DB Cooper

[DangerousDan 0]

The sucess was obvious and easy. The intended LZ Wasnt impossible to hit because it was night, it was possible to hit because it WAS night! What are the two things every skydiver would need to know before you exit solo on this load? Come on folks! This forum is DROPZONE! Arent there any skydivers on here that can step through what you would need? Did he have both? Of course he did!
Youve all been there. "OK. Door!" Im getting a peak. I am getting ready to exit, before I leave this ride, I know for sure:

1)

2)

[Robert99 37]

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Way to keep us (OK, me) on point pek771.

Flight 305 was vectored (not victored) to Reno somewhere around the Red Bluff VORTAC. Robert99 will know better where.

Victor 23 continues south to Sacramento and does not actually go to Reno. As far as the transcripts indicate, Flight 305 was following V-23 from launch to the vicinity of Red Bluff, CA.

Here’s the website with a pan-able group of aeronautical charts.

http://runwayfinder.com/?loc=RBL

You can click on the rectangle in the upper right that says ‘IFR Low’ and that will show V-23. You can trace it back up to Seattle or south to where it peters out in San Diego which is coincidentally where the US peters out.

The flight was basically on V-23 from Seattle to just a few miles north of the Red Bluff, CA VORTAC. The flight path the airliner followed in the Portland area is a matter of continuing disagreement. Hopefully, I will have more on this specific point in a few days.

Just before reaching the Red Bluff VORTAC, the Okland Center controller turned the aircraft direct to Reno. To clear the mountains between Red Bluff and Reno, the aircraft had climbed to 11,000 feet.

Once the aircraft had cleared the mountains it started descending at a requested rate of descent of only 300 to 500 feet per minute. Prior to being handed off to Oakland center, someone (presumably from NWA or Seattle ATC) had informed Oakland that the aircraft was having trouble turning. So the aircraft had trouble climbing out of Seattle, it had trouble turning, and it had trouble descending.

The descent into Reno was slow, involved a lot of turning, and included having to break off the first attempt at landing due to being to high.

The Oakland radio transcripts, including the phone chatter between controllers, is available on Sluggo's web page. If you read the Oakland transcripts, then also read the Seattle transcripts from take off to the hand off to Oakland center. You will probably notice how short and uninformative the Seattle transcripts are compared to the Oakland transcripts.

[Robert99 37]

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The sucess was obvious and easy. The intended LZ Wasnt impossible to hit because it was night, it was possible to hit because it WAS night! What are the two things every skydiver would need to know before you exit solo on this load? Come on folks! This forum is DROPZONE! Arent there any skydivers on here that can step through what you would need? Did he have both? Of course he did!
Youve all been there. "OK. Door!" Im getting a peak. I am getting ready to exit, before I leave this ride, I know for sure:

1)

2)

Dan, There is a small but important problem with your DZ idea. It seems that the airliner was at 10,000 feet, there was an overcast at 5,000 feet, there was a broken cloud layer at 3,500 feet, and there were scattered clouds below that.

The co-pilot of the airliner has been quoted by several sources as saying that they could not even see the lights of Portland when they passed through the area.

So unless Cooper had X-ray vision, he couldn't "spot" anything that night.

[Amazon 7]

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Clam? Clam?

Be a Dungeness crab Farflung. Mobile, aggressive, feared and respected. Just like you, but down a rung or two on Darwin's ladder.

Pretty damned tasty too.

Ask Amazon.

Glad to see you back Orange.
Those free air "tunnels" are wild. Go for it! Post some PIX!!!

377

Maybe we could get some wuffos in the tunnel...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpapAtcjR1I

or

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=Vl1HeQ8U-0I

[JerryThomas 0]

GreenElf: Sorry there will be no remaining money, the elements of time and the field mice have taken care of that. The chute still remains.As for any remnace of Cooper, it would be non existance. The ground in the area , even the area that was searched is harder than the ground near BUILDING 4 at FT Benning Ga where a few soldiers has streamed in. There Bodies were Mush.As is normal for this type of landing. I only mention that location because it is the easiest to verify.Still a search south of the Washougal Watershed will be fruitless. I have researched this case for 25yrs+ I have talked to many FBI agents and profesionals in there fields and those that were present in the original search.Ive talked to Both Scott and Rat the pilots. All have said a Columbia River landing was not possible due to the fact that the flight hadn't even gotten that far south yet.Now, Those that attended the symposim were lucky. Because in the audiance was a retired FBI agent by the first name of Gary , He was in one of the helicopters on the original search. He stated that the search area that was being searched was not as described by Tom Kaye he also said the flight path of the Aircraft was not what was published. After hearing this Info even Tom Kaye admitted that had he of known this his presentation would have been a lot different. The intire Symposim was recorded for future references, Jerry

[DangerousDan 0]

And their in lies your answer. See, you have just solved your own mystery! Youre gonna shoot yourself. 40 years of sleuthing over this?

[DangerousDan 0]

"Yes, I've jumped a round at night. No big deal."

Finally. Someone on a dropzone forum that can admit jumping a round at night is no big deal.

"I havent flown a Carvair. I have two hours of Learstar time though."

Loadstar? or Lear jet? Which Boeing have you flown from the right seat at night?

"Marla in a nun's habit? OMG. Farflung would blow an artery."

I might have mis-spoke, I meant to say you'll be getting nun of that. As a more subtle hidden meaning message: "It wasnt Duane."

Just remember, whenever youre lost out there in the woods, you can take up a 300 heading for 50 yards, or you can walk about 100 feet north, then 100 feet due west and you'll end up in just about the exact same spot! All courtesy of that indian we know as Sohcahtoa. Youre gonna shoot yourself!

[Robert99 37]

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And their in lies your answer. See, you have just solved your own mystery! Youre gonna shoot yourself. 40 years of sleuthing over this?

Dan, What are you talking about? Can you provide a coherent explanation of the above?

[AncestralManor 0]

Sohcahtoa is a Trig memory jogger.

[Robert99 37]

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Sohcahtoa is a Trig memory jogger.

The Sarah Palin part I can believe.

[DangerousDan 0]

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Sohcahtoa is a Trig memory jogger.

YES!!!...but I think you may be thinking of Bertha, the mammary jogger? She's about 5 foot tall but she cant see where she's walking except but about 5 feet in front of where she is. After that, its all academic. Thats why Bob Seger wrote that song. What a problem that would be, except that she really didnt need to see anyway! What a model for us she really was! And what a great song!

[JerryThomas 0]

Dan: Robert99 is one of the few that you do not want to chalenge on this forum he is highly respected and one of the best in his field. Yes I do chalenge him at time's. However when I do it is because of info relayed to me by those tat were there at the time of the original chase. and only has been do to weather paterns. Ive known Robert for about 3 yrs. Jerry

[ParrotheadVol 70]

Dan's suspect is McCoy.

"They were saying he was never gonna make it now, now that daylight had set in. But later that night, they were shining those lights back down on that mountain again." - Todd Snider

[AncestralManor 0]

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Sohcahtoa is a Trig memory jogger.

YES!!!...but I think you may be thinking of Bertha, the mammary jogger? She's about 5 foot tall but she cant see where she's walking except but about 5 feet in front of where she is. After that, its all academic. Thats why Bob Seger wrote that song. What a problem that would be, except that she really didnt need to see anyway! What a model for us she really was! And what a great song!

Nah, it looks like you were prodding folks into thinking about what can be seen above the cloud covers and triangulated -as has been done for centuries.

[DangerousDan 0]

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Dan: Robert99 is one of the few that you do not want to chalenge on this forum he is highly respected and one of the best in his field. Yes I do chalenge him at time's. However when I do it is because of info relayed to me by those tat were there at the time of the original chase. and only has been do to weather paterns. Ive known Robert for about 3 yrs. Jerry

Jerry - Thank you for your note. I hope that I am able to challenge all of you equally. All in fun. Someday you will all look back, maybe print this thread and every word of every sentance that came from me will make perfect sense. We are in the final days of this mystery. For some, it is going to leave a large hole without the lure of the mystery to keep it alive. Its like the withdrawl symptoms after the OJ trial where our US government and their expert investigation correctly determined that poor OJ could not have killed those people. He had a knife, but he never pulled it. "expert government official at work" For some, it will be a relief not to have to wrestle with it any more. For some, lifelong friends have been made, and what is wrong with that? When its done, I'll meet You boys for an evening to remember. Its on me, I found this pack of 20's down at Tena's bar so were all covered. All I can say is the people that broke into my garage and stole my 7 miniature Hymnals are gonna wish they hadnt messed that up so bad. In the end I am sure I will get my Hymnals back. And when I do you all will be the first to know! No disrespect intended sir and I apologize if any taken!

[JerryThomas 0]

ParrotheadVol:Ref Mc Coy Thats too bad not only is that impossible we already know where he was at on 24 Nov 1971. I honestly don't think anyone is that stupid not even Dan. Jerry

[DangerousDan 0]

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Sohcahtoa is a Trig memory jogger.

YES!!!...but I think you may be thinking of Bertha, the mammary jogger? She's about 5 foot tall but she cant see where she's walking except but about 5 feet in front of where she is. After that, its all academic. Thats why Bob Seger wrote that song. What a problem that would be, except that she really didnt need to see anyway! What a model for us she really was! And what a great song!

Nah, it looks like you were prodding folks into thinking about what can be seen above the cloud covers and triangulated -as has been done for centuries.

No that clearly wouldnt work, C/N and getting a shot on anything from that plane would be impossible. But see there, we just talked ourselves out of that hemisphere altogether! That only leaves the other one! You got it!

[JerryThomas 0]

Dan do you realy think Rich was Cooper. Please tell me that isn't so. Jerry

[ParrotheadVol 70]

I have watched Dan's video countless times, and the one thing that jumps out to me is the "simulated gun". We know McCoy used a fake or "simulated" gun to escape prison. If I'm not mistaken, didn't McCoy use a gun in the hijacking he was convicted of? I don't recall any gun in any of the DB Cooper stuff I've read. Maybe I am completely on the wrong track. But, this is the second time that I've pointed out that I think Dan is pointing toward McCoy. He has yet to say that it wasn't him, but he's real quick to say it isn't Weber or LD.

Either way, I look forward to seeing what Dan has.

"They were saying he was never gonna make it now, now that daylight had set in. But later that night, they were shining those lights back down on that mountain again." - Todd Snider

[DangerousDan 0]

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Dan do you realy think Rich was Cooper. Please tell me that isn't so. Jerry

I think you mean Cooper was just trying to be Rich? thats why he asked for cash? Whoever he was, he made a great ride for us all, and Jerry is probably one of the brightest people I know! Lots of possibilities I know, and who am I to say what is and is not so? All I intend to do is to tell the story that hasnt been told yet, and let ya'll will come to the same conclusion, and then you can tell me what was and what was not so. I'l be at the third stool from the end - darker is better. See you there!

[ParrotheadVol 70]

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Dan do you realy think Rich was Cooper. Please tell me that isn't so. Jerry

I think you mean Cooper was just trying to be Rich? thats why he asked for cash? Whoever he was, he made a great ride for us all, and Jerry is probably one of the brightest people I know! Lots of possibilities I know, and who am I to say what is and is not so? All I intend to do is to tell the story that hasnt been told yet, and let ya'll will come to the same conclusion, and then you can tell me what was and what was not so. I'l be at the third stool from the end - darker is better. See you there!

No denial of McCoy as your suspect? I will take that as confirmation that I am right. But, that's cool. I have no suspect that I favor as Cooper, so I'm open minded to whatever you have to say - regardless of who you point the finger at.

"They were saying he was never gonna make it now, now that daylight had set in. But later that night, they were shining those lights back down on that mountain again." - Todd Snider

[JerryThomas 0]

ParrotheadVol: Few people Know Mc Coys excepted nick name. If you ever called him Little anything he would get upset.C/N Was realy known as CCN and it was actualy based out of Da Nang. McCoys where abouts on 24 Nov !971 is actually known and has been verified. So Im not sure that anyone as intelegent as Dan is Talking about Richard McCoy. As a matter of fact I realy doubt it. Im told that Dans research is very good and he would not present anything that is not factual. And that includes a mistake such as claiming Richard McCoy was Cooper. Jerry

[DangerousDan 0]

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Dan do you realy think Rich was Cooper. Please tell me that isn't so. Jerry

I think you mean Cooper was just trying to be Rich? thats why he asked for cash? Whoever he was, he made a great ride for us all, and Jerry is probably one of the brightest people I know! Lots of possibilities I know, and who am I to say what is and is not so? All I intend to do is to tell the story that hasnt been told yet, and let ya'll will come to the same conclusion, and then you can tell me what was and what was not so. I'l be at the third stool from the end - darker is better. See you there!

No denial of McCoy as your suspect? I will take that as confirmation that I am right. But, that's cool. I have no suspect that I favor as Cooper, so I'm open minded to whatever you have to say - regardless of who you point the finger at.

You are an American citizen. You ar free to take anything as anything you want. I think there were a lot of viable candidates out there at one point, other than the obvious flops which we all know and don't need to discuss which are Duane, Pat's guy (girl I guess) and Marla's dream man. My job, as I have self induced it, is NOT to tell you who did or did not do it. Who am I to have been given that divine revelation? My job is to give you a fresh view to some aspects that you have not seen before, and be satisfied that you will come to your own conclusion on your own. Just like I did. Whatever that conclusion may be, I am OK with it. I know I aint the sharpest stick in the shed, but Ive done OK. You guys need to eat more at Taco Bell on this case! Heres a video of me landing the -3 from the right seat on a 1800 foot grass strip. In the beginning is a great side shot that illustrates the problem we face every day when flying airliners. See it? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfNVyG9_d1M

[georger 197]

The co-pilot of the airliner has been quoted by several sources as saying that they could not even see the lights of Portland when they passed through the area.

[georger 197]

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GreenElf: Sorry there will be no remaining money, the elements of time and the field mice have taken care of that. The chute still remains.As for any remnace of Cooper, it would be non existance. The ground in the area , even the area that was searched is harder than the ground near BUILDING 4 at FT Benning Ga where a few soldiers has streamed in. There Bodies were Mush.As is normal for this type of landing. I only mention that location because it is the easiest to verify.Still a search south of the Washougal Watershed will be fruitless. I have researched this case for 25yrs+ I have talked to many FBI agents and profesionals in there fields and those that were present in the original search.Ive talked to Both Scott and Rat the pilots. All have said a Columbia River landing was not possible due to the fact that the flight hadn't even gotten that far south yet.Now, Those that attended the symposim were lucky. Because in the audiance was a retired FBI agent by the first name of Gary , He was in one of the helicopters on the original search. He stated that the search area that was being searched was not as described by Tom Kaye he also said the flight path of the Aircraft was not what was published. After hearing this Info even Tom Kaye admitted that had he of known this his presentation would have been a lot different. The intire Symposim was recorded for future references, Jerry

remnace of Cooper ?

Transbation pleez?

Do you mean "remnonse"?