How to placate the parents?

[kirrz 0]

Ok.. so I started AFF, did 2 jumps, didn't bother telling my parents about my new hobby because it was all in the heat of the moment, I knew they wouldn't approve and there would be big fights and figured I would have to come home for 3 months and I'll work on it then.

Now I'm here.. and from little things like sky diving movies on my desktop & wanting to take diving lessons.. dad caught on and says "I hope its not because you want to go skydiving. Because I will never allow it."

To which I reply, "well if I earn my own money, I'm over 18.. so there is no question of your consent."

He says "there is no way. Do you know why no insurance will cover sky divers? Because its that dangerous, that's why its called an extreme sport."

So I told him that we would have this argument again in 3 months.. during which I will gather adequate evidence and prove to him that it is not as dangerous as the general conception is.
I know that I could just go do it.. but I grew up in an Indian family where the concept of family is all-important so I would feel too guilty.. I would rather play clean.

I was wondering if anyone else had to go through this 'placating the parents' phase.. and what you did. Also, does anyone have any ideas on arguments I could use? So far I have a Forbes publication of the world's most dangerous sports where skydiving isn't listed but scuba is (he would approve of scuba) and I was planning to go through the fatality list and show that its never because the parachute didn't open.. it's because the person made a mistake.

Sorry this post is so long..

Thanks!

[flyangel2 2]

I'm one of those that have had to deal with my whole family over the years about this same subject. It's been over 25 plus years now, and they have finally given up.

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To which I reply, "well if I earn my own money, I'm over 18.. so there is no question of your consent."

I couldn't tell from your post if you are still living at home. You are correct, if you are over 18 years of age, earn your own money, and don't depend on your parents for any finical help, you are a big girl and can make your own decisions. If they are helping you with any of their money, you are going to have a harder road to travel with them.

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He says "there is no way. Do you know why no insurance will cover sky divers? Because its that dangerous, that's why its called an extreme sport."

I have both health and life insurance. Just make sure you have all that in place before starting your skydiving adventures.

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I will gather adequate evidence and prove to him that it is not as dangerous as the general conception is.

For every item you show him saying that skydiving isn't dangerous, he can find the opposite. You need to admit right now, that skydiving is dangerous.

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I was wondering if anyone else had to go through this 'placating the parents' phase.. and what you did. Also, does anyone have any ideas on arguments I could use? So far I have a Forbes publication of the world's most dangerous sports where skydiving isn't listed but scuba is (he would approve of scuba) and I was planning to go through the fatality list and show that its never because the parachute didn't open.. it's because the person made a mistake.

The way I handled my family was to just tell them that I was going to continue with the sport. I think it was easier for me, since I had been moved out and living out of state for a few years before I started skydiving. When ever the subject came up with them, I would just tell them I wasn't going to discuss it. I refused to get sucked into an argument with them.

IMO, going through the fatality list isn't a good idea. Not all those people died because of their mistake. I admit, most of them did, but not all.

Keep it simple with them. The more fire you give them, the more they will argue with you.

May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey

[Orange1 0]

Ya.. difficult one. Other than fatality stats it may be useful (maybe more so) to go over how the risks are controlled for - you'd be amazed how many whuffos don't realise, for example, that you have to have a reserve when you jump! And how because of the chain involved in the sport via the DZs, pilots etc - very different to say paragliding where you can basically just launch off a mountain (some sites you are meant to have x licence etc but there is no-one really checking that you do, if you can fly your gear, how current you are, etc) or scuba even - that the sport is quite controlled because many more people than just you have a vested interest in you making it down alive.

It may help if you can take them to a DZ. A couple of guys i work with were thinking of tandems and were very reassured to see (a) that it is not a bunch of wild-eyed maniacs running around and more importantly (b) lots of safe landings. Of course, this could backfire if you happen to have them there when there actually is an incident... but this just goes to the fact that you do have to realise there is risk in the sport.

btw re insurance: not sure about over there, but over here most of the major medical schemes cover injuries in skydiving and you can get life insurance tho it usually means a higher premium.

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[agent_lead 0]

when my mother was younger she used to date a skydiver..and she always wanted to jump but her father would not sign the consent form..so by the time she was old enuf to do it herself she would get all geared up and then chicken out on the plane..

so i mean..me..as a kid..was always interested in skydiving...so when i was propositioned by a friend to actually do it...i told my mother i was going and she told me this story..and gave me her best wishes..

for my second tandem i took my younger brother for his birthday and he jumped and loved it..and she had no problem with both of her sons jumping out of a plane on the same day...

on my forth jump i brought my mother out with me and she did a tandem at 59 years old!and she absolutley loved it..she cant wait to go back next summer..

of course my father thinks his entire family is fucking crazy...

but i mean..listen..if your old enuf to make your own decisions...just do it..dont lie to them about it tho..tell them that this is something your deeply interested in and will continue to do..and they will be forced to accept it eventually..i mean..what are they gonna do..never speak to their daughter again?


i attached 2 pics of my mom on her tandem..

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www.facebook.com/agentlead

[skybytch 259]

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I was planning to go through the fatality list and show that its never because the parachute didn't open.. it's because the person made a mistake.

It's not always because the person made a mistake. You can do everything right in this sport and still die or be seriously injured. Ask anybody who's been jumping for more than a few years and they likely know or know of someone who died doing everything right.

Your dad is right. Skydiving is dangerous.

I'm assuming by the fact that you're "home" for three months that you are still in school, and thus still "under the thumb" of your parents. Skydiving will still be there when you graduate, get a real job and are supporting yourself - a point at which the argument "it's my money and my life" becomes easier for a caring, involved parent to swallow.

Skydiving is not worth huge fights with your family. I know this isn't what you want to hear, but imho it might be best for you to think about putting off learning to skydive until later.

[Andy9o8 1]

Flyangel's post is right on the money, IMO. Her experience was similar to mine. I started skydiving in 1975 when I was 18. When I told my dad, he flipped his wig. We never told my mom because she was (is) the hysterical type. I was in college at the time, and my dad was paying my tuition, room & board, so he easily could have cut me off financially if he'd wanted to. Luckily for me, he didn't. He later told me he considered it, but figured I'd probably just claim I'd stopped and then skydive behind his back anyway, and he didn't want to have a relationship with me where I never talked to him about myself, so he didn't cut me off. (He was right, if he'd forbade me from skydiving I'd have just done it behind his back.) (I eventually did quit for some years after I got married, and then resumed a couple years ago once my kids got older.) To this day, I won't discuss skydiving with my parents or siblings because I just don't want to hear the bullshit.

I can tell you that when I was 18, 19, 20 years old, I personally had no problem at all with the concept of skydiving (or doing other stuff my parents would have hated, which I did) & just not telling my parents. (It's tough being a young adult with all the rights of an adult but still financially dependent upon one's parents, so that's how I reconciled the conflict.) But that's a value issue, for which there's no objectively "right" answer, and only you can decide if you're willing to do that.

[JeepDiver 0]

At this stage of your life I wouldn't seek out a confrontation with your parents. I'd ask you to understand better what your getting yourself into.

Skydiving is dangerous. You can do everything right and still suffer serious injury or death. Keep in mind the sky is awlays going to be there for you. There's no need to rush.

[daniel_owen_uk 0]

Bad news is your arguements are gonna get you in trouble.

Reasoning 1, its not that dangerous, it is, people die doing exactly what they should have, so don't go down the its not dangerous route. If you want to talk about the risk to your life, then talk him through the safety measures that go into jumping, and if he want's to know the fatality stats quote them and explain how those stats come about (ie low turns etc.).

Reasoning 2, its my money and I will spend it on what I like, others have already said it, that arguements fine, but if you are dependent on your parents for anything it screws you right over. The way to round this one is to go for the "its my life" angle, talk about being an adult and being able to make your own decision based on all the facts available (more you have easier it will be to win this arguement).

I was fortunate enough to have my parents full blessing, tbh they seem a little too unworried

__________________

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[schuey87 0]

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I was wondering if anyone else had to go through this 'placating the parents' phase.. and what you did. Also, does anyone have any ideas on arguments I could use? So far I have a Forbes publication of the world's most dangerous sports where skydiving isn't listed but scuba is (he would approve of scuba) and I was planning to go through the fatality list and show that its never because the parachute didn't open.. it's because the person made a mistake.

Sorry this post is so long..

Thanks!

Skydiving is an extreme sport, it is one where you can do everything right and get hurt, whether it be due to someone else being careless or equipment issues. In addition, no matter how infetissally small it is, there is always the possibility of a malfunction on main and reserve.

Tbh with you, I personally think the only way to get your parents to start coming round is keep jumping. My parents aren't over the moon about me jumping, they'd never put any money towards anything skydiving related, but they are warming to it a bit more now, and no doubt as my jump numbers increase they're attitudes will warm more.

[papax17 0]

Tell your dad that skateboarding is also considered an extreme sport.


If I were you I would definately bring them to a DZ and let them just watch and see how professional skydivers, and instructors actually are, and how they are not some rampant wreckless fools.

If I brought my parents to the DZ they would be completely surprised when they see the people who are actually jumping ie Retirees, mother and daughters etc...


Also if you got a tandem video that helps a lot too. When your parents see it, it should warm them up a little bit more to the sport seeing you having the time of your life and how much fun it is. My tandem video helped, but I am still working on the parentals.


Good luck

[FrEaK_aCcIdEnT 0]

Skydiving is dangerous.

I told my grandmother that it wasnt that bad to eleviate her fears. All the while I understand the risk I take everytime I leave the aircraft in a self induced freefall. I am slowely trying to get my point across to her that everyone dies sometime, i just want to live before i do and Skydivers are not out to kill them selfs. They are out to enjoy life. Its a slow process and i almost regret telling her that it "isnt that bad". I know with jump numbers she will understand beter and I know currency is the best way to keep EPs in the noggin.

If i were in your shoes, it looks like a win/loose situation. If ur parents are funding u in any way then they can unfund you. Yes u are 18 and yes u do have the ability to make ur own decisions. But are u prepared to handle the consequences for a stand that u might regret taking? Maybe waiting is the best answer.

^^^^^^ Did that just come from my rebelious(sp?) mind?

Please god tell me im not becoming a mature adult!!!

I think i need a drink.

ExPeCt ThE uNeXpEcTeD!
DoNt MiNd ThE tYpOs, Im LaZy On CoRrEcTiOnS!

[blithedj 0]

I went through something a little different with my parents. This past summer I had my mind set on doing a tandem, and I knew that both of my brothers had always wanted to do one, along with a good friend of mine. We all made our reservation at the DZ and my dad was planning on coming along for an observer ride.

My dad is a non-current pilot, so the idea of airplanes and flight got him a little excited. When we got to the DZ, he even decided to make the jump with us.

We all did our tandem out of the same otter, on the same load... And let me say that it was awesome being up there with all my brothers, my dad, and my good friend.

After we were done, I was seriously considering going for my A license when I got to college with the Sport Parachute club we have here. My parents were totally against the idea - They figured that a Tandem was enough to get my fix - Boy were they wrong!

So I got to school, and did my FJC at the DZ and continued to jump without them knowing. I made 13 jumps before I finally had to break the news to them, and I found that the best way to do it is admiting right off the bat that you betrayed their trust, and that you're sorry. There's no amount of statistics or reasoning that's going to get them over the fact that you betrayed their trust and went on jumping without them. I stressed the fact that I didn't want this to come between our relationship, but that it really was my passion - and they took it rather well. They even wanted to come to the DZ the next day and meet my instructors (Which really helped a lot). Most whuffos have this idea that all skydivers are your stereotypical 'surfboy' looneys.

It all comes down to roots and wings, something that every parent has to deal with. There's only so much a parent can do before you have to get out on your own and carve your own path.

Obviously your parents will be different then mine... But sitting them down for a real mature conversation where they could ask questions and I could let them know just how passionate I am about this sport really helped.

If you really are passionate about Skydiving, you'll find a way to make it happen. Don't be afraid to 'stretch' your parents a little bit - But if it means they cut you off entirely, then like has been said: The skies can wait. Don't be afraid to follow your dream, even if something stands in your way.

[nate_1979 9]

Guess I'm pretty lucky, My parents are happy that I have found something to be passionate about. Funny thing with my parents is that I didnt wanna do my first jump, my mom wanted to. Being the son that I am, I just couldnt sit on the ground and watch my mom go and not do it myself, so I went on the same load... My dad on the other hand had no problem staying on the ground He thinks its crazy, but he finds it interesting, and although both parents worry (they never expected me to do more than 1 jump) they are just happy that I'm having such a good time.

I hope you can get this sorted out, everyone needs something to be passionate about, and for some people skydiving is it (atleast for a period of time) ... For others it isn't. I would probably attack this situation from the angle of "Be happy that I've found something I really really enjoy" ..

FGF #???
I miss the sky...
There are 10 types of people in the world... those who understand binary and those who don't.

[IanHarrop 41]

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So far I have a Forbes publication of the world's most dangerous sports where skydiving isn't listed but scuba is (he would approve of scuba)

I'd love to get a copy of this article.

Is it on-line and can you post a link? If not is there anyway to get it scanned?

Thanks, Ian

Edit to add: Not to worry... I found it myself

"Where troubles melt like lemon drops, away above the chimney tops, that's where you'll find me" Dorothy

[rmsmith 1]

Tell them you're going to do it anyway. If they really care that much about you they will buy you some safe *new* gear that is appropriate for you. Blue skies!

[kirrz 0]

All the advice so far has been really thought provoking and useful!

The money thing is a bit different.. see I grew up Indian.. and the mindset is pretty much dad takes care of you (financially) and then husband takes care of you. But I'm stuck in transition generation where I will go have a career and make my own choices but because I'm the first generation doing this, its all a big battle and a learning process for everyone involved. He won't cut me off but the thing is because of the patriarchal mindset, I will never actually be cutoff and be able to do the whole independence thing. It could sour our relationship and that's the last thing I want to happen.

I know my dad is a reasonable guy, just stubborn and overprotective sometimes. I have compiled in a folder a whole bunch of articles, statistics and technical information to try to show him:

a) the stigma assc. w/ skydiving is a product of media hype

b) the parachute is like a machine, if packed properly, it will open properly

c) skydivers aren't out to kill themselves and safety is always priority no. 1

d) the number of fatalities arising from human error are large in proportion to total malfunctions

e) it is a highly highly regulated sport

I figured I'll give him this info one of these days and we can argue about it rationally in 3 months time, at least he will be properly informed.

All input has been and is very very much appreciated!! You guys have made me decide not to act like a spoilt brat but approach this maturely instead.

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[grue 1]

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Guess I'm pretty lucky, My parents are happy that I have found something to be passionate about. Funny thing with my parents is that I didnt wanna do my first jump, my mom wanted to. Being the son that I am, I just couldnt sit on the ground and watch my mom go and not do it myself, so I went on the same load... My dad on the other hand had no problem staying on the ground He thinks its crazy, but he finds it interesting, and although both parents worry (they never expected me to do more than 1 jump) they are just happy that I'm having such a good time.

I hope you can get this sorted out, everyone needs something to be passionate about, and for some people skydiving is it (atleast for a period of time) ... For others it isn't. I would probably attack this situation from the angle of "Be happy that I've found something I really really enjoy" ..

Yeah, I got lucky for the most part, too. My dad thinks it's cool as hell, and has made a jump himself. He's going to start AFF after the new year!

My grandparents haaaaaaaate it, though.

cavete terrae.

[ntrprnr 0]

Kirrz: See the thread http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1734651;search_string=parents%20found%20out;#1734651 when my parents found out. It happens. They've since gotten over it, and not only that, came out to watch one day. See the photo http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_attachment;postatt_id=54014;

It gets better. Give them time to realize you love it, then they'll eventually come out and watch, and then they'll eventually get over it. They'll never love it, but they'll realize you're their daughter, and they love you more than they want to disown you. It'll all be good. :)

_______________
"Why'd you track away at 7,000 feet?"
"Even in freefall, I have commitment issues."

[flyangel2 2]

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Tell them you're going to do it anyway. If they really care that much about you they will buy you some safe *new* gear that is appropriate for you. Blue skies!

Should there have been a after that statement? Or is that how you really feel?

May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey

[darkwing 4]

take them to a DZ on a nice day so they can watch. Have them buy you a cypres/vigil for Christmas... You are a big girl now. I wouldn't let them dictate to you. Next thing you know they'd be saying "You are not allowed to date that guy...."

-- Jeff
My Skydiving History

[MB38 0]

I told my parents at about jump 15. I was going to wait until after I had my A, but they asked me what that funny little curved pin was on my necklace and I didn't really have a choice.

My dad took it fine. He wished that I had told him earlier... me keeping it from him bothered him more than the skydiving part. My mother was a different story.

She got very teary and shaky because she was absolutely certain that I was going to die. We all talked about how long I had wanted to jump and how much I've been around dropzones/other jumpers. I've been loosely involved in the sport for the last 8-9 years or so as a spectator and friend. My parents knew that I liked it but didn't have a clue how much I had been involved, how much I'd seen and how much I'd learned over that time.

I talked to them about how the AFF program worked and how one progresses through it. I gave them an idea of what a normal day for me would look like at the dropzone and mentioned some statistics to show them that it isn't as dangerous as they feared... but it's still dangerous. We ended that day off by watching every skydiving video that I had saved for just this occasion.

She only started to realize how dedicated I am to the sport in the past month or so. I live about 3,000 miles from my parents, so I don't see them too much. The last time I was with my parents I started getting into a little more detail about how skydiving works. What is the gear like? What is wingloading? How does a three-ring work? What happens if I have a malfunction? What kind of malfunction can I have and what do they look like? A lot of videos helped. I topped it off with the Skyhook video on Relative Workshop's site to show her where equipment seems to be heading.

The next time they're in town, I'll take them to the dropzone. My dad knows he could do it but my mom is still nervous. She doesn't know if she could handle seeing me getting into an airplane knowing that I was going to jump out of it.

I still have no video of myself in freefall... something I've been damn near dreaming about and something that I know my parents want to see. I am by no means a good skydiver, but them seeing me stable in the air, smiling, turning and docking with somebody will have a huge effect on what they think of it. I'm hoping that I'll be able to do a jump with somebody wearing a camera helmet next weekend. [Pssst, if anybody jumps at Perris, owns a camera helmet and wants to jump with me... ]

So that was my experience telling the parents. It's been a good process so far and they've been generally accepting... but the only difference between fear and respect is knowledge.

I really don't know what I'm talking about.

[freakflyer9999 1]

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d) the number of fatalities arising from human error are large in proportion to total malfunctions

Fatalities from human error vs total malfunctions is irrelevant. You are just as capable of human error as any of the rest of us. Don't think for a moment that you are incapable of making a mistake in this sport. And unlike other sports, skydiving can be a very unforgiving sport when it comes to human error.

[OSOK 0]

My mom used to cry when I would tell her I was going jumping. Since I also work part-time at the dropzone, when she'd ask me if I was jumping I would say "dont know" and then I'd just tell her I did jump when I got back. She's kinda over the whole fear thing because I've shown her my videos... my first tandem and my checkdive. I'm sure the videos have helped a bit... but she still kinda freaks when we talk about it, which is something I avoid as much as possible.


I think to a parent the whole "evidence" thing as in reports and articles is garbage. I know my parent's would feel better seeing me do the actual thing, have fun, and be safe... rather than showing them stuff that says skydiving isn't dangerous, which isn't true in the first place.

IMO you should just go ahead and tell them that you've done the two jumps, had a blast, and want to continue doing it. You're a big girl so don't go "asking" if you can, just tell them you're going to, but make sure to do it in a very docile way. If done right it'll show them that you're not a little girl anymore and maybe put in their heads that you can take care of yourself skydiving.

DISCLAIMER: I will receive private messages if you do any of this and it goes wrong, and we'll talk about it. But please don't hate me for it.

[Tink1717 2]

OK, no one else has said it, so I guess I will. In my, not so humble, opinion, you will NEVER be able to placate your parents. My mother never accepted it, never saw me jump, was always convinced my next jump was going to be my last and hoped out loud that I would "grow out" of jumping. Even though I always came back, didn't get hurt (until after her death) and never had a reserve ride (again until after her death).

You are dealing with belief that is further clouded by emotion. In my experience, when a person believes something, then there is nothing that can change that. Fact, logic, evidence are surprisingly ineffective tolls when encountering belief. To try to advance an argument using those tools is a losing battle for sure.

That being said, keep jumping and do what you need to do to hide or at the least, don't mention it. Part of becoming an adult is finding your own way. Sometimes this entails doing things your family doesn't like or approve of. They will, in time, calm down, and will only be angry for so long. Good luck and blue skies.

Skydivers don't knock on Death's door. They ring the bell and runaway... It really pisses him off.
-The World Famous Tink. (I never heard of you either!!)
AA #2069 ASA#33 POPS#8808 Swooo 1717

[dharma1976 0]

my mom stil hates it....

my dad loves it...

my honorary jewish grandmother hates it and has a hard time whenever wh knows I am at the DZ...

but most importantly I love it and accept the risks myself

Dave

http://www.skyjunky.com

CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing.