2012 Political Race Thread

[Southern_Man 0]

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The one of doing the job closest to the President of the US.

The Secretary of State is, for all practical purposes the "voice" of the President in international affairs. They literally rely on each other to make decisions that affect the entire planet. There is no other job in government that is as close to being the President without actually being the President.

She's still not the most experienced candidate unless you are giving her credit for all the years her husband was in office. Eight years senator and four years as Sec State definitely makes her qualified but not the most experienced candidate.

"What if there were no hypothetical questions?"

[quade 3]

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To repeat, how many presidents in the last century were SecState?

Well, here's the issue with that. SecState doesn't run against the sitting President; ever. To do so would be a vote of no confidence in the current President. It should be woefully obvious why that just doesn't happen. So that's the first issue right off the bat. Meaning it would have to be the SecState of the second term of a two term President.

I believe if Colin Powell had wanted to, he could have easily gotten the nomination and possibly the win in 2008. Of course, that would have required the Republican party to be a bit more centrist than it was at the time and would be completely out of the question today, but I believe Powell absolutely could have had a real shot.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[wmw999 2,121]

Just as Powell would have been a strong candidate in 2008 (depending on his VP choice), McCain would have been a very strong contender, and likely victor, in 2000. Lots and lots of independents that I know voted for Gore simply because they didn't like Bush all that much -- he was clearly the one whom the Republican party decided was their candidate.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[ryoder 1,384]

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Just as Powell would have been a strong candidate in 2008 (depending on his VP choice), McCain would have been a very strong contender, and likely victor, in 2000. Lots and lots of independents that I know voted for Gore simply because they didn't like Bush all that much -- he was clearly the one whom the Republican party decided was their candidate.

Wendy P.

I had long wanted the opportunity to vote for McCain. He seemed like an honest guy who did his own thinking instead of letting the party do it for him. So what did he do as soon as he got the nomination? He totally changed his tune and started trying to convince us he was Dubya II, then picked a fruitloop for VP.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[quade 3]

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Just as Powell would have been a strong candidate in 2008 (depending on his VP choice), McCain would have been a very strong contender, and likely victor, in 2000. Lots and lots of independents that I know voted for Gore simply because they didn't like Bush all that much -- he was clearly the one whom the Republican party decided was their candidate.

Wendy P.

I had long wanted the opportunity to vore for McCain. He seemed like an honest guy who did his own thinking instead of letting the party do it for him. So what did he do as soon as he got the nomination? He totally changed his tune and started trying to convince us he was Dubya II, then picked a fruitloop for VP.

Same thoughts here. Have said the same many times.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[wmw999 2,121]

Co-workers of mine (most of them quite conservative) thought that McCain "hit a home run" when he selected Sarah Palin.

I think that there is so much media now, that it's easy to find your own little world, where you only see what agrees with you, and can't imagine that there are intelligent people who evaluate the same data and come to different conclusions. That's a loss, not a gain. A gain in comfort, maybe, but so is sitting on your butt on the sofa and eating chips, rather than going for a workout.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[SkyDekker 1,122]

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I think that there is so much media now, that it's easy to find your own little world, where you only see what agrees with you, and can't imagine that there are intelligent people who evaluate the same data and come to different conclusions. That's a loss, not a gain. A gain in comfort, maybe, but so is sitting on your butt on the sofa and eating chips, rather than going for a workout.

Or some self proclaimed expert rambling on a blog.

We no longer question the sanity of our opinion, we only question the sanity of those who do not share it.

[kelpdiver 2]

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To repeat, how many presidents in the last century were SecState?

Well, here's the issue with that. SecState doesn't run against the sitting President; ever. To do so would be a vote of no confidence in the current President. It should be woefully obvious why that just doesn't happen. So that's the first issue right off the bat. Meaning it would have to be the SecState of the second term of a two term President.

So to sum up, the answer is zero?

The problem with your argument is simpler. Let's ask a different question. How many VPs have gone on to run for and win the Presidency? The same issue - can't run against sitting President - applies to that person, yet history is quite different.

Has a SecState even won a nomination? I recall Haig running a very short campaign, but that's all I can recall.

[SkyDekker 1,122]

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So to sum up, the answer is zero?

The problem with your argument is simpler. Let's ask a different question. How many VPs have gone on to run for and win the Presidency? The same issue - can't run against sitting President - applies to that person, yet history is quite different.

Has a SecState even won a nomination? I recall Haig running a very short campaign, but that's all I can recall.

You have created quite the little strawman, trying to get answer to questions never posed and irrelevant to the original statement.

[rehmwa 2]

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it's easy to find your own little world, where you only see what agrees with you, and surround yourself with people that feel exactly the same and can't imagine that there are intelligent people who evaluate the same data and come to different conclusions.

that is sad because it's way too common - political leadership lately is very guilty of this too - and that's even more sad and bit scary

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[quade 3]

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it's easy to find your own little world, where you only see what agrees with you, and surround yourself with people that feel exactly the same and can't imagine that there are intelligent people who evaluate the same data and come to different conclusions.

that is sad because it's way too common - political leadership lately is very guilty of this too - and that's even more sad and bit scary

So, you saw Rove on FoxNews last night, eh?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[kelpdiver 2]

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So to sum up, the answer is zero?

The problem with your argument is simpler. Let's ask a different question. How many VPs have gone on to run for and win the Presidency? The same issue - can't run against sitting President - applies to that person, yet history is quite different.

Has a SecState even won a nomination? I recall Haig running a very short campaign, but that's all I can recall.

You have created quite the little strawman, trying to get answer to questions never posed and irrelevant to the original statement.

If you're going to try to help Quade out of his hole, shouldn't you actually add substance? You're spinning your heels in the groundwater.

He claimed Clinton is unquestionably the most qualified potential candidate of either party. History says pretty clearly that the VP is a much more viable candidate...so unless he wants to claim that the electorate is incapable of measuring qualification, that claims falls apart.

[rehmwa 2]

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it's easy to find your own little world, where you only see what agrees with you, and surround yourself with people that feel exactly the same and can't imagine that there are intelligent people who evaluate the same data and come to different conclusions.

that is sad because it's way too common - political leadership lately is very guilty of this too - and that's even more sad and bit scary

So, you saw Rove on FoxNews last night, eh?

I assume that's some kind of snark then?

we played family games and crashed early - didn't watch the news or coverage in lieu of having a life

Though I know you think every comment here is one sided only - I think my comment can apply to the leadership of both teams since they all seem to just be talking to themselves any more - Wendy's the smartest on here right now.

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Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[quade 3]

Not snark, simply thought you may have seen this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvC0-pPbVPU

Even past the time everyone agreed Obama had mathematically won, Rove was insisting it wasn't over. The man was simply an embarrassment to himself.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[kelpdiver 2]

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Even past the time everyone agreed Obama had mathematically won, Rove was insisting it wasn't over. The man was simply an embarrassment to himself.

if you spent hundreds of millions for nothing, you might be grasping at straws too. This defeat may spell the end for the guy...like Newt's loss in 1998.

[headoverheels 291]

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Even past the time everyone agreed Obama had mathematically won, Rove was insisting it wasn't over. The man was simply an embarrassment to himself.

if you spent hundreds of millions for nothing, you might be grasping at straws too. This defeat may spell the end for the guy...like Newt's loss in 1998.

Yeah, well, that doesn't mean he will go away, any more than Newt has.

[quade 3]

At least Newt recognizes the problem . . . in retrospect.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1YZLWj_w3U

There are some in the Republican Party...even TODAY...who think the answer is doubling down on extremism. That's ludicrous.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Bertt 0]

There are a lot of Republicans who feel that way. Let's face it, Obama's record is lackluster at best, but the Republicans lost. Instead of congratulating themselves on retaining some gerrymandered House seats, the Republican party and the whole nation would benefit from a moment of reflection where Republicans ask themselves, "How bad do you have to be to lose to a loser?".

You don't have to outrun the bear.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Yeah, well, that doesn't mean he will go away, any more than Newt has.

Newt did go away. But then he came back, for great hilarity (moon bases!).

[grimmie 173]

Did this election render Karl Rove a useless campaign fundraiser for future Republicans? Is he going to be a conservative outcast or will he still be an important figure?

It seems that the Romney-Ryan campaign was even more poorly run than McCain Palin.

They had no plan, no platform, changed positions and lied about most everything. The Ryan budget doesn't add up, the old folks were worried about medicare, their jobs plan was " vote us in and you will see".

It seems like Obama has more respect for Romney than the conservative talking heads.

[kallend 1,623]

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Even past the time everyone agreed Obama had mathematically won, Rove was insisting it wasn't over. The man was simply an embarrassment to himself.

if you spent hundreds of millions for nothing, you might be grasping at straws too.

Well, it WAS other people's money.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 1,623]

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Did this election render Karl Rove a useless campaign fundraiser for future Republicans? Is he going to be a conservative outcast or will he still be an important figure?

It seems that the Romney-Ryan campaign was even more poorly run than McCain Palin.

They had no plan, no platform, changed positions and lied about most everything. The Ryan budget doesn't add up, the old folks were worried about medicare, their jobs plan was " vote us in and you will see".

.

Yet they still suckered in some 48% of the voters

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Yet they still suckered in some 48% of the voters

at least 40% will vote GOP no matter what. A few of that 8% bought the sale. But I think more of them voted against Obama than for Mitt 2012 version 64.5.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Did this election render Karl Rove a useless campaign fundraiser for future Republicans? Is he going to be a conservative outcast or will he still be an important figure?

I would be surprised if he disappeared entirely. But I do think he lost a significant chunk of his pull.

[quade 3]

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Did this election render Karl Rove a useless campaign fundraiser for future Republicans? Is he going to be a conservative outcast or will he still be an important figure?

I would be surprised if he disappeared entirely.

I'm a little surprised he didn't eat his gun last night (and no, I'm not kidding). He was absolutely, 100% proven to be wrong and in the most humiliating way possible; on his own party's network.

Then, there are the boys from Vegas who are going to want to know what went wrong with all the money they donated.

Today, you do NOT want to be Karl Rove.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver