Safire2/Crossfire2

[billvon 2,400]

So a while back I was looking for a new canopy. Demoed a Crossfire, liked it a lot. Ordered an XF2 109 one a few weeks later (in May.) Still haven't gotten it in.

In the meantime I've been harassing Square One about it (mainly to get Tom going) and they've been great about letting me use their demo XF2 109 (when it's in) on the days I need two rigs for training.

Well, a few weeks ago it was out, so I borrowed their hideously pink Safire2 109 instead. Safires are decent canopies, I figured, and it's better than having to pull out that old Silhouette 170 I have for emergencies.

I was surprised to discover that I liked the Safire as much as, if not more than, the XF. It opened on heading more reliably, floated in brakes more easily, had lower front riser pressure and stayed in the dive longer than the XF. The recovery arc was long and predictable, and it seemed to keep the speed during the flare longer than the XF.

I spoke to a few people who had jumped them both and they confirmed this. It surprised me to say the least. I could have saved $100 and gotten a canopy that I actually liked better! (Perhaps not in pink though.)

(Of course the other possibility is that this particular XF was just out of trim - although it had just been relined.)

[dharma1976 0]

I never jumped the safire2 from what I hear they are great canopies

I would say this that the crossfire2 never treated me wrong

I found that it took more tehcnique but when you threw more techniques at it it wound up performing really well

in fact I waffle back and forth whether or not I made the right choice going crossbraced sometimes :-P

Dave

http://www.skyjunky.com

CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing.

[piahenzi 0]

...that's only because you "balled" yourself in the pond.

[dharma1976 0]

ahhhhh oh well back on the horse anyway

actually I was thinking more about the openings of the crossfire and the range of the crossfire

Dave

http://www.skyjunky.com

CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing.

[bob.dino 0]

Couple of questions Bill:

1- What do you load the 109 at?
2- Could you describe your front-riser turn technique?

[dharma1976 0]

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...that's only because you "balled" yourself in the pond.

isnt there a reason you dont use your rears any more pia?

at least I had enough balls to get back to using rears on the next jump

Dave

http://www.skyjunky.com

CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing.

[piahenzi 0]

right you are... I've been called out...

[billvon 2,400]

>1- What do you load the 109 at?

About 1.9

>2- Could you describe your front-riser turn technique?

90/180 degree turn to final, initiate with one riser/body, plan to plane out a little high, keep it turning/diving with some double riser near the end.

[Pendragon 1]

You'd notice more of a difference between the Xfire2 / Safire2 in a 270 degree turn - especially if you use your rears to help plane the canopy out.

I can't believe the safire2 holds in the dive longer; my Safire2 129 planes out a good 100ft higher than my Xfire2 109 in a 270. However, the height loss during the turn was increasingly similar with smaller rotations.

I do agree on the heading performance comment. Highly loaded Crossfire2 + wingsuit = fun!

--
BASE #1182
Muff #3573
PFI #52; UK WSI #13

[dharma1976 0]

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I do agree on the heading performance comment. Highly loaded Crossfire2 + wingsuit = fun!

ditto it gets a bit more squirelly for sure at high wingloadings

Dave

http://www.skyjunky.com

CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing.

[billvon 2,400]

>I can't believe the safire2 holds in the dive longer . . .

I couldn't believe it either - but it was confirmed by two other jumpers, one of whom does 270's on most jumps. (comparing the safire2 109 to the crossfire2 109.)

[Brains 2]

I have not jumped a safire but i was very impressed with a guy jumping one and kicking our asses in one of our cpc comps this year.

Never look down on someone, unless they are going down on you.

[murps2000 86]

Don't know if you'll answer me, since you usually seem to reply to my posts only when their wrong (not that that's necessarily a bad thing), but . what was the loading? I've jumped both canopies in that size(about 1.9-2.0 wl) and generally agree with your comparison. I thought the front riser was about the nicest I've ever pulled. Also, what's your take on how they stack up at shut down? The Safire2 kept it's speed longer, but which one do you think had a slower stall speed? I only had a few jumps on each, but I would like to have compared these two canopies more.

[BMFin 0]

How would you compare these two canopies in terms of rigidity ?

Im also flying a XF2 109 and found it the most rigid 9cell out of the ones that I have flown..

And like murps was prehaps implying, the XF2 has very nice bottom end lift. I would be suprised to hear that the safire2 has even more.

[billvon 2,400]

>what was the loading?

About 1.95

>Also, what's your take on how they stack up at shut down?

I only have about 30 jumps on the XF and 10 on the Safire, but the XF seems to go a _bit_ longer before shutting down. But not so you'd notice much.

>How would you compare these two canopies in terms of rigidity ?

Both were adequately rigid in the usual Perris turbulence. The XF _felt_ more rigid, but that may have been due to the higher front riser pressure.

[agent_lead 0]

i love my safire2

--------------------------------------------
www.facebook.com/agentlead

[justinhawxhurst 0]

Counld I get some feed back. I am looking for a new canopy. I was thinking the safire 2 129. I will not be changing for another 100 jumps or so. I have talked to lots on this but everyone at my dz and near are pd fans so don't have much info on Icaris.What or how much differnt would the crossfire 2 be. Wing laoding 1.27

[AggieDave 6]

A Safire2 may be the appropriate canopy for you, but at your jump numbers a Crossfire2 most definitely would not be.

My advice to you is to demo everything that is appropriate for your experience level. I would suggest demoing the Sabre2, Safire2 and the Pilot. Buy the one you like. Personally I recommend the Sabre2, but you might find a different canopy to your liking.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[Remolution 0]

i jump a safire2 139 (60jumps WL 1.2) and i really love the way how it fly and flare.
But my Safire opens like Shit more frequently.
Iam sure i can exclude bad bodypostion..
50% of the Openings are 180 to 360 diving spins with always closed endcells. The Spin seems to stop after complete inflation of the endcells or opposite rearriser input.
But time to time i get a nice onheading opening..
any Packing Suggestions for the Safire?
shove the nose in? how tight roll the tail?what not to do? Maybe a Reline will fix it? Vectran dont stretch so i think the lines cant affect my opening!?

[phoenixlpr 0]

Quote

Counld I get some feed back. I am looking for a new canopy. I was thinking the safire 2 129. I will not be changing for another 100 jumps or so. I have talked to lots on this but everyone at my dz and near are pd fans so don't have much info on Icaris.What or how much differnt would the crossfire 2 be. Wing laoding 1.27

What do you want from your canopy? I don't think that you can expect much more performance from an ellipctical on that WL, but you might get more miserable openings. I'd rather choose a canopy opens like "fire and forget", just pitch and you have a good, flying canopy. you may learn a lot. Even a bit shorter recovery arc may save your ass same day. Demo and find a canopy which feel as an extent of body.

[bob.dino 0]

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Iam sure i can exclude bad bodypostion..

You sure?

The Safire2 has a reputation for great openings. How many jumps on the lines? How well does the canopy fit in the bag?

[Remolution 0]

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Iam sure i can exclude bad bodypostion..

You sure?

The Safire2 has a reputation for great openings.

yeah i know about the reputation..this is one of the reasons why i bought it.
Fit very well in the Bag (Mirage M1).maybe 450-500 jumps on the lineset and just gotten new breaklines.
my rigger say i can use the lineset another 50-100jumps.
i never got a hard opening.. it opens always very very soft.but only the bad habit of "searching and turning during snivel and inflation.
I propack it...quarter the slider. let the nose just hanging and roll the tail tight.
Maybe i try a few Jumps with a Pilot this weekend.
I only expect better openings and dont think the Pilot fly much better compare to my safire

[marks 0]

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my rigger say i can use the lineset another 50-100jumps.
i never got a hard opening.. it opens always very very soft.but only the bad habit of "searching and turning during snivel and inflation.

HAHA,

that means it needs to be relined...

[strop45 0]

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any Packing Suggestions for the Safire?

Try psycho packing it. I've got about 200 jumps on a safire 2 and generally get nice on heading openings with a psycho pack. Just watch the pack job is symmetrical when it is lying on the floor (i.e. before you roll it up).

blue skies

The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein

[Remolution 0]

ok i cant blame the canopy for the openings
try a few jumps today and it seems "its just me.
Now i really try to put my foots and knees together as i lift up in the saddle.voila! nice on heading opening. it feels like the canopy want to turn but i dont fight it.. only knees together..thats it.. i read the article about "off headings" here on dz.com and that help me very much. wish read it earlier!
the last jump today i do one ugly trashpack" only to see what happend.. very nice on heading too but only softer

now i jump with a better feeling and no more scared about the packjob and opening