EVs, Aspirations vs Reality

[SethInMI 145]

15 hours ago, brenthutch said:

I’ll stick with my Accord coupe, V6 278hp six speed, paid off and more fun to drive than a glorified four wheel sewing machine 

I got a laugh out of this line so thanks for that. I got a 480 HP AWD "sewing machine" that is very fun to drive. More fun than my 300 HP Subaru STi was. 

And I just got back from a 1400 mi round trip to visit my sis in NC. No waiting for charging. Was I in and out in 5 min? No, but 15-20 min really isn't that long. Stretch your legs, get some lunch or dinner.  And I can couple that with the fact I don't have to wait that 5 min any other time of year, the standing outside my car freezing in the winter or sweating in summer while it fuels is long past for me.

[brenthutch 383]

3 minutes ago, SethInMI said:

the standing outside my car freezing in the winter or sweating in summer while it fuels is long past for me.

You must not realize you don’t have to stand outside you car while refueling anymore than you would have to stand outside while charging 

[tkhayes 126]

1 hour ago, brenthutch said:

https://www.repairerdrivennews.com/2023/10/19/nearly-half-of-ev-households-reverted-to-ice-vehicle-for-next-purchase-study-shows/
 

excluding Tesla fan-boyz

From the DoT

“Level 1

Level 1 equipment provides charging through a common residential 120-volt (120V) AC outlet. Level 1 chargers can take 40-50+ hours to charge a BEV to 80 percent from empty 

Level 2

Level 2 equipment offers higher-rate AC charging through 240V (in residential applications) or 208V (in commercial applications) electrical service, and is common for home, workplace, and public charging. Level 2 chargers can charge a BEV to 80 percent from empty in 4-10 hours”

 

we already hashed this in the thread but apparently you have a short memory or are just content to continue to parrot your bullshit

a century ago, you had to plan your trip around where there might be a gas station because we did not have enough of them.  Now we do.  The same will happen with EVs and charging capabilities, whther they are centralized today and distributed tomorrow, if there is a dollar to be made from it, someone will step up and provide that capacity.  New homes are already being built with the needed infrastructure to accommodate future needs.

To continue to badger the lack of charging stations this early in your 'it should have all happened by now' fantasy, demonstrates a lack of intelligence and/or the lacking ability to even comprehend the future.

Hell you did not even acknowledge the idea that the USA energy strategy MIGHT JUST INCLUDE conserving our old and gas for the future....

And if everyone bought an EV tomorrow, well the next day sales would actually plummet to zero.... and you would be able to post a new troll titled 'see...! EV Sales plummet!  I was right!'.  again, your posts offer NOTHING to any conversation.  they point out no problem, they do not even identify a problem, and they do not offer any information that might help with an existing one, even if you could define it.

owning the libs again..... yawn

[JoeWeber 2,299]

7 minutes ago, tkhayes said:

Hell you did not even acknowledge the idea that the USA energy strategy MIGHT JUST INCLUDE conserving our old and gas for the future....

 

So complex hydrocarbons might have other absolute and potential uses besides once through the tailpipe? Who could have guessed?

[normiss 622]

40 minutes ago, tkhayes said:

we already hashed this in the thread but apparently you have a short memory or are just content to continue to parrot your bullshit

a century ago, you had to plan your trip around where there might be a gas station because we did not have enough of them.  Now we do.  The same will happen with EVs and charging capabilities, whther they are centralized today and distributed tomorrow, if there is a dollar to be made from it, someone will step up and provide that capacity.  New homes are already being built with the needed infrastructure to accommodate future needs.

To continue to badger the lack of charging stations this early in your 'it should have all happened by now' fantasy, demonstrates a lack of intelligence and/or the lacking ability to even comprehend the future.

Hell you did not even acknowledge the idea that the USA energy strategy MIGHT JUST INCLUDE conserving our old and gas for the future....

And if everyone bought an EV tomorrow, well the next day sales would actually plummet to zero.... and you would be able to post a new troll titled 'see...! EV Sales plummet!  I was right!'.  again, your posts offer NOTHING to any conversation.  they point out no problem, they do not even identify a problem, and they do not offer any information that might help with an existing one, even if you could define it.

owning the libs again..... yawn

Those damn charging parking slots at the grocery store though. Why can't I park my antique truck where I want to???

At least I don't have a hand crank starter.

[brenthutch 383]

44 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

So complex hydrocarbons might have other absolute and potential uses besides once through the tailpipe? Who could have guessed?

How about saving some of our lithium, nickel, cobalt, manganese, and graphite?

[ryoder 1,384]

52 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

So complex hydrocarbons might have other absolute and potential uses besides once through the tailpipe? Who could have guessed?

I just want to say one word to you. Just one word.
Plastics.
There's a great future in plastics. Think about it. Will you think about it?

 

[brenthutch 383]

2 hours ago, SethInMI said:

I got a laugh out of this line so thanks for that. I got a 480 HP AWD "sewing machine" that is very fun to drive. More fun than my 300 HP Subaru STi was. 

And I just got back from a 1400 mi round trip to visit my sis in NC. No waiting for charging. Was I in and out in 5 min? No, but 15-20 min really isn't that long. Stretch your legs, get some lunch or dinner.  And I can couple that with the fact I don't have to wait that 5 min any other time of year, the standing outside my car freezing in the winter or sweating in summer while it fuels is long past for me.

Assuming a Tesla 3 and available superchargers at every stop you would have spent at least two hours charging, as BillV put so eloquently, “my time is more valuable than that”

[olofscience 421]

1 hour ago, brenthutch said:

How about saving some of our lithium, nickel, cobalt, manganese, and graphite?

...and use them for what? Do you eat those?

[olofscience 421]

3 hours ago, brenthutch said:

You must not realize you don’t have to stand outside you car while refueling anymore than you would have to stand outside while charging 

At least for the UK, trigger locks on petrol pumps are not a thing (safety standards)

Edited December 31, 2023 by olofscience

[billvon 2,400]

1 hour ago, brenthutch said:

Assuming a Tesla 3 and available superchargers at every stop you would have spent at least two hours charging, as BillV put so eloquently, “my time is more valuable than that”

I spend less time charging than you do getting gas.  Sorry about the facts.

But again, if your time is less valuable, go for it.

[billvon 2,400]

2 hours ago, brenthutch said:

How about saving some of our lithium, nickel, cobalt, manganese, and graphite?

Excellent idea.  Instead of burning them, we should use them to make batteries, then reuse those materials over and over by reusing then recycling the batteries!

[SethInMI 145]

1 hour ago, brenthutch said:

Assuming a Tesla 3 and available superchargers at every stop you would have spent at least two hours charging, as BillV put so eloquently, “my time is more valuable than that”

No. 5 stops, 1.5 hrs total time.  You act like sitting in your car is completely wasted time, but I would disagree. Giving yourself a break every few hours is nice. We watch Netflix on the car screen. 

But I can't win the "we can get there faster so you suck" argument...although like I said, I likely spend less time fueling per year than you do, so if your time is very valuable, maybe an electric car should be on your list. 

 

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

1 hour ago, olofscience said:

At least for the UK, trigger locks on petrol pumps are not a thing (safety standards)

Yeah, not watching the pump nozzle when you are putting gas in is REALLY stupid.
And dangerous.

Note: In the US, for a vehicle hauling hazardous materials (HazMat), it's legally required to be in view of the pump when fueling.

[brenthutch 383]

1 hour ago, SethInMI said:

No. 5 stops, 1.5 hrs total time.  You act like sitting in your car is completely wasted time, but I would disagree. Giving yourself a break every few hours is nice. We watch Netflix on the car screen. 

But I can't win the "we can get there faster so you suck" argument...although like I said, I likely spend less time fueling per year than you do, so if your time is very valuable, maybe an electric car should be on your list. 

 

You must not have children 

BTW there is a big difference in taking a break because you want to and taking a break because you have to.

Not to mention the massive depreciation of EVs relative to normal vehicles (50% vs 30% in three years) which negates any financial advantage EVs have with regard to “refueling”

Edited December 31, 2023 by brenthutch

[JoeWeber 2,299]

11 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

You must not have children 

BTW there is a big difference in taking a break because you want to and taking a break because you have to.

No there is not, or do you often just stop and hang it over the bowl because FUN?

[brenthutch 383]

15 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

No there is not, or do you often just stop and hang it over the bowl because FUN?

I don’t even know what to do with that 

[Phil1111 911]

1 minute ago, brenthutch said:

I don’t even know what to do with that 

Its ok we all know the history of Luddites  People Had To Be Convinced of the Usefulness of Electricity " In 1920, electricity wasn’t something that many people thought they needed, says the Library of Congress. New York Edison still had to push businesses to adopt not just their technology, but the technology of electricity to begin with."

[brenthutch 383]

2 minutes ago, Phil1111 said:

Its ok we all know the history of Luddites  People Had To Be Convinced of the Usefulness of Electricity " In 1920, electricity wasn’t something that many people thought they needed, says the Library of Congress. New York Edison still had to push businesses to adopt not just their technology, but the technology of electricity to begin with."

It is going to be a much harder lift to convince folks to replace their affordable, long range, towing capable, quickly refueled, easy repaired, value retaining vehicles with expensive, quickly depreciating, slow to recharge, expensive to fix, limited range and towing capacity EVs with dubious infrastructure support.

[JoeWeber 2,299]

55 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

It is going to be a much harder lift to convince folks to replace their affordable, long range, towing capable, quickly refueled, easy repaired, value retaining vehicles with expensive, quickly depreciating, slow to recharge, expensive to fix, limited range and towing capacity EVs with dubious infrastructure support.

Some things seem to occur at speeds too fast or too slow for some folks, I reckon.

Edited December 31, 2023 by JoeWeber

[brenthutch 383]

8 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

Some things seem to occur at speeds too fast or too slow for some folks, I reckon.

Not some folks, most folks as indicated by the dramatic drop in the growth of EV sales.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/personalfinance/2023/11/14/ev-sales-2023-slow-inventory-pile-up/71572499007/

[billvon 2,400]

1 hour ago, brenthutch said:

It is going to be a much harder lift to convince folks to replace their affordable, long range, towing capable, quickly refueled, easy repaired, value retaining vehicles with expensive, quickly depreciating, slow to recharge, expensive to fix, limited range and towing capacity EVs with dubious infrastructure support.

Since it's happening right now, apparently not that hard a lift.  Even if you can't figure out those newfangled contraptions, apparently millions of others can.

==========================================================

US EVs skyrocket past 1 million sales, up 50.7% YOY

Michelle Lewis 

Year-to-date US EV sales have surpassed 1 million – the first time EV sales exceeded that threshold in a single sales year.

The National Automobile Dealer Association (NADA) reports that through 11 months of 2023, BEV sales totaled 1,007,984 – an increase of 50.7% year-over-year.

https://electrek.co/2023/12/05/us-ev-sales-pass-1-million-2023/#:~:text=One million EV sales in,January to 7.2% in October.

[brenthutch 383]

1 hour ago, billvon said:

Since it's happening right now, apparently not that hard a lift.  Even if you can't figure out those newfangled contraptions, apparently millions of others can.

==========================================================

US EVs skyrocket past 1 million sales, up 50.7% YOY

Michelle Lewis 

Year-to-date US EV sales have surpassed 1 million – the first time EV sales exceeded that threshold in a single sales year.

The National Automobile Dealer Association (NADA) reports that through 11 months of 2023, BEV sales totaled 1,007,984 – an increase of 50.7% year-over-year.

https://electrek.co/2023/12/05/us-ev-sales-pass-1-million-2023/#:~:text=One million EV sales in,January to 7.2% in October.

Just wait Bill, just wait. The trend is not your friend my friend.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelharley/2023/10/30/5-reasons-why-electric-vehicle-sales-have-slowed/?sh=3d947c765110

You guys are not dummies, you know the wave of early adopters has crested, why do you persist in this nonsense?

Edited January 1 by brenthutch

[lippy 771]

34 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

Just wait Bill, just wait. The trend is not your friend my friend.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelharley/2023/10/30/5-reasons-why-electric-vehicle-sales-have-slowed/?sh=3d947c765110

Yeah you’ve never made an incorrect prediction about the future of EV’s. Where was Tesla stock at the last time you declared with certainty that they were on the way out?
 

You’re so dead set on this not being a viable option, you’re telling Seth he’s wrong when he’s saying that it works for him!!!! 
 

Happy New Year Brent….as they say, “Out with the old, in with the new”

[brenthutch 383]

1 minute ago, lippy said:

Yeah you’ve never made an incorrect prediction about the future of EV’s. Where was Tesla stock at the last time you declared with certainty that they were on the way out?
 

You’re so dead set on this not being a viable option, you’re telling Seth he’s wrong when he’s saying that it works for him!!!! 
 

Happy New Year Brent….as they say, “Out with the old, in with the new”

Happy new year brother! I was wrong about Tesla, full stop. I never said it didn’t work for Seth, I just added some much needed context.