"Cold Hard Facts the Anti-Gun Forces can no longer escape."

[Shredex 0]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPGBXqaF2dg

[Stumpy 256]

No hidden agenda there clearly.

Now for a slightly more scientific viewpoint
http://sydney.edu.au/news/84.html?newsstoryid=1502

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[kallend 1,632]

Quote

No hidden agenda there clearly.

Now for a slightly more scientific viewpoint
http://sydney.edu.au/news/84.html?newsstoryid=1502

Nice one.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[loch1957 0]

Not sure thats the entire story, firearm deaths declined in the US during same time as well. Violent crime went up drastically for the Aussies after the gun ban.

http://www.captainsjournal.com/2012/07/23/do-gun-bans-reduce-violent-crime-ask-the-aussies-and-brits/

http://www.ncpa.org/sub/dpd/index.php?Article_ID=17847

Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing.”

[Stumpy 256]

That may be true. The point is, the initial video was bullshit and designed to push an agenda.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[kelpdiver 2]

Quote

Not sure thats the entire story, firearm deaths declined in the US during same time as well. Violent crime went up drastically for the Aussies after the gun ban.

what time frame?

An article in the WSJ noted last week that serious firearm injuries continue to rise in the US, but that survival rates get better due to skilled trauma surgeons. The major caveat here is that the count of serious injuries (substantial enough to require immediate medical attention) is not as accurate as the number of homicides.

It also made no attempt to differentiate shootings of the gang/drug fights, which I'm mostly indifferent to, from the shootings of random violence, or relationship failures, or others involving non felons on either the giving or receiving side.

[tkhayes 127]

If there are no guns, then no one can be killed by a gun. If there are FEWER guns, then one can expect FEWER gun related deaths.

amazing how simple math works. Not sure that they teach math in American schools anymore.

[lawrocket 3]

Yes. Because there were no guns at that school.

Imagine if there were 20 guns at that school. Goodness, the death toll would have been 10 times higher, right?

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[tkhayes 127]

oversimplified argument that has no merit. Australia's stats, and for that matter the stats of many other regulated-gun countries demonstrate that overall, fewer guns mean fewer gun deaths.

simple STATISTICAL math.on a LARGE scale, not on a single-sample-one-school-size scale.

try statistics 101 at your local college perhaps.

[thedude911 0]

I don't ever post here, but this is starting to piss me off. First of all, just because people own a gun doesn't make them nut cases. Some people are just god damn nuts with or without a gun. Did any of you also know 22 children were slashed by a man with a knife in China the same day the shootings occurred in Newton? Media at it's finest. "GUN GUN GUN, TO HELL WITH THE BORING STORY"

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/12/22-kids-slashed-in-china-elementary-school-knife-attack/

Second of all, the state of Connecticut has some of the most strict gun laws in the country, guess what that did to stop a criminal psychopath? Not a damn thing.

They do teach math, it's great. But here's the problem with that logic.

Take away all REGISTERED guns, now all legal gun owners no longer have a gun, possibly for self defense. Meanwhile, unregistered firearms or registered ones that were sold to other people through private sale are still out there potentially in criminals hands (unregistered is a serious offense). Therefore the loser in this situation is the law abiding citizen. The Aurora theater shooter actually went to the one location he knew banned the carry of licensed concealed firearms, because no one would be able to fight back.

If a criminal wants a gun, they will find a way to get one. It's ancient technology, they've been around for hundreds of years worldwide, they're everywhere. This guy even made an AK-47 out of a DAMN SHOVEL.

http://www.damncoolpictures.com/2012/12/an-ak-47-made-out-of-shovel.html

Guns for me are an insurance policy, hunting tool and sport shooter. I'd rather have one and not need it for self defense, than not have one but be thrown in a situation where I need it.

[tkhayes 127]

go ahead, get pissed off. Your 'pissed-off-ness' is nothing compared to the grief and tragedy experienced by the thousands of people directly affected by a massacre shooting of children,.

No one claimed that gun owners are all nut jobs.

knife attacks that result in injuries are far different than gun attacks that cause fatalities.

No one is talking about taking away guns.

And no, they will NOT find 'a way to get one' if there are no guns. A fact demonstrated in other countries and clearly ignored by you

bottom line is that fewer guns will mean fewer gun related deaths. Fewer cigarettes results in less smoking related deaths. Fewer teenagers driving on Saturday night results in fewer teenage related driving deaths. Fewer bowls of ice cream results in less weight gain.

these are actually pretty simple concepts. You have extrapolated them into a list of nonsense that is not being claimed nor is factual, nor is the basis for any argument being made here.

[toolbox 0]

You make it sound like a knife attack only results in an injury.
I bet if someone stuck a 9 inch blade through your chest and gave it a twist,or chopped off your head with a machete ,that would most likely be fatal.
Look at how many people were hacked to death before guns were invented.
Weaker and less aggressive people have been victimized by stronger,violent people for as long as humans have been around.
Guns give the people who might be victimized a way to defend themselves against the bad guy,or a gang of bad guys who could use their greater numbers to simply beat them to death.
Hell I would rather be shot to death than chopped up and I'm sure most people feel the same way. This is probably why most horror movie villains use something other than a gun to kill the victims(like machetes,chainsaws,polaski axe,ect...) and create more terror.
Now before you say it,I know guns are easier because they work at some distance but so do bombs,or nerve gas,or anthrax.
As long as there are bad people,there will be bad acts upon others,with or without guns.
911 was carried out using box cutter knives as a way to hijack jumbo jets to use as bombs with great effectiveness .

[tkhayes 127]

'the dude911' posted the story about the Chinese school attack with a knife, then apparently deleted it. So in THAT story, people were not 'hacked up', did not have their 'heads cut off' or whatever other fantasy that you are trying to create here as an example.

If 15000 people were killed every year in the USA by KNIVES, then we would most certainly be having a discussion about KNIVES. But they are not.

So again, you to, extrapolate nonsense into something that no one is saying and therefore not much of an argument.

No one ever killed 27 people with KNIVES in just a few minutes. The facts are clearly demonstrated that the USA has fewer gun restrictions, more guns that anywhere else. They also have a higher rate of gun crime and gun death that anywhere else (in the civilized world anyway).

Try posting a fact instead of fantasy please. The number of guns out there and easy access to them IS part of the problem. It is not the only problem but it IS part of the problem.

[winsor 186]

Quote

That may be true. The point is, the initial video was bullshit and designed to push an agenda agendum.

[toolbox 0]

What did I say that is not factual.

[piisfish 135]

Quote

The number of guns out there and easy access to them IS part of the problem. It is not the only problem but it IS part of the problem.

nutters have too easy access on guns.
It seems to me that the relationship to guns is not what I would consider healthy.
Of what I saw (in my very tiny experince of US and Americans), some people consider weapons as "The Savior" and they can do anything, as they have a gun to protect them. Some others consider them as "The Devil", source of all evil. Some see them and consider them as toys or accessories.

They must be respected and treated correctly, and people need to be conscious of the lethal capacity of their guns.

Yes, I also have met very gun conscious people, who can have lots of fun with their guns, but who will not do "crazy shit" with them

Guns are not good or bad, the People behind guns need to wake up and be adult enough.

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[RonD1120 58]

From a comment at Borderline Firearms:
"Why do you need a gun like an AR 15? Answer. It not about need it's about your 2nd amendment right. But assault weapons aren't necessary for hunting. Answer. The 2nd amendment isn't about hunting it about defending liberty from tyranny. So you're worried that a tyrant is going to take away your guns and liberty? Answer. No I'm not worried because we have the 2nd amendment."

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[RonD1120 58]

(I did not write this but I agree with the writer)

I just heard the president say that we as a country have to put politics aside, and call for some “meaningful action” in the future to prevent further tragedies like the one in Newtown, Conn. today. Here is the “meaningful action” that I recommend that you call for, Mr. President. Call for a nation to repent of the sins of our culture that produce monsters of destruction. Call on your Hollywood friends, Mr. President who continue to flood our nation with violence, hate, and abuse to turn their skills to promoting righteousness, purity, love, and peace; call on the leaders of public education to put God back at the center of our school systems; call for those of your political party who war against Christianity to stand down and, call on the patriotic Christians to step up to the challenge of leading America in a new direction, the opposite of which it is going today. And lastly Mr. President, as a husband and father, take the lead in your own household and lead the nation out of this racial, cultural, spiritual war that we are in, and be the example to the land of a man whose heart has come under the control of the Holy Spirit. Bring dignity back to your office, and help bring sanity back to our nation. Make this Christmas the most Christ centered Christmas in our history, and help turn something demonic into the beginning of a national spiritual awakening. In Jesus’ name I ask for this. God will back you up if you will lead. ~ Billy Falling

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[Shredex 0]

Guns are too huge of an economic source to ban.

Just like how the US makes billions each year on the war by selling weapons to other countries.

It's all about the $$.

Personally have a few gun collector friends that have invested close to a 1/4 million dollars into their stash. Guns don't loose their value so your money is safe in the investments. People don't understand why people like guns so much... they just don't understand... Just like how people don't understand why I jump out of airplanes for fun. That is the main problem with liberals...If they don't like something, then they wanna ruin it for the rest of us. My Libertarian views don't allow for such control of individual freedom.

[GeorgiaDon 340]

I find it interesting that any discussion of "gun control" is off the table, as it would violate 2nd amendment rights. Yet, some of the same people have no problem with proposing that the solution to the problem is to be found in eliminating our 1st amendment right to freedom of religion, proposing instead that the government impose Christianity on us all regardless of our personal beliefs.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[skypuppy 1]

Quote

'the dude911' posted the story about the Chinese school attack with a knife, then apparently deleted it. So in THAT story, people were not 'hacked up', did not have their 'heads cut off' or whatever other fantasy that you are trying to create here as an example.

If 15000 people were killed every year in the USA by KNIVES, then we would most certainly be having a discussion about KNIVES. But they are not.

So again, you to, extrapolate nonsense into something that no one is saying and therefore not much of an argument.

No one ever killed 27 people with KNIVES in just a few minutes. The facts are clearly demonstrated that the USA has fewer gun restrictions, more guns that anywhere else. They also have a higher rate of gun crime and gun death that anywhere else (in the civilized world anyway).

Try posting a fact instead of fantasy please. The number of guns out there and easy access to them IS part of the problem. It is not the only problem but it IS part of the problem.

According to the department of justice, in 2004 knives were about 3 times more likely to be used to kill someone than a rifle or a shotgun -- and about twice as likely to kill someone than than rifles AND shotguns. handguns were on the other hand, about 5 times more likely to be used to kill someone than knives.

So it seems there is no reason to be trying to ban these so-called 'assault rifles'.

If some old guy can do it then obviously it can't be very extreme. Otherwise he'd already be dead.
Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone

[kallend 1,632]

Quote

Quote

'the dude911' posted the story about the Chinese school attack with a knife, then apparently deleted it. So in THAT story, people were not 'hacked up', did not have their 'heads cut off' or whatever other fantasy that you are trying to create here as an example.

If 15000 people were killed every year in the USA by KNIVES, then we would most certainly be having a discussion about KNIVES. But they are not.

So again, you to, extrapolate nonsense into something that no one is saying and therefore not much of an argument.

No one ever killed 27 people with KNIVES in just a few minutes. The facts are clearly demonstrated that the USA has fewer gun restrictions, more guns that anywhere else. They also have a higher rate of gun crime and gun death that anywhere else (in the civilized world anyway).

Try posting a fact instead of fantasy please. The number of guns out there and easy access to them IS part of the problem. It is not the only problem but it IS part of the problem.

According to the department of justice, in 2004 knives were about 3 times more likely to be used to kill someone than a rifle or a shotgun -- and about twice as likely to kill someone than than rifles AND shotguns. handguns were on the other hand, about 5 times more likely to be used to kill someone than knives.

So it seems there is no reason to be trying to ban these so-called 'assault rifles'.

Semi auto rifles are, however, weapons of choice for nutjobs on killing sprees.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[RonD1120 58]

Quote

... proposing instead that the government impose Christianity on us all regardless of our personal beliefs.

Don

I am not such a proponent. However, in my lifetime I have seen a social disintegration commensurate with the attack against Christianity and prayer in schools. Is it a direct cause and effect? I don't know.

This I am certain, the government wants and seeks control over everyone because of the behavior of a minority of crazy people. I choose personal responsibility and self protection. If you can't heal the crazies don't take away my ability to protect myself and my family from them.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[regulator 0]

Pretty sure if posed with an option of a class 3 weapon vs. semi-auto the criminal would choose Class 3 all day long.

[kallend 1,632]

Quote

Pretty sure if posed with an option of a class 3 weapon vs. semi-auto the criminal would choose Class 3 all day long.

Yeah, but this is about the choices that NUTJOBs make.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.