Main Flap open in freefall

[Salsa_John 0]

How many of you have had a main flap come open in freefall? I have it on video. I am jumping an old DZ rental javelin J6 with velcro to close the main flap. I did a nice somersaulting exit and it came open immediately exposing the pin and bridle. Did not have a mal. This flap has gotten bumped in the plane and has come open. I have a feeling that in some of my less stable poised exits this has happended then as well.

Another experienced jumper saw it open and warned me.

To the experienced jumpers:

I understand the potential of mals here. I brought this to the attention of the DZO. What do you think?


Thanks,

SJ

"You did what?!?!"

MUFF #3722, TDSM #72, Orfun #26, Nachos Rodriguez

[billvon 2,403]

When I started skydiving, flaps opening in freefall were pretty commonplace. If it held together long enough to let you get out of the plane, it was doing a good job. Many rigs used velcro in high-wear areas like the main closing flap, and thus unless you did maintenance every 200 jumps or so (i.e. replaced the velcro at every other repack) you'd get a flap that was willing to open in freefall.

Nowadays rigs are built a lot better, and there's no reason to put up with flaps that open in freefall.

[JohnMitchell 14]

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When I started skydiving, flaps opening in freefall were pretty commonplace.

Remember swooping in to the formation and looking down, all those little flaps waving back and forth like "Hello."

[apley 0]

if you are a belly flyer, this is likely not an issue. if the wind catches that bridle in a freeflying attitude, you should be very concerned. i have witnessed the results of many a premature deployments in freeflying positions, and the result is unnerving.

be aware that the bridle can be capable of pulling either your pilot chute or main closing pin! i have a video of a guy doing a flip while in a sit fly, main pin cover a flappin, and then a premature deployment at somewhere around 150 mph. hard jerk, horseshoe mal (the bridle actually ripped off the topskin of his canopy... fortunately), and one helluva whiplash.

other possible consequences include broken neck or just a whiplash, broken arm (i watched a girl from eloy land with one hand after breaking her upper arm in a premature during a sitfly), serious back trauma, and many other injuries.

obviously, a premature in the belly position has little risk unless someone is above you, or you are spinning. bottom line is... be very diligent in maintenance and in getting checked before you exit. there have been instances where contact with the door will deploy the main and have you hanging on the tail of the aircraft at best, and taking it down or knocking yourself unconscious at worst.

[riggerrob 558]

Yes, loose pin covers used to be common on old Vectors, Javelins, etc.
Fortunately manufacturers are gradually getting better at designing pin covers.
If your Javelin still has Velcro on the main pin cover, it must be truly ancient, i.e. built in the 1980s.
... or was it built for a main ripcord?

[nacmacfeegle 0]

"This flap has gotten bumped in the plane and has come open."

John, I was watching a video of a premature deployment in the door of a twin otter at lunch time...
http://www.skydivingmovies.com/ver2/pafiledb.php?action=file&id=1982

I'd be careful if I were jumping gear that is likely to open if you bang against a door, its not just mals you have to think about.

--------------------

He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson

[Buried 0]

hasn't happened to me.. yet..?

I've had a riser cover untuck on rental gear and slap me on the side of the face. ouch!

Where is my fizzy-lifting drink?

[mr2mk1g 10]

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hasn't happened to me.. yet..?

how'd you know?

[Darius11 12]

I have a J-6 and I never had a problem with it until I had a cutaway.
After my repack (I was not at my home DZ) the reserve was not evenly distributed in its area so I had the main flap open all the time. I even had my riaser covers open up.
When I got back I had my usual rigger repack the reserve and it is fine again. I also got some advice about adding an elastic fabric to cover the flap and hold it in place. That has also made a big difference.

I have been told (please look and see I am very new to the sport and talk to your rigger first) that when you are packing a big reserve like mine (PD253). That you have to make sure to put a lot of the materiel in the ears of the container. If it is not evenly distributed then it will not hold it’s shape and form a tight fit for the flap.

Hope this helps.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[billvon 2,403]

>That you have to make sure to put a lot of the materiel in the ears of the container.

These sorts of issues vary from container to container. Every container out there has its peculiarities. My reflex needs to have very little material in the top of the bag or the riser covers won't close. My talon needs more material there or it looks awful. Often, newer riggers need a few repack cycles (or they need to repack the rig a few times) before they get a given rig "dialed in."

[Buried 0]

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hasn't happened to me.. yet..?

how'd you know?

i would hope that people would mention it to me once we got to the ground and/or the videos would tell if there was any..

Where is my fizzy-lifting drink?

[NickDG 23]

There was a time when the ripcord equipped R.I. student rigs we used for AFF at Perris needed the main flap left open or the rig would likely total.

This was when main closing flaps are transitioning from Velcro to tuck tabs, from being not secure at all, to being very secure . . . and spring loaded pilots chutes, used by students, were caught in the middle of that change. It's amazing how normal we thought that was.

Sure, you need a secure rig for freefly, but there's an across the board hysteria about it nowadays. We used to jump rigs all the time that had no risers covers at all. We just always made sure the toggles and whatever excess steering line existed was stowed very securely. We now see, with the more secure risers covers, some people don't even stow the excess steering line at all . . . (not good in my opinion).

NickD BASE 194

[Salsa_John 0]

Main ripcord coverted to BOC Manuf in 1997

"You did what?!?!"

MUFF #3722, TDSM #72, Orfun #26, Nachos Rodriguez

[meltdown 0]

I was having problems with my Javelin J2 main flap coming open. Since tightening my closing loop (really really tight) and putting a rubber band on the tab I haven't had any more problems. Also, the way the reserve was packed the last time (more towards the top of the container) has also made a difference.

[funks 1]

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Iputting a rubber band on the tab I haven't had any more problems. .

I jump a javelin with this same flap problem, can you explain what you mean by putting a rubber band on the tab? If it works i sure as hell want to do it.

[Maggotry 0]

I'm wondering what the international hand signal is for "something's up with your gear dude, get on your belly".

One coach I know flip people the finger, essentially saying "you're f*cked". This approach is effective if your buddies are told about it AND aren't freefliers. If they're freefliers they'll just return the service with a big FU back.

I use the two upper fingers (like forming a gun) and moving my thumb when in close or a salute+waveoff if I'm far away but then again, I jump with the same people most of the time. So I gotta know what the de facto standard is on this :)

[kelel01 1]

We use sticking out a flat hand, resembling a person on their belly.

[Scrumpot 1]

He is (most likely) simply taking a rubber band and placing it around the middle of the "stiffened" part of the tuck-tab (closing flap) itself. The rubber band provides just a bit more friction when it is "tucked" and keeps it closed under the circumstances.

This is a "jury rig" though. I am not a rigger, and therefore can not (and will not) comment as to it's real efficacy (or safety/appropriateness), however, I would think that a more reasonable and fixed/permanent "modification" solution actually done by a RIGGER would be more in order than this.

-Grant

coitus non circum - Moab Stone

[RedassSkychic 0]

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I'm wondering what the international hand signal is for "something's up with your gear dude, get on your belly".

I'd think the "pull" signal used in AFF would work pretty well, a pointed index finger. Instructors and jumpers not too far off student status should recognize this, at least. I've always been amazed what can be communicated in freefall with just facial expressions... someone with a freaked out look pointing at my gear would get my attention, i would think. Never been in the situation though.

[billvon 2,403]

>I'm wondering what the international hand signal is for "something's
>up with your gear dude, get on your belly".

I usually just point. That cues them in that there's something to look at. Beyond that, I don't know of any standards. When I did AFF a lot, I got good enough at reading expressions that my partner and I could have entire conversations by making faces at each other and pointing, but you have to know someone well for that to work.