Military spending 2006

[akarunway 1]

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>So if they kill other nations, or groups of people within their own
>nations, then we should just stand aside, watch, and do nothing?

Like I said - when are you going to call for the US to defend Iran against the threat of Israel?

You didn't answer the question. Please try again.

Do you care about defending others from evil, or just America?

Israel threatens Iran, only because Iran has vowed to destroy Israel. Iran is the aggressor here. If they mind their own business, then Israel wouldn't be a concern to them. Ya mean these NICE guys? >http://www.ifamericansknew.org/stats/settlements.html

But I expect the America-haters to ignore such distinctions.

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[billvon 2,400]

>Do you care about defending others from evil, or just America?

I care about defending everyone from evil. I am eager to not become the evil that others defend against. We have been both.

>But I expect the America-haters to ignore such distinctions.

That sort of right wing hatred is so 2003. It lost you control of the government; perhaps it's time to move on.

[kallend 1,623]

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I,ve read that 41% of all taxes collected in the U.S are spent on the militarywww.globalissues.org/Geopolitics/ArmsTrade/Spending.asp#InContextUSMilitarySpendingVersusRestoftheWorld

Which is 3x as much as spent on health and education combined. (Clicky added)

Not true. HHS and Social Security (i.e. entitlements) are more than double than what is spent on defense.

Here's a chart, and a link.

I didn't write "Social Security" or "entitlements", did I? I wrote "health and education". So get it right.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kallend 1,623]

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I,ve read that 41% of all taxes collected in the U.S are spent on the militarywww.globalissues.org/Geopolitics/ArmsTrade/Spending.asp#InContextUSMilitarySpendingVersusRestoftheWorld

Which is 3x as much as spent on health and education combined. (Clicky added)

Not true. HHS and Social Security (i.e. entitlements) are more than double than what is spent on defense.

Here's a chart, and a link.

SMACK!!! LOL

You might check what was actually written before patting yourself on the back.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[SkyChimp 0]

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That's as bad as any other form of tyranny when it's imposed on people without their consent

Which is exactly why a "one world order" will never work.

Does anyone else find it funny that we made a SPORT out of an EMERGENCY PROCEDURE?!?!

[kelpdiver 2]

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>well, shit, if it's already 3x too expensive just taking care of our friends,
>how much is it gonna cost to protect everyone?

Too much. Which is why it's a mistake to try to defend everyone and to try to impose democracy on people who don't want it. That's as bad as any other form of tyranny when it's imposed on people without their consent.

It's been strangely fashionable in the past couple days for people to post countering viewpoints to their own and expect the rest of us to keep score.

If you have a point, make it. No need to be cute unless you don't have a leg to stand on. None of you people are Jonathon Swift.

[chris74 0]

Si vis pacem parra bellum

[Gawain 0]

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I,ve read that 41% of all taxes collected in the U.S are spent on the militarywww.globalissues.org/Geopolitics/ArmsTrade/Spending.asp#InContextUSMilitarySpendingVersusRestoftheWorld

Which is 3x as much as spent on health and education combined. (Clicky added)

Not true. HHS and Social Security (i.e. entitlements) are more than double than what is spent on defense.

Here's a chart, and a link.

I didn't write "Social Security" or "entitlements", did I? I wrote "health and education". So get it right.

Okay, if you look at the budget for HHS alone, it is still significantly larger than defense. If you throw in the budget for education, the gap obviously increases. A large portion of the VAs budget is spent on health care, so again, that widens the gap further still.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[rushmc 18]

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which is still less than 5% of the budget

Oh, well never mind then.

Wait! in other words, more than half a TRILLION dollars

-OR-

One dollar out of every 20 collected.


Pretty soon you're talking about real money!

you missed the point but that does not surprise me given you (implied) leanings

We all get your point, dude. It's liberal and you're against it.

Wow, you just inoculated yourself into the liberal eletist club!! Congratulations

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 18]

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Like I said - when are you going to call for the US to defend Iran against the threat of Israel? Or are only certain groups of people "real" people worth defending?

well, shit, if it's already 3x too expensive just taking care of our friends, how much is it gonna cost to protect everyone?

Can't have it both ways.

Can't by votes that way

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kallend 1,623]

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I,ve read that 41% of all taxes collected in the U.S are spent on the militarywww.globalissues.org/Geopolitics/ArmsTrade/Spending.asp#InContextUSMilitarySpendingVersusRestoftheWorld

Which is 3x as much as spent on health and education combined. (Clicky added)

Not true. HHS and Social Security (i.e. entitlements) are more than double than what is spent on defense.

Here's a chart, and a link.

I didn't write "Social Security" or "entitlements", did I? I wrote "health and education". So get it right.

Okay, if you look at the budget for HHS alone, it is still significantly larger than defense. If you throw in the budget for education, the gap obviously increases. A large portion of the VAs budget is spent on health care, so again, that widens the gap further still.

HHS is more than "health", isn't it?

A large portion of the VA's budget is allocated to caring for bodies broken in the military. But you know that. The cost of long term care for wounded Iraq war veterans may well exceed the direct costs of the war.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[NCclimber 0]

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With a $3T budget it's closer to 17%. Divided by the 130M tax payers in this country it's $3846 for each of us.

Hey don't worry about it, it's all borrowed anyway.

It's your kids who'll have to pay for it, right?

Did you come up with that all by yourself?

[NCclimber 0]

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I,ve read that 41% of all taxes collected in the U.S are spent on the militarywww.globalissues.org/Geopolitics/ArmsTrade/Spending.asp#InContextUSMilitarySpendingVersusRestoftheWorld

Which is 3x as much as spent on health and education combined. (Clicky added)

Not true. HHS and Social Security (i.e. entitlements) are more than double than what is spent on defense.

Here's a chart, and a link.

I didn't write "Social Security" or "entitlements", did I? I wrote "health and education". So get it right.

Okay, if you look at the budget for HHS alone, it is still significantly larger than defense. If you throw in the budget for education, the gap obviously increases. A large portion of the VAs budget is spent on health care, so again, that widens the gap further still.

HHS is more than "health", isn't it?

A large portion of the VA's budget is allocated to caring for bodies broken in the military. But you know that. The cost of long term care for wounded Iraq war veterans may well exceed the direct costs of the war.

Oh great. Let's try and confuse the matter a bit.

I pointed out on page one that your claim of military spending being 3x more than what is spent on health and education was just plain wrong. Considering health and education spending makes up 27% of the budget, your claim is impossible.

I notice you didn't reply to that post.

[jakee 1,255]

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Did you come up with that all by yourself?

Yeah.

I also made a crayon drawing of the White House.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[idrankwhat 0]

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> Don't give them money I agree with. If they try to kill us they die!

That's fine. We have to go the extra step, though - if they DON'T try to kill us we DON'T kill them, or invade them, or change their government, or support terrorists trying to kill them.

...or steal their resources. That one pisses them off too.

[idrankwhat 0]

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Israel threatens Iran, only because Iran has vowed to destroy Israel. Iran is the aggressor here. If they mind their own business, then Israel wouldn't be a concern to them.

But I expect the America-haters to ignore such distinctions.

Speaking of ignored distinctions. Which country, Iran or Israel, is in violation of more UN resolutions than any other country in the world, has weapons of mass destruction and is continuing to steal land from its neighbors on a daily basis?

As for "America-haters", which do you think is worse: people who openly demand that their country abide by the principals which they boast to subscribe to, or people who their turn a blind eye to their country's hypocritical shortcomings by covering their eyes with the flag and calling it "patriotism"?

[Amazon 7]

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A large portion of the VAs budget is spent on health care, so again, that widens the gap further still.

That would not need to be as high... if we were not in a continual state of war all over the world....its what is promised.. to take care of those who DO serve....and in the past the VA has done a VERY dismal job of keeping that promise.

[SpeedRacer 1]

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In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.
-Dwight D. Eisenhower

....whoops.

Speed Racer
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[Amazon 7]

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In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.
-Dwight D. Eisenhower

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....whoops.

Sure does help the family bottom line.. for the Bush and Cheney families.

[NCclimber 0]

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In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.
-Dwight D. Eisenhower

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....whoops.

Sure does help the family bottom line.. for the Bush and Cheney families.

That horse is starting to look like glue.

[Amazon 7]

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Sure does help the family bottom line.. for the Bush and Cheney families.

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That horse is starting to look like glue.

The APOLOGISTS MANTRA.. or is that some form of.. thesearenotthedroidsyouarelookingfor....that you guys buy into and expect the rest of us to do as well...

http://www.envirosagainstwar.org/know/read.php?itemid=2755

The Carlyle Group, The Bush Family, The War Party, And World Leaders
For at least the last twelve years, George W. Bush and George H.W. Bush have been engaging in war-profiteering through the CARLYLE GROUP ("CG"). CG is a consortium of wealthy conservatives who operate worldwide as a merchant banking firm. CG is also a major player in the defense and telecommunications industries.

CG has been averaging a whopping 34% return for its investors over the past 15 years, and its current estimated worth is $18 billion. Largely through war-profiteering, CG's worth soared from $12 billion to $18 billion between 2000 and 2005.

So who's involved in the Carlyle Group? Among many others:

• former President George H.W. Bush (CG's adviser from 1993 to October 2003, and current investor);

• Bush I Secretary of State James Baker (CG's $180 million partner);

• General Colin Powell before he was Bush II's SOS;

• Reagan Secretary of Defense Frank Carlucci (CG's chairman);

• Bush I National Security Adviser Brent Scowcroft;

• former conservative British Prime Minister John Major (head of CG's European operations); and

• the former right-wing presidents of the Philippines and South Korea.

In the typical revolving-door style that has made postmodern Washington an ethics-free zone, the Carlyle Group is managed and staffed by former Republican employees of the CIA, the State Department, and the DOD. The Saudi royal family also is — and the Bin Laden family recently was — a major investor in CG. Additionally, many prominent international bankers are CG investors.

But wait! What about George W. Bush? He was a director in the Carlyle Group's subsidiary, Caterair, before he managed the Texas Rangers baseball team. Then, as Governor of Texas, he induced the board of the Texas teachers' pension fund — the members of which he appointed — to invest $100 million in CG.

Finally, GWB stands to inherit a multimillion dollar portion of whatever his father reaps through his consultations with, and investments in, CG. That might explain why GWB was so adamant both that his illegal elective war against Iraq MUST commence in March 2003, and that the estate tax MUST be repealed (which his party did in April 2005). Now when Poppy Bush dies, he can receive 100% of that blood-soaked windfall inheritance. [5]

EXHIBIT D:
The War-Profiteering Leviathans Bechtel And Halliburton
BECHTEL is a gargantuan multinational construction firm. The US-based Bechtel's war-profiteering activities are so prodigious that they're the stuff of legends. Knowledgeable defense experts have characterized Bechtel as "more powerful than the US Army."

After 9/11, George Schultz, the Bechtel CEO and former Secretary of State, lobbied vigorously for the invasion of Iraq. The Bush administration rewarded Schultz by granting Bechtel exclusive no-bid, gold-plated contracts for the reconstruction of Iraq, before it reduced Iraq's infrastructure to rubble during its "shock and awe" blitzkrieg.

These Iraq War contracts enabled Bechtel to reap record profits of $17 billion in 2003, and $17.4 billion in 2004.

The firm was founded by the San Francisco-based Bechtel family, who are old friends with the Saudi-based Bin Laden family. These two families have worked together on many construction projects in the Mideast. Indeed, they're currently collaborating on a $20 billion deal with the Saudi government to excavate two new ports.

Furthermore, the Bin Laden family owns a $10 million stake in Bechtel Corporation's investment subsidiary, The Fremont Group. Of course, the Bin Laden's are also old friends with the Bush family. It's a small world, after all. [6]

HALLIBURTON has vaulted to the forefront as the USA's premier — and most corrupt — war profiteer. Before revolving-door gamesman Dick Cheney became Bush II's running mate in 2000, he was receiving a multimillion dollar salary as Halliburton's CEO. Upon becoming Vice President Cheney, he oversold the invasion of Iraq by falsely alleging that an imminent threat was posed by Iraq's nonexistent WMD arsenal.

Since the invasion, his cronies at Halliburton have reaped profits of at least $18 billion from their Iraq War contracts. And Halliburton's revenues increased by 80% between 2003 and 2004.

Meanwhile, Halliburton was perpetrating countless acts of fraud, stealing multimillions through overbilling, and taking millions in kickbacks to its executives. For instance, the Defense Contract Audit Agency recently concluded that Halliburton overbilled US taxpayers by $212.3 million for fuel transportation in Iraq.

And Halliburton is currently under investigation by both the FBI and the Securities Exchange Commission for numerous illegalities. Nevertheless, Halliburton and its subsidiary KBR continue to receive lucrative no-bid, gold-plated defense contracts from the Pentagon.

Noting this blatant cronyism, CorpWatch disgustedly concludes that "Halliburton's agenda is so merged with that of the Bush administration that questions raised by auditors, inspectors-general, and other independent agencies — not to mention corporate accountability groups - languish silently in Congress and the White House." [7]

Furthermore, these same major defense contractors — the Carlyle Group, Bechtel, Halliburton, and their subsidiaries — have donated millions to the Republican Party and the Bush-Cheney campaign.

Additionally, they paid for extravagant parties at the 2004 political conventions and the 2005 presidential inauguration. In short, war is a lucrative business that pays the elite war-profiteers and the Washington bribe-ocrats handsomely, while it impoverishes the taxpayers, drains the federal coffers, decimates the target nations, and kills the combatants and their innocent victims hideously.

[NCclimber 0]

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Finally, GWB stands to inherit a multimillion dollar portion of whatever his father reaps through his consultations with, and investments in, CG. That might explain why GWB was so adamant both that his illegal elective war against Iraq MUST commence in March 2003, and that the estate tax MUST be repealed (which his party did in April 2005). Now when Poppy Bush dies, he can receive 100% of that blood-soaked windfall inheritance. [5]

Does anyone have any info regarding the Bush family holdings on Carlyle, Betchel or Haliburton? Or are we talking about wild speculation, leaving people to assume the worst?

And speaking of Carlyle investors, here are a few:
- William Kennard, Chairman of the U.S. Federal Communications Commission (FCC) under President Bill Clinton, Carlyle's Managing Director in the Telecommunications & Media Group from 2001 to the present.
- Arthur Levitt, Chairman of the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) under President Bill Clinton, Carlyle Senior Advisor from 2001 to the present
- Mack McLarty, White House Chief of Staff under President Bill Clinton, President of Kissinger McLarty Associates, Carlyle Senior Advisor from 2003 to the present

[idrankwhat 0]

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Does anyone have any info regarding the Bush family holdings on Carlyle, Betchel or Haliburton? Or are we talking about wild speculation, leaving people to assume the worst?

And speaking of Carlyle investors, here are a few:
- William Kennard, Chairman of the U.S. Federal Communications Commission (FCC) under President Bill Clinton, Carlyle's Managing Director in the Telecommunications & Media Group from 2001 to the present.
- Arthur Levitt, Chairman of the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) under President Bill Clinton, Carlyle Senior Advisor from 2001 to the present
- Mack McLarty, White House Chief of Staff under President Bill Clinton, President of Kissinger McLarty Associates, Carlyle Senior Advisor from 2003 to the present

If you want to see how it's done nowadays, Google any combination of "Congress" and "revolving door". It's good money if you can swing it. Big money organization (BMO) supports candidate "A", who gets elected because he's flush with cash now (ooops, I mean "free speech), writes legislation that benefits BMO at the expense of the taxpayer, then the elected official leaves his job and goes to work for BMO as a consultant or on K street and rakes in millions of dollars. What do you want to bet that members of this current administration have board and consulting positions in their future?

[kelpdiver 2]

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Speaking of ignored distinctions. Which country, Iran or Israel, is in violation of more UN resolutions than any other country in the world, has weapons of mass destruction and is continuing to steal land from its neighbors on a daily basis?

I'll give a hint. It's not the one that advocating wiping the other one off the earth. Proving in yet another way that the UN is a sham.

[idrankwhat 0]

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Speaking of ignored distinctions. Which country, Iran or Israel, is in violation of more UN resolutions than any other country in the world, has weapons of mass destruction and is continuing to steal land from its neighbors on a daily basis?

I'll give a hint. It's not the one that advocating wiping the other one off the earth. Proving in yet another way that the UN is a sham.

Agreed, it's not democratic enough to be able to function appropriately. It allows itself to be influenced to heavily by the more powerful nations.