diablopilot 2 #26 March 28, 2007 QuoteQuoteAs a DZO my self I know what I will do next summer with my instructors. But what you guys think is fare? What do you already earn? What do you want? And why? Thanks Richard Wasn't this suppose to be a thread about what instructors should earn or what they do earn? Focus people. Good instructors should earn alot. Bad ones should earn nothing. That suit you better?---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
camamel 0 #27 March 28, 2007 Good instructors should be well paid, the other's should not work! You don't always need experience to be good. RichardWhen you think you're good...this is when you become dangerous. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
camamel 0 #28 March 29, 2007 Yes it wasWhen you think you're good...this is when you become dangerous. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #29 March 29, 2007 QuoteGood instructors should be well paid, the other's should not work! You don't always need experience to be good. Richard In a fair world......yes...---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnMitchell 14 #30 April 1, 2007 Quote Unfortunately the AFF rating certifies someone to be an instructor on their own. Perhaps an improvement would be a requirement to be an "intern" with a profesional school, but unlike doctors or nurses there is no requirement at an AFFI to show proficiency, skill or contined education post rating course graduation. I liked the old jumpmaster/instructor system. It allowed just that, to work with students while learning to teach the FJC, a skill all its own. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #31 April 2, 2007 I like that idea very much.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
velvetjo 0 #32 April 2, 2007 QuoteI liked the old jumpmaster/instructor system. It allowed just that, to work with students while learning to teach the FJC, a skill all its own. This sounds a lot like a Coach rating to me. Lance Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnMitchell 14 #33 April 2, 2007 I think it was better than a coach rating. It allowed you to go with FJ students on up, not just novices. The only thing it didn't allow you to do was teach the FJC. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #34 April 2, 2007 Unfortunately the coach rating is self supervised.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #35 April 2, 2007 QuoteUnfortunately the coach rating is self supervised. Um, it's not supposed to be. Coaching is supposed to be done under the supervision of an Instructor. Where did you get the idea that it wasn't? The Coach rating is essentially a jumpmaster rating with more restrictions. I think it is good system. In answer to the original poster, I think AFF Instructors should be the paid the most, followed by Tandem Instructors, followed by Coaches, but actual dollar amounts will depend on the business and market. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
slotperfect 7 #36 April 2, 2007 hommie and diablopilot: please take your personal beef to PMs and keep it out of the forums. I removed the PAs - please show some self-control when you post.Arrive Safely John Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
camamel 0 #37 April 3, 2007 Why do you think AFFI should earn more than Tandem instructors? RichardWhen you think you're good...this is when you become dangerous. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PWScottIV 0 #38 April 3, 2007 QuoteStatic line/ IAD instructors have always been and will continue to be the backbone of our sport. Must not be a West Coast thing, cause I've been to three DZs and NEVER heard ANYTHING about active Static Line or IAD courses... Only AFF or AFP.Gravity Waits for No One. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peckerhead 0 #39 April 3, 2007 Quote Must not be a West Coast thing, cause I've been to three DZs and NEVER heard ANYTHING about active Static Line or IAD courses... Only AFF or AFP. Three? Wow! You must be right. There are only 3 dropzones on the west coast. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PWScottIV 0 #40 April 3, 2007 Quote Three? Wow! You must be right. There are only 3 dropzones on the west coast. My bad, it seems that a whole 8 out of 17 California DZs offer S/L or IAD... All of them except for one offer Tandem and AFF... If S/L or IAD were the "backbone" of current training, then wouldn't DZs offer them as much as AFF and AFP? I'm not saying that they're obsolete or anything... It just seems like they aren't "preferred" anymore. Am I wrong?Gravity Waits for No One. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveorino 7 #41 April 3, 2007 Of the 273 USPA DZs listed on dropzone.com, the majority of them are smaller Cessna DZs. IAD and static line instruction are a staple in them. The world of skydiving does exist outside the turbine DZs of CA, AZ, and FL. steveOrino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #42 April 3, 2007 QuoteWhy do you think AFFI should earn more than Tandem instructors? If the AFFI is doing his/her job they should be spending time with the student, conducting ground training, debriefing, etc. I can see where an AFFI who meets each student on the way to the plane, gives some hand signals in freefall, and ensures a pull, never to be seen again, might deserve less than a TI, but an AFFI who is actually instructing, in my opinion, deserves to be paid for their skill and time. None of this is to say that TI's lack skill. They obviously do not, but they are also not expected to put nearly as much time into each student. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WILDBILLAQR 0 #43 April 3, 2007 The world of skydiving does exist outside the turbine DZs of CA, AZ, and FL. 1/2 of the DZ's in AZ offer static line progression.---------------------------------------------- "Thats not smoke, thats BUCKEYE!!" AQR#3,CWR#49 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toolbox 0 #44 April 3, 2007 I know some great AFF instructors who suck at tandems. If the student goes fetal or thrashes on exit they have a hell of a time out flying the student stuck to their chest. The canopy ride is another issue. They have a hard time getting a decent landing without a shitload of wind. AFF and Tandem are two different methods that require different abilities. I know alot of AFF/TI's who do both well. If you have an AFF rating you should be able to fly your ass off but it does not mean you will be a good TI, and a great TI may never be able to get an AFF rating. AFF takes more time, but tandem has greater risk to the instructor. Many say that tandem is ten times safer for the first timer than for them to go by themselves,and ten times more dangerous for the TI who takes them than to go by themselves. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hooknswoop 19 #45 April 3, 2007 Quotea great TI may never be able to get an AFF rating. Quote I know some great AFF instructors who suck at tandems. Exactly. It doesn't work both ways. AFF requires more skill than tandems. Some people said that an AFFI can get away from a student. That is not their job. Both TI's and AFFI's have to stay with the student, but the AFFI doesn't have 5000-lb hooks to help with that. I think AFFI's should earn $50+ a jump while TI's should earn $25+ a jump. I also think the AFF course should be brought back to pre-2001 standards with the 50% pass rate as well as an annual ground prep and evaluation jump to keep the rating. The TI course shuld also be more stringent and include an annual training and evaluation jump. The entire Instructor industry should be more professional. Derek Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #46 April 3, 2007 I think AFFI's should earn $50+ a jump while TI's should earn $25+ a jump. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Since a good AFF Instructor spends three times longer with a student, he deserves three times as much money. On another note, if tandem pay drops to $25, I will start searching for another career. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #47 April 4, 2007 QuoteAFF requires more skill than tandems. Not by current testing standards.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dzolloyd 0 #48 April 4, 2007 As a DZO of a small Cessna DZ in lower mid-west USA, I pay TIs $30 and AFFIs $25 per jump. An AFFI gets $5 extra for a ground prep. A TI gets $5 extra for a ground prep for an AFP type tandem jump. And a TI doing a "VIP" type tandem gets another $10 extra. If the TI does a "handcam" he will earn another $30. So tandem pay here is from $30 to $75 per jump. And the TI may also get a generous tip, something that is rare to the AFFIs.GET SOME, altitude! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #49 April 4, 2007 What's a "VIP" Tandem?---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dzolloyd 0 #50 April 4, 2007 http://www.skydiveairtight.com/vip_tandem.html Edited by slotperfect to make the link clicky! GET SOME, altitude! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
