If Iranian troops are fighting in Iraq, we should attack them in Iran

[sundevil777 94]

I'm under no illusion that we're ready to invade them. But if they're sending troops to Iraq to fight against us, what else does it take to deserve a response of violent force.

An ultimatum with a very short time limit should be delivered to Iran. Several days of air strikes should then follow if/when the response is negative. I suppose that many would call for the UN to be involved, and that an attempt to use that body to deliver a demand to Iran would be expected.

This is still a world where the use of violent force to achieve objectives is the reality.

Should we just give it a miss?

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[quade 3]

If Iranian troops (probably not actually troops but rather willing citizen volunteers) are crossing the boarder to attack U.S. Troops, then we should kill them on Iraqi soil.

Crossing on to Iranian soil carries some really ugly implications internationally that we simply can't afford to deal with at this point, but they're fair game in Iraq and how the hell would anyone know the difference between an Iraqi or Iranian insurgent anyway? From the U.S. Troop perspective, if somebody not in a U.S. uniform is shooting at you, you shoot back and don't question it in either case; no? Or am I wrong?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[sundevil777 94]

Quite right. I should have made it clear that the involvement of the Iranian gov't would be req'd to justify the attack on Iran.

If all this was clear, even if you don't think war is justified, I say that this would be a clear case where Bush's pre-emption doctrine should apply. If not here in such a case as I describe, then where?

I realize this is getting ahead of things a bit, but I would be surprised if the Iranian troops are there without their governments direction.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[matthewcline 0]

We are in no way ready to attack Iran (maybe in DC they are).

We should use a better approach to diplomacy this time (have we not learned our lesson?). We can not fight a 3 front war, we just don't have the assets and we won't have the backing.

Through the UN process we should keep pushing Iran to back out of Iraq.

When their soldiers are caught (like last week) we treat them as any other spy (as, unless Iran had reintroduced the declaration of war against, we are not at war then they are spies or terrorists).

If the actively engage the Coalition Troops and are captured or killed they are processed as all the other Insurgents or as spies (it will depend on their mission they got caught on), if killed it won't really matter to much other than the proof of nationality be brought to the UN.

If the Iranian Government won't stop sending soldiers directly we should use precision weapons to knock out the garrisons and movement routes in Iran, but only after we have done every thing possible to gain the world support again. That would take a lot of real hard evidence.

Matt

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[billvon 2,434]

I think that attacking Iran for this would be about as wise as attacking the USSR for their involvement in Vietnam. We're fighting a proxy war over there; even our president admits that we're not fighting Iraqis so much as terrorists from other countries. Other countries may well do the same, and get a piece of that proxy war.

I'd expect denials from Iran for a while, then an announcement that they are not fighting the US, but rather "protecting the rights of the Shi'a/Sunni/Medhi Army" or some other such rhetoric.

[matthewcline 0]

True as to the "he is shooting so I will shoot back", perspective.

After the shooting is done we do our searches and find a Iranian military ID and turn it in.

The other scene is just like last week when a tip led the coalition to a hotel room in Irbil (right close to Iran) and they captured 5 Iranian Soldiers, who apparently identified them selves as such.

Matt

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[Gawain 0]

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I'm under no illusion that we're ready to invade them.

Actually, we're not. Iran is much larger in scope compared to Iraq, and their Persian heritage is not a rag-tag of different arab tribes. They have a pride and unity on par with American patriotism. Not to mention 70,000,000 people.

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But if they're sending troops to Iraq to fight against us, what else does it take to deserve a response of violent force.

I don't think they are sending Iranian Revolutionary Guard troops. If they were, I'm sure at some point we would engage them, then out Iran for invading Iraq.

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Should we just give it a miss?

I'm not saying that either.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[nathaniel 0]

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If the Iranian Government won't stop sending soldiers directly we should use precision weapons to knock out the garrisons and movement routes in Iran, but only after we have done every thing possible to gain the world support again. That would take a lot of real hard evidence.

Yes, just look how well that worked in Serbia.

My advice is to do what your parents did; get a job, sir. The bums will always lose. Do you hear me, Lebowski?

[Amazon 7]

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If Iranian troops (probably not actually troops but rather willing citizen volunteers) are crossing the boarder to attack U.S. Troops, then we should kill them on Iraqi soil.

If need be kill them in Iraq.. great solution...

But going into Iran.. sure.. lets go.. I will be right there following my Imperius leader... IF he leads from the front....( I am feeling fairly confident that would never happen... no matter how much the fucking chickenhawk blusters and is crazy brave with other peoples lives)

Not that the fucktard would EVER put himself or one of HIS children in harms way.

[rushmc 18]

Why are all, ok, many, in this thread treating this like new news??

The latest details were the men proported to be from the Iranian Gaurd. (caught in an office somewhere in Iraq)

Iran is saying they are diplomats and are asking that they be released.

As for atacking Iran, I agree with the majority here....

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[matthewcline 0]

Read General Clarck's book about the subject. The weapons would have worked much better if he didn't have to get the President and every other world leaders OK prior to going after targets.

They worked real well in the desert on 2 separate conflicts, and have been improved upon since.

Matt

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[matthewcline 0]

Armed Diplomats, cool new idea I guess.
But it is an old one for Iran, I met some of their "Diplomats" in the Summer, Fall and Winter of 03.

Matt

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[sundevil777 94]

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I think that attacking Iran for this would be about as wise as attacking the USSR for their involvement in Vietnam.

I think we should have told the Soviets (and meant it) that they would be attacked if they didn't pull their people out. We did the opposite, not even attacking SAM sites where Soviets were helping them. Can't win wars that way.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[rushmc 18]

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&as_qdr=all&sa=X&oi=spell&resnum=0&ct=result&cd=1&q=Iranian+Guard+caught+in+Iraq&spell=1

Here is a google search I fired off on the 5 men. You can pick you favorite news org from here.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[matthewcline 0]

Like I said I met those types of Iranian Diplomats in 2003.

Matt

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[warpedskydiver 0]

Diplomats, yeah...ok.

I guess a long time ago I just didn't realize the people that we met were "just being diplomatic"

Damn we should have just invited them to smoke a hookah, and share a coke, and a smile.

[Darius11 12]

As per that logic we should invade all of the Middle East.
Aren’t all the people trying to kill us in Iraq considered “insurgents” from other countries?
Aren’t all the Iraqi people handing out flowers and thanking us?

Funny how we feel we have a right to start yet another war and the reasoning behind starting that war is interference of an already unjust war we have started.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[Frenchy68 0]

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But if they're sending troops to Iraq to fight against us, what else does it take to deserve a response of violent force.

That's called skating on thin egg shells...
If country A is sending troops against country B which happens to be on the soil of country C... Let's be careful what message we are sending.
Iraq. Kuwait. US. Iran. Blahblahblah...
Anyway, the war is already lost. All there is left is cosmetic. Call Madison Avenue to the rescue.

"For once you have tasted Absinthe you will walk the earth with your eyes turned towards the gutter, for there you have been and there you will long to return."

[outrager 6]

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But if they're sending troops to Iraq to fight against us, what else does it take to deserve a response of violent force

Was this quote written by somebody from America or from Iran? Either one would be equally justified

bsbd!

Yuri.

[kallend 1,648]

Oooh - remember Cambodia and Laos and the trouble it caused Nixon.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[billvon 2,434]

>We did the opposite, not even attacking SAM sites where Soviets
>were helping them. Can't win wars that way.

We DID win the Cold War that way. Who would have won World War III?

"Win at all costs" just doesn't work. Pyrrhus learned that; we should too.

[idrankwhat 0]

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If all this was clear, even if you don't think war is justified, I say that this would be a clear case where Bush's pre-emption doctrine should apply. If not here in such a case as I describe, then where?

Clearly we shouldn't even consider this without hammering out a tax cut first.

[orribolollie 0]

A pointless war in Afghanistan.

An unlawful war in Iraq - dubious objectives, failures galore and no plan for withdrawal.

Yeah, sounds like a cracking idea to invade a third country. NOT.

[shropshire 0]

So does it matter to you that we've aleady bittenj of waaay more than you can chew?.

You/we bombed Iraq back to the Stone-age over 12 years and we're still fucked.

Or have I missed something in the News recently?

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[orribolollie 0]

what else does it take to deserve a response of violent force

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Hang on a minute!!! YOU, the US, INVADED..what do you expect?

What you think people will just say yeah fair enough bud and walk away after you have attacked them haha.

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