Mortgage interest rates at an all time low...and no one can refinance.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Great than buy!
But you buying will not grow the economy nor create many jobs.

millions of construction jobs are based on housing starts and home turnover (which leads to remodeling for some).

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Send them back the keys.....with $5k income one can live a very comfortable liquid lifestyle. Who needs credit cards when you make that much? And if you rent for say $2k you are in effect up $1k?

There are more consequences to breaking your commitment than losing your credit cards (btw, reserving a hotel room or rental car just got a bit harder in this scenario). Landlords typically run credit checks and aren't so interested in deadbeats if they have better choices in tenants. Companies, particularly finance ones, are also a bit concerned about potential employees who have money management issues. Given the number of abandonments in this cycle, it may not be as bad as it was, but your explanation wouldn't be seen positively.

BTW, an earlier statement of yours:
"Put money towards retirement...wait like those Roth IRA's that lost well over 50% of their value?"

The only people who lost 50% of their value were people who made very poor decisions. If you were fortunate enough to work through the last 3 years, your balance should only be up.

[shah269 0]

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I'm thankful I have a much different perspective on economics than do you.

I know that pesky logic and math are horrible tools utilize in forming an argument.

indeed. So help me out. The numbers don't add up.

If you bought a 300k house and put down 10%, why is your balance still at 270k 4 years later? That balance makes sense on a 3% downpayment (starting mortgage of 288k). Or on an interest only loan with 10% down.

oh brother.....now i have to explain every single portion of my life to give you the full picture?

Life through good thoughts, good words, and good deeds is necessary to ensure happiness and to keep chaos at bay.

The only thing that falls from the sky is birdshit and fools!

[CanuckInUSA 0]

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My only debt is my condo. Other than that I'm free and clear. And I could buy another car right now without needing to refinance.

Really? You told us you have 270k in debt on a condo worth 200k. I realize the value of your condo has gone down and this was out of your control. For this you have my sympathy. But you are in a negative equity position and yet you can buy a new car right now without needing to finance it. Buy what a $500 beater? If you have money sitting around you should get yourself back into a positive equity position. I realize there are penalties to pay down mortgages early (trust me I realize banks really fuck us over in this regard). But so far this is not what we are hearing from you. What we are hearing is that you want banks to lower the already agreed upon contract you have with them to allow you to buy new stuff on credit all in the name of saving society.

Want to help society? Don't be dependent on society.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[shah269 0]

And this is the last post I'm making to what has become a pissing match.

Yes credit does matter, it will hurt your chances of landing a better job or a nice appartment.

However as of late, it appears that more and more people are telling the banks to go pound salt and returning their keys and living off of their liquid income over the next 7 years untill they can good credit.

However as one economist put it, creditors are short sighted with respect to avaliable capital.


And with that, it is a shame this didn't evolve into a more complex discussion.

Life through good thoughts, good words, and good deeds is necessary to ensure happiness and to keep chaos at bay.

The only thing that falls from the sky is birdshit and fools!

[kelpdiver 2]

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I'm thankful I have a much different perspective on economics than do you.

I know that pesky logic and math are horrible tools utilize in forming an argument.

indeed. So help me out. The numbers don't add up.

If you bought a 300k house and put down 10%, why is your balance still at 270k 4 years later? That balance makes sense on a 3% downpayment (starting mortgage of 288k). Or on an interest only loan with 10% down.

oh brother.....now i have to explain every single portion of my life to give you the full picture?

well, since you have been playing loose with facts in this entire thread, yeah. Right now you appear to be lying in your quest for sympathy.

I stayed a renter during this time. Not my preference, but I wasn't willing to make the financial commitment, or overcommitment really, to take on over half a million dollars in debt. So I put up with the nuisances of apartment living. You seem to want to have your cake and eat it too, but somehow it's now for America's good.

[normiss 622]

It's not his fault!
Stoopid banks! Why won't they fix our bad money decisions so we can make more of them?????


No wonder this country is in the shits.

[CanuckInUSA 0]

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it is a shame this didn't evolve into a more complex discussion.

I don't think you would have ever been happy with this discussion unless everyone agreed with your point of view.

Bankers are not my favorite. I realize bankers have a certain degree of blame for the debt problems society finds itself in. But as guilty as bankers are for the credit crunch society is in, the people taking on more debt than they could handle also need to take some responsibility. The solution to society's debt problems is not to just add new debt as you appear to be calling for. What do you think we are, the US government? ROFLMAO.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[Butters 0]

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It's not his fault!
Stoopid banks! Why won't they fix our bad money decisions so we can make more of them?????


No wonder this country is in the shits.

Asking the banks to work with the good individuals since they played a role in the problem by giving loans to bad individuals doesn't seam crazy.

"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

[kelpdiver 2]

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Asking the banks to work with the good individuals since they played a role in the problem by giving loans to bad individuals doesn't seam crazy.

The banks suffer just as much from the properties being underwater as the home owners. If they reset values down, then the property values stay down, and the really good customers ask WTF they're continuing to pay.

[TrophyHusband 0]

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It's an amazing time to buy.

Great than buy!
But you buying will not grow the economy nor create many jobs.


Yes it will. We will not see a true and solid recovery until the housing market recovers. Someone buying a house now is a step in that direction. It also stimulates the local economy a little because people generally go out and spend a bunch of money right away to either fix up a house to rent, or make it "home".

"Your scrotum is quite nice" - Skymama
www.kjandmegan.com

[TrophyHusband 0]

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Debt is not bad. No joke! Debt is not a bad thing to have. We need debt in our economy to keep things going.

Beer isn't bed either, unless you drink too much of it. Debt has been thoroughly abused in this country and we need to detox. Unfortunately it will take time. Less debt equals a more solid financial foundation both as individuals and as a country. In both instances less debt makes it far easier to weather the hard times. There is no easy or quick way out of this and trying force it to happen sooner will only prolong things.

It would be wonderful if every family had $500 a month extra and they probably would go out and stimulate the economy by buying more stuff, but most of them would unfortunately just increase their debt and the $500 a month would go to a loan or credit card payment. In reality the best things the average family could do with an extra $500 a month is use it to pay off existing debt faster, invest it in either a college fund or retirement, or stick it in a money market account in case their financial situation takes an unexpected turn.

I've taken you out of the conversation so as not to make this look like a "pissing match". You're looking to advance the debate here so I'm asking you to advance it by providing some actual numbers to back up your point. How many people are actually upside down and would have at least a couple hundred more dollars in their pocket each month if they could refinance? (Just for the sake of advancing the debate, just find some estimates from a source more reliable than alternet.)

"Your scrotum is quite nice" - Skymama
www.kjandmegan.com

[billvon 2,426]

>However, to fix this the blame has to be properly set

"We can't move forward until we blame someone." Spoken like a true GOPer. Why solve the problem when you can blame Obama? Heck, if you solve the problem you lose a perfectly good gripe!

[rushmc 18]

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>However, to fix this the blame has to be properly set

"We can't move forward until we blame someone." Spoken like a true GOPer. Why solve the problem when you can blame Obama? Heck, if you solve the problem you lose a perfectly good gripe!

Lefty twister strikes again!

No, not Obama. Started way before he came along

But as long as you want to play this game

Enjoy

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About 6,930,000 results

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source=hp&biw=1660&bih=878&q=Obama+blames&oq=Obama+blames&aq=f&aqi=g-z1g9&aql=&gs_sm=si&gs_upl=1734l5172l0l7578l12l12l0l2l2l0l312l2201l0.4.5.1l10l0

Oh, and Bill

It is called getting to the root cause

Otherwise you are just fixing a symptom

But that is ok with you I guess

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[mnealtx 0]

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>However, to fix this the blame has to be properly set

"We can't move forward until we blame someone." Spoken like a true GOPer. Why solve the problem when you can blame Obama? Heck, if you solve the problem you lose a perfectly good gripe!

"I inherited this"
"Bomb throwers"
"Hostage-takers"

All those statements and more by Obama.

Here's your neck brace....you'll need it to counteract the torque from that spin you're doing.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[StreetScooby 5]

If you have a mtg backed by FNMA, etc., then yes they are responsible for P&I payments to bond holders.

We are all engines of karma

[kallend 1,646]

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"most people who bought a home during the boom or right after are in a very difficult position of being able to afford their mortgage but not much else."

THOSE people made a painfully poor financial decision IMO.

It's an amazing time to buy.

The wbankers, of course, made the same bad decisions, over and over, thousands of times, by agreeing to lend to people with no incomes or jobs.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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"most people who bought a home during the boom or right after are in a very difficult position of being able to afford their mortgage but not much else."

THOSE people made a painfully poor financial decision IMO.

It's an amazing time to buy.

The wbankers, of course, made the same bad decisions, over and over, thousands of times, by agreeing to lend to people with no incomes or jobs.

The bankers made brilliant decisions.

They maximized the number of loans written and their sizes, collected the origination fees, signed up to receive the loan servicing fees, and passed the risk on to some one else (like the Government Sponsored Enterprises) while pocketing the profits.

[loumeinhart 0]

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The bankers made brilliant decisions.

They maximized the number of loans written and their sizes, collected the origination fees, signed up to receive the loan servicing fees, and passed the risk on to some one else (like the Government Sponsored Enterprises) while pocketing the profits.

agreed. Investors began buying 'deep' so lenders originated B and C paper because they knew it would sell.

[Butters 0]

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Asking the banks to work with the good individuals since they played a role in the problem by giving loans to bad individuals doesn't seam crazy.

The banks suffer just as much from the properties being underwater as the home owners. If they reset values down, then the property values stay down, and the really good customers ask WTF they're continuing to pay.

I didn't play a role in the problem. The banks did play a role in the problem. Yet, I'm suffering more than the banks. They can maintain the principal and lower the interest rate for the good customers. You know, the customers who always pay on time and who bailed them out ... think of it as good customer service.

"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

[loumeinhart 0]

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Yet, I'm suffering more than the banks

Have you spoken with the 40+ lenders who are out of business?

[Butters 0]

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Yet, I'm suffering more than the banks

Have you spoken with the 40+ lenders who are out of business?

Have you spoken with the 1,000,000+ people who are out of jobs?

"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

[kelpdiver 2]

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Yet, I'm suffering more than the banks

Have you spoken with the 40+ lenders who are out of business?

Have you spoken with the 1,000,000+ people who are out of jobs?

many of them were working for those banks.

Few have enjoyed this bubble bursting. Not the construction workers, nor the realtors and mortgage companies, and not those at the banks that failed, were absorbed by others, or just creeping along (Citi, BofA).

[Butters 0]

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Yet, I'm suffering more than the banks

Have you spoken with the 40+ lenders who are out of business?

Have you spoken with the 1,000,000+ people who are out of jobs?

many of them were working for those banks.

Few have enjoyed this bubble bursting. Not the construction workers, nor the realtors and mortgage companies, and not those at the banks that failed, were absorbed by others, or just creeping along (Citi, BofA).

I don't feel bad for the realtors, mortgage companies, or banks ... they were all profiting while producing the problem that we're paying for.

"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

[kelpdiver 2]

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I don't feel bad for the realtors, mortgage companies, or banks ... they were all profiting while producing the problem that we're paying for.

really, they were all profiting? Oh well, if playing the blame game makes you feel better, have at it. It's factually wrong, but maybe by the next bubble or two you'll understand.

[DougH 270]

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I don't feel bad for the realtors, mortgage companies, or banks ... they were all profiting while producing the problem that we're paying for.

So were the homeowners who were not responsible enough to buy a home they could not afford if there was even a slight bump in the road , or worse were greedy and bought a house that they KNEW they couldn't afford just to ride the speculation wave.

If your bank forecloses on your house because your job was downsized that sucks, no income no house, unless you have substantial reserves.

On the flip side if your bank forecloses on your house because you took a liar loan interest only ARM, and it resets and you can't affoard the house it isn't suckage, it is just deserts.

If you don't want to feel bad for the banks, I suggest you also don't feel bad for a large number of homeowners that were drinking the koolaide along with the bankers.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P