There IS a problem with global warming... it stopped in 1998

[DJL 232]

32 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

Yes I get that, but I also get that the glaciers have been shrinking for the last several hundred years, long before this AGW nonsense.  My contention is that it is part of a natural cycle. If the climate were responding to the input of CO2, the glaciers would have been gone by 2020, just like the models predicted, they didn't and the models were/are WRONG.

Page 75.  This is the ebb and flow of glaciers for the last 2000 years.  Upwards means retreating, downwards means expanding.  1st the majority of the track downwards over the last 2000 years meaning that they were getting larger, not smaller as you've said above.  Now look at the band all the way to the right and you'll see that almost ALL of the glaciers retreat simultaneously.  Look at any other band and you won't find as well sychronized of a move towards retreating.  Now look at page 76, another graphic.  En mass they're headed toward expanding/advancing until around 1800 and the trend entirely falls off.

Now, according to your OWN WORDS???  Any thoughts on this?

https://www.whoi.edu/cms/files/solomina16qsr_238964.pdf

[DJL 232]

4 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

I am just restating what the park service said on its placard.

AND>>>>>>>   There are 11 bodies at Glacier National Park where that placard is posted that are no longer considered glaciers because they don't move anymore and are not growing.

[turtlespeed 212]

1 hour ago, brenthutch said:

What are you talking about???

I am just restating what the park service said on its placard.

The glaciers in question, did not come into existence until 7000 years ago.  Fact

The glaciers have been melting for the past several hundred years.  Fact

Climate models predicted the glaciers would be gone by 2020.  Fact

The glaciers are still here.  Fact

The climate models were wrong. Fact

How is that trolling? 

Did you miss where the glaciers reached their maximum number and size in 1850?

That kinda dismisses your notion of them melting and declining for the past several hundred years.

Doncha think?

 

[mistercwood 287]

It's well established that Brent will never listen to reason on this specific topic, but this might be of use to others as a neat illustration when debating the "iT wAs wArMeR iN tHe pAsT" brigade:

https://xkcd.com/1732/

[brenthutch 383]

8 hours ago, DJL said:

Page 75.  This is the ebb and flow of glaciers for the last 2000 years.  Upwards means retreating, downwards means expanding.  1st the majority of the track downwards over the last 2000 years meaning that they were getting larger, not smaller as you've said above.  Now look at the band all the way to the right and you'll see that almost ALL of the glaciers retreat simultaneously.  Look at any other band and you won't find as well sychronized of a move towards retreating.  Now look at page 76, another graphic.  En mass they're headed toward expanding/advancing until around 1800 and the trend entirely falls off.

Now, according to your OWN WORDS???  Any thoughts on this?

https://www.whoi.edu/cms/files/solomina16qsr_238964.pdf

It reinforces what I have been saying, the ebb and flow of the worlds climate/glaciation/sea level, are natural phenomenon that are occurring now and have occurred in the past.  The notion that we can somehow control it is a fools errand.    

[brenthutch 383]

1 hour ago, mistercwood said:

It's well established that Brent will never listen to reason on this specific topic, but this might be of use to others as a neat illustration when debating the "iT wAs wArMeR iN tHe pAsT" brigade:

https://xkcd.com/1732/

Cartoons, nice.  So we are no warmer than we were 7000 years ago. (which what I have been saying (but thanks for the backup))  The projections are just guesses.

From your source:  warm = stable = optimum 

Edited May 5, 2020 by brenthutch

[mistercwood 287]

2 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

Cartoons, nice.

Everything in it is factual.

[brenthutch 383]

27 minutes ago, mistercwood said:

Everything in it is factual.

Projections are factual????

[mistercwood 287]

1 hour ago, brenthutch said:

Projections are factual????

You're not this dumb.

EDIT: I just saw your earlier edit, missed it before. I retract my generous assertion.

Edited May 5, 2020 by mistercwood

[brenthutch 383]

9 hours ago, mistercwood said:

Everything in it is factual.

Northwest Passage opens?  Open to dog sleds maybe.

"The Northwest Passage is not expected to become a viable trans-Arctic route through 2020 "

http://www.arctis-search.com/2020+Future+Scenario+for+the+Northwest+Passage

Edited May 5, 2020 by brenthutch

[turtlespeed 212]

10 hours ago, brenthutch said:

It reinforces what I have been saying, the ebb and flow of the worlds climate/glaciation/sea level, are natural phenomenon that are occurring now and have occurred in the past.  The notion that we can somehow control it is a fools errand.    

Control it?  Probably not completely.  Not yet, anyway.

Affect it in a negative way - Absolutely.  That has already been done.  Even you, in your own words, admit that much, grudgingly so.

Affect it further in the future if we don't do anything? Absolutely! This is BEING done!  This is where we are now, and that is thanks, mostly to large industry, countries like China, second and third world countries, with their greed, and deniers like you , and until recently, me.

Together, though, we can slow it, and possibly reverse some of the damage.

Its time to wake up, Brent.

[brenthutch 383]

18 minutes ago, turtlespeed said:

Control it?  Probably not completely.  Not yet, anyway.

Affect it in a negative way - Absolutely.  That has already been done.  Even you, in your own words, admit that much, grudgingly so.

Affect it further in the future if we don't do anything? Absolutely! This is BEING done!  

 Nothing is being done.  

CO2 levels are rising and will continue to rise, there is nothing you or I or the United States or the EU can do about it.  That is just the cold hard facthttps://www.co2.earth/daily-co2 Even with the world economy crippled by COVID 19, CO2 levels are greater today than they were a year ago.  China and India are building thousands of coal fired power plants and the US is just replacing coal with natural gas.  The entire Western civilization could disappear overnight and CO2 will just continue to rise.  

[Coreece 190]

39 minutes ago, turtlespeed said:

This is where we are now, and that is thanks, mostly to large industry, countries like China, second and third world countries, with their greed, and deniers like you , and until recently, me.

That's only because a warming climate is likely to produce more female turtles, and we all know how misogynistic you are!

[DJL 232]

11 hours ago, brenthutch said:

It reinforces what I have been saying, the ebb and flow of the worlds climate/glaciation/sea level, are natural phenomenon that are occurring now and have occurred in the past.  The notion that we can somehow control it is a fools errand.    

Except it says the opposite of that.  You're trolling.  It shows them coming and going at a random rate but overall in a trend of increasing in volume.  And then all of a sudden they ALL SIMULTANEOUSLY SHRINK.  Again.  Graphic.  Page 76.

Edited May 5, 2020 by DJL

[kallend 1,623]

54 minutes ago, DJL said:

Except it says the opposite of that.  You're trolling

Trolling?  Oh the humanity!  I am shocked, SHOCKED!

[brenthutch 383]

1 hour ago, DJL said:

Except it says the opposite of that.  You're trolling.  It shows them coming and going at a random rate but overall in a trend of increasing in volume.  And then all of a sudden they ALL SIMULTANEOUSLY SHRINK.  Again.  Graphic.  Page 76.

“the view that the Little Ice Age was a period of global glacier expansion beginning in the 13th century (or earlier) and reaching a maximum in 17the19th centuries is supported by our data.”

before they simultaneously shrank, they simultaneously grew.  Though I understand they are attributing the recent decline to AGW.  

That said, replacing a lifeless bulldozer of ice with a beautiful alpine meadow is ok in my book

Edited May 5, 2020 by brenthutch

[DJL 232]

3 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

“the view that the Little Ice Age was a period of global glacier expansion beginning in the 13th century (or earlier) and reaching a maximum in 17the19th centuries is supported by our data.”

before they simultaneously shrank, they simultaneously grew.  Though I understand they are attributing the recent decline to AGW.  

And you have a more accurate or better explanation than the people who study this professionally?

[kallend 1,623]

5 minutes ago, DJL said:

And you have a more accurate or better explanation than the people who study this professionally?

He's a poster child for Drs. Dunning and Kruger.

[airdvr 197]

You can't tell them their God doesn't exist...it's useless.  The new Green order is taking over and there isn't anything you can do about it.

[DJL 232]

Just now, airdvr said:

You can't tell them their God doesn't exist...it's useless.  The new Green order is taking over and there isn't anything you can do about it.

You have to resort to God in the face of data and facts?  Kind of reaching, aren't you?  If your point of view is only supported by your feelings and wants then isn't it you who is clutching to a religion?  It's like some sort of Monty Python sketch with you two and you're figuring out whether to burn a witch.

[turtlespeed 212]

6 minutes ago, DJL said:

You have to resort to God in the face of data and facts?  Kind of reaching, aren't you?  If your point of view is only supported by your feelings and wants then isn't it you who is clutching to a religion?  It's like some sort of Monty Python sketch with you two and you're figuring out whether to burn a witch.

Duck.

Billvon.

Damn Doode - you trying to burn Bill?

[DJL 232]

14 minutes ago, turtlespeed said:

Duck.

Billvon.

Damn Doode - you trying to burn Bill?

We'll build a bridge out of him.

[turtlespeed 212]

2 minutes ago, DJL said:

We'll build a bridge out of him.

 

6 minutes ago, DJL said:

We'll build a bridge out of him.

Weight!  You can do that with stone too!

[billvon 2,400]

4 hours ago, airdvr said:

You can't tell them their God doesn't exist...it's useless.  The new Green order is taking over and there isn't anything you can do about it.

Funny that you are claiming that climate science is some sort of religion - and you are posting in a thread where a climate change denier fervently believes that climate change ended in 1998.  

It's understandable I guess.  Changing your tune just because the climate keeps warming would be . . . what's the term for it?  . . . heresy.

[airdvr 197]

7 hours ago, billvon said:

Funny that you are claiming that climate science is some sort of religion - and you are posting in a thread where a climate change denier fervently believes that climate change ended in 1998.  

It's understandable I guess.  Changing your tune just because the climate keeps warming would be . . . what's the term for it?  . . . heresy.

Simply pointing out the futility.