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Jo wrote
I think polygraphs are pretty useless having seen guilty people pass them. They are not truth detectors, just stress detectors with a degree of subjectivity thrown in. A human designs the questions and interprets the results.
And Jo, if you try to control the questioning protocol then the outcome is worthless. Hands off if you want even a modicum of credibility.
Ask for a senior discount. Offer advance payment in cash. Put $400 in twenties on the table and tell him that's all you have. Get creative. Jerry said he'd pay for it, but he obviously isn't going to let you meddle with the questions.
You want a polygraph exam that you control. No sale. Nobody will donate a penny under those circumstances. Also, it doesn't matter whether you are telling the truth. I think you probably are. I also do not believe that Duane Weber was Dan Cooper. Your truthful account of what a small time bumbling con man told you about being a heroic figure and about a sentimental journey doesn't turn a frog into a princess.
Save your money for something fun Jo.
377
QuoteI was also asking for help with the polygraph and why I want to do it. The cost at present is over $700 but, he is retired FBI.
I think polygraphs are pretty useless having seen guilty people pass them. They are not truth detectors, just stress detectors with a degree of subjectivity thrown in. A human designs the questions and interprets the results.
And Jo, if you try to control the questioning protocol then the outcome is worthless. Hands off if you want even a modicum of credibility.
Ask for a senior discount. Offer advance payment in cash. Put $400 in twenties on the table and tell him that's all you have. Get creative. Jerry said he'd pay for it, but he obviously isn't going to let you meddle with the questions.
You want a polygraph exam that you control. No sale. Nobody will donate a penny under those circumstances. Also, it doesn't matter whether you are telling the truth. I think you probably are. I also do not believe that Duane Weber was Dan Cooper. Your truthful account of what a small time bumbling con man told you about being a heroic figure and about a sentimental journey doesn't turn a frog into a princess.
Save your money for something fun Jo.
377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
Farflung 0
Finally someone is pulling the board, made out of petrified wood, out of this subject’s ass.
http://orhistory.com/orhistory.com/News/Entries/2011/10/19_PRESS_RELEASE__DB_COOPER_NIGHT_%40_MISSISSIPPI_STUDIOS.html
What else could one expect from our own ‘Beaver State’ than a retrospective laced with pop-art about DB Cooper and his many sunglasses and one type of shoe.
There will be a raffle which includes a fused glass platter and skinny black tie for some lucky winner to wear home or serve bourbon and sodas from. What a gas.
http://orhistory.com/orhistory.com/News/Entries/2011/10/19_PRESS_RELEASE__DB_COOPER_NIGHT_%40_MISSISSIPPI_STUDIOS.html
What else could one expect from our own ‘Beaver State’ than a retrospective laced with pop-art about DB Cooper and his many sunglasses and one type of shoe.
There will be a raffle which includes a fused glass platter and skinny black tie for some lucky winner to wear home or serve bourbon and sodas from. What a gas.
Farflung 0
Who says history can’t be fun? Well everyone actually….. but here is a different approach:
http://www.orhistory.com/orhistory.com/Kick__Ass__Oregon__History/Entries/2011/11/1_Kick_Ass_Oregon_History_Vol_3_6__DB_Cooper_Part_One.html
Just click the little play (delta shaped) icon below the awesome color graphic of Cooper under canopy and listen in glorious, full color, 3-D audio. A very good production including Galen Cook, Geoffrey Gray and Ayn Rand… just kidding it was Ayn Dietrich.
http://www.orhistory.com/orhistory.com/Kick__Ass__Oregon__History/Entries/2011/11/1_Kick_Ass_Oregon_History_Vol_3_6__DB_Cooper_Part_One.html
Just click the little play (delta shaped) icon below the awesome color graphic of Cooper under canopy and listen in glorious, full color, 3-D audio. A very good production including Galen Cook, Geoffrey Gray and Ayn Rand… just kidding it was Ayn Dietrich.
Farflung 0
Here’s part 2 of the DB Cooper podcast with some talk about exit speeds:
http://www.orhistory.com/orhistory.com/Kick__Ass__Oregon__History/Entries/2011/11/15_Kick_Ass_Oregon_History_Vol_3_7__DB_Cooper_Part_Two.html
If nothing else, it is nice to hear some talk from a group of people who lack the self important, verbose and inaccurate diction which has filled this thread like PCBs in a Mexico City river. The salmon producing diamonds by eating twenty dollar bills is a new ‘known fact’.
I enjoyed this pant-less romp through the many theories and ‘personalities’ associated with this story replete with data guardians, self proclaimed experts and the ever so slightly delusional.
Party on Dan!
Party on Farf!
http://www.orhistory.com/orhistory.com/Kick__Ass__Oregon__History/Entries/2011/11/15_Kick_Ass_Oregon_History_Vol_3_7__DB_Cooper_Part_Two.html
If nothing else, it is nice to hear some talk from a group of people who lack the self important, verbose and inaccurate diction which has filled this thread like PCBs in a Mexico City river. The salmon producing diamonds by eating twenty dollar bills is a new ‘known fact’.
I enjoyed this pant-less romp through the many theories and ‘personalities’ associated with this story replete with data guardians, self proclaimed experts and the ever so slightly delusional.
Party on Dan!
Party on Farf!
Thanks Bruce..After reading your report and the FBI's answers, it should obvious to anyone why this crime has never been solved after 40 years. Hope you received a packaged recently with a picture Braden and I in Perth, Scotland in 1962. Again, thanks for your effort in solving this case.
smokin99 0
QuoteIn reality, I knew that yes...you can copy a title of a book. Titles are not copyrighted. I sort of alluded to that in my post.
Mostly, I was trying to shame Bruce into making up his own, original title. His current idea is poor form, bad manners, too convenient, and a cheap attempt to cash in on another writer's hard work.
Besides, it's bad marketing. Amazon reviewers will jump all over him in a very bad way. Crown may still cause him some problems, as well.
377 beat me to it it about the copyright thing.....
As for selling - Not saying it's a good or bad marketing idea now that Geoffrey's title " Skyjack: The Hunt for DB Cooper" is out there. Although you are, as usual, awfully quick to malign and assume nefarious motives, I can still see the point you make. As a reader the title wouldn't necessarily bother me -- but that's a call Bruce will have to make for himself.
Now as to the fairness of it, I do know that Bruce has had a work in progress in the "public eye" for over a year (Maybe longer - just know that I have a copy from Sept 2010) with the same title he is using now. Don't know when Geoffrey Gray first came out with his title. Just saying it may well be that Bruce used the phrase first.
Regardless, it's not like it's a novel idea (
I just don't think it would be a big deal to many readers and I don't automatically assume that Bruce copied it...but that's just mho.but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill
QuoteQuoteIn reality, I knew that yes...you can copy a title of a book. Titles are not copyrighted. I sort of alluded to that in my post.
Mostly, I was trying to shame Bruce into making up his own, original title. His current idea is poor form, bad manners, too convenient, and a cheap attempt to cash in on another writer's hard work.
Besides, it's bad marketing. Amazon reviewers will jump all over him in a very bad way. Crown may still cause him some problems, as well.
377 beat me to it it about the copyright thing.....
As for selling - Not saying it's a good or bad marketing idea now that Geoffrey's title " Skyjack: The Hunt for DB Cooper" is out there. Although you are, as usual, awfully quick to malign and assume nefarious motives, I can still see the point you make. As a reader the title wouldn't necessarily bother me -- but that's a call Bruce will have to make for himself.
Now as to the fairness of it, I do know that Bruce has had a work in progress in the "public eye" for over a year (Maybe longer - just know that I have a copy from Sept 2010) with the same title he is using now. Don't know when Geoffrey Gray first came out with his title. Just saying it may well be that Bruce used the phrase first.
Regardless, it's not like it's a novel idea (I just don't think it would be a big deal to many readers and I don't automatically assume that Bruce copied it...but that's just mho.
Quote
Actually, I was inspired by Nick Cook in his seminal work on hyper-dimensional physics: The Hunt for Zero Point: Inside the Classified World of Antigravity Technology.
Thanks, 377 and Smokin' for stickin' up for me...
Only Gawd knows what GG thinks of me, the title and my work; so I plan on asking him about it all in Portland next week. Friday night in the bar, to be specific.
Nevertheless, I do have other titles: My personal favorite is "Seeking Justice - The Resurgent Investigation into the DB Cooper Skyjacking," but it is vague and "The Hunt for" is more penetrating and precise.
Also, I've put my original title on a shelf, the one that I used here several years ago, "Why Can't the FBI Find DB Cooper?" Nevertheless, that theme still drives my work even though the title is a bit too provocative for my current dealings with the Bureau.
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http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=4222338;sb=post_latest_reply;so=ASC;forum_view=forum_view_collapsed;;page=unread#unread
Looks to me like the 28 ft C9 canopy (stock round canopy for NB8) was the ideal choice for the Cooper jump.
The 26 ft Navy conical (standard in the NB6 and used as an emergency chute in many civilian rigs) was a fine canopy, but didnt have suspension lines going all the way up one side, over the apex and down the other side of the canopy. The C9 did have that construction and I think it was a tougher canopy for withstanding a high speed deployment without damage.
377
Looks to me like the 28 ft C9 canopy (stock round canopy for NB8) was the ideal choice for the Cooper jump.
The 26 ft Navy conical (standard in the NB6 and used as an emergency chute in many civilian rigs) was a fine canopy, but didnt have suspension lines going all the way up one side, over the apex and down the other side of the canopy. The C9 did have that construction and I think it was a tougher canopy for withstanding a high speed deployment without damage.
377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
Lt. Col Hank Bertsch, retired, contacted me today asking me to clarify a report I wrote and posted here in the DZ about his interactions with Ted Braden while in the Army. Specifically, Hank asked me to address the conflicting infomation regarding Ted's wherabouts circa 1973.
In 1974, Hank received detailed information via a conversation with an Army major, who claimed he had seen Braden in Vietnam in 1973. This major also described Braden's journey to Fort Dix and eventual placement under Hank's authority in the Fort Dix stockcade as a "cover-up" for Braden's activities in the Congo immediately after going AWOL from Vietnam in 1967.
The informational conflict arises as fellow officer and DB Cooper enthusiast Allen Tyre reports that he saw Ted at a truck stop in Bowling Green, Kentucky in 1973. So, how can this be when the major says he saw Ted in Vietnam at the same time?
Hank has written a comprehensive report on these developments and I have posted it below. It conforms to everything that Hank has told me throughout our numerous converations and emails of the past few months.
**********
By Lt. Col Hank Bertsch (retired)
Please allow me to clarify some of what Bruce stated about our conversations. When I told Bruce that Braden was seen in Vietnam it was the result of a conversation I had with an Army Major at Fort Jackson, SC in late June or early July, 1974, which I believed at the time to be true and here is why.
In the October, 1967 Ramparts article Braden stated he was held in the Fort Dix, NJ stockade for “123 days and 14 hours.” I was his Commanding Officer at that time. I was the Commander of the 1387 Replacement Company. Within that company was the Special Processing Detachment (SPD). My job as Commander of the SPD was to process all US Army Absent Without Leave (AWOL) personnel returned to military control in NY and NJ as well as other “special cases” from time to time. Ted B. Braden became the most unusual of those special cases.
If Braden’s assertion as to how long he was in the Fort Dix stockade was correct, and I believe it probably is, he arrived in my command in March, 1967 under Military Police escort and was confined immediately. He “resigned for the good of service,” was released from the stockade, escorted to the Fort Dix Transfer Station by my Executive Officer (XO), and discharged from the US Army, most likely with a General Discharge under Honorable Conditions, in July, 1967.
While in solitary confinement in the stockade he was given privileges no other prisoner in solitary had including his own television, Hav-A-Tampa wood tipped cigars, belt with brass buckle which was highly polished, and highly polished boots with laces. NOTE prisoners in solitary confinement were deemed suicide risks and not permitted to have laces or belts.
When Braden’s Military Personnel Records Jacket (MPRJ) AKA 201 File arrived at the SPD it included Braden’s DA Form 20 Enlisted Personnel Record. His Form 20 included his usual battery of tests taken at the time of initial enlistment. Braden’s record included his GT test score which was above 150. This score is a good estimate of IQ so it was apparent Braden was very bright. Also included were records of prior enlisted service in the Army, subsequent commissioned service in the Air Force, and his return to the Army as an enlisted person. It also indicated he had three years of college at the University of Toledo. He had several coded assignments and schools which meant highly classified work. He was also a master jumper. Also included with his MPRJ was DA Form 188 Extract Copy of the Morning Report which documented Braden’s AWOL from his Special Forces unit in Vietnam. DA Form 188 is considered prima fascia evidence to support a charge of AWOL.
Under the provisions of Article 32 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) a commissioned officer must be appointed to investigate the case before any member of the military can be tried by a General Court Martial (GCM). An officer was duly appointed. He investigated the evidence in the case and recommended that the Braden be given a GCM. The convening authority, the Commanding General of Fort Dix, agreed and the date for the GCM was scheduled.
On the date the GCM was to start General Harold K Johnson, Army Chief of Staff, called Fort Dix and ordered the trial not be held “for security reasons.”
Since there was a documented charge of AWOL that did not result in a court martial conviction Braden was offered the opportunity to “resign for the good of the service,” which was permitted under an Army Regulation. The provisions of such resignations include a “bar to reenlistment’ so that the soldier could not reenter the military. Braden initially balked at the terms under which he was to be separated from the Army but eventually agreed.
On the day my XO, armed with a .45-caliber pistol, escorted him to the Transfer Station. Braden was in a Class A or Army green dress uniform complete with his braid, green beret, his many ribbons, highly polished boots, bloused trousers and his Master Jump Wings. (He had been in Army fatigues in the stockade.) He could have been photographed for a recruiting poster.
Although my XO and I thought the entire Braden case very unusual, we had to get back to our regular AWOL case load. In July, 1967 the SPD had 245 Special Court Martial trials for AWOL so we plenty to keep us busy.
In August, 1967, I was released from Active Duty and began my Army reserve career. In late June or early July, 1974, while on annual training at Fort Jackson, SC, I met an Active Duty Army Major who was the Assistant Inspector General (IG) on the post. Since Fort Jackson also had an SPD and prisoners in the stockade frequently complain to the IG, I struck up a conversation with him about unusual cases each of us had experienced with SPD personnel. I described the Braden case without ever mentioning Braden by name and the Major said “you are talking about Ted Braden aren’t you?”
I was initially stunned but replied, “Yes”.
The Major then said “You were had. Braden was a CIA plant in the Congo and he was recognized so he was arrested to save face with the Congolese government. The entire Fort Dix episode was staged as part of the cover up. I saw Braden in Vietnam last year and he is now a Sergeant Major (Grade E-9).”
Braden was a Sergeant First Class (Grade E-7) when he was discharged in 1967 with a bar to ever reentering the military. Now, according to the Major at Fort Jackson, Braden by 1973 had not only reentered the Army but had been promoted twice.
At this point at least I had closure on what had transpired in the Braden case. With what the Major had told me at Fort Jackson everything about the Braden case seemed to make sense and I sort of filed the whole matter away.
In October, 2011 I again thought about the case and wondered whatever had become of Braden so I did a Google search on “Braden” which led me to the DropZone website and via that site I got linked to Bruce Smith, Al Tyre, and Tom Smith. In a phone conversation with Al Tyre he told me he saw Braden in a truck stop in Bowling Green, KY in 1973, and had a lengthy conversation with him. I was stunned because this directly contradicted what the Major at Fort Jackson had told me in 1974. Why the Major lied to me I do not know but it just adds another element to the strangeness of the entire Braden case.
November 16, 2011
In 1974, Hank received detailed information via a conversation with an Army major, who claimed he had seen Braden in Vietnam in 1973. This major also described Braden's journey to Fort Dix and eventual placement under Hank's authority in the Fort Dix stockcade as a "cover-up" for Braden's activities in the Congo immediately after going AWOL from Vietnam in 1967.
The informational conflict arises as fellow officer and DB Cooper enthusiast Allen Tyre reports that he saw Ted at a truck stop in Bowling Green, Kentucky in 1973. So, how can this be when the major says he saw Ted in Vietnam at the same time?
Hank has written a comprehensive report on these developments and I have posted it below. It conforms to everything that Hank has told me throughout our numerous converations and emails of the past few months.
**********
By Lt. Col Hank Bertsch (retired)
Please allow me to clarify some of what Bruce stated about our conversations. When I told Bruce that Braden was seen in Vietnam it was the result of a conversation I had with an Army Major at Fort Jackson, SC in late June or early July, 1974, which I believed at the time to be true and here is why.
In the October, 1967 Ramparts article Braden stated he was held in the Fort Dix, NJ stockade for “123 days and 14 hours.” I was his Commanding Officer at that time. I was the Commander of the 1387 Replacement Company. Within that company was the Special Processing Detachment (SPD). My job as Commander of the SPD was to process all US Army Absent Without Leave (AWOL) personnel returned to military control in NY and NJ as well as other “special cases” from time to time. Ted B. Braden became the most unusual of those special cases.
If Braden’s assertion as to how long he was in the Fort Dix stockade was correct, and I believe it probably is, he arrived in my command in March, 1967 under Military Police escort and was confined immediately. He “resigned for the good of service,” was released from the stockade, escorted to the Fort Dix Transfer Station by my Executive Officer (XO), and discharged from the US Army, most likely with a General Discharge under Honorable Conditions, in July, 1967.
While in solitary confinement in the stockade he was given privileges no other prisoner in solitary had including his own television, Hav-A-Tampa wood tipped cigars, belt with brass buckle which was highly polished, and highly polished boots with laces. NOTE prisoners in solitary confinement were deemed suicide risks and not permitted to have laces or belts.
When Braden’s Military Personnel Records Jacket (MPRJ) AKA 201 File arrived at the SPD it included Braden’s DA Form 20 Enlisted Personnel Record. His Form 20 included his usual battery of tests taken at the time of initial enlistment. Braden’s record included his GT test score which was above 150. This score is a good estimate of IQ so it was apparent Braden was very bright. Also included were records of prior enlisted service in the Army, subsequent commissioned service in the Air Force, and his return to the Army as an enlisted person. It also indicated he had three years of college at the University of Toledo. He had several coded assignments and schools which meant highly classified work. He was also a master jumper. Also included with his MPRJ was DA Form 188 Extract Copy of the Morning Report which documented Braden’s AWOL from his Special Forces unit in Vietnam. DA Form 188 is considered prima fascia evidence to support a charge of AWOL.
Under the provisions of Article 32 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) a commissioned officer must be appointed to investigate the case before any member of the military can be tried by a General Court Martial (GCM). An officer was duly appointed. He investigated the evidence in the case and recommended that the Braden be given a GCM. The convening authority, the Commanding General of Fort Dix, agreed and the date for the GCM was scheduled.
On the date the GCM was to start General Harold K Johnson, Army Chief of Staff, called Fort Dix and ordered the trial not be held “for security reasons.”
Since there was a documented charge of AWOL that did not result in a court martial conviction Braden was offered the opportunity to “resign for the good of the service,” which was permitted under an Army Regulation. The provisions of such resignations include a “bar to reenlistment’ so that the soldier could not reenter the military. Braden initially balked at the terms under which he was to be separated from the Army but eventually agreed.
On the day my XO, armed with a .45-caliber pistol, escorted him to the Transfer Station. Braden was in a Class A or Army green dress uniform complete with his braid, green beret, his many ribbons, highly polished boots, bloused trousers and his Master Jump Wings. (He had been in Army fatigues in the stockade.) He could have been photographed for a recruiting poster.
Although my XO and I thought the entire Braden case very unusual, we had to get back to our regular AWOL case load. In July, 1967 the SPD had 245 Special Court Martial trials for AWOL so we plenty to keep us busy.
In August, 1967, I was released from Active Duty and began my Army reserve career. In late June or early July, 1974, while on annual training at Fort Jackson, SC, I met an Active Duty Army Major who was the Assistant Inspector General (IG) on the post. Since Fort Jackson also had an SPD and prisoners in the stockade frequently complain to the IG, I struck up a conversation with him about unusual cases each of us had experienced with SPD personnel. I described the Braden case without ever mentioning Braden by name and the Major said “you are talking about Ted Braden aren’t you?”
I was initially stunned but replied, “Yes”.
The Major then said “You were had. Braden was a CIA plant in the Congo and he was recognized so he was arrested to save face with the Congolese government. The entire Fort Dix episode was staged as part of the cover up. I saw Braden in Vietnam last year and he is now a Sergeant Major (Grade E-9).”
Braden was a Sergeant First Class (Grade E-7) when he was discharged in 1967 with a bar to ever reentering the military. Now, according to the Major at Fort Jackson, Braden by 1973 had not only reentered the Army but had been promoted twice.
At this point at least I had closure on what had transpired in the Braden case. With what the Major had told me at Fort Jackson everything about the Braden case seemed to make sense and I sort of filed the whole matter away.
In October, 2011 I again thought about the case and wondered whatever had become of Braden so I did a Google search on “Braden” which led me to the DropZone website and via that site I got linked to Bruce Smith, Al Tyre, and Tom Smith. In a phone conversation with Al Tyre he told me he saw Braden in a truck stop in Bowling Green, KY in 1973, and had a lengthy conversation with him. I was stunned because this directly contradicted what the Major at Fort Jackson had told me in 1974. Why the Major lied to me I do not know but it just adds another element to the strangeness of the entire Braden case.
November 16, 2011
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Bruce wrote
Go bigger than Cooper in your title lead in. Many people in 2011 don't know who he is.
Vanishing Act, the ongoing quest to find skyjacker DB Cooper.
Crime of the Century, solving the mystery of DB Cooper
Jet Jump Hijack, looking for DB Cooper in the 21st Century.
Vanished in the Night, the search to identify the most innovative criminal of the 20th century, DB Cooper.
You can do better than I can Bruce, but don't lead with DB Cooper, give the title a broader appeal.
377
QuoteNevertheless, I do have other titles: My personal favorite is "Seeking Justice - The Resurgent Investigation into the DB Cooper Skyjacking," but it is vague and "The Hunt for" is more penetrating and precise.
Also, I've put my original title on a shelf, the one that I used here several years ago, "Why Can't the FBI Find DB Cooper?" Nevertheless, that theme still drives my work even though the title is a bit too provocative for my current dealings with the Bureau.
Go bigger than Cooper in your title lead in. Many people in 2011 don't know who he is.
Vanishing Act, the ongoing quest to find skyjacker DB Cooper.
Crime of the Century, solving the mystery of DB Cooper
Jet Jump Hijack, looking for DB Cooper in the 21st Century.
Vanished in the Night, the search to identify the most innovative criminal of the 20th century, DB Cooper.
You can do better than I can Bruce, but don't lead with DB Cooper, give the title a broader appeal.
377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
377 21
Bruce wrote
WOW Bruce!!! And thanks to Lt. Col Hank Bertsch rtd for coming forward with that fascinating information.
This is EXACTLY what I am talking about when I say that ANY publicity about DB Cooper is good because it shakes the trees, jogs memories and something new comes out, like this.
I am not a conspiracy nut but Braden sure rings those bells loudly. I am not saying that Norjack was a covert op, I dont think it was, but Braden might have known he could get away with such a crime because he already had intervention from VERY VERY high up (General Harold K Johnson, Army Chief of Staff) to kill an AWOL prosecution. Braden was, for some reason, untouchable.
What a bizarre tale. I too wonder why the Major apparently lied to Bertsch about Braden's whereabouts in 1973. I wonder if an FOIA request could verify the claimed post discharge promotion of Braden to Sergeant Major (Grade E-9)?
377
QuoteLt. Col Hank Bertsch, retired, contacted me today asking me to clarify a report I wrote and posted here in the DZ about his interactions with Ted Braden while in the Army. Specifically, Hank asked me to address the conflicting infomation regarding Ted's wherabouts circa 1973.
WOW Bruce!!! And thanks to Lt. Col Hank Bertsch rtd for coming forward with that fascinating information.
This is EXACTLY what I am talking about when I say that ANY publicity about DB Cooper is good because it shakes the trees, jogs memories and something new comes out, like this.
I am not a conspiracy nut but Braden sure rings those bells loudly. I am not saying that Norjack was a covert op, I dont think it was, but Braden might have known he could get away with such a crime because he already had intervention from VERY VERY high up (General Harold K Johnson, Army Chief of Staff) to kill an AWOL prosecution. Braden was, for some reason, untouchable.
What a bizarre tale. I too wonder why the Major apparently lied to Bertsch about Braden's whereabouts in 1973. I wonder if an FOIA request could verify the claimed post discharge promotion of Braden to Sergeant Major (Grade E-9)?
377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
Quote
377, if I was Braden with mad skills and well known to those in the biz...I would put on a show as well...to conceal my true skills.
I would not bring my own gear...because that would be a tell for sure...I would dress as Cooper did...to look the opposite of what I really was...or the G Men would know in an instant it was me.
It also sounds like Braden always wanted the easy dollar...the truck jacking thing is also very interesting that Bruce talks about.
I don't have a favorite suspect...but to the Braden of SOG...the Cooper jump was a cakewalk.
Melvin Wilson does sound interesting as well...I can't recall...did he have any jumping history?
Thanks Snow...I'm still reading that article from Ramparts...fascinating read by the way.
hangdiver
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=4204201;search_string=braden;#4204201
Just thought I'd quote myself...
hangdiver
"Mans got to know his limitations"
Harry Callahan
smokin99 0
QuoteGo bigger than Cooper in your title lead in. Many people in 2011 don't know who he is.
Vanishing Act, the ongoing quest to find skyjacker DB Cooper.
Crime of the Century, solving the mystery of DB Cooper
Jet Jump Hijack, looking for DB Cooper in the 21st Century.
Vanished in the Night, the search to identify the most innovative criminal of the 20th century, DB Cooper.
You can do better than I can Bruce, but don't lead with DB Cooper, give the title a broader appeal.
377
Good point, good advice, 377.
but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill
Hangdiver: I just finished a interview with the USA Today Show. I took them to the woods In Washougal. We discused Melvin Wilson I Told them that he was the strongest candidate for cooper i have seen in my25 yrs on this case . They agreed. Ralph was also Interviewed for this story . It will Air on the 27 of November.They and many other news stations will be at the conference on the 26 of november. One topic will be melvin Wilsson and why he is the best suspect since the hyjacking. The other topics will be why the other suspects could not have been Cooper . Jerry
georger 200
QuoteHangdiver: I just finished a interview with the USA Today Show. I took them to the woods In Washougal. We discused Melvin Wilson I Told them that he was the strongest candidate for cooper i have seen in my25 yrs on this case . They agreed. Ralph was also Interviewed for this story . It will Air on the 27 of November.They and many other news stations will be at the conference on the 26 of november. One topic will be melvin Wilsson and why he is the best suspect since the hyjacking. The other topics will be why the other suspects could not have been Cooper . Jerry
and how to you explain the particles Tom found?
377 21
Jerry,
If Melvin Wilson was DBC:
Was Norjack his first jump?
Did he know a 727 could be jumped?
If so, how did he learn that it could be jumped?
377
If Melvin Wilson was DBC:
Was Norjack his first jump?
Did he know a 727 could be jumped?
If so, how did he learn that it could be jumped?
377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
Mark If melvin was Db Cooper he is dead and never made another jump . the same can be said for any one that made that jump. Jerry
QuoteHangdiver: I just finished a interview with the USA Today Show. I took them to the woods In Washougal. We discused Melvin Wilson I Told them that he was the strongest candidate for cooper i have seen in my25 yrs on this case . They agreed. Ralph was also Interviewed for this story . It will Air on the 27 of November.They and many other news stations will be at the conference on the 26 of november. One topic will be melvin Wilsson and why he is the best suspect since the hyjacking. The other topics will be why the other suspects could not have been Cooper . Jerry
Thanks Jerry for the info...will you be giving a presentation on Wilson?
I have the same question as 377...did Wilson have any jump history...???...or is that info being saved for the Symposium and the Show?
hangdiver
"Mans got to know his limitations"
Harry Callahan
Robert, read this. http://copyright.gov/circs/circ34.pdf
Bruce can copy Geoffs title verbatim without infringing a copyright. Titles alone are not protected. Still, bad idea to copy it for a number of reasons including being fair.
Lawyers can threaten trade dress and unfair competition cases where there is no copyright infringement. Lawyers in the copyright arena rarely tell a paying client that he has no viable case and should just keep his money. They will find something to litigate and get that money from the clients pocket into their own. A very pissed off client with a big budget is their dream: (sound) "Damned right Mr. Client, we'll crush the bastards." (thought) "would that Ferrari look better in red or black?)."
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