skyjack71 0 #31601 April 4, 2012 QuoteMarch, 1999 in Maui, Hi. Right after my mother died. I met a wonderful Doctor (whose name I don't remember) who prescribed a wonderful combination of Vallium and Vicodin, commonly referred to as a "cocktail". I contribute my recall to that regiment of drugs. Expensive duo on the street. I had a 30° fracture of L4 in the inside. Not operable. Looked like a chisel in the X-ray. I suggest you call a top expert in the field of hypnosis and inquire as to the validity of recall from medication. An MKUltra expert in California advised me on it. I expect you will find the same answers I got. That will do it! If you recall, Duane had a recall in the hospital under medication as well...... Same scenerio. But Jo will disagree. She will change her story again, because I upstaged her again. Big monochrome puzzle that lights up when all the pieces are in their proper places. More Crap - you were talking to me before 1999! What-ever that has to do with this I don't know but it is worth mentioning. Duane did NOT have a RECALL in the hospital and when he made his confession - he had taken NO drugs for 48 hrs. Even then what they gave him was not strong...he refused them because he did NOT want the Dr. to dispute his decision...when he asked me if I had the briefcase with me - which he proceeded to open and presented to the Dr., The Administrator and the Dr.'s nurse with complete clarity. He pointed out to the Dr. "Note the date on the papers." He had made his decision 5 yrs before what he intended to do when his time came - and had all of the legal papers taken care of. I was unaware of these papers until that day in March of 1995. You, Knoss are NOT upstaging anyone - because this thread knows my story about the hospital has NOT ever changed. AS I have said - PLEASE to not refer to Jo or Duane - we are NOT part of you ridiculous story and we never have been. Perhaps you are pissed because I led you on to see if any of your story could be true - but, you quickly showed your true colors. You invented characters - you know you claimed there was NO Tommy Gunn. Then you invent his character in your story and make him part of your story. Duane Weber had NO recall under medication - you are a horrible and terribly sick man. Please DO NOT use Duane or Jo in anything you have to say. You did NOT know Duane Weber and if you did PROVE IT! You cannot even prove you knew Duane Weber or John Collins!Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #31602 April 4, 2012 Georger stated: QuoteYou lack perspective. You weren't here during the early days of Jo Weber's stuff. Knoss is like sheep grazing compared to that! It permanently ruined Jo"s case ... as FBI SA Larry Carr can personally testify. This is way off base - I exchanged things with Carr not mentioned in the thread - things he did NOT investigate and then I posted about them. Carr did many things on this thread that were unethical - such as making Duane's record public when I had been asking the FBI for this for yrs. He refused the Jefferson file to me as the former agent did - ASK yourself why? Then when it has reached the statue time when they destroy the detail files after a certain number of yrs, Carr tells me it is on the computer - but the actual file was not there. The actual file had been destroyed when he made that post. The photo and the work details are ALL gone. Destroyed! I had managed to obtain the McNeil, the Folsom/SanQuentin and Canon files before they knew it was even being done. Now those files are NO longer available. If Carr managed to damage anything about Weber it was his lack of actual digging for information. I sent him somethings and my guys have NOW found what he did not. Carr was a media hound looking to make a reputation for himself. All I have ever done with this thread was try to find information and to learn and to explore Duane's past hoping that someone here would be able to help me acquire more than I had. I didn't jump off the wagon and make stories up to get attention. In no way have I EVER stooped to the level a certain other poster has - YOU, Georger owe me an apology for the statement you made. My story has been consistent. I made suggestions, but never did I do as Knoss does. I explored the different theories with all of you and I did defend myself when I had to. As for the case regarding Duane Weber being permanently ruined - you are so very wrong. This thread made it possible for me to find individuals who have actually been helping me to explore Duane's past. How are you going to feel when we announce Duane's past with the state of WA and OR and ID? Will it prove he was Cooper? Not unless one can accept that our government and the authorities are incrediablity stupid and/or deliberately cover things up. At the rate Knoss is going we won't have to put up with him much longer. The authorities will be picking him up to commit him and this time they will throw the key away.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #31603 April 4, 2012 I just found this on the Selective Services website. Beginning in 1964, President Lyndon B. Johnson (1908–1973) was authorized by Congress to increase the number of troops in Vietnam, and by early 1968 the United States had more than 500,000 troops there. Tens of thousands of young men were drafted through the Selective Service lottery, while thousands of others avoided service through exemptions—also called deferments—granted by the several regional Selective Service draft boards around the nation based on educational commitments, membership in the clergy, medical restrictions, membership in the National Guard, and other obligations. Critics of the draft process noted an inordinate number of minorities had been selected, and questioned the randomness of the lottery. As in the past, the draft was seen as unfairly singling out those without the economic means to avoid service. As the number of U.S. soldiers killed in action rose and the war became increasingly unpopular, the draft became a focal point for antiwar protestors. In 1973 President Richard M. Nixon (1913–1994) signed legislation that ended the draft, and those joining the military thereafter did so as volunteers."It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #31604 April 4, 2012 QuoteYou may now breathe a sigh of relief. I'm going to retire from this thread for a while. I think a week out in the hills will do me good, plus I have to make a trip shortly to Phoenix and then on to Vista, California for a bit. I will check in occasionally via smartphone to sort of see what's happening, but that's it. It's part of my Move Beyond Cooper Program. The truth is, Cooper has been more of a drain on AB of Seattle than anything else, and we need to move forward. You are free to poke fun at this concept if you wish, (and some will) but others will understand completely. You and Mrshutter and Matt and 377 are the only sane ones left. I don't want to be here, but I also don't want myths to become known as facts in the future. Maybe the next Cooper book will be about the struggles to separate myth from fact - so at least there would be one factual accounting of the incident and the investigation of all of the suspect. Not sure that is even possible - I would vote for 377 on that one as he was alway careful to be objective about all of the suspects. He just could NOT get past the Tena's Bar find nor has anyone else if they really think about it. The only story ever told was told by a woman who had NO knowledge of the crime and NO knowledge of the find other than what was in the newspapers in 1980 and her memory of a 1979 trip to WA - where her husband took her to some unusual places along the Columbia and told her to stay in the car - plus all of the things he did tell her and his confession 11 days before he died in 1995. A yr later she finds purely by accident the name Cooper used was Dan Cooper. Her mind flashes to the incident in the hospital when he got angry because she didn't understand what he was talking about. He told her "I'm Dan Cooooper". She was chastising him and she did NOT grasp what he was trying to tell her. She did NOT know the name used by D.B.Cooper was Dan Cooper.... One Yr Later: Her husband's sudden exit from CO where they were living, the things he did on that 1979 trip, The few things he did tell her about his life and a book that was mostly fiction written by Max Gunther D.B. CooperWhat Really Happened. Had it not been she was trying to discourage a suitor who actually was listening to what she said and had knowledge of the crime, she never would have read that book. She had NO idea who Dan Cooper was until approx May 24 of 1996 - the night she started reading the book. 16 Years later A night that would change her life and not for the better. If anything it destroyed her life and everything it could have been. She accepted this as her mission in life - that it was just meant to be. As she nears the last yrs of her life - she looks back and regrets the yrs lost. Out of the blue everything started to come together and she knew the end was within her reach. The biggest obstacle was how could she prove it - and as the crime entered it's 40th anniversary and that too had passed - she felt defeated. Suddenly there were these hints of footprints (these are small and insignifcant things - feelings and the memories of the trip and the things her husband said to her)....she narrowed her search to the most important things even though the FBI had claimed to have investigated her husband and dismissed him as a suspect. One thing leads to another and then another and the pieces start to fall in place. Suddenly she has to strive to get well enough to make a trip back to WA so she can view what others have found - but, they need more than what they have. She is the key and she has to go back to WA but, doesn't know if this is going to be possible. She is the only one who will recognize his footprints. The "guys" found the direction and remnants of his having been in certain locations, but she has to see this for herself - they need for her to see it. They need to find more. How much of that is fiction and how much of it is fact. Maybe NONE of it is fiction.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #31605 April 4, 2012 "P.S. I have in writing where you claimed the guy at the collections place for the front pack was in on this and Coopers boots were in the pack marked with an X. I told you then HOW ridiculous you were being - because they had NO idea where they would be getting those front packs." Sorry, Jo. I can't figure out what you are trying to say. The good chute was with the X, it would be rediculous to say the boots were in there. TOG stored them for Duane where Cossey? could get them. Your information is disinformation. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #31606 April 4, 2012 "Rataczak is gracious as he has always been - never says anything bad about anyone. I would really like to meet him someday. How is he doing and how is his wife doing - they were both having a hard time last yr and why I do NOT bother him." No, Jo. This is Bill's son who is an EXTREMELY talented artist. He is a friend of mine and I hold the greatest respect for him. I suggest you all buy his art and enjoy his perspective on flight. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #31607 April 4, 2012 "Third, even though I've been wrong many times along the way, I still seek whatever that truth is." Please throw in your Brigham Young Medallion files before you go. You owe us a little of that truth from your locked stash. Sort of an apology of parting words? You will not be able to stay away, you know. You are addicted to this place as your personal diary and venue to your whipping posts for different opinions. You can not change. You are cast. Perhaps we can have civil discussions here at long last. Enjoy if you can. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #31608 April 4, 2012 QuoteShed some light here for me Bob, where does Janet live? my understanding is that she lived right under or close to the FBI flight path, how would she then be able to see the plane if it was 15 miles off of the course you speak of, I'm not as up to date in this area but do recall reading that she was in the flight path. Yes, I calculate that she was 2 miles off the ACTUAL flight path. Since the angle of sight she had was 45°. I got her address and Googled her, put her on the shifted flight path (15 miles West) and that is right where it is. Everything fits perfectly, with a swing around the population of Portland. She was apparently 2 miles East of the actual path on the Westerly side of Portland, South of center. You can do the same thing. Robert99 should have done the same thing, but I hear nothing of the results he got. This is 100% factual, so verifying it has got to be pretty simple. I'm like many others finding it hard to believe that she could see the back of the plane so well? I live very close (about 7 miles) to Ft Lauderdale airport and the planes are at a couple thousand feet if that, not far from my home, I have looked many times during the nite and can't see anything but a shadow (Silhouette) of the plane? even when it has a light under the back tail. The trailing helicopter was shooting flares up in the air above 305. Have you ever seen a flare? You would understand. She could easily see everything at that distance, given a good pair of eyes. Granted, a blind person would have problems. How far is the Moon? Similar lighting to a flare. Can you see the fine details when you get an opening in the clouds? Same thing. and if he did have flares, I could understand that some light would be on the stairwell, but then where did he get the flares if the bomb was made of red wood dowels as you explained in the past? McCoy and Ralph have explained where the lit flares came from. It was not Duane. It would not have been in his benefit to use a blinding flare. The original training discussion included red painted dowels from the local Hank's Hardware Store by TOG. Duane asked about using flares as fake dynomite instead. Flares are red, dynomite is tan. The red was to tell the FBI that it was NOT a bomb when they saw it. He MAY have had flares instead of dowels. Depends on what was left on the plane. I don't know. Flares leave a smoke trail, one would think that some of this would have made it's way into the plane and then the cabin, possibly causing them to become alarmed! Flares were not fired or lit from 305, they came from the trailing helicopter. They did not help, they made visibility from the chopper worse, but they lit up the sky for Janet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31609 April 4, 2012 "No, I do NOT believe that it was Richard Floyd McCoy who contacted Janet and made the alleged threat. Since Janet testified she mailed the letter directly to the Portland FBI, this would assume McCoy had access to the Portland FBI's incoming mail, and that is doubtful." Mac was the "go-to" guy for the project. It went directly to him. He went directly to Janet. I explained that McCoy was assigned to NOH. the SA in charge of the project. I pointed you to the association (team) for Walker between NOH and McCoy between March, 1968 and 1974. This is not a snapshot in time, it is a moving, living, breathing, growing series of events that meld together. You need to have a heart to heart sit down with Ralphy in a very private friendly location. Take a Bible along. Ralph is a good man. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31610 April 4, 2012 "you are a horrible and terribly sick man." Yes, Dear, whatever you say, Dear. But I am a very HONEST, horrible and terribly sick man. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31611 April 4, 2012 "How much of that is fiction and how much of it is fact. Maybe NONE of it is fiction." I'd say that is probably all 100% totally true. Unfortunately, there is nothing there of value to anyone except you. We ALL deal with the same situation. Lots of words and no tangible proof. Just meaningless history. On a good day. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrshutter45 21 #31612 April 4, 2012 Had to use the "SPECIAL" sewen shut chute to assure no tampering, the one belonging to 'kingpin', the rigger, who sewed it shut and put the "X" on it. Why would there be a concern of tampering on a secret Government plan? Flares were not fired or lit from 305, they came from the trailing helicopter. They did not help, they made visibility from the chopper worse, but they lit up the sky for Janet. Janet, who was in the passenger seat, looked up just as the car was backing out of the driveway and saw a light pass overhead. A platform or ladder below a plane caught her eye. "What I saw was flames and thought I saw something on the platform which could have been a person," Janet said. Immediately, the fireball arched away from the platform, split into two and then disappeared in the direction of the Columbia River she does not mention any helicopter in the area, with nightvision like hers, she would have spotted a black kite that nite Yes, I calculate that she was 2 miles off the ACTUAL flight path. Since the angle of sight she had was 45°. I got her address and Googled her, put her on the shifted flight path (15 miles West) and that is right where it is. Everything fits perfectly, with a swing around the population of Portland. She was apparently 2 miles East of the actual path on the Westerly side of Portland, South of center. You can do the same thing. Robert99 should have done the same thing, but I hear nothing of the results he got. This is 100% factual, so verifying it has got to be pretty simple. perhaps you could go ahead and do this for us, you do want the truth out.....correct? I thought you were aware of Janet for years? why did you have to Google? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31613 April 4, 2012 Quote Had to use the "SPECIAL" sewen shut chute to assure no tampering, the one belonging to 'kingpin', the rigger, who sewed it shut and put the "X" on it. Why would there be a concern of tampering on a secret Government plan? The FBI acting on the report of a hijacking were not part of the team. Some creative agent could have taken it upon himself to "FIX" the hijacker, or plant a tracker. If everyone knew of the plan, it would not have been a secret, would it? Flares were not fired or lit from 305, they came from the trailing helicopter. They did not help, they made visibility from the chopper worse, but they lit up the sky for Janet. Janet, who was in the passenger seat, looked up just as the car was backing out of the driveway and saw a light pass overhead. A platform or ladder below a plane caught her eye. "What I saw was flames and thought I saw something on the platform which could have been a person," Janet said. Immediately, the fireball arched away from the platform, split into two and then disappeared in the direction of the Columbia River she does not mention any helicopter in the area, with nightvision like hers, she would have spotted a black kite that nite. The helicopter had trouble keeping up. 305 was never in sight of the helicopter according to Ralph. It was not nightvision that allowed Janet to see the stairs, it was the red flare. I can't bite on a kite that nite, at that height, no fight, her sight of the flight with the light, McCoy's warning so Duane's plight might be tight in the night. I'm sure, that's right. Chances I'm wrong are slight. Why would she report something so akin if it didn't happen? why did you have to Google? I Googled the LOCATION on the map. I think I put her in the West Beaverton area. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrshutter45 21 #31614 April 4, 2012 your going against your own witness statements? "the flares lit up the sky for Janet" That's one special lady to be the only person within miles to see the sky lit up? nobody on the highways, nobody outside walking the dog, Police must of been blind or out of the area? other planes witness to seeing the sky lit up? perhaps I could ask the dairy cows? oh crap, we didn't have dairy cows at the Dairy farm did we, Dam! what happened to the post you made about McCoy being a Marshal...with one L....... Why would she report something so akin if it didn't happen? I bet a lot of people are asking the same about B Madoff! If it's too good to be true...well you know the rest."It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31615 April 4, 2012 Quoteyour going against your own witness statements? "the flares lit up the sky for Janet" Cook's and Tosaw's witness, not my witness. That's what flares do, that is what they are intended for. I think it is safe to assume that's what would happen. That's one special lady to be the only person within miles to see the sky lit up? nobody on the highways, nobody outside walking the dog, Police must of been blind or out of the area? other planes witness to seeing the sky lit up? We were not there, we can only try to visualize what the witness stated. perhaps I could ask the dairy cows? oh crap, we didn't have dairy cows at the Dairy farm did we, Dam! If you were there, you might have seen and talked to the cows. I was told it was an abandoned farm and I was not there. what happened to the post you made about McCoy being a Marshal...with one L....... McCoy was given a Marshal's badge by O'Hara, I wasn't aware of any swearing in, but I guess that's possible. Probably even probable. Why would she report something so akin if it didn't happen? I bet a lot of people are asking the same about B Madoff! If it's too good to be true...well you know the rest. I don't grasp your point. If it quacks like a duck and walks like a duck and lays eggs like a duck, there is a pretty good chance it will taste like a duck. Chickens don't fly into a duck blind during duck season. They rarely even cross the road anymore. If it is duck hunting season and you hear someone shooting a shotgun in a marsh area right when the season opens at 6 AM and they tell you they shot some ducks, I guess it is fair to assume they bagged some ducks. What's the point of telling you unless they got some ducks?? That's what hunters do. Janet was a concerned citizen. Mac was responsible for keeping her quiet. He TOLD me he did that! Bad word and all! Monochrome puzzle that lights up when everything is in place. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites airtwardo 6 #31616 April 4, 2012 The trailing helicopter was shooting flares up in the air above 305. Have you ever seen a flare? You would understand. She could easily see everything at that distance, given a good pair of eyes. Granted, a blind person would have problems. How far is the Moon? Similar lighting to a flare. Can you see the fine details when you get an opening in the clouds? Same thing. Quote Just curious, what kind of chopper back then could fly that high-that fast-in that weather? And what good would shooting flares off DO at a couple hundred knots...light up where you WERE a couple miles back? Do you even THINK about the logic of the BS you report? ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrshutter45 21 #31617 April 4, 2012 The witness statement I made was about a witness that could help your case, not your actual witness. I see we are back to the point of just a farm now vs a dairy farm, similar to the can that turned into a dairy can as your story rolled on. that's ok, can, dairy can, farm, dairy farm, all the same, moving on now. How much in detail can you go into on McCoy's jump? any special chute requests made on this jump, perhaps a Z or W chute? (code for a chute not tampered with) why was a second jump required? (after Cooper) he was able to hijack the plane (per instructions) he survived (according to you) the Cooper vein was named after his jump (success for project) Coopers name by record is the one responsible for new improved security features as intended going back to 1968, the only problem would be the missing money The FBI acting on the report of a hijacking were not part of the team. Some creative agent could have taken it upon himself to "FIX" the hijacker, or plant a tracker. If everyone knew of the plan, it would not have been a secret, would it? I would be more inclined to believe that if the X chute was in fact a dummy chute, the FBI would have notified the cockpit if it was found that Cooper was going to jump with someone, since they were 100% positive he was alone, the FBI remained silent about the chute with the X on it until after the jump. If everyone knew of the plan, it would not have been a secret, would it? I don't think the secret was intended for the Officials, more like a secret to the public!! "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #31618 April 4, 2012 Dammit Janet Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31619 April 4, 2012 Just curious, what kind of chopper back then could fly that high-that fast-in that weather? 10,000 ft, light rain and 175 knots? Not an avionics expert. Ralph wrote the book describing what they did. I was told they could just barely keep up and the jets couldn't go slow enough. Ask Ralph what he flew. It might be in his book. And what good would shooting flares off DO at a couple hundred knots...light up where you WERE a couple miles back? I was not there, but they were close enough, as flares light up the entire sky from the ground. From the chopper the flares just blinded them. Couple miles? Who says? Blevins? I believe McCoy AND JANET. Do you even THINK about the logic of the BS you report? No, actually, I really don't. The ONLY thing I concentrate on is precise accuracy. The point of the planning was to AVOID logic. Upside down inside out. I do not read whole books, just exerps to verify truth and authenticity. When I run into an obvious falsehood, I give the book away. The only book I have is Gray's and I only read the pages he wrote about our visit. He got it all correct, but the Judge managed to slip in an untruth. My Dad never taught me the clock business. I just naturally gravitated to the spelter like the Judge did. Not my Dad's choice. He liked wooden pendulum clocks and pocket watches. I have hundreds of epic spelter statues, large Japy and Ansonia statue clocks which I restore. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Robert99 37 #31620 April 4, 2012 Quote Just curious, what kind of chopper back then could fly that high-that fast-in that weather? 10,000 ft, light rain and 175 knots? Not an avionics expert. Ralph wrote the book describing what they did. I was told they could just barely keep up and the jets couldn't go slow enough. Ask Ralph what he flew. It might be in his book. And what good would shooting flares off DO at a couple hundred knots...light up where you WERE a couple miles back? I was not there, but they were close enough, as flares light up the entire sky from the ground. From the chopper the flares just blinded them. Couple miles? Who says? Blevins? I believe McCoy. Do you even THINK about the logic of the BS you report? Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. The rest of the claims made by Knoss are also BS. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31621 April 4, 2012 Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. That sounds accurate and consistent with what I said. They also saw no parachute at any time. Your claim of BS is totally unfounded as what I claim is the actual truth. You just don't know it yet. You have the tennacity to search out the truth and you could do it if you really wanted to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Robert99 37 #31622 April 4, 2012 Quote Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. That sounds accurate and consistent with what I said. Except your claim of BS is totally unfounded as what I claim is the truth. You just don't know it yet. You have the tennacity to search out the truth and you could do it if you really wanted to. You need to read my response to your silly claims again. That response is NOT "accurate and consistent with what I (Knoss) said" as you claim. You don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrshutter45 21 #31623 April 4, 2012 I think you may be thinking of flares that have chutes on them used to locate ground forces and so on, is it possible they had those but the chutes were sewn shut on them? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31624 April 4, 2012 QuoteQuote Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. That sounds accurate and consistent with what I said. Except your claim of BS is totally unfounded as what I claim is the truth. You just don't know it yet. You have the tennacity to search out the truth and you could do it if you really wanted to. You need to read my response to your silly claims again. That response is NOT "accurate and consistent with what I (Knoss) said" as you claim. You don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about! I read consistency. I repeated what McCoy reported. I see nothing at odds, just different words. I am not a pilot, just a reporter of fact. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31625 April 4, 2012 Quote I think you may be thinking of flares that have chutes on them used to locate ground forces and so on, is it possible they had those but the chutes were sewn shut on them? Chutes were sewn shut on flares?? Huh? I have no I idea what kind of flares were in the choppers. Only that they fired a couple or a few. "You don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about!" Don't believe I have to know how to swim to toss a life preserver. 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BobKnoss 0 #31609 April 4, 2012 "No, I do NOT believe that it was Richard Floyd McCoy who contacted Janet and made the alleged threat. Since Janet testified she mailed the letter directly to the Portland FBI, this would assume McCoy had access to the Portland FBI's incoming mail, and that is doubtful." Mac was the "go-to" guy for the project. It went directly to him. He went directly to Janet. I explained that McCoy was assigned to NOH. the SA in charge of the project. I pointed you to the association (team) for Walker between NOH and McCoy between March, 1968 and 1974. This is not a snapshot in time, it is a moving, living, breathing, growing series of events that meld together. You need to have a heart to heart sit down with Ralphy in a very private friendly location. Take a Bible along. Ralph is a good man. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #31610 April 4, 2012 "you are a horrible and terribly sick man." Yes, Dear, whatever you say, Dear. But I am a very HONEST, horrible and terribly sick man. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #31611 April 4, 2012 "How much of that is fiction and how much of it is fact. Maybe NONE of it is fiction." I'd say that is probably all 100% totally true. Unfortunately, there is nothing there of value to anyone except you. We ALL deal with the same situation. Lots of words and no tangible proof. Just meaningless history. On a good day. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #31612 April 4, 2012 Had to use the "SPECIAL" sewen shut chute to assure no tampering, the one belonging to 'kingpin', the rigger, who sewed it shut and put the "X" on it. Why would there be a concern of tampering on a secret Government plan? Flares were not fired or lit from 305, they came from the trailing helicopter. They did not help, they made visibility from the chopper worse, but they lit up the sky for Janet. Janet, who was in the passenger seat, looked up just as the car was backing out of the driveway and saw a light pass overhead. A platform or ladder below a plane caught her eye. "What I saw was flames and thought I saw something on the platform which could have been a person," Janet said. Immediately, the fireball arched away from the platform, split into two and then disappeared in the direction of the Columbia River she does not mention any helicopter in the area, with nightvision like hers, she would have spotted a black kite that nite Yes, I calculate that she was 2 miles off the ACTUAL flight path. Since the angle of sight she had was 45°. I got her address and Googled her, put her on the shifted flight path (15 miles West) and that is right where it is. Everything fits perfectly, with a swing around the population of Portland. She was apparently 2 miles East of the actual path on the Westerly side of Portland, South of center. You can do the same thing. Robert99 should have done the same thing, but I hear nothing of the results he got. This is 100% factual, so verifying it has got to be pretty simple. perhaps you could go ahead and do this for us, you do want the truth out.....correct? I thought you were aware of Janet for years? why did you have to Google? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #31613 April 4, 2012 Quote Had to use the "SPECIAL" sewen shut chute to assure no tampering, the one belonging to 'kingpin', the rigger, who sewed it shut and put the "X" on it. Why would there be a concern of tampering on a secret Government plan? The FBI acting on the report of a hijacking were not part of the team. Some creative agent could have taken it upon himself to "FIX" the hijacker, or plant a tracker. If everyone knew of the plan, it would not have been a secret, would it? Flares were not fired or lit from 305, they came from the trailing helicopter. They did not help, they made visibility from the chopper worse, but they lit up the sky for Janet. Janet, who was in the passenger seat, looked up just as the car was backing out of the driveway and saw a light pass overhead. A platform or ladder below a plane caught her eye. "What I saw was flames and thought I saw something on the platform which could have been a person," Janet said. Immediately, the fireball arched away from the platform, split into two and then disappeared in the direction of the Columbia River she does not mention any helicopter in the area, with nightvision like hers, she would have spotted a black kite that nite. The helicopter had trouble keeping up. 305 was never in sight of the helicopter according to Ralph. It was not nightvision that allowed Janet to see the stairs, it was the red flare. I can't bite on a kite that nite, at that height, no fight, her sight of the flight with the light, McCoy's warning so Duane's plight might be tight in the night. I'm sure, that's right. Chances I'm wrong are slight. Why would she report something so akin if it didn't happen? why did you have to Google? I Googled the LOCATION on the map. I think I put her in the West Beaverton area. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrshutter45 21 #31614 April 4, 2012 your going against your own witness statements? "the flares lit up the sky for Janet" That's one special lady to be the only person within miles to see the sky lit up? nobody on the highways, nobody outside walking the dog, Police must of been blind or out of the area? other planes witness to seeing the sky lit up? perhaps I could ask the dairy cows? oh crap, we didn't have dairy cows at the Dairy farm did we, Dam! what happened to the post you made about McCoy being a Marshal...with one L....... Why would she report something so akin if it didn't happen? I bet a lot of people are asking the same about B Madoff! If it's too good to be true...well you know the rest."It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31615 April 4, 2012 Quoteyour going against your own witness statements? "the flares lit up the sky for Janet" Cook's and Tosaw's witness, not my witness. That's what flares do, that is what they are intended for. I think it is safe to assume that's what would happen. That's one special lady to be the only person within miles to see the sky lit up? nobody on the highways, nobody outside walking the dog, Police must of been blind or out of the area? other planes witness to seeing the sky lit up? We were not there, we can only try to visualize what the witness stated. perhaps I could ask the dairy cows? oh crap, we didn't have dairy cows at the Dairy farm did we, Dam! If you were there, you might have seen and talked to the cows. I was told it was an abandoned farm and I was not there. what happened to the post you made about McCoy being a Marshal...with one L....... McCoy was given a Marshal's badge by O'Hara, I wasn't aware of any swearing in, but I guess that's possible. Probably even probable. Why would she report something so akin if it didn't happen? I bet a lot of people are asking the same about B Madoff! If it's too good to be true...well you know the rest. I don't grasp your point. If it quacks like a duck and walks like a duck and lays eggs like a duck, there is a pretty good chance it will taste like a duck. Chickens don't fly into a duck blind during duck season. They rarely even cross the road anymore. If it is duck hunting season and you hear someone shooting a shotgun in a marsh area right when the season opens at 6 AM and they tell you they shot some ducks, I guess it is fair to assume they bagged some ducks. What's the point of telling you unless they got some ducks?? That's what hunters do. Janet was a concerned citizen. Mac was responsible for keeping her quiet. He TOLD me he did that! Bad word and all! Monochrome puzzle that lights up when everything is in place. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites airtwardo 6 #31616 April 4, 2012 The trailing helicopter was shooting flares up in the air above 305. Have you ever seen a flare? You would understand. She could easily see everything at that distance, given a good pair of eyes. Granted, a blind person would have problems. How far is the Moon? Similar lighting to a flare. Can you see the fine details when you get an opening in the clouds? Same thing. Quote Just curious, what kind of chopper back then could fly that high-that fast-in that weather? And what good would shooting flares off DO at a couple hundred knots...light up where you WERE a couple miles back? Do you even THINK about the logic of the BS you report? ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrshutter45 21 #31617 April 4, 2012 The witness statement I made was about a witness that could help your case, not your actual witness. I see we are back to the point of just a farm now vs a dairy farm, similar to the can that turned into a dairy can as your story rolled on. that's ok, can, dairy can, farm, dairy farm, all the same, moving on now. How much in detail can you go into on McCoy's jump? any special chute requests made on this jump, perhaps a Z or W chute? (code for a chute not tampered with) why was a second jump required? (after Cooper) he was able to hijack the plane (per instructions) he survived (according to you) the Cooper vein was named after his jump (success for project) Coopers name by record is the one responsible for new improved security features as intended going back to 1968, the only problem would be the missing money The FBI acting on the report of a hijacking were not part of the team. Some creative agent could have taken it upon himself to "FIX" the hijacker, or plant a tracker. If everyone knew of the plan, it would not have been a secret, would it? I would be more inclined to believe that if the X chute was in fact a dummy chute, the FBI would have notified the cockpit if it was found that Cooper was going to jump with someone, since they were 100% positive he was alone, the FBI remained silent about the chute with the X on it until after the jump. If everyone knew of the plan, it would not have been a secret, would it? I don't think the secret was intended for the Officials, more like a secret to the public!! "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #31618 April 4, 2012 Dammit Janet Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31619 April 4, 2012 Just curious, what kind of chopper back then could fly that high-that fast-in that weather? 10,000 ft, light rain and 175 knots? Not an avionics expert. Ralph wrote the book describing what they did. I was told they could just barely keep up and the jets couldn't go slow enough. Ask Ralph what he flew. It might be in his book. And what good would shooting flares off DO at a couple hundred knots...light up where you WERE a couple miles back? I was not there, but they were close enough, as flares light up the entire sky from the ground. From the chopper the flares just blinded them. Couple miles? Who says? Blevins? I believe McCoy AND JANET. Do you even THINK about the logic of the BS you report? No, actually, I really don't. The ONLY thing I concentrate on is precise accuracy. The point of the planning was to AVOID logic. Upside down inside out. I do not read whole books, just exerps to verify truth and authenticity. When I run into an obvious falsehood, I give the book away. The only book I have is Gray's and I only read the pages he wrote about our visit. He got it all correct, but the Judge managed to slip in an untruth. My Dad never taught me the clock business. I just naturally gravitated to the spelter like the Judge did. Not my Dad's choice. He liked wooden pendulum clocks and pocket watches. I have hundreds of epic spelter statues, large Japy and Ansonia statue clocks which I restore. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Robert99 37 #31620 April 4, 2012 Quote Just curious, what kind of chopper back then could fly that high-that fast-in that weather? 10,000 ft, light rain and 175 knots? Not an avionics expert. Ralph wrote the book describing what they did. I was told they could just barely keep up and the jets couldn't go slow enough. Ask Ralph what he flew. It might be in his book. And what good would shooting flares off DO at a couple hundred knots...light up where you WERE a couple miles back? I was not there, but they were close enough, as flares light up the entire sky from the ground. From the chopper the flares just blinded them. Couple miles? Who says? Blevins? I believe McCoy. Do you even THINK about the logic of the BS you report? Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. The rest of the claims made by Knoss are also BS. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31621 April 4, 2012 Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. That sounds accurate and consistent with what I said. They also saw no parachute at any time. Your claim of BS is totally unfounded as what I claim is the actual truth. You just don't know it yet. You have the tennacity to search out the truth and you could do it if you really wanted to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Robert99 37 #31622 April 4, 2012 Quote Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. That sounds accurate and consistent with what I said. Except your claim of BS is totally unfounded as what I claim is the truth. You just don't know it yet. You have the tennacity to search out the truth and you could do it if you really wanted to. You need to read my response to your silly claims again. That response is NOT "accurate and consistent with what I (Knoss) said" as you claim. You don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrshutter45 21 #31623 April 4, 2012 I think you may be thinking of flares that have chutes on them used to locate ground forces and so on, is it possible they had those but the chutes were sewn shut on them? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31624 April 4, 2012 QuoteQuote Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. That sounds accurate and consistent with what I said. Except your claim of BS is totally unfounded as what I claim is the truth. You just don't know it yet. You have the tennacity to search out the truth and you could do it if you really wanted to. You need to read my response to your silly claims again. That response is NOT "accurate and consistent with what I (Knoss) said" as you claim. You don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about! I read consistency. I repeated what McCoy reported. I see nothing at odds, just different words. I am not a pilot, just a reporter of fact. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31625 April 4, 2012 Quote I think you may be thinking of flares that have chutes on them used to locate ground forces and so on, is it possible they had those but the chutes were sewn shut on them? Chutes were sewn shut on flares?? Huh? I have no I idea what kind of flares were in the choppers. Only that they fired a couple or a few. "You don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about!" Don't believe I have to know how to swim to toss a life preserver. 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mrshutter45 21 #31614 April 4, 2012 your going against your own witness statements? "the flares lit up the sky for Janet" That's one special lady to be the only person within miles to see the sky lit up? nobody on the highways, nobody outside walking the dog, Police must of been blind or out of the area? other planes witness to seeing the sky lit up? perhaps I could ask the dairy cows? oh crap, we didn't have dairy cows at the Dairy farm did we, Dam! what happened to the post you made about McCoy being a Marshal...with one L....... Why would she report something so akin if it didn't happen? I bet a lot of people are asking the same about B Madoff! If it's too good to be true...well you know the rest."It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #31615 April 4, 2012 Quoteyour going against your own witness statements? "the flares lit up the sky for Janet" Cook's and Tosaw's witness, not my witness. That's what flares do, that is what they are intended for. I think it is safe to assume that's what would happen. That's one special lady to be the only person within miles to see the sky lit up? nobody on the highways, nobody outside walking the dog, Police must of been blind or out of the area? other planes witness to seeing the sky lit up? We were not there, we can only try to visualize what the witness stated. perhaps I could ask the dairy cows? oh crap, we didn't have dairy cows at the Dairy farm did we, Dam! If you were there, you might have seen and talked to the cows. I was told it was an abandoned farm and I was not there. what happened to the post you made about McCoy being a Marshal...with one L....... McCoy was given a Marshal's badge by O'Hara, I wasn't aware of any swearing in, but I guess that's possible. Probably even probable. Why would she report something so akin if it didn't happen? I bet a lot of people are asking the same about B Madoff! If it's too good to be true...well you know the rest. I don't grasp your point. If it quacks like a duck and walks like a duck and lays eggs like a duck, there is a pretty good chance it will taste like a duck. Chickens don't fly into a duck blind during duck season. They rarely even cross the road anymore. If it is duck hunting season and you hear someone shooting a shotgun in a marsh area right when the season opens at 6 AM and they tell you they shot some ducks, I guess it is fair to assume they bagged some ducks. What's the point of telling you unless they got some ducks?? That's what hunters do. Janet was a concerned citizen. Mac was responsible for keeping her quiet. He TOLD me he did that! Bad word and all! Monochrome puzzle that lights up when everything is in place. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites airtwardo 6 #31616 April 4, 2012 The trailing helicopter was shooting flares up in the air above 305. Have you ever seen a flare? You would understand. She could easily see everything at that distance, given a good pair of eyes. Granted, a blind person would have problems. How far is the Moon? Similar lighting to a flare. Can you see the fine details when you get an opening in the clouds? Same thing. Quote Just curious, what kind of chopper back then could fly that high-that fast-in that weather? And what good would shooting flares off DO at a couple hundred knots...light up where you WERE a couple miles back? Do you even THINK about the logic of the BS you report? ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrshutter45 21 #31617 April 4, 2012 The witness statement I made was about a witness that could help your case, not your actual witness. I see we are back to the point of just a farm now vs a dairy farm, similar to the can that turned into a dairy can as your story rolled on. that's ok, can, dairy can, farm, dairy farm, all the same, moving on now. How much in detail can you go into on McCoy's jump? any special chute requests made on this jump, perhaps a Z or W chute? (code for a chute not tampered with) why was a second jump required? (after Cooper) he was able to hijack the plane (per instructions) he survived (according to you) the Cooper vein was named after his jump (success for project) Coopers name by record is the one responsible for new improved security features as intended going back to 1968, the only problem would be the missing money The FBI acting on the report of a hijacking were not part of the team. Some creative agent could have taken it upon himself to "FIX" the hijacker, or plant a tracker. If everyone knew of the plan, it would not have been a secret, would it? I would be more inclined to believe that if the X chute was in fact a dummy chute, the FBI would have notified the cockpit if it was found that Cooper was going to jump with someone, since they were 100% positive he was alone, the FBI remained silent about the chute with the X on it until after the jump. If everyone knew of the plan, it would not have been a secret, would it? I don't think the secret was intended for the Officials, more like a secret to the public!! "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Amazon 7 #31618 April 4, 2012 Dammit Janet Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31619 April 4, 2012 Just curious, what kind of chopper back then could fly that high-that fast-in that weather? 10,000 ft, light rain and 175 knots? Not an avionics expert. Ralph wrote the book describing what they did. I was told they could just barely keep up and the jets couldn't go slow enough. Ask Ralph what he flew. It might be in his book. And what good would shooting flares off DO at a couple hundred knots...light up where you WERE a couple miles back? I was not there, but they were close enough, as flares light up the entire sky from the ground. From the chopper the flares just blinded them. Couple miles? Who says? Blevins? I believe McCoy AND JANET. Do you even THINK about the logic of the BS you report? No, actually, I really don't. The ONLY thing I concentrate on is precise accuracy. The point of the planning was to AVOID logic. Upside down inside out. I do not read whole books, just exerps to verify truth and authenticity. When I run into an obvious falsehood, I give the book away. The only book I have is Gray's and I only read the pages he wrote about our visit. He got it all correct, but the Judge managed to slip in an untruth. My Dad never taught me the clock business. I just naturally gravitated to the spelter like the Judge did. Not my Dad's choice. He liked wooden pendulum clocks and pocket watches. I have hundreds of epic spelter statues, large Japy and Ansonia statue clocks which I restore. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Robert99 37 #31620 April 4, 2012 Quote Just curious, what kind of chopper back then could fly that high-that fast-in that weather? 10,000 ft, light rain and 175 knots? Not an avionics expert. Ralph wrote the book describing what they did. I was told they could just barely keep up and the jets couldn't go slow enough. Ask Ralph what he flew. It might be in his book. And what good would shooting flares off DO at a couple hundred knots...light up where you WERE a couple miles back? I was not there, but they were close enough, as flares light up the entire sky from the ground. From the chopper the flares just blinded them. Couple miles? Who says? Blevins? I believe McCoy. Do you even THINK about the logic of the BS you report? Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. The rest of the claims made by Knoss are also BS. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31621 April 4, 2012 Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. That sounds accurate and consistent with what I said. They also saw no parachute at any time. Your claim of BS is totally unfounded as what I claim is the actual truth. You just don't know it yet. You have the tennacity to search out the truth and you could do it if you really wanted to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Robert99 37 #31622 April 4, 2012 Quote Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. That sounds accurate and consistent with what I said. Except your claim of BS is totally unfounded as what I claim is the truth. You just don't know it yet. You have the tennacity to search out the truth and you could do it if you really wanted to. You need to read my response to your silly claims again. That response is NOT "accurate and consistent with what I (Knoss) said" as you claim. You don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mrshutter45 21 #31623 April 4, 2012 I think you may be thinking of flares that have chutes on them used to locate ground forces and so on, is it possible they had those but the chutes were sewn shut on them? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31624 April 4, 2012 QuoteQuote Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. That sounds accurate and consistent with what I said. Except your claim of BS is totally unfounded as what I claim is the truth. You just don't know it yet. You have the tennacity to search out the truth and you could do it if you really wanted to. You need to read my response to your silly claims again. That response is NOT "accurate and consistent with what I (Knoss) said" as you claim. You don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about! I read consistency. I repeated what McCoy reported. I see nothing at odds, just different words. I am not a pilot, just a reporter of fact. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BobKnoss 0 #31625 April 4, 2012 Quote I think you may be thinking of flares that have chutes on them used to locate ground forces and so on, is it possible they had those but the chutes were sewn shut on them? Chutes were sewn shut on flares?? Huh? I have no I idea what kind of flares were in the choppers. Only that they fired a couple or a few. "You don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about!" Don't believe I have to know how to swim to toss a life preserver. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1260 1261 1262 1263 1264 1265 1266 1267 1268 1269 1270 Next Page 1265 of 2543 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 47 47
airtwardo 6 #31616 April 4, 2012 The trailing helicopter was shooting flares up in the air above 305. Have you ever seen a flare? You would understand. She could easily see everything at that distance, given a good pair of eyes. Granted, a blind person would have problems. How far is the Moon? Similar lighting to a flare. Can you see the fine details when you get an opening in the clouds? Same thing. Quote Just curious, what kind of chopper back then could fly that high-that fast-in that weather? And what good would shooting flares off DO at a couple hundred knots...light up where you WERE a couple miles back? Do you even THINK about the logic of the BS you report? ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #31617 April 4, 2012 The witness statement I made was about a witness that could help your case, not your actual witness. I see we are back to the point of just a farm now vs a dairy farm, similar to the can that turned into a dairy can as your story rolled on. that's ok, can, dairy can, farm, dairy farm, all the same, moving on now. How much in detail can you go into on McCoy's jump? any special chute requests made on this jump, perhaps a Z or W chute? (code for a chute not tampered with) why was a second jump required? (after Cooper) he was able to hijack the plane (per instructions) he survived (according to you) the Cooper vein was named after his jump (success for project) Coopers name by record is the one responsible for new improved security features as intended going back to 1968, the only problem would be the missing money The FBI acting on the report of a hijacking were not part of the team. Some creative agent could have taken it upon himself to "FIX" the hijacker, or plant a tracker. If everyone knew of the plan, it would not have been a secret, would it? I would be more inclined to believe that if the X chute was in fact a dummy chute, the FBI would have notified the cockpit if it was found that Cooper was going to jump with someone, since they were 100% positive he was alone, the FBI remained silent about the chute with the X on it until after the jump. If everyone knew of the plan, it would not have been a secret, would it? I don't think the secret was intended for the Officials, more like a secret to the public!! "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #31619 April 4, 2012 Just curious, what kind of chopper back then could fly that high-that fast-in that weather? 10,000 ft, light rain and 175 knots? Not an avionics expert. Ralph wrote the book describing what they did. I was told they could just barely keep up and the jets couldn't go slow enough. Ask Ralph what he flew. It might be in his book. And what good would shooting flares off DO at a couple hundred knots...light up where you WERE a couple miles back? I was not there, but they were close enough, as flares light up the entire sky from the ground. From the chopper the flares just blinded them. Couple miles? Who says? Blevins? I believe McCoy AND JANET. Do you even THINK about the logic of the BS you report? No, actually, I really don't. The ONLY thing I concentrate on is precise accuracy. The point of the planning was to AVOID logic. Upside down inside out. I do not read whole books, just exerps to verify truth and authenticity. When I run into an obvious falsehood, I give the book away. The only book I have is Gray's and I only read the pages he wrote about our visit. He got it all correct, but the Judge managed to slip in an untruth. My Dad never taught me the clock business. I just naturally gravitated to the spelter like the Judge did. Not my Dad's choice. He liked wooden pendulum clocks and pocket watches. I have hundreds of epic spelter statues, large Japy and Ansonia statue clocks which I restore. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Robert99 37 #31620 April 4, 2012 Quote Just curious, what kind of chopper back then could fly that high-that fast-in that weather? 10,000 ft, light rain and 175 knots? Not an avionics expert. Ralph wrote the book describing what they did. I was told they could just barely keep up and the jets couldn't go slow enough. Ask Ralph what he flew. It might be in his book. And what good would shooting flares off DO at a couple hundred knots...light up where you WERE a couple miles back? I was not there, but they were close enough, as flares light up the entire sky from the ground. From the chopper the flares just blinded them. Couple miles? Who says? Blevins? I believe McCoy. Do you even THINK about the logic of the BS you report? Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. The rest of the claims made by Knoss are also BS. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #31621 April 4, 2012 Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. That sounds accurate and consistent with what I said. They also saw no parachute at any time. Your claim of BS is totally unfounded as what I claim is the actual truth. You just don't know it yet. You have the tennacity to search out the truth and you could do it if you really wanted to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Robert99 37 #31622 April 4, 2012 Quote Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. That sounds accurate and consistent with what I said. Except your claim of BS is totally unfounded as what I claim is the truth. You just don't know it yet. You have the tennacity to search out the truth and you could do it if you really wanted to. You need to read my response to your silly claims again. That response is NOT "accurate and consistent with what I (Knoss) said" as you claim. You don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #31623 April 4, 2012 I think you may be thinking of flares that have chutes on them used to locate ground forces and so on, is it possible they had those but the chutes were sewn shut on them? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #31624 April 4, 2012 QuoteQuote Ralph H. flew in either a Army National Guard or Army Reserve UH-1 helicopter. He did not see the airliner at any point. In 1971, no USA operational military helicopter could maintain 175 knots in level flight. There are some technical factors involved that Knoss obviously has never heard of. That sounds accurate and consistent with what I said. Except your claim of BS is totally unfounded as what I claim is the truth. You just don't know it yet. You have the tennacity to search out the truth and you could do it if you really wanted to. You need to read my response to your silly claims again. That response is NOT "accurate and consistent with what I (Knoss) said" as you claim. You don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about! I read consistency. I repeated what McCoy reported. I see nothing at odds, just different words. I am not a pilot, just a reporter of fact. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #31625 April 4, 2012 Quote I think you may be thinking of flares that have chutes on them used to locate ground forces and so on, is it possible they had those but the chutes were sewn shut on them? Chutes were sewn shut on flares?? Huh? I have no I idea what kind of flares were in the choppers. Only that they fired a couple or a few. "You don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about!" Don't believe I have to know how to swim to toss a life preserver. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
