DB Cooper

[skyjack71 0]

Would someone post that picture of LD Cooper - I need to see it one more time!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[BruceSmith 3]

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Bruce wrote

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While we take a pause to get all lovey-dovey with each other for a bit - which I support completely - I'd like to share a little family news from Sandy Land, aka New York. The snow storm may not be the biggest storm of the century as the New York Times was reporting today, but it's a doozy.

Glad your family is OK Bruce.

I heard NJ Gov. Christie giving storm survival advice. He advised residents to go home, relax and have a drink. Is he a natural born leader or what?

377

Now that Governor CC is BFF with the Boss, I'm inclined to follow him anywhere, metaphorically. Glad Barry O could make that bromance happen.

Storm Update:

Sis got power back within three hours. Two feet just south of Bahstahn...another day at the office, so to speak. She's very proud of her three-handled roof-rake to get snow off the roof so it doesn't leak. Such are her priorities today. Not exactly sure now the rake actually works, but it's apparently nifty.

Mom had a foot. The Ex still baskin' in Tucson.

[MeyerLouie 5]

Well hello DZ colleagues, this is MeyerLouie, your friendly 'banned Blevins basher.' I saw JT's post, I had to come on and give him a big welcome back. It's been along time, Jerry. I hope you are well.

I have been checking out Sluggo's website and I have also been reading some of the early DZ posts. In some ways, that's where some of the best conversation, information, and insight into the case occurred. That early DZ stuff was great -- before Jerry Springer got involved here, and decided to stay.

Is Blevins still around? Does a bear shit in the woods? Ha! I'm betting he's got other people very frustrated too. As you all know, I lost my cool with him. It might be better to just deflect -- I was taught to just ignore annoying people and eventually they will go away -- if not physically then at least in one's mind as one changes one's attitude about the person. My opinion of Blevins and where I stand are crystal clear. It won't be necessary to rehash the same old stuff. I am happier when I am on task and focused on the case -- the evidence and information.

Did I wish you all a Happy New Year? If not, Happy New Year y'all. And just in case I get banned again real soon, here's to wishing you Happy Valentine's Day, Happy Presidents' Day, Happy St. Patty's Day, and Happy Easter.

MeyerLouie

[BruceSmith 3]

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Hurricane Sandy and the intensive storms along the East Coast make me wonder if the North Atlantic current is still actually RUNNING...

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Does anybody know the current status of the North Atlantic Current? The last I heard a couple years ago it was reduced about 40%. Guess I could Google it, too.....

[georger 197]

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Well hello DZ colleagues, this is MeyerLouie, your friendly 'banned Blevins basher.' I saw JT's post, I had to come on and give him a big welcome back. It's been along time, Jerry. I hope you are well.

I have been checking out Sluggo's website and I have also been reading some of the early DZ posts. In some ways, that's where some of the best conversation, information, and insight into the case occurred. That early DZ stuff was great -- before Jerry Springer got involved here, and decided to stay.

Is Blevins still around? Does a bear shit in the woods? Ha! I'm betting he's got other people very frustrated too. As you all know, I lost my cool with him. It might be better to just deflect -- I was taught to just ignore annoying people and eventually they will go away -- if not physically then at least in one's mind as one changes one's attitude about the person. My opinion of Blevins and where I stand are crystal clear. It won't be necessary to rehash the same old stuff. I am happier when I am on task and focused on the case -- the evidence and information.

Did I wish you all a Happy New Year? If not, Happy New Year y'all. And just in case I get banned again real soon, here's to wishing you Happy Valentine's Day, Happy Presidents' Day, Happy St. Patty's Day, and Happy Easter.

MeyerLouie

Hey Meyer. Just got in, been a long day, but much
accomplished. Welcome back. Take care. You know
what I mean ....

Yes, there is some good material in those early days.
Was more problem oriented back then I think ... in
spite of JT! (thats a joke - he's reading this).
Take care.. take care.. later.
G.

[sailshaw 0]

Georger:

You say: "The oxygen for the passengers came from other tanks either over the cabin area or beneath the cabin floor. It was supplied to the passengers through constant-flow masks that would drop down, at least in theory, when the cabin depressurized at altitude."

I say from experience testing the passenger oxygen supply "cans". That cans are exactly what they are and are mounted in the overhead above each passenger. When the face masks drop down for each passenger, they have to pull down on the masks to actuate "their can" and it causes a small lever to snap over and start the chemical reaction that creates the oxygen within the can to then flow to their own face mask. Each passenger has then their own short supply of oxygen to allow them to breath as the pilot dives to a safe altitude where passengers can breath normally. Remember, their supply is just in their personal can (size of a coke can) when they activate it by the down pull on their mask. The pilots have a much larger supply of oxygen in their one big tank close to the cock-pit. The pilots have plenty of oxygen to do what ever they must do in an emergengy where the passengers only have their coke can size supply that lasts only a couple of minutes. That is long enough to dive to a safe altitude. So, the passengers have only the can above them (and not under the floor) to survive with and the Flight Attendant has a portable oxygen bottle to allow free movement within the cabin and assist passengers that are having problems (usually the passengers don't pull down hard enough to start their supply).
So, it is just that simple

Bob Sailshaw
[email protected]

[airtwardo 6]

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Georger:

You say: "The oxygen for the passengers came from other tanks either over the cabin area or beneath the cabin floor. It was supplied to the passengers through constant-flow masks that would drop down, at least in theory, when the cabin depressurized at altitude."

I say from experience testing the passenger oxygen supply "cans". That cans are exactly what they are and are mounted in the overhead above each passenger. When the face masks drop down for each passenger, they have to pull down on the masks to actuate "their can" and it causes a small lever to snap over and start the chemical reaction that creates the oxygen within the can to then flow to their own face mask. Each passenger has then their own short supply of oxygen to allow them to breath as the pilot dives to a safe altitude where passengers can breath normally. Remember, their supply is just in their personal can (size of a coke can) when they activate it by the down pull on their mask. The pilots have a much larger supply of oxygen in their one big tank close to the cock-pit. The pilots have plenty of oxygen to do what ever they must do in an emergengy where the passengers only have their coke can size supply that lasts only a couple of minutes. That is long enough to dive to a safe altitude. So, the passengers have only the can above them (and not under the floor) to survive with and the Flight Attendant has a portable oxygen bottle to allow free movement within the cabin and assist passengers that are having problems (usually the passengers don't pull down hard enough to start their supply).
So, it is just that simple

Bob Sailshaw
[email protected]

Ummm...not really~
http://www.boeing-727.com/Data/systems/infooxygen.html

From the ones I've seen & tested - the oxygen generators you're referring to are a bit larger than a coke can

They aren't set up 'one to a customer' but rather in 2 or 3 masks per generator type of thing depending on the cabin configuration.

In narrow body aircraft they're usually in the overhead panel, in wide bodies they are in the seat back in front of you, because most people can't reach the ceiling in those.

The generators are activated by pulling on the mask which pulls a pin, firing a 'hammer&primer' devise much like on a hand grenade, it contains a lead styphnate and tetrazene mixture .

That 'blast' triggers a chemical reaction, the oxidizer core is sodium chlorate (NaClO3), which is mixed with less than 5 percent barium peroxide (BaO2) and less than 1 percent potassium perchlorate (KClO4) which creates the 02.

The chemical reaction also creates a lot of heat - up to 500 degrees F.

The 'firing pin' is designed to activate with about 3-5 pounds of force which is nothing in a panic situation. I've never heard of them NOT being activated because of failing to pull hard enough, just extending the mask from it's deployment position usually activates them.

The fact that they activate so easily & run so hot is what caused that plane to crash some years back in the Fla. Glades
-they were hauling a bunch of 'em as cargo 'packed' loosely in a box with some other maintenance items in the hold.

They probably got banged around during take-off and activated, the heat caused the fire & down she came.

They use those now instead of high pressure cylinders as the 727 was designed to take, because of weight and safely considerations.

Those big tanks are heavy, require a lot of pluming, aren't a good thing to have under ya during a crash&burn situation, and if they for what ever reason end up empty before needed...EVERYBODY is screwed. Having multiple generators lowers that possibility.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[Robert99 37]

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The Ex still baskin' in Tucson.

Bruce, No one is really basking in Tucson this weekend. A cold wave passed through yesterday morning, the night time temperatures are below freezing, and the outer portions of Tucson had snow yesterday.

But it still beats the New England area.

Robert99

[Robert99 37]

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Ummm...not really~
http://www.boeing-727.com/Data/systems/infooxygen.html

Airtwardo,

To put it another way, on your better half's flights to and from Paris, she has her quick don oxygen mask on above a certain altitude and has it in place and breathing oxygen at a still higher altitude. Same for her co-pilot.

Robert99

[airtwardo 6]

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Ummm...not really~
http://www.boeing-727.com/Data/systems/infooxygen.html

Airtwardo,

To put it another way, on your better half's flights to and from Paris, she has her quick don oxygen mask on above a certain altitude and has it in place and breathing oxygen at a still higher altitude. Same for her co-pilot.

Robert99

Not in normal fight situations.

The mask is donned only in an emergency or when 'alone' in the cockpit...as in a restroom break.

The problem with the 'quick don on' is difficulty in communication.

Can't use your personal head-set, and the cockpit mike won't pick up the muffled voice with a mask on.

So for the most part no voice radios during an emergency until below 15...and general comm with flight is by keyboard only during a potty break.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[Robert99 37]

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Ummm...not really~
http://www.boeing-727.com/Data/systems/infooxygen.html

Airtwardo,

To put it another way, on your better half's flights to and from Paris, she has her quick don oxygen mask on above a certain altitude and has it in place and breathing oxygen at a still higher altitude. Same for her co-pilot.

Robert99

Not in normal fight situations.

The mask is donned only in an emergency or when 'alone' in the cockpit...as in a restroom break.

The problem with the 'quick don on' is difficulty in communication.

Can't use your personal head-set, and the cockpit mike won't pick up the muffled voice with a mask on.

So for the most part no voice radios during an emergency until below 15...and general comm with flight is by keyboard only during a potty break.

Keyboard? I must be getting old or something.

Robert99

[georger 197]

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Georger:

You say: "The oxygen for the passengers came from other tanks either over the cabin area or beneath the cabin floor. It was supplied to the passengers through constant-flow masks that would drop down, at least in theory, when the cabin depressurized at altitude."

I say from experience testing the passenger oxygen supply "cans". That cans are exactly what they are and are mounted in the overhead above each passenger. When the face masks drop down for each passenger, they have to pull down on the masks to actuate "their can" and it causes a small lever to snap over and start the chemical reaction that creates the oxygen within the can to then flow to their own face mask. Each passenger has then their own short supply of oxygen to allow them to breath as the pilot dives to a safe altitude where passengers can breath normally. Remember, their supply is just in their personal can (size of a coke can) when they activate it by the down pull on their mask. The pilots have a much larger supply of oxygen in their one big tank close to the cock-pit. The pilots have plenty of oxygen to do what ever they must do in an emergengy where the passengers only have their coke can size supply that lasts only a couple of minutes. That is long enough to dive to a safe altitude. So, the passengers have only the can above them (and not under the floor) to survive with and the Flight Attendant has a portable oxygen bottle to allow free movement within the cabin and assist passengers that are having problems (usually the passengers don't pull down hard enough to start their supply).
So, it is just that simple

Bob Sailshaw
[email protected]

Sail, I didn't post on this topic. Someone has me
confused with someone else - probably Blevins or Jo.

[airtwardo 6]

Keyboard? I must be getting old or something.

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~ Better yet, in the newer stuff ya get a hard-copy print out of flight path deviation due to traffic or weather, expected corridors, current weather at destination, gate for arrival...heck, the aircraft sends fuel consumption rate, speed, altitude, maintenance issues - to the ops main frame on a regular basis.

They say in ten years a monkey could fly a heavy anywhere in the world...the crew's only manual will be instructions on how to feed the monkey!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[Robert99 37]

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Keyboard? I must be getting old or something.

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~ Better yet, in the newer stuff ya get a hard-copy print out of flight path deviation due to traffic or weather, expected corridors, current weather at destination, gate for arrival...heck, the aircraft sends fuel consumption rate, speed, altitude, maintenance issues - to the ops main frame on a regular basis.

They say in ten years a monkey could fly a heavy anywhere in the world...the crew's only manual will be instructions on how to feed the monkey!

I guess it is time for me to start checking for a book on basket weaving or a related activity if I want to stay busy.

Robert99

[georger 197]

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'Sail, I didn't post on this topic. Someone has me
confused with someone else - probably Blevins or Jo...'

Robert99 was the one responding to the oxygen questions.

Thank you Mother Hen.

Sort all the eggs while you're at it!

Be sure to throw out all the dead ones.

Well will get to Narcissism later.


Dot every i, and cross every t. Even if they don't exist.

[airtwardo 6]

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Keyboard? I must be getting old or something.

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~ Better yet, in the newer stuff ya get a hard-copy print out of flight path deviation due to traffic or weather, expected corridors, current weather at destination, gate for arrival...heck, the aircraft sends fuel consumption rate, speed, altitude, maintenance issues - to the ops main frame on a regular basis.

They say in ten years a monkey could fly a heavy anywhere in the world...the crew's only manual will be instructions on how to feed the monkey!

I guess it is time for me to start checking for a book on basket weaving or a related activity if I want to stay busy.

Robert99

Feed the monkey!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[georger 197]

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'Sail, I didn't post on this topic. Someone has me confused with someone else - probably Blevins or Jo...'

Robert99 was the one responding to the oxygen questions.

Thank you Mother Hen.

Sort all the eggs while you're at it!

Be sure to throw out all the dead ones.

Well will get to Narcissism later.


Dot every i, and cross every t. Even if they don't exist.

And even if they DO exist.

Verify all testimony or evidence with a second source, if possible.
I learned that from THIS.

If you keep on with those offhand, insult-for-no-reason type of comments, you'll get a posting with an excerpt about the first manned landing on Mars. Which has nothing to do with Cooper, by the way, although I guarantee it's more entertaining than your last post.

You don't want that.

Picking and choosing times to insult works better than just spray-and-pray. Like when you have a good reason for it besides just a general principle.

It's no insult. It's just a factual observation shared by
the vast majority, of how you operate - Sham Wow.
Farflung noted it well!

That you should be insulted by this factual account
means only that you cannot change, do not see the
error of your ways, resist honest criticism when it
comes your way, that your analysis cannot tolerate
FACTS or a factual analysis, and that you are probably
some loner looking for recognition where recognition
is not due ....

I don't expect you to understand it. But to keep
calling it a personal insult only proves you don't have
the faintest idea what you are saying and doing !
You keep wandering into the no-man's-land of your
lack of personal epiphany only to get lost, then you
try and decode things which fails, you try and tell
others how to decode things (like Jo does) and that
does not work, then you get mad, then you call clouds
passing by an insult! (Hit your finger with a hammer
to bring yourself back to reality?) Stop blaming me
and others for your own self induced stupor, hanging
out on Dropzone expecting something to happen!

Blevins! You did not create the world and you don't
control it or anyone else in it.

Play it again, Sam. Its all you have in your arsenal of
card tricks.

Are you a Master? Don't make the world laugh!

I will anyway...

Get a map. That might help and most people would
almost three into a voyage going nowhere.

It's not an insult. Its just me sitting here looking out
my window watching 'some guy' wandering around in
the street, wondering how long until someone calls
authorities to come and look into the matter and take
the guy home ... wherever in hell he belongs, to
relieve the neighborhood of his rants!

[georger 197]

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Hmm. I just love it when you speak for everyone who posts here...who exactly is this 'vast majority' you speak of?

Never mind. You get the excerpt.

The MEV shook and roared as it continued a headfirst, full-power descent toward the Martian surface. Johnson’s heart was racing like a runaway freight train. She tried not to show her anxiety as she worked. “Stand by for pitch program.”

“Thirty thousand meters to ground contact,” said McKendrick tersely.

As Johnson pitched the MEV around so that its landing legs were now pointed toward the surface, she felt as if her stomach had been wrenched from her body.

Walker glanced out the right-hand window, trying to gauge the terrain below. “I recognize this area. We’re over the Terra Meridian.”

“That’s right,” said Johnson. “Canyons and mountains, mostly.” She resisted adding an ‘I told you so.’ She pressed another switch that rattled the MEV. “Shield jettison,” she said. No longer needed, the red-hot heat shield that had protected the lander from heat buildup during atmospheric entry flew away from the spacecraft.

McKendrick studied the module’s image on the radar screen as the MEV’s descent engines screamed in the background. “Module is coming up on shield jettison. Looks like the parachutes are opening, too.” In the next moment, he gasped as a tiny white blip on the radar screen suddenly blossomed to the size of a golf ball. “Look out! We’re headed right for the heat shield!”

The cargo module had also jettisoned its now-useless heat shield, and the lander was descending directly into its path. A warning buzzer blared in the cabin. Johnson switched it off and reached for the manual controls to make a quick course-correction. It was too late. “Oh, my God…” She ducked away involuntarily as a huge metal panel rushed past her window and disappeared. There was a distinctive thump as it passed. The MEV shuddered for a moment, and then seemed to recover. Instinctively, she scanned the controls for any damage, but found nothing. “I think we clipped it,” she said cautiously.

“No kidding,” McKendrick said. His eyes stayed glued to the control boards. “No cautions-and-warnings, though. Cabin pressure is still holding steady.”

“Damn! I just lost Houston,” said Johnson. She checked the com signal-strength meter. It read zero.

Walker tilted his head and looked out his window. From his vantage, he was able to see their com-dish. A ragged mounting pole about six inches long was all that remained of the antenna. “We’ve lost the X-band. K-band, too. Antenna’s gone. Must have been torn away by the impact.”

“26,000 meters,” said McKendrick. “I’m not seeing the module on radar anymore. I think it’s…” Another warning buzzer and a red light caught his attention. “Hey...we’re losing fuel fast from descent tanks two and six. Looks like they’re breached.”

“I see it.” Johnson switched off the second alarm and closed the flow valves to the damaged tanks. “They must have been struck by the heat shield, too. We’ll have to dump them before they ignite.” She flipped two red switches and with a pair of quick bangs, the leaking tanks flew away from the MEV.

Walker leaned over and scanned the fuel readings. “We’re still within parameters on fuel for the landing. We’ll have to transfer from the ascent tanks, though.”

Johnson glanced at the ‘abort’ control for a moment. She surreptitiously moved her left hand toward it.

“24,000 meters,” McKendrick said calmly. “Sixty seconds to commit point. Someone make the call.”

“There’s five tons of fuel in that cargo module down there,” said Walker. “More than enough to replace any we use from the ascent tanks.”

“That’s not an answer.” Johnson laid her left hand on the abort control. “If we can’t find that module, we’ll never make orbit again without more fuel. I remind you we also have no com with Houston. I think we should abort and head back to the Lincoln until Houston sorts this out. We can still do a full abort on the descent engines and try a landing later. We could also restore our com there.”

“No!” Walker said. “No abort damn it! We stay with the module!”

“Didn’t you hear me, Mike? If we abort in the next twenty seconds, we can do it without dumping the descent stage. There would still be a chance for a landing later.”

“Absolutely not!” Walker said. “Divert fuel from the ascent tanks and stay on course. That’s an order.”

McKendrick glared at both of them from his center couch. “Come on, you two. Make up your minds, or I’ll pull that abort handle myself.”

“Are we still tracking the module’s homing beacon?” said Walker.

Johnson checked the homing signal and was relieved to see it was still showing. The beacon system was on a smaller, separate antenna. “Yes. I might be able to put us down within a couple of kilometers of wherever it decides to land. I can’t guarantee the terrain, though.”

“Do it,” Walker ordered. “We’ll figure out a way to restore communications after we land.”

Johnson knew Walker was taking a tremendous risk by ordering a blind landing over unknown terrain. Without communications, it was beyond risky. It was a crazy gamble. However, she couldn’t bring herself to override his decision. “All right. We go.” She moved her hand away from the abort lever and toward another set of controls. She was now more frightened than at any time she could remember. “Opening ascent fuel valves,” she said. “Transferring fuel to descent engines.” They were now burning fuel actually designated for their liftoff from the Martian surface. “There goes the reserve,” she said. She increased thrust and made a slight adjustment, shadowing the module’s course as it screamed toward the surface somewhere below them. She could see the fire trails from its landing engines as a long thin line.

“Estimated four minutes to touchdown,” said McKendrick. “Okay that’s it, guys. Twenty thousand meters to ground contact. We just passed the commit point.”

At Mission Control in Houston, organized pandemonium now reigned. All communications with the MEV had died a few seconds after McKendrick had called out his warning about the cargo module’s heat shield. Suddenly, Houston had lost both telemetry and radio signal.

The MEV had simply vanished.

Jim Morris stood silently at the back of the room and waited for the flight controllers to sort it out. He already suspected the worst. The heat shield on the cargo module weighed several hundred pounds. If the MEV had struck the shield, it could mean disaster. Morris tried to remain calm and keep his mind clear.

He watched as the CapCom technician frantically tried to reach the crew, calling repeatedly, “Mars One, this is Houston, do you read? Mars One, this is Houston, do you read?” There was no response.

***

“We’ve lost the radar signal on the module,” said McKendrick. “Homing beacon is still there. Pretty weak signal, though.”

“It may have gone into a canyon,” said Johnson. “Some of them are fairly deep in this area.”

At a scant two thousand meters above the ground, she increased power again to slow their descent. She saw what resembled the Grand Canyon below them, however, this place contained scores of Grand Canyons from horizon to horizon, like some colossal stone maze. They all looked dark and deep.

She spotted a few large plateaus rising above the canyons and considered putting the MEV on top of one. She decided against it. They would never reach the cargo module sitting on top of a plateau. Instead, she made another course change, flying horizontally, trying to bring the MEV closer to the module’s last known position.

As they thundered over the canyons searching for a landing site, the descent engines continued to burn fuel at a furious rate.

“Watch out. I see broken terrain on radar,” said McKendrick.

“Roger that.” Outside her window, Johnson saw sharp-edged ridges and deep slashes across the ground that ended in shadows. “Damn, it’s dark down there,” she said.

It was nearly sunset on Mars. The canyons shone in dark burgundy and crimson. The light was fading fast.

She finally glimpsed something encouraging. Between two of the high plateaus was a narrow valley covered in nothing more dangerous than small rocks. It was an ancient riverbed, winding among the canyons. “I think I see a good landing site. Here we go.” She leveled off and dropped them smoothly into the valley. Sheer cliffs and steep hills seemed to swallow the MEV.

McKendrick checked their fuel supply. “Sixty seconds. Open valves on tank four?”

Johnson understood the question. They had already transferred fuel from three of the six tanks on the upper ascent stage. In one minute, they would have to transfer even more if they were not on the ground. “No.” She reached up to close another switch. “No transfer. Plenty of time. Landing lights on.” She risked another quick glance out the window. “We’re going for the riverbed,” she said. “It’s at least thirty meters across. No boulders. Terrain looks good.”

“Radar shows same,” said Walker. “Come on Anna, get it down.”

Johnson watched the altimeter carefully and piloted the MEV into a gentle vertical descent, its engines still roaring and gulping fuel. As they dropped into the spot she had selected, thick rust-colored dust flew in all directions. Sensors in the landing legs brushed the ground.

“Contact light,” said Johnson calmly. She flipped another switch above her head. “Engine stop.”

The MEV settled to the ground with a soft bump, coming to rest at a slight angle. The engine shut down with a drawn-out whine that slowly faded into silence. The sun was completely gone now, and the darkness outside was total.

In the swirling shadows created by their landing lights and the Martian dust, they could see only tantalizing hints of the towering walls of stone surrounding the spacecraft. (end of excerpt)

OFF TOPIC KNOSS RANT!

[skyjack71 0]

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Sail, I didn't post on this topic. Someone has me
confused with someone else - probably Blevins or Jo.

NOT ME! I only noted I know where the O2 was located! NO need for me to elaborate!
And I Sure WASN't TALKING about the passenger O2 which we all know is located over our seats.

Jo is just sitting out and making observations! BUT, I'm heeeearrr!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

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You keep wandering into the no-man's-land of your
lack of personal epiphany only to get lost, then you
try and decode things which fails, you try and tell
others how to decode things (like Jo does).

Be REAL Nice my sweet baboon and leave Jo out of this. What U hear might Not be what you Expected!

Weird Rumor going around! Being paid to write Books! Like Option contracts if you don't produce then you pay everything back they advanced. NOW that sounds like something to cause a person to produce a book they had NO basis for in the 1st place.

READ READ READ and talk to the right kind of Attorneys before you sign on the dotted line. Glad I never fell into that deep dark pitt.

So much shit seeping out of the cracks here lately - glad I just stayed on my own and did it MY WAY! Keeping on and on seeking the truth - money is NOT everything and FAME will not find them. The only loyalty I owe to anyone is to myself and my heart!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[Robert99 37]

Blevins, Please entertain a few questions.

Your Mars writings, whatever they are named, result in some interesting situations:

1. How many heat shields does this Mars lander have? You have a cargo module heat shield and a lander heat shield. Just exactly how do you manage to get two (or more) heat shields on this vehicle and what is the overall vehicle configuration?

2. A "red hot" heat shield? Could you explain the difference between ablation, as used in heat shield design, and heat sinks, which are used in various ways and for various reasons? Why is it that all the space vehicles to date, that I am aware of and that used heat shields, used the abalation design? What color(s) are caused by the ablation of the heat shield?

3. There seems to be a problem with the time between the points 30,000 meters and 26,000 meters to touchdown. The 4000 meters covered in some unspecified time is less than three miles distance. Since the lander was between 75,000 and 80,000 feet above the Mars surface when this was happening, it was probably going at least Mach 1 or 2. In Earth air, Mach 1 is a function only of the air temperature. Making a wild guess and assuming it is the same for Mars air, and assuming a high temperature on the outer edge of the Mars atmosphere, then the lander could be going at least 1000 miles per hour. That computes to about 17 miles per minute or about 0.3 miles per second or about 10 seconds to cover the three miles. Your lander crew did a lot of things in that 10 seconds.

4. Your "head first, full power descent" is a problem. Generally speaking, the arrangement would be "feet first, full power descent" assuming that the rocket engine is pushing against the feet in the direction that the lander is coming from. Assuming, of course, that you want to slow the vehicle down so it can land.

5. Etc., Etc..

Robert99

[skyjack71 0]

Did I ask for a reply from U or anyone else? NO! What I was stating was A RUMOR I heard out THERE in NEVER NEVER LAND! My post required NO instructional post from U. It was NOT about me and NO one asked U for advice.

U continuallly twist and turn EVERY post like it is directed at you or 4 u & U have NO idea what is happening!

U have NO idea what is going on AROUND U or in the CASE - Nothing - IOTA! YOU (U) keep this thread OFF subject with trivial stuff exhibiting your writing skills. U DO NOT allow anyone to have an INTELLIGENT conversation about the CASE. U are here for PROMOTIONAL reasons only.

U are NOT here to explore the truths or possibilites UNLESS they are about YOUR BOOK or your subject who WAS NEVER a suspect and NEVER will be!

A lot has been missed in the BASICS of the investigation - everyone was trying to make it complicated. It wasn't. NOW many SUSPECTS have been presented and extractions taken from the basics of the case.

The Truth was too SIMPLE.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[sailshaw 0]

Georger: Sorry I thought you had posted about the oxygen tanks. Actually, Airtwardo brings up some interesting history about passenger oxygen on airplanes. It is actually very confused and involved in what the airlines wanted to have in their fleet.

Not to get into the history but there are at least two types of systems for the passengers. Tanks of oxygen dispersed as in the article Airtwardo quotes and oxygen generator cans of various sizes in the overhead. The distributed generator cans systems are much lighter and less complicated (no plumbing) and at some time in the 727 manufacturing history one took over for the other and with many variations too. I only mentioned what I had tested at Boeing and did not intend to open a ball of worms. The passenger oxygen system on NWA 305 may be in 377's manual as it might cover what was going on in 1971. I will only stand by what I said about what I tested at Boeing. I retired over 19 years ago and was an Engineering Manager for the last 18 years. So when I tested the oxygen generators was more than 37 years ago when I was a test engineer. Like Hillary Clinton said "it really dose not matter dose it?"

Bob Sailshaw
[email protected]

[georger 197]

Speaking of plagiarism, Georger's post back there with the Mars Thing sounds a lot like an excerpt from The 13th Day of Christmas.

Georger...tsk, tsk.

Just kidding, man. If you didn't like the excerpt, you should just delete the thing. It WAS a bit long, I'll admit.

The post was yours, not mine, you bloviating idiot.

As in: Re: [RobertMBlevins] OXYGEN TANKS & WHY NWA 305 [In reply to]

[georger 197]

Probably time to return to Cooper now. If Georger gets angry about all of this, I can't blame him. I'll just have to take it.

why dont you leave ME out of your shit from now on?

and everyone else here too?