cvfd1399 0 #1 April 20, 2004 I am wondering what is the best pack job for a 370sf 7 cell f111 ram air. I am looking for good head on safe reliable opening, easiest on body, and rig, ease of packing for the jumper and the others around him/her. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #2 April 20, 2004 If it was mine, I'd pack it like a tandem.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
webracer 0 #3 April 20, 2004 Pay a packer! That is a big canopy to pack, and will take lots of space. It is too big to PRO pack from the shoulder effectively (especially if you're new to packing). You will have to flatpack it. Paying is still the best way in my opinion, and stimulates the DZ economy.Troy I am now free to exercise my downward mobility. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymick 0 #4 April 20, 2004 Quote Pay a packer! Yeah but this guy has only 10 jumps, so learning to pack it himself would be the best idea IMHO. It may be a pain in the arse to pack but i've always been a believer in packing yourself (at least until you understand all the basics of packing and how different techniques affect deployment etc) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bertusgeert 1 #5 April 20, 2004 Do you just want to learn to pack your own gear, or just learn to pack in general? Why do you highlight that you want it to open on heading and be safe? ANy reason in particular? Thats what I do EVERY time I pack! Learn flat and pro packing, and watch a lot of people. You will develop your own style, pcik things up from certain people, and ignore other people's suggestions. Just learn as much as you can, know how it works and what causes what. Then you know what to do to make a slower opening, or to pack a more on heading opening. Personally I'd pro pack it cuz that is what I am comfy with. i can see how symmetrical I did it, how the whole thing looks before I close it up. Its just how I do it. You choose! --------------------------------------------- As jy dom is moet jy bloei! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cvfd1399 0 #6 April 20, 2004 Oh I definately will learn to pack myself. I am just looking for everyones opinion on which is best to learn first for a big canopy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChasingBlueSky 0 #7 April 21, 2004 Usually a canopy that big is flat packed. You will have better control of the lines and the material. I have seen some people pro-pack some old EZ tandem canopies that were roughly the same size and they seemed to have more issues on openings (line twists and line overs). I've been to DZ's where hooks are used to help pro-pack a canopy of that size, and that seems to work quite well. The largest student canopy that I have pro-packed is a Safire 260 and have yet to pack a mal on it. There is a lot of material to control, and you must really pay attention to where the lines are or you will get material in the line set which could produce line burn. The good thing about a canopy that big is the bag is HUGE. I do not use the typical S-Fold to manage that much material, I use a backwards S-Fold (no, I won't try to explain that to a student - see if you can find someone on the DZ to show you). I'll be in the same category as you soon - I am moving back to the ranks of staff packer this season and will be taught how to pack the Sigma tandems over the next few weeks. Should be interesting!_________________________________________ you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me.... I WILL fly again..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dougjumper 0 #8 April 21, 2004 Just Flat Pack the Damn thing.. then be done with it... The glass is half full or half empty doesn't matter. Let go and have the Lord guide your path. He will take care of it all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
atsaubrey 0 #9 April 21, 2004 Have Bill at Elsinore pack that XX canopy! Now that we figured it out, nothing but soft on heading openings! No, but seriously flat pack the beast and if it doesn't have packing tabs, have them put on (makes it even easier) I've been getting nice 300-500ft snivels lately and as soft as a babies bottom. just roll the nose tightly to the A lines and pay close attention to the slider. If you pay a packer like I do, add $1-$3 for his trouble with the big thing. Man, it's just another reason you need to get yur big ass out here and jump with me, oh and have Bill teach ya."GOT LEAD?" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Auryn 0 #10 April 21, 2004 QuoteI am wondering what is the best pack job for a 370sf 7 cell f111 ram air. I am looking for good head on safe reliable opening, easiest on body, and rig, ease of packing for the jumper and the others around him/her. LONG: I have a good amount of experience with packing canopies of that size.. and additionally other canopies that are known to open hard. I'm a packer, so I'm buried in 400 sq ft tandems all day long.. I recommend Pro Pack because of several reasons: #1: You can still roll the snot out of the nose if it needs be.. just simply put the nose along your right leg, controlling the pack job after it's arranged w/ your left hand and leg.. roll the nose however you prefer w/ your right hand. w/ a canopy like that, heading control really isn't an issue, so you can do a simple one directional roll. Go all the way up to the A lines and then a bit if you wish. #2: the first reason why I think pro pack is better to get soft openings no matter what: you can bury the rolled nose deeper inside the pack job than you can w/ a flat pack. A tip for really burying the nose: when you're finishing arranging the lines, before you deal w/ the nose and slider, roll the stabilizers and ends of the tail INWARD, so that when you stuff the nose deeply this helps control the lines and keeps them from splaying outward everywhere. #3 It is easier to roll the hell out of the tail, which is JUST AS IMPORTANT for a soft opening as rolling the nose. remember also that if you have a canopy that opens hard, pull the slider as far forward as you can without messing up the quartering along the sides and back. I got a 2500 ft snivel on a tandem last weekend using these methods. I am 6'1" so I can pro pack stuff this big reasonably easily. if you are shorter it shouldn't be an issue unless the D lines touch the ground when it's over your shoulder.. you just have to bend down a bit to get the tail and flake the D lines, which even I do. if the lines touch the ground, you can use a booster of some sort under your feet if you're really concerned. My partner is 5'4" and has no problem pro packing tandems either. My $.02 worth.. remember, nothing is better than practice and subsequent confidence. PS: the reason I say that heading control isn't that big of an issue is: it's flying so slow, you should be able to react to any off heading really easily.. but you have to work very hard to get a canopy that big to open off heading w/ a pro pack.. w/ a flat pack it is MORE prone to be off heading.. laying it on it's side puts it 90 degrees off if you don't splay the nose out like a reserve, which causes hard openings. Blue Skies ! Bryan D27808 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 4 #11 April 21, 2004 QuoteHave Bill at Elsinore pack that XX canopy! Now that we figured it out, nothing but soft on heading openings! No, but seriously flat pack the beast and if it doesn't have packing tabs, have them put on (makes it even easier) I've been getting nice 300-500ft snivels lately and as soft as a babies bottom. just roll the nose tightly to the A lines and pay close attention to the slider. If you pay a packer like I do, add $1-$3 for his trouble with the big thing. Man, it's just another reason you need to get yur big ass out here and jump with me, oh and have Bill teach ya. Why did you have to figure things out? I gave you the packing manuel on the damn thing. SparkyMy idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
atsaubrey 0 #12 April 21, 2004 First of all I dont want to steal the post. Well the CD you gave me is blank, and when he was packing it we tried a few differnet things to get the best openings. The way you did it worked best [runs off with tail between his legs]"GOT LEAD?" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flynhigh 0 #14 April 21, 2004 Definitely flat pack - tandem roll the nose and it'll be all good!! Dare to dream and then make it happen! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumpervali 2 #15 April 21, 2004 The 370 sqft 7 cell canopies I've seen were normally flat packed by the military jumpers using them. jumpervali Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 624 #17 April 21, 2004 PRO pack it the same way the REAL MEN pack tandems. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnMitchell 16 #18 April 21, 2004 Flat pack that big boy, and enjoy squeezing the air out of an F-111 canopy. Won't be like that when ya move up to ZP. With a little practice, it'll fall in the bag like a dream. Don't worry about the size. My kid can pack a big F-111 as fast as a small ZP. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bertusgeert 1 #19 April 21, 2004 Auryn makes really good points here that I was going to post anyhow. As you see here, some people like one way, others prefer a different way. Thus, I say, do both and see what YOU like. I had a brand new 400sq. ft. ZP to pack to other day, and I PRO-packed it no prob. (I am also 6'1, that makes a dif.) The TM said it opened beautifully. For the same reasons as Auryn, I pro pack 'em. I know exactly what I am doing when I pro pack and I can do it in half the time. Just my preferance. So, WATCH, LEARN, DO, DECIDE. --------------------------------------------- As jy dom is moet jy bloei! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Luv2Fall 0 #20 April 21, 2004 But I'm not a real man lol. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airtwardo 7 #21 April 21, 2004 QuoteFlat pack it. *** I was talking to Ted Strong a few weeks ago... Flat Pack ALL big canopies.... ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
feuergnom 26 #22 April 21, 2004 are you a skydiver or a sissy? just trash pack it ok - i'm serious now: learn to pro-pack it on a hook. this does miracles on a large canopy if you are not comfortable when packing over the shoulder. once you are comfortable with this, try it over your shoulder. and never hesitate to ask a rigger/packer for hints, tipps & advice - it's priceless! once you have managed to handle a canopy of this size, you shouldn't have problems packing any other shute – xcept these really slippery zp-bastards The universal aptitude for ineptitude makes any human accomplishment an incredible miracle dudeist skydiver # 666 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cvfd1399 0 #23 April 21, 2004 Wouldn't mind trying a sub-terminal trash pack with 2 reserves one day. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 4 #24 April 21, 2004 Quoteok - i'm serious now: learn to pro-pack it on a hook. this does miracles on a large canopy if you are not comfortable when packing over the shoulder. This canopy has a cord of 13 feet. That is 3 feet higher than a baskeball hoop. Just putting it on the hook would be a problem. SparkyMy idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 4 #25 April 21, 2004 QuoteFirst of all I dont want to steal the post. Well the CD you gave me is blank, and when he was packing it we tried a few differnet things to get the best openings. The way you did it worked best [runs off with tail between his legs] It wasn't blank when I gave it to you. I will make you another. Elsinore Sunday. Sparky Edited to include: What about the printed version I gave you on the Main and Reserve?My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
