloud? Do you get drenched?

[kelpdiver 2]

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When I am in a cloud, I get an irrational fear that my altimeter will suddenly stop working and the cloud goes to the ground. I am also terrified that other jumpers are in there with me and I can not see them.

This is why you want to check altitude on the way up as you get to the base and top of the cloud layer (if the clouds are so nicely organized - they tend to be here in California). Know where the bottoms are - if too low, don't get out on an iffy spot.

If you had good separation, you're much less likely to have other jumpers in there with you. Whereas tracking off increases the odds. And if you're sure you're alone, that shadow below is likely your own. (threw me for a couple seconds)

From limited experience, the edge of the cloud is less stable than the rest of it - not hugely different, but I felt a little buffeting as the density changed about.

[popsjumper 2]

Good stuff, JoJo...not comfortable, no jump. IMHO, a very good decision.

My concern is the tracking away from them and you said, "it may put me off the jump run."
If I read you correctly, tracking "off jump run" is the thing you should do, not stay on jump run as you track which takes you up or down the flight line.

Is your concern about tracking direction and distance from larger groups where you may be stuck in a position that takes you up/down jump run or just simply tracking away from clouds regardless of group size?

I sincerely hope that nobody gave you any razz for stepping down. You should be commended.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[billvon 2,435]

> What's it liking going through a cloud? Do you get drenched?

If there's rain in it - yes. Ordinarily it's just a bit damp.

[Guest]

They also smell good too....well, mine did.

Spot was perfect on that jump, but the clouds were scattered. Yet, the upper winds were a tad strong, and they blew me into the side of the cloud (which was at 4K). Pulling in the middle of it was quite awesome! But, the cloud was only about 500ft thick, so wasn't in there too long.

[mik 2]

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What's it liking going through a cloud? Do you get drenched?

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I have jumped through loads of clouds (on maybe 100 jumps in UK, South Africa, Russia - the first 2 countries require you to see the DZ before exit) and have never got drenched. Worst thing is clouds with hail in them. Hurts like hell. (Or maybe if you have to open in clouds and not everyone on the load knows to make right hand turns until clear of cloud base.)

***********************************************
I'm NOT totally useless... I can be used as a bad example

[Yossarian 0]

hail made me bleed once, and in the wetter clouds my goggles fog up from all the moisture beeds but it doesnt tend to bother me much, i prefer falling next to clouds as it gives you an idea of just how fast you're moving, freefall, despite the feeling of fast air on your body, still gives the impression of floating, but when you're falling past something i get an extra adrenalin buzz :)

[OnYourBack 0]

Nephophobia- Fear of clouds.

I'm afraid of clowns, Coulrophobia, but fear of hitting someone else in a cloud is probably more rational.

[BIGUN 1,073]

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Last week I did not make a jump because when the light went green, I could not see the ground. I had no problem stepping down and letting the tandems out but felt funny getting off the plane on the ground.

1. You done good.
2. NEVER be more afraid of landing in the plane and embarassed, than couragous and dead. It's skydiving; not combat.
3. Landing with the plane is an example to younger skydivers that it's OK to land with the plane for the sake of safety.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[boyd38off 0]

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They also smell good too....well, mine did.

TASTE good too! yummmmm.

Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out and shouting,
".... holy crap....what a ride!"

• Quote

[Zoter 0]

Although we have similar rules for cloud jumping in the UK...you will hard pressed to find any UK jumper who doesnt jump in clouds ...if they jump in the UK ....

They ARE fluffy and moist to jump though and if they are the big puffy white ones they slow down your fall rate dramatically....

[fcajump 153]

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Last week I did not make a jump because when the light went green, I could not see the ground. I had no problem stepping down and letting the tandems out but felt funny getting off the plane on the ground.

1. You done good.
2. NEVER be more afraid of landing in the plane and embarassed, than couragous and dead. It's skydiving; not combat.
3. Landing with the plane is an example to younger skydivers that it's OK to land with the plane for the sake of safety.

What BIGUN said!
Came back down once when a cloud moved in... much to the disgust of on other TI (5 TI'/TS on board). He was insistant that it was no big deal... Turned out a DOWNPOUR (wind/rain/cats/dogs) had parked over the DZ... Ya never know, even with GPS.

JW

Always remember that some clouds are harder than others...

[jojo69 0]

I want to thank everyone for their support. This is not the first time I have avoided a cloud. This is the first time that I was aware that I was doing it and should not have. Now that I am aware of my actions and why I do it, I am hoping to change this habit.

The ride down was the right thing for me on that day. It may or may not be the same decision on another day or on a DZ that I am very comfortable with.

Again, thanks for your support and advice.

[councilman24 36]

Many years ago there was a jumper who wasn't afraid of clouds particularly but didn't know what to expect falling through one. So I took her up and launched a two way above a big fluffy. It's no big deal by itself. The safety aspects are a big deal.

When I had about 100 jumps I was on a four way on a 182. On the way up the base of the clouds was about 4000' and they weren't solid. By the time we got to 10000' it was solid. The pilot got a glimpse of ground, spun the plane around, popped the door and said "Get out". I didn't know any better and we got out. We went into the cloud about 9500. I docked with one guy and we never saw the other two. We held the two way. At 4000' there was no sign of ground and my Paralert (early audible) went off. I shook but the other guy held on and yelled hold it through the clouds. At 3000' I started getting lose and we came out the bottom. I saw one of the others come through the clouds as I turned to track. Didn't see the other guy until we were open.

But, we were open over a 40-50 acre lake on the farther side from the airport. I decided to head across toward the airport and got back to the other side. There was water streaming up my goggles on that one.

Too lazy to look it up but in the 70's (hmmm) many 60's a Twin Beech load got out over the clouds and ended up several miles out into Lake Erie. IIRC all died.

Not getting out over the clouds is always a good decision. These days it's more common with GPS but still illegal in the U.S.

BTW you have been in a cloud .... on the foggest day you remember. That's all a cloud is is heavy fog. And maybe depending on what kind of cloud some turbulence.

One thing to remember when you do go through a cloud is it LOOKS solid but it isn't. Even with a lot of jumps I've tensed going into the top of a cloud. The other cool thing is the "flyer's cross". Your shadow on the top of the cloud is sometimes surrounded by a halo.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[bch7773 0]

I get scared of clouds when they are in a thick layer at breakoff altitude. Theres nothing so exciting (in the bad kind of exciting) then turning to track and hoping everyone picked different directions.

MB 3528, RB 1182

[dorbie 0]

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The other cool thing is the "flyer's cross". Your shadow on the top of the cloud is sometimes surrounded by a halo.

You don't do it justice it's your shadow against a bright patch inside a circular rainbow halo. When I first saw this on AFF my AFFI- told me this is called a "glory", and of course you converge and 'impact' with it as it changes scale. A very cool experience for any skydiver.

The first time I fell past a cloud on AFF was pretty intense because it's the only realistic speed cue and it's shocking the first time you see it. You're pretty much floating with almost no sense of relative motion and a cloud suddenly goes screaming past. Wow!

[agent_lead 0]

me and 2 friends were doing a hi alti jump from 24k at the wffc this year...

as we exited we looked down and saw nothing but clouds...

as we were getting closer...we were turning some points...i look down and see a 3 way in the clouds below us and im pointing it out to my biddues...im thinking shit..were gonna hit this 3 way...

turns out it was just us...with the cool rainbow effect..
once we punched thru them we just continued on with our points...


120 seconds of freefall was awesome...must do it again

--------------------------------------------
www.facebook.com/agentlead

[Nickkk 0]

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me and 2 friends were doing a hi alti jump from 24k at the wffc this year...

as we exited we looked down and saw nothing but clouds...

as we were getting closer...we were turning some points...i look down and see a 3 way in the clouds below us and im pointing it out to my biddues...im thinking shit..were gonna hit this 3 way...

turns out it was just us...with the cool rainbow effect..
once we punched thru them we just continued on with our points...


120 seconds of freefall was awesome...must do it again

What do you do when someone throws a big planet at you?
Throw your pilot chute in defense!

[GreenLight 5]

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and of course you converge and 'impact' with it as it changes scale. A very cool experience for any skydiver.

All the fun of going in without the mess....

Green Light
"Harry, why did you land all the way out there? Nobody else landed out there."
"Your statement answered your question."

[brettski74 0]

I'm still new to skydiving, but wouldn't tracking inside a cloud be a bad idea? My thoughts are kinda conflicted on this, anyway, so it would be nice to get some perspective from some of the more experienced jumpers on this.

I've been thinking about this a little lately. At my home DZ in Canada, we aren't allowed to jump through clouds due to Transport Canada rules - similar to the US. When I did some jumps in Australia, I was required to read and sign their cloud-jumping rules, which are probably much the same as anywhere and could be summed up in three main points:

1. No horizontal movement in freefall while in a cloud.
2. Do not deploy inside a cloud unless you are at the hard-deck.
3. If under canopy inside a cloud, do a gentle right-hand spiral down until you in clear air again.

We didn't have any clouds to worry about while I was there, but it all makes sense when you think about it. At the time, I was only doing solo jumps. Now I'm doing RW, and jumping in Latvia, where we also jump through clouds on occasion. On the weekend, I was in a six way inside a cloud. We didn't quite make the complete formation, but I still had sight of everyone on the jump, so we were still all pretty close, which was good. We broke through before we hit break-off altitude, but it made me think about what if we hadn't? My thoughts have led me to the following:

- with 6 people in the air, we wouldn't be able to see whether we had good separation after tracking while still in the cloud.
- if everyone does a 180 and tracks away from the centre of formation, the risk of collision would be pretty low unless someone was wickedly bad at tracking straight. If we lost sight of anybody in the cloud, though, this may no longer be true.
- we still need to track some time before the hard-deck, to ensure both adequate horizontal separation and altitude for deployment and EPs

So what would be the normal thing to do? We had set break-off at 4500 feet. If we allow 1500 feet for turn and track and hard deck is 2500 feet, if we're still in clouds at break-off, we don't really have much extra altitude to wait. So I guess if you were in the air in such a scenario, then turn and track is still the right answer, but perhaps the better answer here is that we shouldn't be doing RW if the clouds are below 5000 feet - or at the very least, nothing more than a 2-way?