quade 3 #51 July 18, 2014 m529gft So is there a law on here against speculating on DZ Quade? I can understand when a skydiving issue/incident is being discussed, but surely people can speculate on a non-skydiving air crash. People are after all using the very limited info available at this time. Perhaps this thread should be locked until the full air-crash investigation report is published? Let me make this a bit more clear. My objections with regard to speculation have zero to do with my moderation duties. They have everything to do with my duties as a human being. If you want to speculate about who may or may not get killed in a TV series; go for it. If you want to speculate about who may or may not win the quadrennial quidditch cup; go for it. If a person wants to speculate about something that may CAUSE the additional death of what may be innocent people by blaming them for something they might not have done; that's simply irresponsible behavior for humans to partake in. So sure, by forum rules anyone can and may speculate. However, by the rules of being a good human; not so much. And I will ALWAYS object to that.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #52 July 18, 2014 >Just like one of you inevitably blaming it on george bush That was a joke, my overly-sensitive friend. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #53 July 18, 2014 billvon >Just like one of you inevitably blaming it on george bush That was a joke, my overly-sensitive friend. He has lots of fellow travelers. We have a nanothermite type guy here at work... I guess even a large place like this has to have one.... He is sure this is all an Obama-CIA false flag operation that shot down the airliner. He has a perfectly plausible Infowars kind of explanation... that could only be swallowed by a complete idiot. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 622 #54 July 18, 2014 More from CNN It appears to me the Russians are providing some hot shit technology to the folks they seem to be supporting. From what we've seen so far, I say this is 1000% on the Russians. Like with Crimea, the world will do nothing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 3 #55 July 18, 2014 BBC article on the blame game. http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-28371461 Both sides want to blame the other. At best only one is right, but it's entirely possible neither of them are. I'd heard from another person today that supposedly the US has satellite imagery of the missile launch and positively can determine from that the location of launch and type of missile. IF that were the case, then why wouldn't we (the US) immediately make that information available? (Certainly the US has this capability at least in some limited form and the rest of the intelligence world would know that.) IF the reason to that is, "it's TOP SECRET!", then how would anyone in the media know of it? IF the answer to that is, "unnamed sources!", then why would we (the general public) believe that? (Please see named and unnamed sources credibility wrt Snowden debacle.) I have the feeling we (the general public) might never know the actual answers in this.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 622 #56 July 18, 2014 Thousands of troops in the region in brand new Russian military uniforms, albeit no markings from anywhere. Driving brand new Russian military gear. Shooting brand new Russian missile using brand new Russian anit-aircraft radar system. I think the clear answer is Russian efforts to create issues and destabilize the region in order to "deal with the problems of destabilization". Again, the world won't do dick. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 3 #57 July 18, 2014 More information in the disinformation war. http://www.vox.com/2014/7/18/5916005/malaysian-crash-mh17-russia-ukraine-wikipedia-editquade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 622 #58 July 18, 2014 Seriously??? The same site that listed a soccer player as the Secretary of Defense. Next please? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #59 July 18, 2014 Speculation abounds. I think that the Howard Stern caller pranking MSNBC was an indication of the utter lack of fact checking sources in order to get a scoop. If MSNBC let that guy on, what's it say about every other person who is a source? Plenty. My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 622 #60 July 18, 2014 I'm still going with the odds. If it looks like a Russian, quacks like a Russian, and launches like a Russian...... There's plenty of recent indicators. They are clearly invested in everything that happens there. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhaig 0 #61 July 18, 2014 billvon>Just like one of you inevitably blaming it on george bush That was a joke, my overly-sensitive friend. What do you think... too optimistic? http://i.imgur.com/zgOtqwG.jpg-- Rob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #62 July 19, 2014 normissI'm still going with the odds. If it looks like a Russian, quacks like a Russian, and launches like a Russian...... There's plenty of recent indicators. They are clearly invested in everything that happens there. I agree wholeheartedly. I don't think that they intended to shoot down a passenger airliner - they thought it was a cargo vessel. But, the Russians suplied the equipment, their boys fucked up, and consequences should be faced. Compare this to the Vincennes incident. A huge fuckup for which the US never apologized. Shit happens in battle. Unfortunately, it appears that the Russian separatist leader is making excuses worthy of a Taliban, like this was all a set up. Fuck him. My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #63 July 19, 2014 Quote Like with Crimea, the world will do nothing. By now you should realize that Russia has some really big guns. And that scares most people. We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #64 July 19, 2014 Quote IF that were the case, then why wouldn't we (the US) immediately make that information available? Because the Russians have some really big guns. And that seems to scare the Obama administration? Just guessing...We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 3 #65 July 19, 2014 StreetScoobyQuote IF that were the case, then why wouldn't we (the US) immediately make that information available? Because the Russians have some really big guns. And that seems to scare the Obama administration? Just guessing... Don't kid yourself; every US President has been scared of Russia/Soviet Union since at least before WWII for various reasons. That's why we also have "big guns."quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #66 July 19, 2014 lawrocket***I'm still going with the odds. If it looks like a Russian, quacks like a Russian, and launches like a Russian...... There's plenty of recent indicators. They are clearly invested in everything that happens there. I agree wholeheartedly. I don't think that they intended to shoot down a passenger airliner - they thought it was a cargo vessel. But, the Russians suplied the equipment, their boys fucked up, and consequences should be faced. Compare this to the Vincennes incident. A huge fuckup for which the US never apologized. Shit happens in battle. Unfortunately, it appears that the Russian separatist leader is making excuses worthy of a Taliban, like this was all a set up. Fuck him. And it looks like the evidence is being spirited away to Mother Russia where it is safe from prying eyes. http://news.nationalpost.com/2014/07/18/after-mh17-shot-down-video-allegedly-shows-buk-launcher-missing-one-of-four-missiles-being-moved-to-russia/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rifleman 61 #67 July 19, 2014 And for the conspiracy theorists amongst us - make of this what you will.... http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/malaysia-airlines-crash-joep-lange-among-up-to-100-aids-researchers-and-activists-on-board-flight-mh17-9613821.htmlAtheism is a Non-Prophet Organisation Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #68 July 19, 2014 Quote A huge fuckup for which the US never apologized. IIRC, the US paid significant compensation to the victim's families.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #69 July 19, 2014 riflemanAnd for the conspiracy theorists amongst us - make of this what you will.... http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/malaysia-airlines-crash-joep-lange-among-up-to-100-aids-researchers-and-activists-on-board-flight-mh17-9613821.html The nanothermite is strong in some here.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CornishChris 5 #70 July 20, 2014 The general response to this incident on here appears to me to be one of mild disbelief and in some cases dark humour. I see this as one of the most potentially volatile few days in recent history. Whilst what happened in Kyiv over the winter and the subsequent 'civil war' (if you can call it that), is easy for most countries, and more so people, to dismiss as another's business this accident makes it much more real and dangerous. IMO the sanctions levied on Russia were not necessarily harsh enough, especially considering historic promises some made to support the sovereignty of the Ukraine post disarmament. Now we are in a situation where it is clear to all but the most politically naive that Russian backed militia have shot down a civilian aircraft, albeit by mistake. This takes something that was 'their problem' and adds a death toll from many other countries. Yes it was an accident in a war zone rather than a deliberate terrorist action but the reprecussions will still be huge. Putin's typically arrogant response is not helping and the atmosphere in Europe is tense, to say the least. It's easy for Americans (who comprise the majority of users on this site) to be off hand about this but this level of risk has knock on effects. Russia is arguably the one country with the strength and idiocy to take you guys on... I'm back into news watching mode and think that this time that shit could get real messy not just in Ukraine/Russia, but potentially much further afield... CJP Gods don't kill people. People with Gods kill people Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rifleman 61 #71 July 20, 2014 No one is doubting that it's a potential flashpoint for world conflict and maybe that's what Putin's Russia is hoping for, but conspiracy theorists abound. I saw one the other day trying to draw links between MH370 and MH17 because of the pristine condition of passports found at the scene, the fact that 2 777's from the same airline have been lost in 4 months and the fact that according to flightradar24.com the MH17 flight was showing as cancelled on the day in question. It was a terrible (and possibly) criminal loss of life and if someone was responsible for those deaths then they should face the consequences of their actions.Atheism is a Non-Prophet Organisation Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StreetScooby 5 #72 July 20, 2014 Quote I see this as one of the most potentially volatile few days in recent history. There are many boiling hot spots around the world right now, IMO. Things can easily get out of hand, with significant repercussions to our way of life. Couple this with the fact that western democracies are losing their ability to fund their military (i.e., Britain is down to one aircraft carrier with no airplanes, and 14 dinghies ). It should be cause for great concern to all thinking people. Quote It's easy for Americans (who comprise the majority of users on this site) to be off hand about this but this level of risk has knock on effects. Russia is arguably the one country with the strength and idiocy to take you guys on... In addition, there's also the increasingly nationalistic Chinese, the ever insane Kim-worshiping North Koreans, the jew-hating Iranians who want to bring about conditions for the 12th imam, and the peaceful jihadists who are better funded by the day. Those are the ones that come to mind rather quickly. Outside of Obama's immediate circle, most people don't know the words to Kumbaya in this violent world that we actually live in. “We sleep soundly in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm.” -- Winston Churchill No truer words have ever been spoken. It's best we not lose sight of them, IMO.We are all engines of karma Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 3 #73 July 20, 2014 QuoteMalaysia Airlines Ukraine crash: Black box 'recovered' The black boxes belonging to the Malaysia Airlines jet crash in Ukraine have been recovered, according to a rebel leader. Alexander Borodai said the devices had been taken to Donetsk, the biggest rebel-held city in the east. The claim could not be verified independently. Source: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-28391773 Link includes footage of worker walking through field carrying what does indeed look like a flight data recorder.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1969912 0 #74 July 20, 2014 QuoteThere are many boiling hot spots around the world right now, IMO. Things can easily get out of hand, with significant repercussions to our way of life..... Good thing we have strong Presidential leadership "Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ." -NickDG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GeorgiaDon 340 #75 July 21, 2014 1969912QuoteThere are many boiling hot spots around the world right now, IMO. Things can easily get out of hand, with significant repercussions to our way of life..... Good thing we have strong Presidential leadershipNo doubt you'd prefer someone more like Putin. Don_____________________________________ Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996) “Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
