relyon

This isn't a statistical anomoly. I've seen plenty of close range worse possible deployment scenarios and quite a few have resulted in collisions. It only takes once. With 20+ jumpers bailing out from a disabled aircraft with some stable and some not, some deploying immediately and some not, the chances of off-heading deployments and collisions is going to go way up. It wouldn't be very cool to successfully exit a ship that's going down only to get entangled or wrapped by the jumper who left before/after you. At Kapowsin's safety day a number of years back, they made a Otter run at 3000' with the left engine feathered. The plan was for 2 second poised exits (something most skydivers rarely if ever do). I went out first so I could watch the antics. Well over half the load had deployment problems of some sort or another and there were several close calls. Again, I'll be using my eyes before deploying, regardless of exit timing. Bob

You might want to think twice about this. There was a double fatality at the '96 CRW nationals that occured in exactly this way. I'd give it at least a second at the door or, better yet, suck it down a little lower and use my eyes. Bob

CRW main canopies get inspected quite often, though usually not by riggers (unless it happens to be by the 10% of CRWdogs that are riggers and that's free). Given the constraints of your poll (a paid for service by a rigger), I'll have to say it never gets inspected. FWIW, my main gets inspected thoroughly by me at every reserve repack, after every cutaway, after any sort of wrap or entaglement, before and after relining (every 250-350 jumps for a CRW main), and just for the heck of it every 20 or so jumps. Since I'm not a rigger, I guess that means my inspections don't count - whatever. Bob

The right part of the tail has slipped between the outside A-B and C-D line groups. Similar to the Mae West mulfunction in rounds. I'll guess it was propacked and occurred when flaking the line groups - I've come very close to packing myself one of these. Chopping was the only workable solution. That slight slider hangup and closed left end cell on the reserve ride was a bonus. Stay safe! Bob

Most beer contains only dissolved carbon dioxide. Guinness adds nitrogen as well. Bob

I've seen lots of actual hookknife use - all during CRW gone bad. Plenty of cut lines, a few canopies sliced and diced, and a number of pilotchutes (including two of mine ). I'd never had occasion to need mine until last year's CRW nationals, but luckily for my teammates canopy I couldn't. Cocooned head to toe, I couldn't reach either knife or either handle and my left 3-ring was fouled with fabric as well . Outside of CRW, I anticipate little need for a knife, but I always carry two just the same. Bob PS - Chico didn't cut his reserve lines at Ranoul, though he did manage to slice the slider. He was cutting the lines of the other canopy that was entangled with his main and reserve. Talk about mid-air rigging!

I prefer pullout deployment but don't like the pud. I solved the dilemma with a pullout handle that has a hackey and a patch of velcro stitched to the type IV lanyard. Bob

I'm focused in a discipline other than swooping (CRW) that I think does a good job of developing long term survival skills. Accuracy jumpers can make a similar claim. Canopy piloting is a lot more than just swooping. Bob

They do? Any crew dogs out there what to confirm this.? Sparky I'm not aware of any crwdogs that do intentional chops before a repack or any other time. We use our reserves too often as it is. Getting through a full reserve cycle is a good thing. Bob

Last Sat in Perris during CRW nationals rotation round #7: I was #3 out and was completely cocooned by #4. My left leg was entangled in a cascade, both arms were all but immobilized (think straight jacket), and I could barely see. As if that wasn't enough, I couldn't reach my hook knives or handles, and my left 3-ring was fouled by canopy fabric and wouldn't have released. Fortunately, I had a good canopy and two other jumpers docked above me. I spent 7000' feet trying to control the loose fabric and sweating bullets as to what would happen if it caught air and downplaned. My teammates flew me to the grass and dropped me at about 20 feet. Almost stood it up (I could barely reach the brakes and the winds were good) but tripped over the wrapped canopy and face planted right in front of the accuracy pit. Bob

Jump #234, a 25-way CRW diamond that funnelled. Four of us took reserve rides. Bob

what reserve do you have Tempo 170 what container Infinity I-2.5 what loading on the reserve 1.14 how did it fly docile, plenty of flare what was the mal no malfunctions, all 9 were after CRW wraps & entanglements Bob

The addition of the word "only" changes the meaning of your message, but I still think it's pretty sick to want people to get hurt. I've seen plenty of folks bust themselves up and a couple fatalities. Some were the results of their actions, some weren't. It all sucks, it's all bad, regardless of who or why. If there is never another incident to post in this forum, it won't be soon enough. Bob

You actually wish bodily harm upon someone in this sport? That's sick. Please tell me I'm misunderstanding something here. Bob

I don't think science has any pretense of getting everything right every time. What's your point? It sounds as though you're saying "Don't try". Bob

I've never jumped a round myself. But from what I have heard they a good for this type of deployment (if it wasn't for the contaminition issue and for he record i am still jumping my sabre 170 with my swift reserve at 220 (reserve only used once by me) Rounds have been used with success in the past for aerial retrieval using airplanes, but they're poorly suited for use with helicopters. First, there is a low pressure turbulent area immediately above a round one would not want to fly a helicopter into, though that could be avoided with a long line. Second, and more importantly, rounds have little forward speed and a significant descent rate. Matching this with a helicopter would put it in perfect conditions for settling with power - definitely not good. Ram air canopies have enough forward speed that SWP can be avoided and the capture can be made. Bob

I'm curious how she could know so soon. During the press conference, the Lockheed Martin guy said dead batteries could be a root cause, but it wasn't stated it was the root cause. By design there was no telemetry from the craft since the time it was released by the bus. As of 1pm PDT it was still in the ground. Even if the batteries are dead upon removal, it doesn't necessarily mean they were dead upon entry - it was a hell of an impact. The inquiry will be interesting. Bob

You're confusing two failed Mars missions. Mars Climate Orbiter failed because it's aim point for entry interface was too low (by a factor of about three - the ratio of feet to meters). It incinerated on entry. It's sister mission, Mars Polar Lander, is believed to have failed because the sensors that detect surface touchdown were tripped when the legs were extended after the heatshield was jettisoned. It thought it was on the surface and never fired it's braking motors. Different missions, different failures. I wouldn't be too quick to speculate or poke fun at the latest failure. Robotic atmospheric entry, descent, and landing missions are some of the most difficult to pull off. Bob

I was watching NASA TV the whole time and that's not what I heard. One of the first on the ground reported nothing out. We'll see. Bob

Yup! Here's one we went to just this past weekend: Coastal Kitchen in Capital Hill. Great brunch spot. Get there early or plan on a little bit of a wait (10- 30 minutes). Another is Julia's in Wallingford. Jai Thai in Fremont is good too, as is Bahn Thai on Roy St (a couple blocks from Seattle Center/EMP/Space Needle). Bob

Yeah, what they said to all the suggestions you've gotten so far. Pioneer Square has a number of nightclubs and a variety of music. My wife and I like the Fenix in particular. That's a great list. The Mt Pilchuck trail is a good one. The Naches Peak Loop Trail wasn't on the list but is a great day hike with easy access and plenty of parking. Take Hwy 410 east from Enumclaw to Chinook Pass and park at the vistors center. Part of the hike is on the Pacific Crest Trail. About 3.5 miles and not very strenuous. Another short hike is Rattlesnake Ledge (see here too). There's a nice vistors center for the Cedar River Watershed as well, if you're into that sort of thing. There's also the Tillicum Village cruise on Argosy. You'll get a tour of the Seattle waterfront on the way over, a show and dinner, and there's a trail around Blake Island as well. Agosy's web site mentions 1/2 hour free time after the dinner/show, but when we took it you could stay and take a later boat back to Seattle if you booked an earlier cruise. Bob

The incident described wasn't an intentional cutaway, it was an intentional reserve deployment. There's a significant difference between the two. I've seen way more stupid things than that at DZs on a regular basis, but that's JMO. A friend of mine once had a total because his pilot chute handle had been jammed deep into the ROL pouch by the jumper behind him while sitting on the floor of the plane. When he went to deploy he immediately realized he'd probably spend the rest of his life trying to get the handle, so he dumped his reserve instead and had an uneventful ride on his Swift Plus. My devil's advocate question is how is my friend's reliance on his reserve any different that the incident described? Please understand I'm not advocating intentional reserve rides. I just don't understand how in one context an action is the dumbest thing that can be done, yet in another it is exactly the right move. Bob

What John said, and maybe also explain what that site has to do with skydiving...

I suggest you learn a little more about the person you're replying to before you start questioning his reply. He's being doing CRW longer than avgjoe, you, and I combined have been jumping. Proficient CReW pilot? I know most of them in the country and all of them on the west coast. crewdog2 is one of the best. Bob

AggieDave - I've heard of folks chasing nerf balls under canopy. Supposedly they fall at roughly the same rate as canopies and there's little harm that can come from running into one. IIRC, Jon Sikorsky (sikorsky) has done some of this. avgjoe - I'm with crewdog2 on this one. starkmtn - Based on your avatar (only three shirts with that font were made - I have one of them), I'll guess I know you, but your lack of profile info makes it difficult to place the face. Care to identitfy yourself? A PM is fine. Bob