Troops at U.S. Border to Cost About $210 Million

[Phil1111 911]

Pentagon: Troops at U.S. Border to Cost About $210 Million
http://time.com/5460825/pentagon-troops-border-210-million/
WASHINGTON — Using thousands of military troops to help secure the Southwest border will cost an estimated $210 million under current plans, the Pentagon told Congress on Tuesday, even as questions arose about the scope and duration of the controversial mission....

The total would grow beyond the current combined estimate of $210 million if the active-duty mission is extended beyond the current completion date of Dec. 15. Officials said an extension appeared likely but had not yet been agreed upon....

About 2,800 of the active-duty troops are in South Texas, far from the main migrant caravan in Tijuana, Mexico, south of California. The movement of the Central American migrants into Mexico in October was the stated reason that President Donald Trump ordered the military to provide support for Customs and Border Protection....

Trump said he was sure the troops are happy to be on the border mission, even though it means being away from home over Thanksgiving.

“They know what they’re doing and they’re great and they’ve done a great job. You’re so worried about the Thanksgiving holiday for them. They are so proud to be representing our country on the border where if you look at what’s happening,"

Why migrants won’t see armed US troops on the border
https://www.armytimes.com/news/your-military/2018/11/18/migrants-wont-see-armed-us-troops-on-the-border/

No combat pay. Little electricity. Troops on border just waiting for caravan.
"Instead of football with their families on this Veterans Day weekend, soldiers with the 19th Engineer Battalion, fresh from Fort Knox, Ky., were painstakingly webbing concertina wire on the banks of the Rio Grande, just beneath the McAllen-Hidalgo-Reynosa International Bridge....

Come Thanksgiving, they likely will still be here.

Two thousand miles away, at the Pentagon, officials privately derided the deployment as an expensive waste of time and resources, and a morale killer to boot....

The troops will not be enforcing U.S. immigration law — that would run afoul of the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878, unless a special exception is made....

Men and women have set hours for bathing. Permitted shower length: seven minutes.

There is no mess hall — just the MREs."

[RonD1120 58]

Think training, therefore, money well spent. That kind of money is spent on military exercises all the time.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[DJL 232]

I don't see anything wrong with having sent troops there and spending the money. Sure, they were also political props and more was made of the caravan than what it was but the issue is that the caravan was gaining momentum as a way for a large number of (at that point) illegal immigrants to cross the border with no (at that point) path to naturalization. We simply cannot have thousands of people entering our country like that and it's important to let them know it. As for using military troops, no the military is not to be used for civil affairs but this one blurs the line. What it was is a show of force, something the military is very capable of doing. It's no different than any other mobilization exercise the military spends money on and yes, soldiers miss holidays and their families when that happens.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[normiss 622]

Courts disagree with your perspective.
We can, we have, and we do have thousands of immigrants showing up at our borders.

[DJL 232]

normiss

Courts disagree with your perspective.
We can, we have, and we do have thousands of immigrants showing up at our borders.

At least the guy finally got his parade. He wasn't there for it and it wasn't in DC but it's the dog and pony show he wanted all along.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

Absolutely hilarious that he sent them the week before the election...

When the actual immigrants aren't expected for another month or so.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[DJL 232]

wolfriverjoe

Absolutely hilarious that he sent them the week before the election...

When the actual immigrants aren't expected for another month or so.

I think he could've gotten more bang for the buck by making it an issue that would be outstanding, depending on the outcome of the elections. Sending them early pissed off voters.

I do still stand by the idea that this act of bravado and politics made enough of a show to send a message to those in the caravan that they wouldn't be able to enter the US as a mob.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[Iago 8]

RonD1120

Think training, therefore, money well spent. That kind of money is spent on military exercises all the time.

Sure, plus if depends on an active duty or reserve unit. If they're active duty a good portion of that would already be budgeted for pay, food, and housing costs.

Reserve units owe their two weeks a year and if they weren't doing this they'd be camped out in a field.

In either case units go places for 'training' all the time and the 19th Engineers mentioned in the article would be off someplace doing exactly what they are doing now as part of that training.

Confirmed cynical sarcastic bastard since 2003

[BIGUN 1,053]

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no the military is not to be used for civil affairs

You're mistaken - 17 years ago; our borders were invaded and we; as a nation; said, no more. There was no left or right side; it was our side. The military's sole reason to exist is to defend our borders (civil affair). Hence, the reason the US Army Civil Affairs and Psychological Operations Command (Airborne) (USACAPOC) alone has thirty-two civil affairs battalions.

https://www.thebalancecareers.com/army-enlisted-job-description-civil-affairs-specialist-3346018

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[BIGUN 1,053]

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When the actual immigrants aren't expected for another month or so.

More than 2,000 Central American migrants arrived in the border city of Tijuana in recent days, and about 3,000 more migrants are estimated to be in Mexicali, Mexico, another border city about 100 miles away, UNHCR spokeswoman Francesca Fontanini said.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/19/americas/tijuana-migrants-protest/index.html

Hispanics hating on hispanics?!?!? What is that? some kind of Intra-racism? What's it called when a culture hates on their own culture.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[normiss 622]

You should a little deeper into the Hispanic culture.
It's quite an interesting hierarchical structure depending on country of origin.

[billvon 2,400]

>Hispanics hating on hispanics?!?!? What is that? some kind of Intra-racism? What's it called
>when a culture hates on their own culture.

They are all brown, so they must all have the same culture? You are really going to go there?

They are different people from different countries and different cultures. Mexicans not wanting Guatemalans to enter Mexico is no different than you not wanting Mexicans to enter the US. All three groups are Americans, after all, so they must all have the same culture - right? Why are you hating on your own culture?

[DJL 232]

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Hispanics hating on hispanics?!?!? What is that? some kind of Intra-racism? What's it called when a culture hates on their own culture.

I'm not sure where to start with the face palming but other examples of people at war or in conflict with others with basic ethnic and regional similarities: Nearly every war ever.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[jakee 1,254]

BIGUN

Hispanics hating on hispanics?!?!? What is that? some kind of Intra-racism? What's it called when a culture hates on their own culture.

Jesus Christ you're on a roll today

You think everyone below the Rio Grande is the same? You think every culture across 20 countries and 8 million square miles is the same culture? You think because they all look the same to you that they all look, sound and think the same to each other?

Are all white people the same to you? No matter what country they come from, no matter what language they speak, do you treat them all the same as your white american neighbours because they're also white?

In the UK (a white country) we have a lot of economic migration from places like Poland, Lithuania, Romania etc. These migrants are also white. Does it amaze you that white British people hate on these white migrants? What do you call it when that happens?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[SkyDekker 1,122]

White House has now approved lethal force and limited policing roles for military.

Those so concerned about Jade Helm previously are eerily quiet. Bunch of racist fucks.

[BIGUN 1,053]

billvon

>Hispanics hating on hispanics?!?!? What is that? some kind of Intra-racism? What's it called
>when a culture hates on their own culture.

They are all brown, so they must all have the same culture? You are really going to go there?

They are different people from different countries and different cultures. Mexicans not wanting Guatemalans to enter Mexico is no different than you not wanting Mexicans to enter the US. All three groups are Americans, after all, so they must all have the same culture - right? Why are you hating on your own culture?

Brothers,

All of you have really got to stop playing the "Brown-Hater" card as some kind of shaming-compliance strategy. First, I have several years of traveling around Central America as both a soldier and a tourist and no man has more greater love than I do for the people and their culture (not so much the politics). They are a beautiful people and I do wish I had inherited their olive colored skin tone more so than my own Sicilian.

So, part of my reason down there as a tourist was to write the curriculum for a local university (NSU) on "Cross-Cultural Communication." And, lest we forget - the undergraduate degree is in communications (Social Science) Yes, their cultures are extremely intertwined - mostly due to the Spaniard colonization of the region.

The majority of Latin & Central Americans & Mexico are Christians (90%), mostly Roman Catholics. They cook and eat the same foods, they worship family values. Part of my love for their culture is the sense of community wherein every evening, in 90% of the areas I visited every one would meet at "El Centro." Basically, the town square. It was awesome to watch - families would visit, the Priest would come around offering blessing, perhaps a little guidance, Grandchildren, nieces, nephews & cousins would get to play while the elders talked and relaxed. The list goes on & on.

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Mexicans not wanting Guatemalans to enter Mexico is no different than you not wanting Mexicans to enter the US.

BINGO!! Now, you're getting it!! It's not a people, or racism or cultural issue - it's about Illegal Immigration no matter which country - even those of the same culture. Plain & simple. No difference than if 5,000 Brits showed up trying to cross our borders from Canada - There are those of us that feel that illegal immigration is; well, Illegal. (personally, I'd rather keep 5,000 Brits out a lot more than I would those from Central America).

But, even so; there is a process. It's there for a reason.

So, let's look at the EU In comparison. Freedom of movement allows citizens of the European Union (EU) to move to, live in, and in certain circumstances access the welfare system of the EU country to which they have moved. Freedom of movement is one of the founding principles of the EU.

And, yet then in in April 2013, four of the 28 EU governments called on the EU to change its rules on free movement to make it harder for EU citizens to claim benefits when moving to another member country. These governments argue that higher standards of living and a generous system of state benefits in their countries have attracted large numbers of EU citizens from the newer EU member countries (in particular, the eight Central and Eastern European countries that joined the EU in 2004).

UK Home Secretary Theresa May has claimed that these citizens are “benefit tourists.” That is, they are not workers or self-employed, and have come merely to access public services and the host state’s benefits system. Say Whhhhaaaat???

So, now with BREXIT - the UK is wishing to restrict their borders again after learning how much that open movement policy can be a drain on their resources. Do I hear cries of Romanian and Bulgarian-Haters. Why don't the Brits like the Romanian and Bulgarian people? Is it their culture or the color of their skin? Their Religion? The fact that they believe in religion? What?

Yet, the Brits DEMAND the US change its policy of letting people in - all while their trying to limit their borders or oust people back to their own countries. Won't that be the enforcement of "illegal Immigrants?"

But, the big bad US is wrong for having the same policy, same issues and same process for dealing with such as many other countries.

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Why are you hating on your own culture?

Mostly because I see the left and east coast trying to create an effeminate, I'm a victimized oppressed culture who should all be so ashamed of ourselves, cry and beg forgiveness for whatever person standing in front of you telling you how you've offended them that day.

You know the beauty of "Freedom of Expression?" Even SCOTUS has ruled that offending someone is not illegal. You can offend me and I can offend you. There is no gold standard for distinguishing offensive speech and difference of opinion. It is important that we do not censor individuals’ speech—even if some may consider that speech offensive.

I hope everyone has a wonderful Thanksgiving or in the case of those who are offended by that term - have a wonderful friendsgiving.


Keith

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[SkyDekker 1,122]

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So, now with BREXIT - the UK is wishing to restrict their borders again after learning how much that open movement policy can be a drain on their resources. Do I hear cries of Romanian and Bulgarian-Haters.

Concerns regarding racism and BREXIT are not uncommon at all.

That is an understatement.

[billvon 2,400]

>White House has now approved lethal force and limited policing roles for military.

"Limited police actions" using our military have always turned out well for us in the past.

[billvon 2,400]

>All of you have really got to stop playing the "Brown-Hater" card as some kind of
>shaming-compliance strategy.

And you've got to stop using their race to put them all in the same bucket.

>Now, you're getting it!! It's not a people, or racism or cultural issue - it's about Illegal
>Immigration no matter which country - even those of the same culture.

OK. So your post above was a joke? My mistake, then.

Since there are people here who really believe things like what you posted, there's a Poe's Law problem there - it's often impossible to tell such jokes from serious posts.

>Mostly because I see the left and east coast trying to create an effeminate, I'm a victimized
>oppressed culture who should all be so ashamed of ourselves, cry and beg forgiveness for
>whatever person standing in front of you telling you how you've offended them that day.

That's amusing, given how the US was very recently painted as the victim of a horde of violent invaders attacking us from Central America by the right wing. And that same right wing has been listing all the ways it has been the hapless victim of everything from the Deep State to the evil media to George Soros. In many ways that's a big part of how Trump won - telling conservatives they have been victims of these evil liberals for so long that it was time to stand up and fight for what they believed in (which, unfortunately, included white supremacy, xenophobia and sexism.)

Also, do you really see "effeminate" as an insult? Why is comparing someone to a woman offensive? Do you call people you don't like "gay" as well?

[BIGUN 1,053]

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And you've got to stop using their race to put them all in the same bucket.

Don't you & several others on here put all white people in the same bucket (as in the Caucasian race). I mean all white people are xenophobic, sexist, racists, by your standards UNLESS they happen to be a liberal. Because only the Liberals are the enlightened ones.

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Also, do you really see "effeminate" as an insult?

1. I see the effeminization of the US as a bad path. Becoming a society in which social gender roles overlap: Both men and women are supposed to be modest, tender, and concerned... I mean we went from 1) discussions about transexuals being allowed to use the restrooms based on the sex they had become, to 2) Allowing people to use the restrooms based on which gender someone "identifies" with???

1) No issue with transexuals using the restrooms of the sex they've become.

2. Using the restroom based on the gender you identify with??? Sorry, that doesn't work for me.
a. You got a penis; use the men's room. You got a vagina; use the women's room.
b. You're in-between? - look between your legs and see a.

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1. Why is comparing someone to a woman offensive?
2, Do you call people you don't like "gay" as well?

1. I wasn't comparing someone to a woman - I was comparing a society to being effeminate.

2. No. I call "Gay" people gay.

Which by the way, why are the liberals anti-labeling; but insist on labels to identify with which subculture they most identify with... LGBTQE???? WTF? Just parade in the streets for all equal rights; not more rights for your label.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[billvon 2,400]

>Don't you & several others on here put all white people in the same bucket (as in the
>Caucasian race).

I don't think so. I see James Fields as very different from Jeff Flake, for example.

>I mean all white people are xenophobic, sexist, racists, by your standards UNLESS they
> happen to be a liberal. Because only the Liberals are the enlightened ones.

?? Some liberals are enlightened, some conservatives are enlightened. As with any group. Jeff Flake is a pretty smart guy; James Fields is a racist murderer. They are both conservatives.

> I wasn't comparing someone to a woman - I was comparing a society to being effeminate.

"Effeminate" means "like a woman." I've never understood why the right wing likes to use that as a slur.

> Using the restroom based on the gender you identify with??? Sorry, that doesn't work
>for me.
>a. You got a penis; use the men's room. You got a vagina; use the women's room.
>b. You're in-between? - look between your legs and see a.

Out here people decide for themselves - without even asking the government. Seems to work.

In college we just did away with the whole issue and made all the dorm bathrooms coed. Also seemed to work fine. I guess we were all "effeminate" or something.

[BIGUN 1,053]

SkyDekker

White House has now approved lethal force and limited policing roles for military.

The new “Cabinet order” was signed by White House Chief of Staff John Kelly, not President Donald Trump. It allows “Department of Defense military personnel” to “perform those military protective activities that the Secretary of Defense determines are reasonably necessary” to protect border agents, including “a show or use of force (including lethal force, where necessary), crowd control, temporary detention. and cursory search.”

https://www.militarytimes.com/news/your-military/2018/11/21/white-house-approves-use-of-force-some-law-enforcement-roles-for-border-troops/

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[jakee 1,254]

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Yet, the Brits DEMAND the US change its policy of letting people in - all while their trying to limit their borders or oust people back to their own countries. Won't that be the enforcement of "illegal Immigrants?"

What is it with you pretending to be an idiot today?

The Brits who think the US goes way overboard on xenophobic immigrant hating? Probably the same Brits who oppose Brexit, and the same Brits who want to keep freedom of movement throughout the EU, including the freedom of the Poles and Romanians to come and live here if they want to.

Like, isn't it amazing how the populations of any given country or culture aren't big homogenous blobs of groupthink? Blowing your mind, right?

BIGUN

Mostly because I see the left and east coast trying to create an effeminate, I'm a victimized oppressed culture

Yet you want to cry about being a victim of illegal immigration.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[jakee 1,254]

BIGUN

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And you've got to stop using their race to put them all in the same bucket.

Don't you & several others on here put all white people in the same bucket (as in the Caucasian race).

Are you for real? Show some examples.

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1. I see the effeminization of the US as a bad path. Becoming a society in which social gender roles overlap: Both men and women are supposed to be modest, tender, and concerned

Why is that a bad thing?

You didn't give a single example except for restrooms. Do restrooms really bother you that much?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[DanG 1]

I think you have a common misconception about what Civil Affairs does. The mission is to act as liason between the US military and local nationals in a host country. For instance, in Afghanistan we were the bridge between the US Army and the Afghan people, both government and private citizens. Civil Affairs is not involved in dealing with the US civilian population, or domestic affairs on US soil.

Civil Affairs units could potentially be useful dealing with a migrant caravan, but that's not currently a part of the doctrine.

- Dan G