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medusa

Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD!

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Well said Dave. Giselle, Please argue with this. We care that for once, it seems that for a period of time that is not the initial exit of an aircraft, no matter how brief, or what causes it, that the wingsuit is going up, and not down. We are simple people with low expectations who are excited about such tiny achievements.

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Yes, because every wingsuit jumper I met in person think non-powered aircrafts gain altitude and fly hundred of miles by "speeding" or " diving and flaring" wingsuiters for some reason has this stupid misconception



You are dumb as shit. You really think that anyone here believes you can dive and flare a wingsuit across the countryside?



A Phd calling another pilot dumb shit? unbelievable you are! "Speed" " dive and flare" if you believe or not that is exactly what I heard from wingsuiters. period. That's how some wingsuiters believe non-powered manage to fly hundred of miles, they don't know even what thermals are. Maybe you can understand it as simple as I do as we are both pilots, but believe me, some wingsuiters have absolutely no idea of how non-powered flight works, and the worse bit, they think they already know everything like yourself and if you try to explain to them how it actually works, they do what they done on this topic. incredible really.
Lauren Martins - www.youtube.com/user/gisellemartins20

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REMINDER TO EVERYONE: I have been extremely tolerant of everyone posting in this thread. Some of you still cannot stop yourselves from using words and or descriptives that constitute a Personal Attack (PA). Here's the deal, you can stop it completely from here on out OR I will ban the offending parties for 60 days and lock this thread. If you cannot express yourself without committing a PA then step away from the keyboard and this thread. By all means, continue the discussion but leave the PA's and insults out of it. That is all. :)
"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

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OK, you stupid wingsuitors, which one of you thinks you can dive and flair across country?
I suspect that we understand a lot more than the lady thinks. She, on the other hand, understands a lot less than she thinks she does, especially about wingsuits and the people that fly them.
But what do I know?

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OK, you stupid wingsuitors, which one of you thinks you can dive and flair across country?



I'm sure every single jumper here knows that doing that on a wingsuit is not possible, but read back the entire topic and you will see a few have wrote and posted videos of gliders and planes ( with engine off) diving and flaring and they said how doing that is the way to gain altitude and that there were no need for thermal for non-powered flight. examples like the tail exit was given, etc... makes laugh hard really LOL! If you don't believe me, read back the topic and check it yourself.
Lauren Martins - www.youtube.com/user/gisellemartins20

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Yup, diving and flaring is the way wingsuits gain altitude, which is probably why they brought it up as an example. And no I dont mean gain altitude from a plain, or maintain climb, i mean dive steep, and flare out, which is what everyone has been trying to fucking say to you in the first place.

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Ok, the title says "Wingsuits gain altitude PERIOD!" Flaring after a dive gives you a (small) gain in altitude PERIOD! Jumping out of skyvan at a decent speed gives you a (small) gain in altitude PERIOD! Without the wingsuit no gain PERIOD! So Giselle/Lauren do you agree with the first post in this thread? Yes or no? Everyone else does so I am asking you...

Do we really need 5 pages of this shit?

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Yup, diving and flaring is the way wingsuits gain altitude.



No, because doing that you always end at the same height or lower than where you started the "U" dive. So that's not gaining altitude, that's keeping the same altitude or losing it. Small Momentaneous speed to lift is not considered gaining altitude.
Lauren Martins - www.youtube.com/user/gisellemartins20

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Ok, the title says "Wingsuits gain altitude PERIOD!" Flaring after a dive gives you a (small) gain in altitude PERIOD! Jumping out of skyvan at a decent speed gives you a (small) gain in altitude PERIOD! Without the wingsuit no gain PERIOD! So Giselle/Lauren do you agree with the first post in this thread? Yes or no? Everyone else does so I am asking you...

Do we really need 5 pages of this shit?



Finally a First educated post coming from a jumper without a swear word or personal attack :)

Mark as I said before I don't think that gain of altitude on that video was because of a dive and flare, firstly because there is no sharp dive on his glide path, secondly because he kept climbing for 6 seconds and for several meters, this amount of time climbing and height is simple not possible just by diving and flaring, only a thermal could be strong enough to lift him like that.

Lauren
Lauren Martins - www.youtube.com/user/gisellemartins20

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No, because doing that you always end at the same height or lower than where you started the "U" dive.

And precisely no one is claiming otherwise, which has been said here about 20 times already. The gain everyone but you is talking about is relative to the lowest point of the "dive".
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Mark as I said before I don't think that gain of altitude on that video was because of a dive and flare, firstly because there is no sharp dive on his glide path, secondly because he kept climbing for 6 seconds and for several meters, this amount of time climbing and height is simple not possible just by diving and flaring, only a thermal could be strong enough to lift him like that.

Right, so there is a mighty thermal that's always there, in the exact same place, on multiple jumps at that event?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMkvPDd-8wE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=VigfXe1vhYg

And it also for some reason only affects the jumper, but not the smoke?
And entering it always for some reason corresponds with a change in body position?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Tu5Cyw8xlI&feature=player_embedded

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Altitude as defined by websters.
1. The height of a thing above a reference level, especially above sea level or above the earth's surface. See Synonyms at elevation.

So if my reference level is the low point of a dive, then the altitude increased caused by the flare would be then, by definition, or physics, or semantics, or whatever you want to say, a GAIN IN ALTITUDE.

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I don't think that gain of altitude on that video was because of a dive and flare



For once your words speak very clearly.

You are making what you believe is an educated guess, but you have no experience flying wingsuits, and are arguing with those who do have such experience. Question: at what angle dive must one fly a wingsuit before he is able to do a 6 second climb? Since you can judge with your eyes, you must know. Next question: at what angle dive was the pilot in the video diving? Final, and most important question: on WHAT are you basing these previous answers? Surely you are probably qualified to watch one of the glider type that you fly, and judge with your eyes what sort of climb is possible based on the angle of the dive. But wingsuits are extremely different from the glider types you fly, you have never flown a wingsuit, and you haven't seen many videos like the one posted, because... let's face it... NONE of us have! Most BASE videos are taken from the pilot's perspective or from a fixed point close to the line of flight, which the pilot zooms by. This video shows something I had never seen before (maybe others have). There is very limited data out there for those of us who haven't been in these pilots' shoes (one reason for all the arguments), and yet you think you can judge a video of something you've never done, conclude that you "think" the video showed not a dive/flare but a thermal, and then argue for pages about how what you "thought" must be right, and everyone else is an idiot for thinking otherwise.

I don't think that seems very logical.
www.WingsuitPhotos.com

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Altitude as defined by websters.
1. The height of a thing above a reference level, especially above sea level or above the earth's surface. See Synonyms at elevation.

So if my reference level is the low point of a dive, then the altitude increased caused by the flare would be then, by definition, or physics, or semantics, or whatever you want to say, a GAIN IN ALTITUDE.



Even easier. I start my dive at 12pm. I start my flare at 12:01pm. My flare causes me to travel upward from 12:01pm to 12:01:30pm.

Question: Between 12:01pm and 12:01:30pm, did I (a) gain altitude (b) lose altitude or (c) stay level?

Multiple guess... that should make this extremely difficult question a bit easier. :)
www.WingsuitPhotos.com

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Giselle/Lauren, I am curious as to why you do not think he was in a dive if he traveled from exit point to under the cable cars in roughly 20sec.? Even if you have not flown a wingsuit I know you are smart enough to understand they slow down a person's vertical speed so if he wasn't diving than how do you explain him eating up that altitude so fast?

Also I am curious to know wether or not you agree there is a drastic change in body position once he reaches the cable cars/finish line?

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No, because doing that you always end at the same height or lower than where you started the "U" dive.

And precisely no one is claiming otherwise, which has been said here about 20 times already. The gain everyone but you is talking about is relative to the lowest point of the "dive".
Quote


Mark as I said before I don't think that gain of altitude on that video was because of a dive and flare, firstly because there is no sharp dive on his glide path, secondly because he kept climbing for 6 seconds and for several meters, this amount of time climbing and height is simple not possible just by diving and flaring, only a thermal could be strong enough to lift him like that.

Right, so there is a mighty thermal that's always there, in the exact same place, on multiple jumps at that event?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMkvPDd-8wE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=VigfXe1vhYg

And it also for some reason only affects the jumper, but not the smoke?
And entering it always for some reason corresponds with a change in body position?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Tu5Cyw8xlI&feature=player_embedded



Interesting valid points you have, it is possible to a place have a residential thermal given very specific conditions but it is unusual. I can't see the bottom of the mountain so I can't say if it would be the case or not.

The smoke did move a tiny bit upwards but yes not as much as it would in a strong thermal, so your point is valid there.

I didn't see the other videos before, on the new videos you posted I can see that his body position did change, so there is a flare factor there, your correct.

What amazes me is how he manage to climb so high for so long ( 6 )seconds with just a sharp dive and flare?

I wonder what was the wind speed that day? was the wind direction head wind at take off? anyone knows? because a strong wind hitting the mountain will create a strong lift band, not strong enough to give him sustained flight but strong enough to help him gain height on his flare?

The fact is that is hard to believe that he manage to climb all that height all that time just with a flare without any help of a thermal or ridge lift, unless the latest largest suits from Tony are REALLY that big!
Lauren Martins - www.youtube.com/user/gisellemartins20

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What amazes me is how he manage to climb so high for so long ( 6 )seconds with just a sharp dive and flare?

I wonder what was the wind speed that day? was the wind direction head wind at take off? anyone knows? because a strong wind hitting the mountain will create a strong lift band, not strong enough to give him sustained flight but strong enough to help him gain height on his flare?



OK, I had a lot of time to read this topic. I have also a Doctor in Physics so I think I can help you understand how this is been done. The trick is to eat a lot of onions the day before you jump. Then during the flight you need to dive really hard. During the flaring you also need to turn on your back and fart as hard as you can. This will give you the nescessary wind and you will gain another 2 seconds of climbing time. I hope I could contribute to this intersting discussion.
Michi (#1068)
hsbc/gba/sba
www.swissbaseassociation.ch
www.michibase.ch

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OK, I had a lot of time to read this topic. I have also a Doctor in Physics so I think I can help you understand how this is been done. The trick is to eat a lot of onions the day before you jump. Then during the flight you need to dive really hard. During the flaring you also need to turn on your back and fart as hard as you can. This will give you the nescessary wind and you will gain another 2 seconds of climbing time. I hope I could contribute to this intersting discussion.

with a piezo-electric lighter, you can have the after-burner:)
scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

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Yes,



Then you have zero understanding of what is being said to you.

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because every wingsuit jumper I met in person think non-powered aircrafts gain altitude and fly hundred of miles by "speeding" or " diving and flaring"



Bullshit.

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wingsuiters for some reason has this stupid misconception,



The stupid misconception is yours. If any wingsuiter thinks that then they are a tiny, tiny minority.

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and they always use the tail exit climb as an example to explain how they think gliders fly to clouds etc



No, they don't. That is your own idiotic misinterpretation of what is actually being said to you.


It really is un-fucking-believable. Do you honestly think it is more likely that every wingsuiter thinks that wingsuits are magic perpetual motion machines, than it is that you are misunderstanding what they are saying? You are failing so badly at human communication that I'm starting to wonder whether you might be autistic.
Do you want to have an ideagasm?

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"Speed" " dive and flare" if you believe or not that is exactly what I heard from wingsuiters. period.



That is what you heard from wingsuiters describing what leads to small, unsustainable positive climb rates.

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That's how some wingsuiters believe non-powered manage to fly hundred of miles,



No, it is not. that is your mistake.

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if you try to explain to them how it actually works, they do what they done on this topic.



Yes, if you try and explain I'm sure they do get pissed off.
Do you want to have an ideagasm?

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Bullshit.

Your stupid

Fucking Idiot

Your moron

Autistic




Moderator this jakee user has no respect, can not dialogue without swearing and personal attacks, I feel insulted as pilot and as a person, I'm a well respected wherever I go, and this is not the first he does it, disrespecting even what you asked.
Lauren Martins - www.youtube.com/user/gisellemartins20

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I'm sure every single jumper here knows that doing that on a wingsuit is not possible, but read back the entire topic and you will see a few have wrote and posted videos of gliders and planes ( with engine off) diving and flaring and they said how doing that is the way to gain altitude and that there were no need for thermal for non-powered flight. examples like the tail exit was given, etc... makes laugh hard really LOL! If you don't believe me, read back the topic and check it yourself.



Yes, please, please, please do read back the topic. You will see that those examples were posted to show how unpowered aircraft can achieve temporary, unsustainable rates of climb - but not at any point ever, not even in the slightest, to show how unpowered aircraft can continually gain altitude.

That is why everyone else is laughing at you.
Do you want to have an ideagasm?

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Moderator this jakee user has no respect, can not dialogue without swearing and personal attacks, I feel offended and this is not the first he does it, disrespecting what you asked.



Read your own posts one day, you may find you need to put yourself in the naughty chair.

You have been attacking and insulting every single person you've disagreed with in this thread, and the root cause of all the disagreements has been your own comprehension problems, as I've just shown you.
Do you want to have an ideagasm?

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