0
chemist

newb helmet question

Recommended Posts

hello,

I did a tandem and am thinking now about getting a class A category license. However, most skydiving school have lower quality helmets, not to mention they usually have other peoples sweat in it.

So I guess I just wanted any input in the Ozone helmet by Cookie composites. http://www.cookiecomposites.com/shop/helmets/71/index.htm

I know nothing about skydiving. I am planning on getting a go pro camera, there shouldn't be any problems attaching it to that helmet right? I heard it connects using an adhesive tape to any helmet, but is it really that reliable to handle the strong ~100mpg winds?!

thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Troll much ?

where does your knowledge of what *most* skydiving schools use for helmets come from ?



lol why would I start an account to troll on this subject? Is it really that hot of an issue? haha

I saw a youtube video of a jump from the school I want to go train at and it looked like the helmets they used were those skateboarding style ones which is how I know, Although they do have a brand new facility and good new gear otherwise and a really nice airplane over there. I guess I couldn't speak for *most* schools.

Regardless the sweat would be an issue even if they did give students higher end ones. I just wanted to run it by a forum, who knows maybe I wouldn't be able to hear the radio since the ears are covered? Doubt that would be an issue though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Regardless the sweat would be an issue even if they did give students higher end ones.



As already stated. those plastic "skateboard" helmets provide better protection than the expensive skydiving specific helmets. If other peoples sweat will bother you, buy one - the cheap skateboarding one, not the expensive skydiving one. Do a search in this forum to find out why you don't need the expensive one right now.

Pick up a pair of goggles too. They see more sweat than helmet liners do.

You can probably find both at the dz. If not, they can tell you where to look.

Other than a logbook and beer, that's all the gear you need to buy until you are done with your student jumps.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

I know nothing about skydiving. I am planning on getting a go pro camera, there shouldn't be any problems attaching it to that helmet right?



Do those two sentences seem to go together properly to you?



that was also a concern of mine, but why would you need jump experience to have a go pro on your head? They seem like they would be lightweight, I feel like once I get it and try it on I wouldn't even know that its on there.

Is it possible for it to get caught in a rope twist in the event you have a rope twist?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

Quote

I know nothing about skydiving. I am planning on getting a go pro camera, there shouldn't be any problems attaching it to that helmet right?



Do those two sentences seem to go together properly to you?



that was also a concern of mine, but why would you need jump experience to have a go pro on your head? They seem like they would be lightweight, I feel like once I get it and try it on I wouldn't even know that its on there.

Is it possible for it to get caught in a rope twist in the event you have a rope twist?



Because you have too much other stuff to worry about. You cannot simply put it there, turn it on and forget about it. It doesn't happen that way.

There is a discipline specific forum for Photog and Vid. There are two "sticky" threads at the top. One is "Read this first" the other is the "Small Camera Incidents" list.
I suggest that you read them.
"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I saw the sticky, attention is a hot issue. Not interested in going there.

As for the helmet, I looked at other threads. Is it because high impact helmets can be harder on the head during low impact events? Or what? I don't understand why the pro tec is the best for protection, aren't all helmets made for protection?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

aren't all helmets made for protection?



Nope.... In the strange world which is skydiving.... Many, many helmets are designed for everything except protection. They are designed to carry cameras, audible altimeters, or shield the face from the wind in freefall... but NOT to provide significant protection to the brain in the case of a blow to the head. Some skydiving helmets even carry labels which make it clear that they offer no protection!
The choices we make have consequences, for us & for others!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

"Skateboard" type Protec helmets are by far the helmets that offer the best head protection used in skydiving.



Protecs don't have any specific safety certification whatsoever. The dual foam liner in a Protec is only designed to withstand multiple minor impacts, not major ones. As far as I can tell, there is no evidence that a Protec offers significantly more protection than any other skydiving helmet. If you know of such evidence, please post it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The best protection is provided by a hard shell that resembles a Pro-Tec with a fancy liner from Oregon Aero.
At ten times the cost of a Pro-Tec, that combination provides five percent better protection.

Also consider that before Pro-Tecs were invented (circa 1980) many skydivers wore hockey helmets for "combat RW" events like ten-way speed-stars. The only practical difference between a Pro-Tec and a hockey helmet is fewer snag points on the Pro-Tec.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

"Skateboard" type Protec helmets are by far the helmets that offer the best head protection used in skydiving.



Protecs don't have any specific safety certification whatsoever. The dual foam liner in a Protec is only designed to withstand multiple minor impacts, not major ones. As far as I can tell, there is no evidence that a Protec offers significantly more protection than any other skydiving helmet. If you know of such evidence, please post it.



there wouldn't be any data because carbon fiber is much stronger than general plastic that the pro tech are made from.

In fact carbon fiber is even stronger than some metals such as aluminum.

I have heard some motocross helmets can hurt more for minor impacts since the foam is built to absorb high impact only, but I do not think this is the case with the ozone helmet, it looks like the foam is very soft and comfortable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

there wouldn't be any data because carbon fiber is much stronger than general plastic that the pro tech are made from.

In fact carbon fiber is even stronger than some metals such as aluminum.



You really have no clue what you're talking about. There is no data because there is no certification for skydiving helmets to compare to the Protec. I'm not even sure the Protec is built to a standard of any kind.

Motorcycle and auto racing type helmets are built to a standard, and it's very specific to deal with the type of impacts you could expect from an incident involved with those activities.

The main shock-absorbing feature is the EPS foam liner (expanded ploy-styrene). It's like styrofoam, and what it does is crushes on impact, slowing the decelleration of the brain/skull in an effort to prevent TBI (Traumatic Brain Injury). Once these helmets are involved in an impact, they should be retired as the crushed liner can no longer absorb a shock.

The shell material, and the strenght of it are somwhat irrevelant. If it can remain in one peice through the certification, it matters little what it is.

Skydiving helmets, including the Protec, do not work on this pricipal. They are designed to protect from a much lower energy impact, more of a 'bump' than an impact.

The Protec is regarded as safer based on the thickness of the padding. In addition to the comft padding, they have 1/2 of stiff foam (not crushable) that provides added protection over a skydiving sepcific helmet.

Skydiving helmets feature one thin layer of comfort padding between the user and the shell. The purpose is to allow for a low profile helmet, which skydivers favor for the aerodynamics and unlimited range of peripheral vision. The use of carbon fiber in the shell was not for strength, but for weight, or the lack of it. Again, the weight is a plus to the jumper who has to wear the helmet though potentially high-g parachute openings.

Again, beyond a certain level, the strenght of the shell is academic. Your head/body can only survive so much of an impact, so if your helmet lives or not matters little.

No shit, try making one jump before rewriting the way things are done. A can guarantee that anyting you're going to think of for the next 50 to 100 jumps has been thought of, discussed, and tried at least 500 times before. Despite this, the status quo is what it is because that's what works in the real world.

Make a jump, see what you think of how it all works, and if you like it make another.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

there wouldn't be any data because carbon fiber is much stronger than general plastic that the pro tech are made from.

In fact carbon fiber is even stronger than some metals such as aluminum.


You can get plastics that are stronger than steel, but so what? Material comparisons without taking the application and operating environment into account are meaningless at best.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

The best protection is provided by a hard shell that resembles a Pro-Tec with a fancy liner from Oregon Aero.
At ten times the cost of a Pro-Tec, that combination provides five percent better protection.



Do you have a reference for the study that measured this 5%? As convincing as hearsay and conjecture is, it would be nice to follow it up with verifiable fact.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

In fact carbon fiber is even stronger than some metals such as aluminum.



Judging by the number of carbon lids you see on a DZ with bits of gaffa tape and glue holding all the cracks together, I'd say the brittleness of carbon is a significant disadvantage.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

carbon fiber is much stronger than general plastic that the pro tech are made from.

In fact carbon fiber is even stronger than some metals such as aluminum.



WTF mate?

Carbon Fiber may be stronger than plastic or aluminum, but it is NOT tougher than plastic, aluminum, or steel.

Would you take a 20oz framing hammer to a Cookie Composite helmet and expect it to hold up?
Hell No! But you could take it to a plastic Pro Tech.

Would you take a 20oz framing hammer to a Trek Madone OCLV Carbon Road Bike frame just to see if it holds up, then bomb down a hill at 40+ mph?
Hell No! But you could take it to an alloy frame and still ride with confidence.

Don't confuse strengthness with toughness

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

In fact carbon fiber is even stronger than some metals such as aluminum.



Judging by the number of carbon lids you see on a DZ with bits of gaffa tape and glue holding all the cracks together, I'd say the brittleness of carbon is a significant disadvantage.



This is usually due to the matrix around the carbon fiber oxidizing quickly in the hot and sunny conditions most people skydive in. A new carbon fiber helmet will be awesome. But as it gets brittle and old over the years, you will definitely lose some protection.

As far as this whole thread, still not sure if serious -_-
100mpgs?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Don't confuse strengthness with toughness



Don't confuse toughness with the ability to prevent injury to the head.

A good quality motorcycle helmet (they ARE designed to protect the head, with very well designed tests to confirm that ability), I think would be destroyed by a strong hammer blow, but the structure is designed to do that. The skydiving helmets are definitely not so well designed to absorb impact, but may do a better job of it than you might think based upon their destruction from a hard impact.
People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Quote

Judging by the number of carbon lids you see on a DZ with bits of gaffa tape and glue holding all the cracks together, I'd say the brittleness of carbon is a significant disadvantage.



This is usually due to the matrix around the carbon fiber oxidizing quickly in the hot and sunny conditions most people skydive in. A new carbon fiber helmet will be awesome. But as it gets brittle and old over the years, you will definitely lose some protection.



I'm not sure I completely buy this. 1) I've seen fairly new carbon helmets with cracks in them, 2) where I jump it is neither hot nor sunny.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account. It's free!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
0