Canopy Swooping - Sport or Stupidity?

[paulledden 0]

Given the number of injuries and fatalities under functioning canopies, isn't it time we (the Skydiving community) excommunicated Swooping from our Sport. I remind you that we call it Skydiving because that's what we do it for. (Crew Dogs are excused because they don't do it at ground level (generally).

Swooping is giving Skydiving a bad name.

Regards

Paul

"The probability of being observed is directly proportinate to the stupidity of your actions at the time."

The probability of being observed is directly proportionate to the stupidity of your actions at the time!

[rsibbald 0]

Sport.

If you look at statistics, it's actually a lack of education about canopy piloting skills which is getting skydiving a bad reputation through injuries and deaths.

Edit to add: I can understand your perspective based on certain DZs I have been to, but the wider picture is thankfully safer. It all depends on how it is treated locally.

[piisfish 135]

Quote

Given the number of injuries and fatalities under functioning canopies, isn't it time we (the Skydiving community) excommunicated Swooping from our Sport.

injuries and fatalities under a functioning canopy do not mean that the involved people were swooping/trying to swoop.

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[grega 0]

I disagree.

-How many people died on swooping competitions?
-And how many people died on regular skydive without intention to swoop?

I don't think swooping is giving skydiving a bad name, the lack of knowledge and common sense is!

"George just lucky i guess!"

[Tonto 1]

With that logic we should ban driving, because "Given the number of injuries and fatalities" with functioning motor vehicles, something should be done!

I wonder what your personal views are on Freestyle, freeflying, speed skydiving, Wingsuits etc. Are they not "Skydiving" enough for you? Too skydiving for you?

The UK and the BPA are MASSIVELY over regulated. Signed off gear checks, compulsory hook knives, and yet last year the UK had it's fair share of fatals - and seems to be developing a suicide in the sport culture unseen elsewhere. Perhaps that's cos you guys don't have guns - but that's a thread for Speakers Corner.

These regulations are the thin end of the wedge. 20 years ago, the canopy you're currently jumping - a Sabre 2 - would have been deemed "too radical" for someone with your number of jumps.

You have more chance of excamunicating swoopers from skydiving than you do excluding sinners from the church.

As others have said - not all those who die under functioning canopies are swooping.

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[AndyMan 7]

You sound like my mother.

Wuffo you jump outta dem airplanes for?

_Am

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[paulledden 0]

Thanks Andy

It's reassuring to know that you're still occupying the prime plot in 'Thinker's Corner'.

Regards

Paul

The probability of being observed is directly proportionate to the stupidity of your actions at the time!

[ladyskydiver 0]

Sport

I don't swoop, but I've watched swoopers. From what I've seen (in general), they have a better skill set at handling their canopies.

The majority of the people injured/fatalities under a "perfectly good canopy" are ones that have been under canopies they shouldn't have been or have done panic moves, etc.

Swooping isn't what is giving the Skydiving a bad name.

Life is short! Break the rules! Forgive quickly! Kiss slowly! Love truly, Laugh uncontrollably. And never regret anything that made you smile.

[AggieDave 6]

If you look at the number of fatalities and the experience level you'll see its not the swoopers getting killed, its the low jump jumpers (sub 500 jump) that are doing stupid maneuvers close to the ground.

Personally, I love swooping, it feels good, its hard to do, the challenge of learning how to do it and the amount of time I've put in to get to even the mediocor level I'm at now is what really makes it worth while.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[Bartje 0]

Quote

Swooping is giving Skydiving a bad name.

Call it parachute jumping. As I remember it al started with a parachutejump before FreeFall.
In fact is Swooping a trip to the past.
And Paul, thx to people like you as a non swooper,swooping is getting a bad name.

A FreeFly Gypsy

[stuartledden 0]

Check out mjosparky's post "Landing/hook turn fatalities" on this forum for your answer to your question!!!! 'nough said!

Don't forget to pull your stopping ropes!

[pilotdave 0]

Ya know how many people have asked me "have you seen this pond skimming thing? there was an article in___...looks like a lot of fun..." Even RealTV did a POSITIVE piece on swooping.

When a speed skiier doing 100mph crashes on tv, do you think it gives skiing a bad name?

I think swooping is great for the sport. But on the other hand, inexperienced jumpers learning to swoop without proper instruction could do all kinds of harm to the sport. But swooping in general has a very positive image, in my opinion.

Dave

[mr2mk1g 10]

You're right - ban these new fangled hook turns!

[AggieDave 6]

Ha, yeah. One of my instructors from my SL days broke his ankle back in the early '70s doing a hook turn too low on a Para-Commander.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[CanuckInUSA 0]

Quote

isn't it time we (the Skydiving community) excommunicated Swooping from our Sport.

Cool ... please do so (there's always BASE jumping and Ground Launching to keep me busy). Why would I want to be around someone like you with such a close minded view towards this ever evolving sport. Better hope you don't ever hurt yourself under canopy as you are going to look rather foolish when it's reported. And if you think you're immune from doing this, you better start reading the incident reports again. Anyone of us regardless of how many or how little jumps we have, what gear we jump, where we jump, or what disciplines we choose are capable of being hurt and dying in this sport. It's not just the swoopers who die.

Swooping is not a safe activity, but then neither is jumping out of airplanes to begin with.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[superstu 0]

I personally know more people on the bigger "regular" parachutes not trying to swoop hurt them selves then the few of us at my dz that swoop all day long.
And also, ***Crew Dogs are excused because they don't do it at ground level (generally).***My self and couple of my friends are always doing canopy runs under our small mains, so are we excluded from being "excommunicated" as well. your post just doesn't make sense to me.

Slip Stream Air Sports
Do not go softly, do not go quietly, never back down

[alanab 0]

thats like asking if skydiving is a posrt or stupidity

[LawnDart21 0]

Amen Dave, its not swooping that kills its "Gotta Go Big" mentalities exibited by over zealous short time jumpers who believe that "no one understands my skills" and that they are "different".

As I've said before, (don't want to rehash it all), only the ground can stop these people, and generally it does. Thats life on DZs these days. Can't change it. So be it.

Personally at this point in my career, (tandems aside), I only skydive so I can swoop. Early on, canopy flight was the "bonus" of my skydive. Now a days, the skydive is the "bonus" of my swoop. But thats just me.

And as anyone that has ever dragged a foot across the water and emerged dry on the shore line can agree, swooping is a very rewarding/exciting aspect of our sport.

Tom

--
My other ride is a RESERVE.

[AggieDave 6]

Quote

Personally at this point in my career, (tandems aside), I only skydive so I can swoop. Early on, canopy flight was the "bonus" of my skydive. Now a days, the skydive is the "bonus" of my swoop. But thats just me.

HA! Same here. I love doing tandems and I love swooping, beyond that ok sure we can go do *insert freefly dive or RW dive here* but as long as I can swoop.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[Designer 0]

There is no "Mistaking" of it now and in the future of becoming a main stream sport?(media coverage)The problem is still the same.Just 1 "Dumbass" will ruin everybody else's hard work.The world class guys and gals have all put in the time and that(Swooping)is their "Job"!The last thing they need is some "Idiot" mucking up the works.Put in the time.rob

[piisfish 135]

my innocent question...

Is Stuart the son of Paul ?
Is Stuart an 80 jump wonder swooper wannabe ??
Does Paul ask Stuart : Wuffo you wanna surf that perfect grass??
Does Stuart answer : my X-jumps friend said I would be OK ??
No personal attack, just trying to find out.

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[darkwing 4]

You might as well say "Skydiving - Sport or Stupidity?"

Which is something many (most?) non-jumpers would consider a good question.

-- Jeff
My Skydiving History

[GTAVercetti 0]

Quote

Given the number of injuries and fatalities under functioning canopies, isn't it time we (the Skydiving community) excommunicated Swooping from our Sport. I remind you that we call it Skydiving because that's what we do it for. (Crew Dogs are excused because they don't do it at ground level (generally).

Swooping is giving Skydiving a bad name.

Regards

Paul

"The probability of being observed is directly proportinate to the stupidity of your actions at the time."

I do not swoop yet, but would like to in the future. Ultimately, the canopy portion of my skydive takes a longer time than my freefall at this point. And being that I pay 21 dollars each jump, why would I not utilize the latte (and longer) portion of my jump doing something?

I use that time to play with my risers up high and practice turns for when I want to swoop in the future.

If anything, swooping is what will get our sport more recognized in the future. Whuffos cannot see the freefall portion live just yet, but they can see a canopy speeding across the ground. If anything, we should embrace those who have taken the time to learn to swoop properly.

Not to mention also: What is better on a full load on a hot day than the extra space resulting from a swooper's low pass?

Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing.

[billvon 2,406]

>isn't it time we (the Skydiving community) excommunicated Swooping from our Sport.

I can remember when freak flying (now called freeflying) bigway RW and AAD's were all black death. "You're jumping with an AAD? What if you're in the crotch and your AAD fires and your reserve wraps around the strut and kills everyone in the plane? I'm not jumping with you, you dangerous lunatic."

Now swooping is black death. Stick around another ten years, and speed skydiving, or wigsuit bigway, or high-G freefly will be black death, and you'll have forgotten about swooping and be all over banning these new things. There are always new things to want to ban. Fortunately for the us, there are more people who try to advance rather than try to stop the sport.

[paulledden 0]

Piisfish

He's my little brother and you know what they can be like maybe.

I'm just asking the question about swooping. In the UK, bad publicity for the Sport generally can result in grants from the Sports Council being withdrawn and induce political interference and regulation.

I think authority tends to start interfering when people keep dying. Our equipment is generally tip-top for reliability these days but to Joe Public and Authority a death is a death. I believe Skydiving is a very safe sport, I just question whether swooping is a means of the sport shooting itself in the foot politically.

I managed to break my tib' and fib' doing accuracy a couple of years ago on a PD190 - what do I know? (I know it hurt - a lot!)

If you keep swooping - enjoy and be careful - you're braver than me!

Regards

Paul

The probability of being observed is directly proportionate to the stupidity of your actions at the time!