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winsor

Woke is a Joke

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59 minutes ago, lippy said:

Can you provide a link to this mythical evil CRT Bible or is it a fabrication of the right used to keep the uneducated angry?

One of the central themes of CRT - and one of the reasons that so many on the right are violently opposed to it - is that some racism is structural and not individual.  In other words, the guy at the bank who is implementing redlining may not be racist (and has a black friend, and supports civil rights etc) - but the structure itself causes racist outcomes.

This is anathema to many conservatives who feel as long as THEY are not being racist, there is no racism, and therefore nothing to fix.  And if you are trying to fix something given that they are not racist, you're a demented social justice warrior who is actually the real racist, because you are trying to help people who, by conservative definitions, do not need any help.  Winsor regularly posts along these lines.

So they create a carciature that's easier to attack.  FOX and Breitbart have the clown-car carciature down to a science - as soon as an old claim loses its ability to outrage, a new one pops out of the back of the car.  CRT is racist!  CRT teaches white kids to hate themselves.  Why, my poor daughter cried for weeks when her teacher blah blah blah.  Oh was that story fake?  Then CRT is intolerance, and will divide America!

The intolerance claim is especially funny.  After living with being literally enslaved for a few hundred years, then treated as non-citizens for decades, then as an official government-sanctioned underclass for decades more, black people now hear that conservatives will not stand for intolerance when it might be directed at them.

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24 minutes ago, billvon said:

Again, this is also the argument against teaching Holocaust studies.  Why make Jewish children hate German children?  Wouldn't not knowing be better for them, and let them get over their old hate?

Answer - no.

Holocaust studies, as I experienced them, were literature written by historians taught as history. The authors of CRT are largely activists and lawyers. The message is different.

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38 minutes ago, metalslug said:

Holocaust studies, as I experienced them, were literature written by historians taught as history. The authors of CRT are largely activists and lawyers. The message is different.

Which CRT courses did you take?

 

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5 minutes ago, billvon said:

Which CRT courses did you take?

Zero. I didn't take courses on Lord of the Rings either, although it was a good read. Taking courses is not a requirement for knowing the nature of the authors and the content. Which 'Great Replacement Theory' courses did you take?

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6 hours ago, metalslug said:

A disgraceful statement. Holocaust studies are not a theory and to attempt to compare that to CRT is probably deeply insulting to the Jewish community. CRT, if you've ever read more than a few lines of the original literature, is significantly more skewed than a mere recounting of history.

I don't think you know what Holocaust studies are. The Holocaust itself isn't a theory, just like slavery, Jim Crow and the KKK aren't theories. The study of many things around the Holocaust (how it happened, why it happened, how people went along with it, what repercussions does it have today etc etc) are absolutely theories. If Holocaust studies was just the fact of the Holocaust then it wouldn't be a branch of academia anymore, there would just be a book of what happened in the Holocaust. But that'a not how History works.

 

Now, please tell us more about this original CRT literature you've been reading. I'm fascinated.

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5 hours ago, metalslug said:

The clearest evidence yet that you've never read it. The original work was not a stand-alone publication. Do you feel angry?   If you need it concise, try this.

What's wrong with it? What makes you angry about it?

 

And how is it a part of the original literature when it was put together 30 years after the beginnings of CRT?

 

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4 hours ago, metalslug said:

Holocaust studies, as I experienced them, were literature written by historians taught as history. The authors of CRT are largely activists and lawyers. The message is different.

CRT arose as a study of racial injustice in the US legal system. The people studying it are supposed to be lawyers.

 

Is maths bad because it's taught by mathematicians, not historians?

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(edited)
2 hours ago, jakee said:

And how is it a part of the original literature when it was put together 30 years after the beginnings of CRT?

?? Carefully read my part that you quoted, observing the punctuation too. You might realise that I made two separate literature references in that statement; the original work and the 'concise'.

2 hours ago, jakee said:

The people studying it are supposed to be lawyers.

Tell that to the educators pushing it through schools.

2 hours ago, jakee said:

Is maths bad because it's taught by mathematicians, not historians?

Non sequitur.  My statement that you replied you stands.

3 hours ago, olofscience said:

So which bit of this do you think is bad?

Nothing. I think my statement that you're replying to was fine in all respects.

Edited by metalslug

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1 hour ago, metalslug said:

?? Carefully read my part that you quoted, observing the punctuation too. You might realise that I made two separate literature references in that statement; the original work and the 'concise'.

So what 'original' CRT work have you read, and what do you dislike about it?

 

Of the concise version, have you read it and can you give an example from it of what you dislike?

Quote

Tell that to the educators pushing it through schools.

Holy goalpost change batman! What educators are pushing it through schools and what exactly are they pushing?

Then, what does the thing they are pushing have to do with the things you dislike in the original literature of CRT?

 

And to go back to Holocaust studies, why do you think it doesn't involve any theory? Do you believe it's just an exercise in listing events? I'm not quite sure why you're trying to insult all the Hoocaust academics out there.

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11 minutes ago, jakee said:

Holy goalpost change batman! What educators are pushing it through schools and what exactly are they pushing?

Are you genuinely still unaware that there's a push (even an existing practice) of teaching CRT in US schools? You've no idea why bill compared CRT to Holocaust studies?  51 pages into this thread and yourself and Olof are still at the starting blocks asking old questions about CRT?  If that's where you are then I can't engage with you further as you're either trolling or demonstrating an abject inability to follow the thread (and even some individual posts), neither of which I have patience for. 

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Just now, metalslug said:

Are you genuinely still unaware that there's a push (even an existing practice) of teaching CRT in US schools?

CRT as a discipline is not on the syllabi of elementary through Jr. high schools in the US. It might be an allowed area of study in some high schools, but I'd bet that it's not a central theme.

The acknowledgment of policies like redlining, and the downstream effects of longstanding practices in the US are considered to be "critical race theory" by some. They're not -- those are the study of the effects of facts on society, just as the study of the effect of the Civil War on southern US life and its economy is a perfectly valid area of study.

Identifying where a statement of "the government is not racist" is potentially inaccurate is not sedition.

Wendy P.

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2 hours ago, metalslug said:

51 pages into this thread

It's 51 pages of an old man yelling at a cloud...

2 hours ago, metalslug said:

yourself and Olof are still at the starting blocks asking old questions about CRT?

Starting blocks? That implies you're ahead on something. Hate and fear?

2 hours ago, metalslug said:

If that's where you are then I can't engage with you further

You never even started. Didn't even answer the simplest question.

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2 hours ago, metalslug said:

51 pages into this thread and yourself and Olof are still at the starting blocks asking old questions about CRT? 

Provide some actual evidence then. Curriculums are documented, show a few of them with CRT on it.

Maybe some people want evidence for things you blindly accept as true?

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(edited)
4 hours ago, metalslug said:

Are you genuinely still unaware that there's a push (even an existing practice) of teaching CRT in US schools? 

A push by who, and teaching what, exactly? Are they teaching principles from the original literature of CRT? What is that literature and what is within it that you find so objectionable.

 

Quote

You've no idea why bill compared CRT to Holocaust studies?  51 pages into this thread and yourself and Olof are still at the starting blocks asking old questions about CRT?  If that's where you are then I can't engage with you further as you're either trolling or demonstrating an abject inability to follow the thread (and even some individual posts), neither of which I have patience for. 

Lol. It's absolutely hilarious that you're pretending to take the intellectual high ground when what you're actually doing is trying to distract from the fact that you were lying about having read 'the original' CRT literature.:rofl:

Edited by jakee

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14 hours ago, metalslug said:

Zero. I didn't take courses on Lord of the Rings either, although it was a good read. Taking courses is not a requirement for knowing the nature of the authors and the content. Which 'Great Replacement Theory' courses did you take?

Never took any such course.  An old friend of mine (now philosophy professor at a Northeast college) teaches a CRT course along with three other colleagues.  So I am going to take her word over yours as to what's in CRT courses.  Sorry.

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6 hours ago, metalslug said:

Are you genuinely still unaware that there's a push (even an existing practice) of teaching CRT in US schools?

So show us where one of these evil white-hating courses is taught to primary school kids. Just one.

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For some reason this didn't show up in the Times:

https://nypost.com/2022/06/18/detransitioned-teens-explain-why-they-regret-changing-genders/

I am very much in favor or criminal proceedings against people who perform sex reassignment on otherwise normal children.

If someone wants to change their gender identity as an adult, fine.  They can self-identify as a gargoyle and undergo surgery to effect that transformation for all I care.  It's supposedly a free country.

Having said that, anyone who thinks that middle-school children are suited to making long term, binding, life altering decisions is an idiot and should be charged with child abuse (for starts) for enabling them.

Religion is but one form of communicable mental illness, and the Woke variant is peculiarly  pathological.  Admittedly, throwing people off of buildings for being homosexual gives Islam an edge, but I get the impression that Woke is not to be outdone in the long run.  In the race to see who is more fucked up, it's rather a tie.

 

BSBD,

Winsor

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11 hours ago, winsor said:

Having said that, anyone who thinks that middle-school children are suited to making long term, binding, life altering decisions is an idiot and should be charged with child abuse (for starts) for enabling them.

Correct, ballet and gymnastics for children should absolutely be banned.

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14 hours ago, winsor said:

Having said that, anyone who thinks that middle-school children are suited to making long term, binding, life altering decisions is an idiot and should be charged with child abuse (for starts) for enabling them.

I look forward to your brave campaign to have anyone who circumcises their child, or repairs their cleft palate, arrested.

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14 hours ago, mistercwood said:

Correct, ballet and gymnastics for children should absolutely be banned.

You equate ballet and gymnastics with 'gender affirming' vivisection.  I am in awe of your semantic prowess.

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15 hours ago, billvon said:

I look forward to your brave campaign to have anyone who circumcises their child, or repairs their cleft palate, arrested.

It is of course perfectly normal for the Mohel to suck the foreskin off the penis, that is just cultural tradition.

Discussing gender fluidity with a teen, that is clearly child abuse.

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