AggieDave 6 #76 January 24, 2002 Sudsy-fist and mnischalke:Thanks for your reply, I was off a bit this morning too, I think the PT this morning had put me in a bad mood (it was a hell of a run, thoughThank you for the apologies, too. They weren't really needed, but much appreciated. The online community we have here may not be perfect, but it is overall a great group of people with wildly differing opinions on everything. What's great, though is even after a honest to god arguement, people walk away ok with each other. Sort of like a weekend at the DZ...Gig'em Ags, Blue Skies and Semper Fi!Success is how high you bounce when you hit bottom.-General George Patton- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyhawk 2 #77 January 24, 2002 its good it didnt turn out like my "wigga" post ages ago (and no we dont wont to bring that up again :) ) misconception on the internet is a bitch isnt it.While i think war is bad , im still going to join the army though :-) it is a part if almost all of the cultures in the world we have been doen it all through history the cave man did it to to getting more land to expand and more resources, then the egyptions for land power and wealth as well as the romans, the crusades where for the same reasons under the disguise of religion while we are entering a new form of war i.e distroying an enemy without taking land and wealth etc it will continue for the rest of our life times and probably forever as the world gets smaller we will look for land yet again and restart the cycle on other planets that beeing suitible for us to live on no doubtr have some form of life.war is bad, destructive and leaves most ppl hurt either physicaly or mentally while we should try to sort things out diplomaticly sometimes it just doesnt work for whatever reason eg terrorists and we resort to what we do naturally, thats fight. ive got lots more to say but i dont wanna bore you :)(o)(o) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thrillseek 0 #78 January 24, 2002 Re: Black Hawk Down-- I haven't seen the movie, but i was there. Frankly, it was the worst day in my life. I hope to never re-live that again, whether in real life or on the silver screen. honestly, i wish hollywood would stop making a profit out of our nation's most trying times. And to the theater commander for that operation, who denied us air support due to a concern for collateral damage, god help you if this ranger ever meets you in a dark alley. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
raver1 0 #79 January 24, 2002 So, uh, back to the movie... was the Eric Banna's american accent really anooying? I havent seen the movie yet, but as an aussie I know that local actors usually do crap yank accents.Hey, waddya know, my first post!CheersRavs Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
raver1 0 #80 January 24, 2002 hehe sorry I should check my spelling!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyhawk 2 #81 January 24, 2002 shee dont tell them the aussie invasion is meant to be a surprise :)(o)(o) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #82 January 24, 2002 "And to the theater commander for that operation, who denied us air support due to a concern for collateral damage"Yeah...ya know that's one question I never really asked anyone. I know that there was at least 1 Romad, 2 CCT, and 1 PJ that were SOTACs. (Special Operations Tactical Air Controllers) Plus the Delta guys I know have at least some training on controlling Close Air Support. (I've done range safety for them on an AC-130 shoot) They had the means and training(Of varying skill levels) to bring in fighters. I know personally that I could have wiped out that entire mob in a matter of 15 or 20 minutes(AT MOST). Then subsequently dropped CBU 97's to make sure no one else could have even gotten close to that force. I never asked that question of the guys that were there. Was the request made? At what level was it denied? I wouldn't be shocked to hear that it was denied. I still have a briefing card from Kosovo that requires no less than the Unit commander (Say company or BN commander initials) then the BDE, and so on all the up to "Red Dawg" CINC command in Italy. I thought that shit was rediculous and I'm really glad no real shooting(on the ground) went on there. The response times would have sucked and I never wanted to do "The Auddie Murphy thing on the radio" like one of my friends in Desert Storm!!!"I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thrillseek 0 #83 January 24, 2002 requests were repeatedly made and were repeatedly denied. such is life in the military, i guess. BOHICA! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #84 January 24, 2002 "requests were repeatedly made and were repeatedly denied"Man...that really sucks. Thats what was wrong with the entire operation. Hell, they had requested armor support prior to going in and didn't get that either. Fuckin Clinton administration!!! I've sure seen it happen though. A friend in Desert Storm held his mike out the top of his track so the REMF working the ASOC (Air Support Operations Center; Sends CAS aircraft forward) could hear the artillery rounds taking out the commanders tank. They new who was shooting at them and this dingleberry kept telling him he didn't have "Priority of Fire" Luckily another ROMAD flying on an ABCCC (Airborne Command Post) heard the radio calls and figured out he owned that kill box and not the ASOC. My buddy had fighters on station within 3 minutes and made short work of the jerkies shooting at them. He was an E-3 at the time..LOL "I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bill2 0 #85 January 24, 2002 "The psychological cost is born by our soldiers...the blame belongs to all of us"Thank you! That's probably the worst part. I don't think the average person even has close to a clue what that "cost" is. I've seen it and it's not pretty. Some handle it better than others but it's definately baggage that they will carry for the rest of their lives. ________________________________________Very true, both of you. Time magazine did a story, in the 70's I think, about war heroes and how they were in civilian life. It was prompted by a guy from Detroit getting the Medal of Honor in Vietnam for killing 50 - 60 guys in a very short period of time while charging several machine gun nests, one after another. Two years after getting out, he was killed while trying to rob a grocery store. The article went on to list similar happpenings. I'm not saying that all heroes are scum,just that their life stories are more complicated than the general public wants to believe, and that war can have a negative effect psychologically on many people. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #86 January 24, 2002 "Two years after getting out, he was killed while trying to rob a grocery store."I have an award in a box somewhere. It's the highest award you can get in the USAF Airman leadership school. (PLDC for you Army guys) and it's named after John Levitow, MOH winner in Vietnam. This guy was a complete loser and alcoholic after getting out of the Air Force. Well....the AF fixed that. They started paying him a pretty decent salary to go around giving speeches at AF functions. I guess it really helped him be something besides a bum and as far as I know he's sober now and makes about 50K a year. "I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymonkey 0 #87 January 25, 2002 "There were atleast 1 Romad, 2 CCT, and 1 PJ"Actually the fact is that there were 2 PJ's (Tim Wikinson, and Scotty Fales). These were the guys that in the movie were in the helo the whole time with the steel saw and all. The fact is Fales and Wilki both got hit and eneded up with the Rangers in that room treating casualties for most of the night. As a matter of fact Wilkinson was the one who treated Rodriguez 2 Controllers (Bray and Schilling) Bray roped in with the boys, and Schilling was with the convoy. Never heard about any TACP. Not to knock on TACP, but around that time the only Romads in the spec ops community were from JCU and they were not kicking doors. The only SOTAC's were the CCT guys. The PJ's were only there in a CSAR role as medics.I've actually heard the story from Wilki's perspective himself over some beers. Sure beat the book or the movie. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #88 January 25, 2002 Thats why I put the "At least" disclaimer on there. I couldn't remember all the people there. I do know that Chris Huneke was with the convoy and did lots of shooting. I worked for him when I first got to Bragg. As I heard the story "As usual" the CCT/PJ guys showed up at the last minute (While the rotor blades were turning and DEMANDED to be let on the mission. The ROMADs that were there kinda shrugged their shoulders and said "You go right ahead" Remember this was like the 7th or more time they had done this Op in recent weeks so as far as anyone knew at that point it was going to be another boring helicopter ride. "but around that time the only Romads in the spec ops community were from JCU and they were not kicking doors"Not true at all. The Ranger slots have been there for many years. I know guys that were doing Ranger assignments way back in the early 80's. Now the assignments to SF groups didn't come about until Desert Storm when they did it as an emergency measure and it worked so well that the SF requested it be permanent. "I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,122 #89 January 25, 2002 ok, ok, I am really tryingt o follow this story, because I am definitely interested in it, but someone needs to explain some things to me, especially those damn acronyms:Quote1 Romad, 2 CCT, and 1 PJ, TACP, SOTAC"We cannot do great things, only small things with great love" Mother Theresa Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #90 January 25, 2002 "1 Romad, 2 CCT, and 1 PJ, TACP, SOTAC"Romad- A Forward Air Controller...The only Enlisted people in the world that have the primary job of controlling Close Air Support. They control Fighters dropping bombs when they are near ground troops.CCT- Combat Control Teams. Special Ops Air Force guys that have the Primary job of controlling Airlift planes dropping troops and supplies and landing in forward areas. PJ- Air Force Pararescueman. Their Primary job is saving downed pilots. Highly qualified combat medics and very close to being a Physicians Assistant qualified.TACP- See ROMAD....Stands for Tactical Air Control Party which includes some officers and maint personnel also for support.SOTAC- Special Ops Tactical Air Controller....Once a ROMAD trains a CCT/PJ/Special Forces/Ninjas whatever they go through some checkride evaluations (Like a pilot checkride) and are officially signed of to control air strikes...WHEW!!!! Are you on the boat now....LOL See the link a few posts back or just go to www.romad.com to find out more about ROMADs. Most people don't know who they are. Even a lot of people that should..."I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #91 January 25, 2002 QuoteNinjas Yeah, the DOD ninja squad, man those guys rock. Sneak in, slice up the bad guys, do some flips and stuff. Well, we had to have something to counter the super secret Communist Nazi Russian Ninja (CNRN, pronounced K-nern) during the Cold War. So now they basically sneak around trying to fend off the invasion of Boy Bands, although they are finding this enemy to be quite diffucult, since they have their own huge armies of screaming 14 year old girls...(I guess it's one of those days, too much whiskey last night combined with PT this morning and class...mix and serve sarcasticly)Success is how high you bounce when you hit bottom.-General George Patton- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #92 January 25, 2002 "Communist Nazi Russian Ninja (CNRN, pronounced K-nern)"ROFTLMAO!! Well..I've just gotten a little put off in the past by everyone and their mother claiming to be so damn special and "High Speed" I don't think you get much more secret or special than the Delta teams and we see what CAN happen. They have had great success in the past..Panama/Peru/ many others...But this claiming to be superman shit just pisses me off. Often times it's pretty low speed units doing all the claiming too. Thats even worse.....In the immortal words of Arnold "If it bleeds.....We can kill it!""I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #93 January 25, 2002 We need a Celeberty Death Match between all the Spec-Ops...a regular alphabet soup of distruction. We could throw in some of the "non-military" ones too, maybe a couple of the "militias" and an action hero to make it all work. Oh, we need the A-Team too, or atleast Mr. T. That would be a great episode.Strangely enough, I've read quite a bit about some of the more popular Spec-Ops groups, and I did see a lot of that from the second hand knowledge that I gained. Don't have any first hand, but you use what you got, right? It did sort of humor me that each group hated the other groups and thought that *they* and only they were the supergrade-god-of-war. (ahhh, Marchinko?)(gotta run, damn class)Success is how high you bounce when you hit bottom.-General George Patton- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #94 January 25, 2002 "ahhh, Marchinko"He's definately a culprit because of the books....Met him once and he seemed like a nice guy. *Shrug* I think those books started the "Fake SEAL" phenomenon...Celebrity Death match!!!!! Thats great!!!"I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
indyz 1 #95 January 25, 2002 QuoteWe need a Celeberty Death Match between all the Spec-OpsThe USA network runs a show called "Combat Missions." Different special forces teams (bunch of different military, SWAT, HRT) go head-to-head in simulated combat. From the commercials it looks like they pretty much just run around in MILES gear playing capture the flag. It's hosted by Rudy from the first Survivor, but since the show is on USA they probably made him clean up his language.--BrianHomepage Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #96 January 25, 2002 "Combat Missions." I change the channel every time that damn commercial comes on. Talk about annoying!"but since the show is on USA they probably made him clean up his language."He is kinda a crusty old bastard isn't he....."I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnischalke 0 #97 January 25, 2002 Oh yea, back in the Trang...mud all over my tigerstripe cammies...with gook blood flowing down the blade of my battle knife, I called in an B2 airstrike...the AC-130 was cutting through the huts and I was like "Charlie Mike Mike, This is Alpha Bravo. Chech your fire, Over."...Charlie and about 20 of his friends were running right at me and I yelled "Hoooaaaah, Gung Ho Gung Ho." I let em all have it with my GE mini gun...I was screaming, "medic, medic!!" and I notice he was shot too, so, since I only had two bullet wounds in my leg and a little shrapnel in my shoulder, I carried my seal buddy and him outta there because that's our motto "leave no man behind."...Yeah, President Kennedy was really a nice guy. He said, "Sir, for your bravery and anal fortitude, I am pleased to award you with the Medal of Honor."...Well, I wear my ribbons on my cammie blouse when I go to gun shows because the Secretary of the Navy authorized it for me...I got to SEAL Team 2 just as Colonel Boesch, you know, Rudy from Survivor, was leaving...I was going to get on that Combat Missions show, but I couldn't tell them about any of the missions I had been on since they are all classified...mike...red and yellow then came to be, reaching out to me... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skreamer 1 #98 January 25, 2002 spectre230 rides again.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freeflir29 0 #99 January 25, 2002 "I couldn't tell them about any of the missions I had been on since they are all classified..."Who knows how many people have used that line after recounting what a hero they are in their own mind!!!"I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mnischalke 0 #100 January 25, 2002 See, I don't even exist on paper. I was only known by a few other members of the SEAL teams and then they only knew me by my codename, Water Moccasin. They called me that because after the surgery, I didn't need scuba gear. I used the gills and the rebreather they implanted. See the scars where the gills used to be, here under my armpits?mike...red and yellow then came to be, reaching out to me... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 Next Page 4 of 5 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
freeflir29 0 #99 January 25, 2002 "I couldn't tell them about any of the missions I had been on since they are all classified..."Who knows how many people have used that line after recounting what a hero they are in their own mind!!!"I got some beers....Let's Drink em!!!"Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnischalke 0 #100 January 25, 2002 See, I don't even exist on paper. I was only known by a few other members of the SEAL teams and then they only knew me by my codename, Water Moccasin. They called me that because after the surgery, I didn't need scuba gear. I used the gills and the rebreather they implanted. See the scars where the gills used to be, here under my armpits?mike...red and yellow then came to be, reaching out to me... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
