rhino 0 #51 March 6, 2003 Anything from I-beams in construction to car driveshafts.. Just SNAP.. No reason.. Defect in the metal. Things break all the time for no apparent reason. I build redundant security systems, computer networks.. Everything I do pretty much has a backup. Why shouldn't my rig be the same? I have a reserve parachute? Why not have redundancy in other possible points of failure? Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #52 March 6, 2003 Cool... I was just curious. Thanks -My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Clownburner 0 #53 March 6, 2003 I like the idea, but how many fatalities are caused by hip-ring failures?7CP#1 | BTR#2 | Payaso en fuego Rodriguez "I want hot chicks in my boobies!"- McBeth Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #54 March 6, 2003 None...but what ever gets a person out of the aircraft, is ok by me. -My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #55 March 6, 2003 QuoteI like the idea, but how many fatalities are caused by hip-ring failures? None YET. How long have hip rings been out? I hope there is NEVER EVER EVER EVER such a failure.. Better safe then sorry I feel.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #56 March 7, 2003 Interesting.. I expected a bunch of people to jump on me for being paranoid about the hip ring? I guess not? Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #57 March 7, 2003 Actually, I kinda dig it Rhino, provided a rigger is cool with it, I mean sometimes adding things actually weakens stability. How about this? a contrasting color piece of webbing to accent your rig? -- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #58 March 7, 2003 Could do the color but I don't want to take away from the look of the stainless ring. The stitching will be above and below the original stitching Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Beppo 0 #59 March 9, 2003 QuoteJust SNAP.. No reason.. Defect in the metal. Things break all the time for no apparent reason. Nobody should say that this is not possible. A hair-crack in material caused by smashing a ring on a stone can be the cause for a ring failure. Has nowbody seen the pictures of riser or 3-ring failures? And what is if this ring is on your hip and not on your shoulder?..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mountainman 0 #60 March 9, 2003 Finally... here are pics of Laura and my rigs. Rhino - you will NOT be disappointed. http://www.brandonandlaura.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #62 March 10, 2003 Contact RWS, Bill Booth used to have some examples of risers that were made out of substanderd materials or to poor specs and had issues. The soft rings issue I think was in it, as was some risers that were made wrong enough they probally would'nt release. If your worried wnough about hardware failure there is'nt much you can do since if the hardware is bad how can you be sure the stitching will hold? And Rhino, is Sunrise doing that mod or are you having it done locally? I'm wondering if thats senior or master rigger territory since its a major design change to the rig. Is that possibily in the range of a new TSO since its a different design on the harness?Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #63 March 10, 2003 QuoteI'm wondering if thats senior or master rigger territory since its a major design change to the rig. Doesn't seem like a major change to me, not any more invasive than sewing on a pocket for a hook knife onto the webbing, as long as you stay away from the existing stitching. Am I wrong?People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #64 March 10, 2003 Your not sewing a pocket into the main lift web, you'd sew it into the cordura or parapack cloth wraping around the webbing. I'd assume that a mod like the supplement for the hip ring would require manufactor approval at the least. The sewing pattern for major joints is very well defined and it has to be made with all certified materails so I'd assume the same would be the same since this is designed as a supplement with a weight bearing design. Poor stitch would fail if the opening was strong enough to break the ring its self. I'd be more worried about the stitching failing then then ring...Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Beppo 0 #65 March 10, 2003 Quote Hi ZigZag! I must search and scan this pictures but im sure that i have some of this. On the one hand - service bulletins are the solution to eliminate material caused errors. On the other hand we must accept that ANY metal can get hair-cracks by different reasons. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 7 #66 March 10, 2003 QuoteInteresting.. I expected a bunch of people to jump on me for being paranoid about the hip ring? I guess not? No, you are paranoid.....But hey its your rig. Why should we care if you want to add stuff that does not make it unsafe.....A little over the top, but what the hell... If the ring breaks, most likley the type 8 will pop as well, and you would not survive the whack anyway! Type 8 is rated at what 3800-4000 pounds? And I have played with the pull machine at RWS, and almost ALL the materials stressed much higher than rated. But like I said...Do what ya want....its not unsafe, just overkill. Ron"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #67 March 10, 2003 Yes Sunrise is doing it for me.. It isn't a new design or harness.. Just an addition behind the hip ring.. Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #68 March 10, 2003 QuoteNo, you are paranoid.....But hey its your rig. Why should we care if you want to add stuff that does not make it unsafe.....A little over the top, but what the hell... If the ring breaks, most likley the type 8 will pop as well, and you would not survive the whack anyway! Type 8 is rated at what 3800-4000 pounds? And I have played with the pull machine at RWS, and almost ALL the materials stressed much higher than rated. But like I said...Do what ya want....its not unsafe, just overkill. Finally!! Someone to talk sense into me.. lol Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #69 March 10, 2003 First of all, I have never heard of a broken harness ring of any sort. My experience includes working at Rigging Innovations from 1994 to 1997. Remember that R.I. was the first company to build ringed harnesses and we learned a lot of lessons the hard way before anyone else started licensing our harness ring technology. Yes there were a few problems with soft RW-1-82 3-rings, but that was a heat-treating problem and RWS gracefully addressed that problem with a Service Bulletin and screw-in RW-6 rings. I have only seen a handful of BENT hip rings. These were the early stainless steel rings only installed on the first few hundred Flexons. All the owners of bent hip rings complained of painfully hard openings that twisted their necks so badly that they had to take time off jumping for a few weeks to heal. The worst bent hip rings I ever saw were Ton Falzone's who shredded a canopy and has complained about his neck injuries ever since. The problem was that hip rings, Spectra suspension lines, Tube Stows, z-p fabric and wing loadings greater than 1 pound per square foot all arrived on the market at the same time. Some people found out the hard way that old packing methods did not work with newer technology. As soon as people re-learned the lessons about keeping rubber bands tight, etc. harness rings quit bending. Frankly, you run a greater risk of falling out of a ringed harness than of having a ring break on you. The most likely causes of falling out of a harness are too large a harness or forgetting to tighten your leg straps. Finally, as for Rhino adding an extra piece of Type 17 webbing to the bottom of the main lift web: that would be a minor modification, but it can only be done gracefully when the harness is manufactured at the factory. Now I don't want to tell Wings how to run their production line, but it would seem to me pretty simply to substitute Type 17 webbing for the current 1 inch wide Type 4 tape buffer that is already found in most ringed hip joints. Buffers are extra layers of webbing that rub against hardware instead of the structural webbing. Buffers are made from "any old scrap webbing laying around the shop" and are usually not included in TSO tracking paperwork. But who cares, their sole function is the absorb abrasion, so the structural webbing remains intact. The only disadvantage I can see with substituting Type 17 for Type 4 is the change in bulk may make it more difficult to sew. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #70 March 10, 2003 They will be using the same type of webbing that the chest strap is made of. That was my request.. Still very strong, thin, won't feel it between the rig and the hip ring.. 2,800lbs ish strength,, Correct me if I am wrong please.. Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #71 March 11, 2003 Type 8.. 3800lbs... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #72 March 11, 2003 Dude, when do you get yours? I got mine on Friday and it is so freaking pimp, I love it!!!-- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skygod7777 0 #73 March 11, 2003 QuoteDude, when do you get yours? I got mine on Friday and it is so freaking pimp, I love it!!! pics?? later Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyingferret 0 #74 March 12, 2003 Will post when I can, it is getting assembled. Here is one before I had options added -- All the flaming and trolls of wreck dot with a pretty GUI. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jimbo 0 #75 March 16, 2003 I've got some questions about the Wings, hopefully someone here can answer them. What's the difference between the 'Standard' and 'Deluxe' stainless options? I've seen people talk in this thread about the Wings EXT. What is it? I don't see anything about it on their website. What about the cut in straps, similar to the new Javs, I don't see anything about that on the website either. - Jim"Like" - The modern day comma Good bye, my friends. You are missed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
