It's 2014...e-mails don't just get lost

[Stumpy 256]

rushmc

******Had this happened at any level when Bush was in office you would be howling until your hemorrhoids exploded!!!

Um... Not only did it happen under Bush, FAR more emails were lost.cool let's see it

How about 22 million emails.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bush_White_House_email_controversy

Your turn.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[rushmc 18]

if this was over the fired lawyers controversy, there is nothing to it

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Stumpy 256]

And there we have it folks. Denial - not just a river in Egypt.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[rushmc 18]

Stumpy

And there we have it folks. Denial - not just a river in Egypt.

if denial comes from looking at your posts I'm proud of it cuz you still got nothing

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Bertt 0]

5 years behind. Yeah, probably.
At one time in the not too distant past, Social Security had a computer system that took more than a month to run a monthly report. (that's not a joke)
But what do you think the IRS would say if they called you in for an audit and you told them you only keep records for 6 months?

You don't have to outrun the bear.

[Stumpy 256]

Bertt

5 years behind. Yeah, probably.
At one time in the not too distant past, Social Security had a computer system that took more than a month to run a monthly report. (that's not a joke)
But what do you think the IRS would say if they called you in for an audit and you told them you only keep records for 6 months?

Absolutely agree.I'm not making a judgement on the quality or lack thereof of the IRS email system, I just call it as I see it and its a very similar situation to many many companies and FED/SLED organisations we work with.
However there is usually a difference between emails and official financial records. I'm a bit rusty on this stuff but do the IRS want to go through 7 years of your old emails when they audit?

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[airdvr 200]

Stumpy

***5 years behind. Yeah, probably.
At one time in the not too distant past, Social Security had a computer system that took more than a month to run a monthly report. (that's not a joke)
But what do you think the IRS would say if they called you in for an audit and you told them you only keep records for 6 months?

Absolutely agree.I'm not making a judgement on the quality or lack thereof of the IRS email system, I just call it as I see it and its a very similar situation to many many companies and FED/SLED organisations we work with.
However there is usually a difference between emails and official financial records. I'm a bit rusty on this stuff but do the IRS want to go through 7 years of your old emails when they audit?

Still trying to pick that turd up by the clean end? I'm not sure why but please understand the IRS is the most fearsome collection machine ever invented. If you owe them money they will filet you without a thought. When you are in their sites they don't care about what you lost or why you don't have the proper documents. I speak from experience. They are ruthless and frigid and will bend you over and fuck you in the ass without even the courtesy of a reach-around.

So when they start targeting individual groups, be they conservative or liberal we should all sit up and take notice. For those of you who say its happened before; when you compare the Obama administration to those of W and Nixon you're not doing yourselves any favors.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[regulator 0]

I completely agree and speak from my own experience with the IRS from owing 11 grand in back taxes. I see all the time about people owing 100,000 in back taxes and only had to pay 15,000! Such a bunch of bullshit. I spend 7 grand on a tax lawyer to reduce the amount and the IRS told me that I can just pay it all back. The IRS on a whole are a heartless group and should not even REMOTELY be cut any fucking slack at all about this situation. And if there are any of you out there that seriously believe this evidence was 'accidentally lost' ....I've got a some land in southeast asia I would like to sell you.

[wayneflorida 0]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/05/26/irs-chief-defied-nixon/2360951/


"In the early 1970s, when embattled President Richard Nixon sought to use the Internal Revenue Service as a weapon to investigate his enemies, the administration turned to Walters, a Hartsville, S.C., native and head of the tax agency, to do the dirty work.

Walters, now 93, said he refused."

[rhaig 0]

tkhayes

So a more fundamental question....how does the country pay for the things that it needs (yes include the things that YOU think it needs) and then how do we collect those funds, if any?

national sales tax. Don't tax food items unless they're sold ready to be consumed. Don't tax clothing and home electronics/appliances during certain times of the year (once a quarter for instance). Drop all the write-offs and deductions.

States already collect sales tax. States already send money to the federal govt.

--
Rob

[DanG 1]

Quote

I completely agree and speak from my own experience with the IRS from owing 11 grand in back taxes. I see all the time about people owing 100,000 in back taxes and only had to pay 15,000! Such a bunch of bullshit. I spend 7 grand on a tax lawyer to reduce the amount and the IRS told me that I can just pay it all back.

You paid a lawyer $7,000 to reduce a $11,000 tax bill? How much did you think they were going to reduce it by?

- Dan G

[SkyDekker 1,150]

rhaig

***
So a more fundamental question....how does the country pay for the things that it needs (yes include the things that YOU think it needs) and then how do we collect those funds, if any?

national sales tax. Don't tax food items unless they're sold ready to be consumed. Don't tax clothing and home electronics/appliances during certain times of the year (once a quarter for instance). Drop all the write-offs and deductions.

States already collect sales tax. States already send money to the federal govt.

YES PLEASE!!!!!!!

This would be great for the retail market in Canada.

[quade 3]

rhaig

national sales tax.

It's not exactly a fair tax. It hits the low income earner at a vastly higher rate (percentage of income) than higher income earners.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Amazon 7]

quade

***national sales tax.

It's not exactly a fair tax. It hits the low income earner at a vastly higher rate (percentage of income) than higher income earners.

Well .... that is the point isn't it... We must protect our Oligarchs so they may trickle on us.

[airdvr 200]

quade

***national sales tax.

It's not exactly a fair tax. It hits the low income earner at a vastly higher rate (percentage of income) than higher income earners.

That thinking is exactly why we have the mess we have today. The "it's not fair" crowd .

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[aphid 0]

airdvr

Maybe they should check with NSA.

"A memory hole is any mechanism for the alteration or disappearance of inconvenient or embarrassing documents, photographs, transcripts, or other records, such as from a web site or other archive, particularly as part of an attempt to give the impression that something never happened. The concept was first popularized by George Orwell's dystopian novel Nineteen Eighty-Four where Big Brother's Ministry of Truth systematically re-created all potential historical documents, —in effect; re-writing all of history to match the often-changing state propaganda. These changes were complete and undetectable."

(source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_hole)

[rhaig 0]

quade

***national sales tax.

It's not exactly a fair tax. It hits the low income earner at a vastly higher rate (percentage of income) than higher income earners.

did you see the part about some items not being taxed? no... you didn't, or you chose to ignore them so you could trot out this old saw.

--
Rob

[normiss 634]

It's 2014....most transparent administration EVER...



my ass

[quade 3]

rhaig

******national sales tax.

It's not exactly a fair tax. It hits the low income earner at a vastly higher rate (percentage of income) than higher income earners.

did you see the part about some items not being taxed? no... you didn't, or you chose to ignore them so you could trot out this old saw.

You presume too much. Yes, I read what you wrote.

Even with your "except for food" bit, it still hits low incomes vastly harder than high incomes.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[rhaig 0]

quade

You presume too much. Yes, I read what you wrote.

Even with your "except for food" bit, it still hits low incomes vastly harder than high incomes.

so you're saying that taxing things that aren't necessary for life is going to cause an unnecessary burden?

With that provision, sales tax becomes essentially an optional tax. Don't want to pay it, then don't buy the things that are taxed. All the other necessities that I can think of already included federal tax on them. (fuel, communications)

Compare two families with monthly food budgets of $500 and $1500. The lower income family buys produce, uncooked meat, and spends 10% of their grocery budget on luxury foods. They prepare their meals at home. The wealthier family spends $800 at the grocery store and spends 25% of their grocery budget on luxury items. The other $700 is spent at restaurants. Assuming (for calculation simplicity) a 10% tax, the lower income family paid $5 in tax on groceries that month. The wealthier family pays $90 in tax on their groceries. For that to hit the lower income family harder, the wealthier family in this example would have more than 18 times the income of the other family.

--
Rob

[normiss 634]

"The lower income family buys produce, uncooked meat, and spends 10% of their grocery budget on luxury foods. They prepare their meals at home."

From all the data I've seen, this is very inaccurate.
Price out a freshly prepared meal with fresh fruits and veggies and then compare it to the 12 pack of Taco Bell tacos with drinks.

We have a serious flaw in our food supply when McDeath is the value meal of choice.

[rhaig 0]

normiss

"The lower income family buys produce, uncooked meat, and spends 10% of their grocery budget on luxury foods. They prepare their meals at home."

From all the data I've seen, this is very inaccurate.
Price out a freshly prepared meal with fresh fruits and veggies and then compare it to the 12 pack of Taco Bell tacos with drinks.

We have a serious flaw in our food supply when McDeath is the value meal of choice.

12 tacos for $10 at taco bell.

1.5lb ground beef $4.50
1 head lettuce $1.00
one Tomato $0.50
1 onion $0.50
assorted spices $0.50 (guess)
12 taco shells $2
total: $9

I don't see the problem here.

--
Rob

[PhreeZone 15]

Your prices are off a slight bit.


Ground beef prices are closer to 3.89 a pound nationally.
Lettuce is around $1 a head.
Tomatoes are about 1.75 a pound
Onions are about right since they are closer to .75 usually
Shells are 2.

My math shows its almost $6 for meat, 2.75 for veggies, and 2 for shells. Now add in the cheese since every taco needs cheese and also the sour cream and you are over $18-20 to make those same tacos.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[rhaig 0]

PhreeZone

Your prices are off a slight bit.


Ground beef prices are closer to 3.89 a pound nationally.
Lettuce is around $1 a head.
Tomatoes are about 1.75 a pound
Onions are about right since they are closer to .75 usually
Shells are 2.

My math shows its almost $6 for meat, 2.75 for veggies, and 2 for shells. Now add in the cheese since every taco needs cheese and also the sour cream and you are over $18-20 to make those same tacos.

I base prices off my grocery store. I won't dispute that price varies from your location or from national average. I pay $0.99 for a large tomato, and wouldn't use all of it on 12 tacos. I pay $2.89/lb of beef.

Do you really think there is a pound of tomatoes on 12 tacos? And I forgot the cheese. 12 tacos worth of shredded cheese is about a buck. (I can get pre-shredded cheese for $6 for almost 2lb)

Sour cream? Well, we're comparing to the taco bell dozen for $10. The taco supreme dozen is more. But you brought it up... I'd probably use 2/3 of an 8oz package of sour cream on 12 tacos. I don't buy them a lot, but they're about a buck and a quarter here. So call it $1 worth. There you go... I'm up to $10 now. And that's all beef. Not TVP like you'll get at taco bell.

And check your math. Even if I use your prices, 1.5*3.89+1+1.75+0.75+2+1+1 (last two are cheese and sour cream) that's $13.55, not $18-20.

--
Rob

[kelpdiver 2]

rhaig

***
You presume too much. Yes, I read what you wrote.

Even with your "except for food" bit, it still hits low incomes vastly harder than high incomes.

so you're saying that taxing things that aren't necessary for life is going to cause an unnecessary burden?


Is a car an unnecessary burden? Your 10% tax would add a couple grand to the cost. And the less rich are unlikely to pay cash and probably won't qualify for the 0.9% car loan I got last year, so that 2k over 6 years is now closer to 3k.

Short of a spending exemption, you either have to add so many exemptions that the sales tax has lost any meaning, or you have a regressive tax that is a nuisance to the well to do, and a serious blow to the lower class.

And to properly compare impact, you examine the additional tax burden as a percentage of discretionary income for each cohort.