Are you fat?

[wayneflorida 0]

"......Obesity fight must shift from personal blame-U.S. panel
In an ambitious 478-page report, the IOM refutes the idea that obesity is largely the result of a lack of willpower on the part of individuals. Instead, it embraces policy proposals that have met with stiff resistance from the food industry and lawmakers, arguing that multiple strategies will be needed."

Nothing that government courses (PT), taxes, fines,
and mandating 50% sawdust in food products can't fix.


http://news.yahoo.com/obesity-fight-must-shift-personal-blame-u-panel-123320915--sector.html

[lawrocket 3]

Both sides have a point. On the one hand, I've been obese and know how I got there. I got skinny and know how I got there. Now I'm medium build and know how I got there. There is a highly personal aspect to it.

But there's also a government aspect and policies that help obesity become an easier choice. For example, corn subsidies. It makes such things as high fructose corn syrup much less expensive to the consumer and producer. Therefore, products can be cheaply sweetened and inexpensively sold.

Beef subsidies are there. So are soy subsidies. Dairy subsidies. You name it.

And what we find is that the calorie dense, nutrient poor food products are less expensive. It IS quicker and easier to make a run by Wendy's for a meal.

What we are not seeing are policies ensure people are paying for what food actually costs. I understand that this is probably not the major reason for obesity but it is a contributor.

But my main beef with this (pun intended) is that arguments over obesity and such are centered around the costs to society and healthcare. Ever notice that the fattening of America roughly coincides with the socialization of America? Why worry about diabetes and the like if society will pay for it? It's an individual cost/benefit analysis where the cost is spread and the benefit is focused.

The problem with health care costs isn't health - it's socialism. What I do to my body is nobody else's damned business. And what you do to yours isn't mine, either. Meaning that I'll pay for mine and you'll pay for yours.

Obesity isn't a problem in a free society. It's a problem that takes care of itself, like smoking and alcoholism.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[kallend 1,647]

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Both sides have a point. On the one hand, I've been obese and know how I got there. I got skinny and know how I got there. Now I'm medium build and know how I got there. There is a highly personal aspect to it.

But there's also a government aspect and policies that help obesity become an easier choice. For example, corn subsidies. It makes such things as high fructose corn syrup much less expensive to the consumer and producer. Therefore, products can be cheaply sweetened and inexpensively sold.

Beef subsidies are there. So are soy subsidies. Dairy subsidies. You name it.

And what we find is that the calorie dense, nutrient poor food products are less expensive. It IS quicker and easier to make a run by Wendy's for a meal.

What we are not seeing are policies ensure people are paying for what food actually costs. I understand that this is probably not the major reason for obesity but it is a contributor.

But my main beef with this (pun intended) is that arguments over obesity and such are centered around the costs to society and healthcare. Ever notice that the fattening of America roughly coincides with the socialization of America? Why worry about diabetes and the like if society will pay for it? It's an individual cost/benefit analysis where the cost is spread and the benefit is focused.

The problem with health care costs isn't health - it's socialism. What I do to my body is nobody else's damned business. And what you do to yours isn't mine, either. Meaning that I'll pay for mine and you'll pay for yours.

Obesity isn't a problem in a free society. It's a problem that takes care of itself, like smoking and alcoholism.

Nice diatribe, but we don't actually have socialized healthcare in the USA.

My BMI is 21. I can eat for a week on $30 if I eat at home. I think the "bad food is cheaper" argument is bunk. Just eat less, take the stairs instead of the elevator, and don't circle the parking lot waiting for the closest parking space to become available.

I know several overweight women who claim that they eat very little and claim "it's my metabolism", but when I've dined with them I notice that they eat more than I do.

Fat bastards.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[wmw999 2,147]

Just as some people don't have a realistic view of what they actually look like (both on the fat and the skinny side), others don't have a realistic view of what they actually eat.

And just as some people seem to fall into alcoholism easily, others seem to fall into overeating easily.

It's a multi-piece problem. But if crap food isn't as available, and crap activities are less attractive, people who follow the easiest path through life (which is a large number) will start weighing less. That leaves the people with serious problems (i.e. who really do have metabolism problems, or are seriously addicted to eating) as a smaller minority.

Not making excuses; just stating what I see. Kids don't play outdoors any more, people won't live without A/C (even in New England!), families don't play croquet any more. Computers and TV have taken a lot of that. WTF do you expect when activity levels have gone down, and opportunities for eating have gone up? It's a whole lot harder to snack on chips when you're playing outdoors than when you're playing Nintendo or whatever.

And those habits become lifetime ones.

Note: My BMI is NOT 21 (and has very rarely gotten there). It's generally between 24 and 26, on the upper edge, to just past, the level between normal and overweight. Such is life. I exercise, and I enjoy eating. When I'm busy, I eat less and do more; when I don't have enough to do, it goes the other way.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[weekender 0]

>Not making excuses; just stating what I see. Kids don't play outdoors any more, people won't live without A/C (even in New England!), families don't play croquet any more. Computers and TV have taken a lot of that. WTF do you expect when activity levels have gone down, and opportunities for eating have gone up? It's a whole lot harder to snack on chips when you're playing outdoors than when you're playing Nintendo or whatever.

i see the same thing as you. Kids do not move as much.

AC is a big one to me. when i was a kid my family, solid middle class, ran the AC only when my dad decided it was impossible to sleep. we were not abnormal to my childhood friends families. People use to eat less in the summer because its an appetite suppressant to be warm. Today, you can see AC units hanging out the windows of the worse housing projects. they are very affortable.

I dont want the poor to be hot and unhappy. I just believe AC is a factor in gaining weight. Why go outside and sweat when you can sit in an AC'd room and play video games. expecially if your poor and the local park is concrete and a mess.

"The point is, I'm weird, but I never felt weird."
John Frusciante

[kelpdiver 2]

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But my main beef with this (pun intended) is that arguments over obesity and such are centered around the costs to society and healthcare. Ever notice that the fattening of America roughly coincides with the socialization of America? Why worry about diabetes and the like if society will pay for it? It's an individual cost/benefit analysis where the cost is spread and the benefit is focused.

It coincided with a lot of factors, some already named. You're concluding this factor is the key one, but your argument isn't compelling. Being fat, having diabetes ... these aren't free rides. Despite the widespread obesity, it still harms your social life, your work, your lifestyle. Not having to pay an extra $100/mo for health care doesn't make this find and dandy. Having your heart surgery paid for keeps you from going broke, but it's still nothing anyone would volunteer for, or want to have experienced in hindsight.

Other factors emerging in the 70s and 80s.
1- the video game, as mentioned by Wendy. Huge change as kids now play virtual sports instead of real ones
2- helicopter parents who don't let their kids play outside or take any real risk (which then goes back to #1 - they can have virtual adventures!)
3- kids follow their parents' example. The first generation spawned a much bigger second generation.
4- loss of serious PE in school, driven by many factors (budget, test taking, more material to cover) No longer makes up for parent neglect.
5- Corn syrup - I blame this more than most, but maybe I just don't like the taste.
6- "low fat" foods. Stuffed with corn syrup or maltodextrin, the low fat items tended to have just as many calories, but foolish would be dieters ate more of it.
7- the Value Meal and the Double Gulp. Capitalism at its finest. Offering you 50% more for just an extra 59 cents was great for the bottom line, but lousy for the waistline. And Americans are suckers for quantity over quality.

-----
It has gotten to the point where government intervention needs to be very openly debated. The First Lady is doing as good a job as Arnold did in the 80s, but that's not nearly enough.

BTW, BMI is a joke, and part of the problem. Focus should be on fitness and lean muscle mass (vs body fat), not simple weight, which leads to all sorts of dietary problems.

[shah269 0]

You know my thoughts on fat chicks and chubby ass engineers.....
I'll just shut up

Life through good thoughts, good words, and good deeds is necessary to ensure happiness and to keep chaos at bay.

The only thing that falls from the sky is birdshit and fools!

[DiverMike 5]

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BTW, BMI is a joke, and part of the problem.

I find BMI annoying. At 5'9 170 lbs I am considered 'overweight' even though I have a 32 in waist and the 'mass' that puts me overweight is muscle.

For the same reason I jump off a perfectly good diving board.

[shah269 0]

You know what i love about being with big American women....
When you put your hand on their waist and you feel the fat just roll over the top of their pants...like an explosion of fat / lava....falava....

And when you brush their hair back to kiss the back of their neck while you are spooning them as if they were some sea mammal....that hump thing they develop between their shoulders....like a back tit...not sure what it is....but all you want to do is either pop it start sucking on it like it were a tit!

Or when they are standing naked in front of you and bend over to pick something up.....her thighs, knees, calves and ankles touch and form a wall of thighs from tank ass to now sagging floor joist.

Yeah the future looks good for dating for only the engineers who will walk right past an athletic sexy African American woman to talk to some thick thighed thing putting away a box of crispy cream!

Life through good thoughts, good words, and good deeds is necessary to ensure happiness and to keep chaos at bay.

The only thing that falls from the sky is birdshit and fools!

[ryoder 1,398]

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You know my thoughts on fat chicks and chubby ass engineers.....
I'll just shut up

So promising;Then he blows it in the next post.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[linebckr83 3]

I agree. At 6'2" and 220lbs, mine is 28.2 which is overweight bordering obese. The "medical recommendation" for me is 148-195lbs. 148? That was 8 years ago.

Last summer I was much heavier. Just graduated college, got a desk job as an engineer, living on my own eating all the worst foods and never doing anything active. I believe it when some people say fast food can be addictive. It was tough never having energy, always getting tired and never wanting to go out and enjoy summer weather.

Since then I've lost 30lbs, workout most days of the week if I'm not already doing something, and practice a strict calorie deficient diet. With 12% body fat, I really really doubt I'm at an unhealthy weight. Most of it is muscle, which makes the bmi scale useless.

I don't know what groceries cost me last year when I was usually just going to taco bell or pizza hut anyways, but it wasn't near as much as what good food costs nowadays. I see it in everything I buy. The ramen noodle or spaghetti-o's route is much cheaper and easier than cooking a fancy chicken dinner.

So according to the bmi scale, yes I'm fat. According to my doctor, family, friends and the mirror, no I'm not.

"Are you coming to the party?
Oh I'm coming, but I won't be there!"
Flying Hellfish #828
Dudist #52

[mirage62 0]

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Fat bastards.

Skinny prick

Remind me to crush you like the little wormy insect you are next time we jump together.

Kevin Keenan is my hero, a double FUP, he does so much with so little

[Zenister 0]

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Just eat less, take the stairs instead of the elevator, and don't circle the parking lot waiting for the closest parking space to become available.

I know several overweight women who claim that they eat very little and claim "it's my metabolism", but when I've dined with them I notice that they eat more than I do.

Fat bastards.

This. The one thing I do agree that the government should do is mandate calorie count information on menus. Even if its not 100% accurate it is incredibly helpful with weight management. I'll skimp on my lunch/dinner calories when I know I going to a beer tasting later... knowing (roughly) how much I'm eating helps moderate.

is/was turning into a fat bastard himself lately

____________________________________
Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[kallend 1,647]

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Fat bastards.

Skinny prick

Remind me to crush you like the little wormy insect you are next time we jump together.

You'll never catch me, fatso.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[linebckr83 3]

If I notice myself gaining a couple pounds slowly, I'll use MyFitnessPal to moniter what I'm eating. It's always surprising to see what I really eat even when I think I'm doing good. Hell, if you get religious about doing a food diary like that, you never want fast food because it sucks so much to log it!

That website has almost every food from every restaurant in its database. But I agree, when people really see how bad that mcChicken and fries really are, it's a little easier to say no.

"Are you coming to the party?
Oh I'm coming, but I won't be there!"
Flying Hellfish #828
Dudist #52

[kelpdiver 2]

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You'll never catch me, fatso.

?? He's got a higher terminal velocity than you.

[kelpdiver 2]

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This. The one thing I do agree that the government should do is mandate calorie count information on menus. Even if its not 100% accurate it is incredibly helpful with weight management.

This is one of the more interesting potential mandates already being done in varied degrees based on the item and the jurisdiction. I feel for the restaurants that constantly change their menu - this is a bit of effort. And I worry that they may be held accountable to an unjust level for inaccuracies when they made a good faith effort. But it is quite startling to realize the calorie contents of common fast food items, or even larger coffee drinks. Often this data can be found, but when it's up there on the menu right next to the price it certainly will drive people away from the shakes and super sizings.

Compared to the proposals around soda or junk food taxes, or other mandatory actions, this one should be more palatable, save to the donut shops. Personally I'm interested in actions that increase the weekly physical activity for Americans, but thus far I'm unable to devise a process that is meaningful, effective, and not just intrusive.

[wmw999 2,147]

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7- the Value Meal and the Double Gulp.

This is a biggie. One of the most powerful food/health posters I saw was one called Portion Distortion. Really drives home what we think we're eating vs. what we're actually eating.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[kallend 1,647]

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You'll never catch me, fatso.

?? He's got a higher terminal velocity than you.

Unproven, but I notice I'm always behind him in the line up at big ways. You know, where they put the faster divers.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[mirage62 0]

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but I notice I'm always behind him in the line up at big ways. You know, where they put the faster divers.

Bullshit you put the people in the back that can't handle having people in front of them and behind them.... any thought the it takes high skill to dock late is made up by skinny pricks.....

Pretty soon you'll want me to use a seperate bathroom

Kevin Keenan is my hero, a double FUP, he does so much with so little

[Marinus 0]

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But my main beef with this (pun intended) is that arguments over obesity and such are centered around the costs to society and healthcare. Ever notice that the fattening of America roughly coincides with the socialization of America? Why worry about diabetes and the like if society will pay for it? It's an individual cost/benefit analysis where the cost is spread and the benefit is focused.

This would mean that Scandinavians would have a giant obesity problem. They don't, because your argument is nonsensical. There is no correlation between socialization of health care and obesity.

[mnealtx 0]

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But my main beef with this (pun intended) is that arguments over obesity and such are centered around the costs to society and healthcare. Ever notice that the fattening of America roughly coincides with the socialization of America? Why worry about diabetes and the like if society will pay for it? It's an individual cost/benefit analysis where the cost is spread and the benefit is focused.

This would mean that Scandinavians would have a giant obesity problem. They don't, because your argument is nonsensical. There is no correlation between socialization of health care and obesity.

I must have missed where he blamed it on socialized medicine - can you highlight it in his post for me?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Fearjoburg 0]

I recently took up bodybuilding at the local mcdonalds to work on my AAD. (automatic arching device)

[mnealtx 0]

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I recently took up bodybuilding at the local mcdonalds to work on my AAD. (automatic arching device)

How's that working out for ya?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Marinus 0]

Well, obesity is mainly a medical issue if you look at the financial side of it, so why wouldn't I talk about the medical socialization. However lawrocket is free to proof to us that countries which are relatively socialistic have the fattest citizens. Not that he would be able to.....