Rent vs. buy used

[k_marr08 0]

Hello. I am a student skydiver (just graduated AFF) - I've been jumping a 200 (I weigh between 135-150, depending on the day) and would like to do some research as far as buying my first used rig - I figure I have some time before I get my A - Should I continue renting gear at the dz or should I buy used after I get licensed?? I would speak with my instructors as far as what exactly to get, but the reason for posting is that jumps cost $65 each now, and if I buy a used rig (with all safety features of course) they could cost $25 each plus a pack job.

"I believe the risks I take are justified by the sheer love of the life I lead" - Charles Lindbergh

[AFFI 0]

Buy.

[Mostly_Harmless 0]

Katie,
I think it's definately worth buying a used rig. I know that when I use to rent gear from SDLI I had to make sure I got there early to get the one I wanted. I wouldn't be so quick as to add the cost of a pack job to your ticket. As a requirement for your "A" you do need to pack and jump your own packjob. When I first started out I thought that I would never want to pack my own stuff but after doing it for a while I realize there was no need to spend $7 dollars to have someone do it for me. I normally do anywhere from 5-8 jumps (forget about doing that many jumps on a busy day at SDLI when the packers are busy doing the tandems and video guys rigs) in a good day so thats $35-$56 I am spending on something I could do myself. Talk to Richie about your gear he will steer you in the right direction.

_________________________________________
www.myspace.com/termvelocity

[ChrisL 2]

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if I buy a used rig (with all safety features of course) they could cost $25 each plus a pack job.

You arent that far from your A. What, maybe 10 or 15 jumps?

Learn to pack. Just because some people can afford to pay packers forever doesnt mean thats how you have to be. Especially if money IS an object

__

My mighty steed

[k_marr08 0]

Hi Steve OK good point with the packing - haven't done it yet so I'm kinda nervous about jumping something I packed - And yes money is an issue. Thanks everyone

"I believe the risks I take are justified by the sheer love of the life I lead" - Charles Lindbergh

[wmw999 2,123]

Packing is something that (most) experienced skydivers do as a matter of course, but it's no different from any other skill -- you have to learn it, and practice it. It's not that hard, but you have to do it enough times that the things that are important are automatic.

And there's nothing wrong with making yourself a checklist until you're comfortable with remembering what you have to check.

And there's nothing wrong with buying used. I jump pre-owned gear (until last year, even my jumpsuit was used, and it was great -- in some ways, better than my current one). Just make sure you become familiar with it, and have an experienced rigger/instructor type person check it out, and teach you about it.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[kenneth21441 0]

I would say that if you plan on staying on with skydiving that you buy your own rig.
It will pay for it self in the long run just be sure to pay yourself back for it.

New and used gear has its good points and bad points but the best thing to state here is get any gear checked by a rigger.

Personally I got new gear so it fit me like I wanted with the colors that I wanted and etc....

Hope this helps,

Enjoy,.

Kenneth Potter
FAA Senior Parachute Rigger
Tactical Delivery Instructor (Jeddah, KSA)
FFL Gunsmith

[AFFI 0]

And you will feel much better in your own gear, that you take care of and it is not passed around like a bong at a hippie party.

[psipike02 0]

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And you will feel much better in your own gear, that you take care of and it is not passed around like a bong at a hippie party.

Puttin' some stank on it.

----Hellfish #707----

[kelpdiver 2]

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but the reason for posting is that jumps cost $65 each now, and if I buy a used rig (with all safety features of course) they could cost $25 each plus a pack job.

They're charging you $40 per jump with a pack job?! That's $10 worse than the highest I ran into during my renting days, and double the best that charged on a per jump basis. (places that rent by the day are great IF you do 4-5 jumps)

Depending on how close to the target wingloading you are for the next couple hundred jumps, renting can save you money, or cost you money. The more rigs you can try, the more informed a choice you can make, esp with regards to the comfort issues.

[sagan 0]

The DZ I jump at (and where I graduated AFF, A-lic, etc from) has a pretty cool setup. It's renting on a per basis jump until the day rate becomes a better deal. At that point they switch it to dhe day rate.

As for buying or renting... you haven't said if you owned all the other gear yet: jumpsuit(s), alti, helmet, goggles, etc.

I (not saying you should) ended up buying these items first (many from dz.com classifieds btw).

I don't know about the people with experience on their advice (I'm still ~50 jumps) but since your exit weight is so considerably lower than your current size canopy, I'd rent until you get to a size that you will stay on... for me that hadn't changed since the tail end of getting my A-lic but for others this apparently swings more.

Also, depending on your body type/size, all used gear might be perfect but get into it and if possible jump it first. I ended up getting a new container as I have an awkward torso to rest of body ratio and most of the used containers "hurt" to fly in that I've tried.

Good Luck!
Patrick

-Patrick

[popsjumper 2]

As you've already noted, you will be clearing all the info you get here with your instructors, right?

By all means buy used sport gear as soon as you can.

Used because:
1. It won't hurt your pride so much when you are rolling over on landings getting dirt all over it. j/k But until you get good at landings, damaging used is cheaper than damaging new...less investment in the first place. And that goes for jumpsuits and canopies, too.
2. You can get out from under those high jump prices sooner and, in effect, you will be paying yourself back with the savings.
3. Getting way from adjustable main lift webs is a good thing...one less place for slippage and potential hurt.
4. You will have a constant canopy to learn canopy skills on as opposed to flying different ones every day.
Flying different canopies is a good thing but at your stage of the game, learning basic canopy skills is the goal and it's easier to do that when you have some consistency to work with.
5. You can re-sell it to buy new later when you decide exactly what brand, size and type you want/need.

Most reputable sellers of used gear will let you try it on and demo it before deciding to buy it. I advise NOT to bother with those who won't do that for you if for no other reason than to protect yourself and your wallet. The normal process is to have the seller send it to your rigger for inspection prior to purchase and you should make it known that you will be demoing it at the same time. Common courtesy is that if you damage it, you buy it or pay for repairs.

Me? I got lucky...I bought used...the harness fit perfectly, the container was the right size and the canopies that were recommended to me by my instructors was exactly what I needed and I'm still flying all that stuff even today....and I got it ALL right there at my home DZ.


Packing:
Call me an old goat but I have NEVER understood why people insist on depending on packers to perform life-saving skills for them and don't learn to even pack their own. It's like having more dollars than sense. Not hammering packers - there are lots of good ones out there that make their living packing for the rushed, the lazy and the stupid.
Learn to pack your own...don't be one of those dependent on others...
That's not to say you shouldn't use packers at all because there may come a time in your jumping life when you badly need one - you could be one of the "rushed".

Good luck!

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[wmw999 2,123]

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But until you get good at landings, damaging used is cheaper than damaging new

And damaging either is way less expensive than damaging yourself.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[k_marr08 0]

I'll have you all know that I printed the thread - thank you so much for advice - and yes...I ALWAYS will talk to instructors first before I use any info I've obtained. To answer one of the questions - I have not bought ANY gear to date - I probably should start with alti, goggles, helmet, stuff like that. Don't have a jumpsuit either. I'll work on it

"I believe the risks I take are justified by the sheer love of the life I lead" - Charles Lindbergh

[kelpdiver 2]

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Call me an old goat but I have NEVER understood why people insist on depending on packers to perform life-saving skills for them and don't learn to even pack their own. It's like having more dollars than sense. Not hammering packers - there are lots of good ones out there that make their living packing for the rushed, the lazy and the stupid.
Learn to pack your own...don't be one of those dependent on others...

when renting student gear, the packing isn't always optional. Most commonly you must pay for the last pack job. And some build the packjob into the rental price. Of the 5 DZs surround SF - 3 included the pack job in the price, 1 had you paying the packers on your own to get it taken care of, the final one required just the last pack job.

[shermanator 3]

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Hi Steve OK good point with the packing - haven't done it yet so I'm kinda nervous about jumping something I packed - And yes money is an issue. Thanks everyone

best way to get over this fear... for your first own pack jump, do it as a hop & pop. I so wanted to do this, but decided to jump, because i could, to get the canopy out of the bag, rather than pull it out myself. so, did my h&p on that one, oh well. with propor training on packing, you'll feel fine. won't be nervous at all!... kind of

CLICK HERE! new blog posted 9/21/08
CSA #720

[dharma1976 0]

buy used

then learn to pack...if you live around the new york area you can hit me up for some free packing coaching (I am a packer and never mind showing people the way that I do things for free I guess I am a bad prostitute)

I bought my first rig when I had like like 30 jumps from my roommate who got me into jumping it lasted me about a year. I then swapped the sabre 170 that was in it out for a 179 safire ( Which I though would be larger) it turned otu to be around a 162 or something bizarre) so do your research and find soemthign that will be good for you if you have any questions ASK YOUR INSTRUCTORS....

Cheers

Dave

http://www.skyjunky.com

CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing.

[popsjumper 2]

True but we are talking about first rig..not student jumps.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[Mostly_Harmless 0]

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... I then swapped the sabre 170 that was in it out for a 179 safire ( Which I though would be larger) it turned otu to be around a 162 or something bizarre) ....

I know! I just found out that the safire 1's are 8% smaller then stated!

_________________________________________
www.myspace.com/termvelocity

[MarkM 0]

You're paying $40 per jump to rent, so 10 jumps will cost you $400. You could probably buy used, put 100 jumps on it, then sell it with around a $400 dollar loss from the use you put on the gear.

And pack for yourself now. You'll make the loads faster and one day when you're at a boogie and there are no available packers(or they're really slow) you'll know how to pack for yourself. It's really an important skill to develop, even if you end up normally using packers later on.

[NWFlyer 2]

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You'll make the loads faster

I don't know about you but that certainly wasn't the case when I was first learning to pack.

But your points are valid. Packing skills are critical to learn.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[kelpdiver 2]

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You'll make the loads faster

I don't know about you but that certainly wasn't the case when I was first learning to pack.

I think you pretty quickly get to that 30 min range, which means you can't make the quick 20 minute call for the same plane after you land, but the next one. I found packing services across California to be unreliable for that sort of timeframe. As soon as circumstances forced to me pack most of the time, I got to the point where I would be faster. (does leave me more tired by the 5th)

And at a boogie event, it could be a couple hours with the hangar full of rigs they have to do.

[Hayfield 0]

save money, go to the ranch.

"Remember the First Commandment: Don't Fuck Up!"
-Crusty Old Pete

[dharma1976 0]

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save money, go to the ranch.

and I will teach you to pack for free if I am there ;-)

cheers

Dave

http://www.skyjunky.com

CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing.

[XXTurTleXX 0]

Packing:

When you start jumping more and more you are not going to want to wait for packers who are swamped with tandem rigs. There is also personal preference baout how rigs are. I like do it this way, he does it that way, and so on. You'll have plenty of help when you need it. Take Steve up on the offer of packing help. He practices packing whether he is jumping or not!

Gear:

Of course you want to get out from under the rental fees. Everyone recommended used gear to me because of the price and the fact that I was landing on my ass all the time. Just have whatever you buy used inspected by your rigger. If possible, before you buy it!

Does your weight really fluctuate 15 lbs from day to day? That's weird! You're weird!

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