ZigZagMarquis 8 #26 July 25, 2006 QuoteYep. me too. and i've seen and reassembled way too many PD Reserve brake lines putting them to spec. is it just me. I haven't found a reserve SLINK installed wrong, but I have encountered folks attempting to install main SLINKs and they had it wrong... fortunately, they didn't think they were doing it right and came and found a rigger for help. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
azdiver 0 #27 July 25, 2006 newbie so im not sure exactly where these would be isnt the canopy lines directly atached to the webing with the two of the three rings, sorry if this is a stupid ? but confusedlight travels faster than sound, that's why some people appear to be bright until you hear them speak Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #28 July 25, 2006 Canopy Lines Links (either metal or softlinks) Risers 3 rings (small and medium ring on riser... large ring on harness) Harness In that order from canopy on down.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
azdiver 0 #29 July 25, 2006 thankslight travels faster than sound, that's why some people appear to be bright until you hear them speak Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yarpos 4 #30 July 25, 2006 why prefer them?....because like 3 rings they are proven technology they fail, like many other things on our rigs, if they arent checked and maintained. If you look after them they have a proven history of working. if people cant or wont check and maintain their own gear (regardless of new or old config options) badness generally follows. For a while when we start we are in the hands of others, but eventually its up to the individual to do these small things to ensure they save themselves on each jump.regards, Steve the older I get...the better I was Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #31 July 25, 2006 I think it worthy of mention that there have been some failures of links due to overtightening, which can cause the barrel to crack especially on the small versions.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DEDjed 0 #32 July 25, 2006 Hi, I'm an absolute newbie (still saving up for my AFF) so in all likelyhood this is gonna show my complete ignorance in these matters but... Why isn't there some kind of redundancy in these connector systems ...could you not 'double up' links so that if 1 were to bend like this you still had a chance of another 1 'hanging in there'?Blue skies and deep water Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fcajump 153 #33 July 25, 2006 QuoteHi, I'm an absolute newbie (still saving up for my AFF) so in all likelyhood this is gonna show my complete ignorance in these matters but... Why isn't there some kind of redundancy in these connector systems ...could you not 'double up' links so that if 1 were to bend like this you still had a chance of another 1 'hanging in there'? You do, a complete redundent parachute... its called the reserve. Beyond that, there are still some single points of failure in the system... such as the harness. This is why many of us are a bit anal when it comes to the condition of the harness. I strongly recommend that everyone learn how to inspect their gear. And stop depending on the packers to do it when the pack your main... because (generally) they don't (no offence). This particular problem could be (as others have said) either too loose or too tight (broken barrel). The trick is to check them, mark them, cover them with a protector that also keeps the barrel from turning and then use some supertack to keep the protector from running up the lines. Additionaly, PD's reserve manual instructs a specific torque and the use of both thread lock and a tell-tale on hard links. PS - BTW - old problem that we should not forget... when we discuss hard links, most of us mean Rapide (French) brand links ONLY. Other brands have let down their owners in the past. Politically some in the US might have "freedom fries" but I will continue to trust the French when it comes to good connector links!! As to softlinks - I use a set on my main and like them, but they have their own failure and maintenance issues... LEARN YOUR GEAR!!! JWAlways remember that some clouds are harder than others... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
azdiver 0 #34 July 26, 2006 how do the soft links fail, is there a visable defect when there bad, does the hole thing just pop off or a line or two pop outlight travels faster than sound, that's why some people appear to be bright until you hear them speak Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fcajump 153 #35 July 26, 2006 Quotehow do the soft links fail, is there a visable defect when there bad, does the hole thing just pop off or a line or two pop out While I have installed them, I have not actually seen them fail, so this is my speculation on how they fail... It is my guess that they would fail all at once and leave little room for any lines in the group to remain attached to the riser. It is possible that they could suffer a strand break that would be visible as a slight lengthening of the loop (think about the rope your hero is swinging on during the escape schene of your favorate adventure) but I doubt it would be that forgiving. Anyone actually experience this wish to speak up? JWAlways remember that some clouds are harder than others... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #36 July 30, 2006 First of all, soft connector links rarely fail. The most likely cause for failure is improper installation. The only excuse for improper installation is that you were too lazy to read the installation instructions (available on the web sites of every company that makes soft links). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mircan 0 #37 September 2, 2008 Reviving this thread... Last Saturday metal link on my front left riser got unscrewed, opened and bent (pic_1). I did not notice it in the air. I think that link opened somewhere during canopy flight because I reviewed the video and it seems (to me) that the link was not open for some time after opening (pic_2), plus I pulled the slider down over links and behind my head after opening. Canopy is Icarus Safire 2, links provided by manufacturer. I connected it 110 jumps ago and I clearly remember that I tighten the screws like in the manual (finger tight plus 1/4 turn). My biggest mistake was that I did not check screws when packing it. Sure it was connected when I did line check, but I did not check if the screws are tight or not... I was lucky also because there was turbulence that day at about 300 feet on final which shook me pretty well. Someone wrote that this could lead to loosing lines. Maybe yes, maybe not, but it would not be a pretty scenario to loose line group at 300 feet. I learned my lesson: Check your links! dudeist skydiver #42 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DougH 270 #38 September 2, 2008 Is there any reason you chose to use hard links over soft links? Other than the one crew canopy I have on larger risers I have switched them all over the slinks. I found they were easy to inspect and once I knew they were installed right I didn't have to worry about them as much."The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall" =P Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimjumper 25 #39 September 2, 2008 The Slinks can fail after opening. A Perris instructor was severely injured last year after his Slink failed during a front riser turn to final. The Slink failed due to excessive wear (+2000 jumps). I have never seen a rapide link that was properly installed and with a silicone slider bumper fail. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DougH 270 #40 September 2, 2008 The slink failed due to 2000 jumps... how many properly installed sinks have failed under 500 jumps? Lots of components fail at 2000 jumps, I would expect a mini riser to start really getting scary at that kind of jump numbers too. I have seen more bent links, online and in person, than I have seen people making the claim that their slink that was well within its lifespan just plain blew up. A metal link is an industrial fastener, it needs to be torqued down right, and it needs to be checked to make sure the barrel hasn't backed off. A lot of people don't do that, this thread has plenty examples of that! Maybe I am too trusting of the new tech?"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall" =P Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NickDG 23 #41 September 2, 2008 >>Maybe I am too trusting of the new tech?I stayed with metal Rapid links even after Slinks came out. I'm not the type to put a slider behind my head and I just collapse it in place. So I use tight rubber tubes as slider bumpers over my rapid links, which also prevents the barrel nut from moving. On top of that I fingernail polish mark them too. Too paranoid? Your example of a failed mini-riser isn't the best as they usually fail right on opening and you have another canopy. But if one of your riser to line connections fail it could be later and closer to the ground. Now I've seen Rapid links open and bend but still retain their lines, but I don't think I've ever heard of one outright failing. And I've seen some less than stellar riggers using metal links straight out of the local hardware store, which is a big no-no. But I've not seen any of those completely fail either. And I know how well Slinks work, in fact I saw them on sailboats long before they hit the drop zone, but all in all, for me, the price of being fashionable wasn't worth hanging the only ass I have on them. And once you get to certain point with a piece of gear that has a known failure mode either through mis-assembly, wear, and considering the fact we are now putting tremendous amounts of line pressure on our smallest and fastest canopies, you have to make an informed decision about the risk vs reward . . . And you know us older guys don't take to new stuff easily so don't bag on me too hard (and I still consider Slinks somewhat new). But I'm not as bad as some. Master Rigger Al Frisbe, before he passed, and Slinks were first appearing would remark, "What idiots! They install Slinks to save an ounce of weight and then they strap on lead . . . !" NickD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimjumper 25 #42 September 2, 2008 Thats why at 200+ pounds I don't jump mini rings, mini risers,mini canopies, or come to think of it, Slinks! I'll let the test jumpers work it out and when I think its safe Maybe!!! I'll give it a try. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mircan 0 #43 September 3, 2008 Quote Is there any reason you chose to use hard links over soft links? 1. The links came from the manufacturer (with the canopy). I guess that the company that makes the parachute knows what hardware is the best for their product. What I mean is If Icarus says that Vectran is right choice for canopy, I`m not going to reline it with Spectra. 2. On my last canopy I had soft links and I liked it. Even when considering my statement above I planned to install them. It happens that I ordered new H/C that was due to arrive in a couple of months and I was going to jump this Javelin until it does. 5 months and 100+ jumps later I`m still jumping this old Jav... I really did not know that this type of equipment failure happens this often.dudeist skydiver #42 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airathanas 0 #44 September 8, 2008 I was thinking of this thread this weekend. I had to replace the bumpers on my metal links and it was a challange! The risers were still twisted after double and triple checking that I hooked up everything ok. I was very careful not to hook up the lines in the incorrect order, which I didn't. The canopy flew pretty well, but it opened in a dive. I landed fine. When I was working on this whole project, at least a dozen people walked by and said, "Get slinks." I keep saying, "I know, I know..."http://3ringnecklace.com/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
longtall 0 #45 September 9, 2008 Ive had slinks for several jumps on my saber 2 main but for some reason my slider came down with enough heat to scorch my type 8 risers. Not too much of a problem untill I saw a scorch on my naked slink disrupt the slinks top layre. Now its back to type 5 conn links and silicone bumpers." 90 right, five miles then cut."---Pukin Buzzards Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #46 September 9, 2008 QuoteIve had slinks for several jumps on my saber 2 main but for some reason my slider came down with enough heat to scorch my type 8 risers. You can have slink caps or bumpers with slinks nowadays. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mircan 0 #47 September 9, 2008 Couple of my friends and me went to the other DZ last weekend. My friend rented a rig and "enlightened" by my experience from weekend before checked hard links. Guess what? Three out of four links were unscrewed by the point that you could easily turn them with fingers without applying any significant force! dudeist skydiver #42 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydiverek 55 #48 September 9, 2008 QuoteYou can have slink caps or bumpers with slinks nowadays. I think they ONLY fit with the narrow (i.e. Type 17) risers. True? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #49 September 9, 2008 QuoteQuoteYou can have slink caps or bumpers with slinks nowadays. I think they ONLY fit with the narrow (i.e. Type 17) risers. True? I have not seen any limitation. I don't use them, because I prefer to pull the slider down. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #50 September 9, 2008 QuoteQuoteYou can have slink caps or bumpers with slinks nowadays. I think they ONLY fit with the narrow (i.e. Type 17) risers. True? .................................................................... That is what the PD factory will tell you .... but I have installed SLink hats on wide Type 8 main risers. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
