Florida mandates teaching that slavery had benefits to blacks

[winsor 187]

3 hours ago, kallend said:

Emmett Till would have been 82 today.

I wonder how the bigots will handle this - boycott maybe.  Perhaps our resident bigots will tell us.

https://apnews.com/article/biden-monument-emmett-till-black-civil-rights-6d26b248f906a4ce5654cb2f11c9ffa2

The Chicago monument will be just a couple of blocks from the campus where I taught for 39 years.

If I went to a Muslim country, whistled at one of the Ninja women and lost my head as a result, my cause of death would be listed as "suicide."

Anyone criticizing the process would be labeled an "Islamophobe."

By all accounts Emmett Till was told in no uncertain terms that flirting with white women in Mississippi was a Bad Career Move.

Emmett, however, made light of it, claimed to have dated white girls back home, and made a point to demonstrate to his cousins that it was no big deal.  That did not end well.

Though I consider Klan types to be every bit as evil as Muslim fundamentalists, I know better than to goad either when they're in a position to kill me - in the same sense that I don't tell Hells Angels that Harleys suck and that people who ride them are trying to compensate for undersized genitals.

If the upshot of Emmett Till's slaying throughout the Black community was a binding commitment to foreswear race based violence,  that would be one thing.  That has not been the case, and it often seems the response has been more of "two can play at this game!"

 Back to the simplistic view of things.

 

BSBD,

Winsor 

 

[lippy 779]

50 minutes ago, winsor said:

If I went to a Muslim country, whistled at one of the Ninja women and lost my head as a result, my cause of death would be listed as "suicide."

Anyone criticizing the process would be labeled an "Islamophobe."

By all accounts Emmett Till was told in no uncertain terms that flirting with white women in Mississippi was a Bad Career Move.

Emmett, however, made light of it, claimed to have dated white girls back home, and made a point to demonstrate to his cousins that it was no big deal.  That did not end well.

Though I consider Klan types to be every bit as evil as Muslim fundamentalists, I know better than to goad either when they're in a position to kill me - in the same sense that I don't tell Hells Angels that Harleys suck and that people who ride them are trying to compensate for undersized genitals.

If the upshot of Emmett Till's slaying throughout the Black community was a binding commitment to foreswear race based violence,  that would be one thing.  That has not been the case, and it often seems the response has been more of "two can play at this game!"

 Back to the simplistic view of things.

 

BSBD,

Winsor 

 

You managed to get a dig at Muslims in the same post as claiming Emmett Till had it coming...I'd almost give your post a 10/10, but I think you missed sticking the landing when you brough the Hell's Angels into it.

[gowlerk 1,939]

1 hour ago, winsor said:

If I went to a Muslim country, whistled at one of the Ninja women and lost my head as a result, my cause of death would be listed as "suicide."

Anyone criticizing the process would be labeled an "Islamophobe."

By all accounts Emmett Till was told in no uncertain terms that flirting with white women in Mississippi was a Bad Career Move.

Emmett, however, made light of it, claimed to have dated white girls back home, and made a point to demonstrate to his cousins that it was no big deal.  That did not end well.

Though I consider Klan types to be every bit as evil as Muslim fundamentalists, I know better than to goad either when they're in a position to kill me - in the same sense that I don't tell Hells Angels that Harleys suck and that people who ride them are trying to compensate for undersized genitals.

If the upshot of Emmett Till's slaying throughout the Black community was a binding commitment to foreswear race based violence,  that would be one thing.  That has not been the case, and it often seems the response has been more of "two can play at this game!"

 Back to the simplistic view of things.

 

BSBD,

Winsor 

 

Probably the worst most sickening post I have seen here in a very long time. Worse than Ron's copy and paste "coon" post because you actually wrote it yourself. 

[jakee 1,262]

1 hour ago, winsor said:

If I went to a Muslim country, whistled at one of the Ninja women and lost my head as a result, my cause of death would be listed as "suicide."

Anyone criticizing the process would be labeled an "Islamophobe."

Well that’s an obvious lie designed to deflect criticism of racism.

 

1 hour ago, winsor said:

By all accounts Emmett Till was told in no uncertain terms that flirting with white women in Mississippi was a Bad Career Move.

Emmett, however, made light of it, claimed to have dated white girls back home, and made a point to demonstrate to his cousins that it was no big deal.  That did not end well.

Though I consider Klan types to be every bit as evil as Muslim fundamentalists, I know better than to goad either when they're in a position to kill me - in the same sense that I don't tell Hells Angels that Harleys suck and that people who ride them are trying to compensate for undersized genitals.

If the upshot of Emmett Till's slaying throughout the Black community was a binding commitment to foreswear race based violence,  that would be one thing.  That has not been the case, and it often seems the response has been more of "two can play at this game!"

 Back to the simplistic view of things.

It shouldn’t be lost on anyone that the above conclusions are only possible if you accept the words of two heinous racist murderers as being implicitly true. 
 

I wonder what else could be classed as suicide using the same logic though? Beaten woman tries to leave her husband? Suicide. Firefighter in a burning building? Suicide. Shopkeeper tries to stop paying protection to the mob? Suicide. Every Iranian protester this year? Suicide. Any American soldier in a foreign field? Suicides all of them. Thank goodness there are some people in this world who, unlike Winsor, are willing to stand up for themselves even when someone or something makes it dangerous.

[kallend 1,654]

"Twas down in Mississippi no so long ago,
When a young boy from Chicago town stepped through a Southern door.
This boy's dreadful tragedy I can still remember well,
The color of his skin was black and his name was Emmett Till.

Some men they dragged him to a barn and there they beat him up.
They said they had a reason, but I can't remember what.
They tortured him and did some evil things too evil to repeat.
There was screaming sounds inside the barn, there was laughing sounds out on the street.

Then they rolled his body down a gulf amidst a bloody red rain
And they threw him in the waters wide to cease his screaming pain.
The reason that they killed him there, and I'm sure it ain't no lie,
Was just for the fun of killin' him and to watch him slowly die.

And then to stop the United States of yelling for a trial,
Two brothers they confessed that they had killed poor Emmett Till.
But on the jury there were men who helped the brothers commit this awful crime,
And so this trial was a mockery, but nobody seemed to mind.

I saw the morning papers but I could not bear to see
The smiling brothers walkin' down the courthouse stairs.
For the jury found them innocent and the brothers they went free,
While Emmett's body floats the foam of a Jim Crow southern sea.

If you can't speak out against this kind of thing, a crime that's so unjust,
Your eyes are filled with dead men's dirt, your mind is filled with dust.
Your arms and legs they must be in shackles and chains, and your blood it must refuse to flow,
For you let this human race fall down so God-awful low!

This song is just a reminder to remind your fellow man
That this kind of thing still lives today in that ghost-robed Ku Klux Klan.
But if all of us folks that thinks alike, if we gave all we could give,
We could make this great land of ours a greater place to live."

Bob Dylan.

[kallend 1,654]

1 hour ago, winsor said:

If I went to a Muslim country, whistled at one of the Ninja women and lost my head as a result, my cause of death would be listed as "suicide."

 

 

That has absolutely nothing whatever to do with going places in one's own country and expecting to be treated according to its founding documents, laws and Constitution.

"We hold these truths to be self evident. . . ."

[billvon 2,446]

3 hours ago, winsor said:

If I went to a Muslim country, whistled at one of the Ninja women and lost my head as a result, my cause of death would be listed as "suicide."

 . . . 

Emmett, however, made light of it, claimed to have dated white girls back home, and made a point to demonstrate to his cousins that it was no big deal.  That did not end well.

Perhaps - just perhaps - our goal should be to be a bit better than the worst of the bigots and racists.

[JerryBaumchen 1,068]

5 hours ago, winsor said:

If I went to a Muslim country, whistled at one of the Ninja women and lost my head as a result, my cause of death would be listed as "suicide."

Anyone criticizing the process would be labeled an "Islamophobe."

By all accounts Emmett Till was told in no uncertain terms that flirting with white women in Mississippi was a Bad Career Move.

Emmett, however, made light of it, claimed to have dated white girls back home, and made a point to demonstrate to his cousins that it was no big deal.  That did not end well.

Though I consider Klan types to be every bit as evil as Muslim fundamentalists, I know better than to goad either when they're in a position to kill me - in the same sense that I don't tell Hells Angels that Harleys suck and that people who ride them are trying to compensate for undersized genitals.

If the upshot of Emmett Till's slaying throughout the Black community was a binding commitment to foreswear race based violence,  that would be one thing.  That has not been the case, and it often seems the response has been more of "two can play at this game!"

 Back to the simplistic view of things.

 

BSBD,

Winsor 

 

Hi Winsor,

First, I am no expert on what happened to Emmett Till.

Re:  Emmett Till was told in no uncertain terms that flirting with white women in Mississippi was a Bad Career Move.

I have never read that.  Could you provide some info as to how you concluded that he was told in no uncertain terms  before he did what he was killed for?

Jerry Baumchen

[normiss 634]

26 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi Winsor,

First, I am no expert on what happened to Emmett Till.

Re:  Emmett Till was told in no uncertain terms that flirting with white women in Mississippi was a Bad Career Move.

I have never read that.  Could you provide some info as to how you concluded that he was told in no uncertain terms  before he did what he was killed for?

Jerry Baumchen

What he was ACCUSED of doing. Other than racist's accusations after the fact, to "justify" his heinous murder, I don't believe there was proof of ANY wrong doing.

Simply looking at another human is in no way grounds for murder, at least to any decent human.

[olofscience 424]

7 hours ago, winsor said:

Though I consider Klan types to be every bit as evil as Muslim fundamentalists, I know better than to goad either when they're in a position to kill me - in the same sense that I don't tell Hells Angels that Harleys suck and that people who ride them are trying to compensate for undersized genitals.

So when a crime is committed, do you ALWAYS blame the victim, or is that only when you like the perpetrator?

 

Let's see you blame the victim when it's a middle aged white man, and the perpetrator is an immigrant...

 

Based on your reasoning, if you WERE murdered by a Hell's Angels biker, they should get away scot-free, no consequences.

Edited July 25, 2023 by olofscience

[Phil1111 921]

15 minutes ago, olofscience said:

So when a crime is committed, do you ALWAYS blame the victim, or is that only when you like the perpetrator?

 

Let's see you blame the victim when it's a middle aged white man, and the perpetrator is an immigrant...

 

Based on your reasoning, if you WERE murdered by a Hell's Angels biker, they should get away scot-free, no consequences.

Since there are about 50 Muslim majority countries in the world. Italians and republicans would likely be under permanent travel bans to them.

[winsor 187]

51 minutes ago, normiss said:

What he was ACCUSED of doing. Other than racist's accusations after the fact, to "justify" his heinous murder, I don't believe there was proof of ANY wrong doing.

Simply looking at another human is in no way grounds for murder, at least to any decent human.

Since the reading comprehension here is abysmal, likely clouded by righteous indignation, let me walk you through this.

Let us all agree that the fate that Emmett Till suffered was unjust, undeserved and a very bad thing by any measure.  Also, misreading one's audience is hardly justification for being murdered.

I watched a documentary some time back, on PBS IIRC, where Emmett Till's family members were interviewed, to include his mother and cousins.  His mother had warned him to be very careful what he said and did when he went down South, since things were different there, and he assured her that he'd be fine.  His cousins said that while in Mississippi he claimed to have dated a white girl back home (Chicago?), and was cavalier about it.

The overall picture that was painted was that of a brash, very naïve and generally typical adolescent, out of his element, who had no idea how dangerous was his environment.  I do not suggest for a second that it was his fault, and think his behavior as described was harmless.

My point is that he unwittingly triggered the reaction of the people who then murdered him.  I don't condone for a second the senseless violence inflicted upon him, but have some idea of why these people targeted him.

I have spent time among easily confused people whose response to being confused is to become very violent, and I have gone out of my way not to confuse them.  The penchant for violence is theirs, and when they become violent it is almost always unjustified.  Doing anything that could be perceived as a threat is bad policy, harmless joking doesn't get a pass.

Making a wrong turn in Los Angeles and trying to ask directions can be fatal.  This is hardly 'victim blaming' the hapless motorist for turning into a gang dominated cul de sac, and this does not put me on the side of the gang.

Emmett Till may or may not have been a saint, but he worked out to be a useful martyr.

 

BSBD,

Winsor

 

 

[JoeWeber 2,333]

22 minutes ago, winsor said:

Since the reading comprehension here is abysmal, likely clouded by righteous indignation, let me walk you through this.

Let us all agree that the fate that Emmett Till suffered was unjust, undeserved and a very bad thing by any measure.  Also, misreading one's audience is hardly justification for being murdered.

I watched a documentary some time back, on PBS IIRC, where Emmett Till's family members were interviewed, to include his mother and cousins.  His mother had warned him to be very careful what he said and did when he went down South, since things were different there, and he assured her that he'd be fine.  His cousins said that while in Mississippi he claimed to have dated a white girl back home (Chicago?), and was cavalier about it.

The overall picture that was painted was that of a brash, very naïve and generally typical adolescent, out of his element, who had no idea how dangerous was his environment.  I do not suggest for a second that it was his fault, and think his behavior as described was harmless.

My point is that he unwittingly triggered the reaction of the people who then murdered him.  I don't condone for a second the senseless violence inflicted upon him, but have some idea of why these people targeted him.

I have spent time among easily confused people whose response to being confused is to become very violent, and I have gone out of my way not to confuse them.  The penchant for violence is theirs, and when they become violent it is almost always unjustified.  Doing anything that could be perceived as a threat is bad policy, harmless joking doesn't get a pass.

Making a wrong turn in Los Angeles and trying to ask directions can be fatal.  This is hardly 'victim blaming' the hapless motorist for turning into a gang dominated cul de sac, and this does not put me on the side of the gang.

Emmett Till may or may not have been a saint, but he worked out to be a useful martyr.

 

BSBD,

Winsor

 

 

I guess the moral of the story is there is a time and a place for everything, including being woke.

[JerryBaumchen 1,068]

29 minutes ago, winsor said:

Since the reading comprehension here is abysmal, likely clouded by righteous indignation, let me walk you through this.

Let us all agree that the fate that Emmett Till suffered was unjust, undeserved and a very bad thing by any measure.  Also, misreading one's audience is hardly justification for being murdered.

I watched a documentary some time back, on PBS IIRC, where Emmett Till's family members were interviewed, to include his mother and cousins.  His mother had warned him to be very careful what he said and did when he went down South, since things were different there, and he assured her that he'd be fine.  His cousins said that while in Mississippi he claimed to have dated a white girl back home (Chicago?), and was cavalier about it.

The overall picture that was painted was that of a brash, very naïve and generally typical adolescent, out of his element, who had no idea how dangerous was his environment.  I do not suggest for a second that it was his fault, and think his behavior as described was harmless.

My point is that he unwittingly triggered the reaction of the people who then murdered him.  I don't condone for a second the senseless violence inflicted upon him, but have some idea of why these people targeted him.

I have spent time among easily confused people whose response to being confused is to become very violent, and I have gone out of my way not to confuse them.  The penchant for violence is theirs, and when they become violent it is almost always unjustified.  Doing anything that could be perceived as a threat is bad policy, harmless joking doesn't get a pass.

Making a wrong turn in Los Angeles and trying to ask directions can be fatal.  This is hardly 'victim blaming' the hapless motorist for turning into a gang dominated cul de sac, and this does not put me on the side of the gang.

Emmett Till may or may not have been a saint, but he worked out to be a useful martyr.

 

BSBD,

Winsor

 

 

Hi Winsor,

Re:  Since the reading comprehension here is abysmal, likely clouded by righteous indignation, let me walk you through this.

You were doing great until you started with this.

Jerry Baumchen

[jakee 1,262]

33 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi Winsor,

Re:  Since the reading comprehension here is abysmal, likely clouded by righteous indignation, let me walk you through this.

You were doing great until you started with this.

Jerry Baumchen

Yeah, but at least the final paragraph was worse.

[jakee 1,262]

1 hour ago, winsor said:

Since the reading comprehension here is abysmal, likely clouded by righteous indignation, let me walk you through this.

That’s so crazy, Emmett Till’s killers were misunderstood too! They weren’t racist, they liked black people and were never violent to them!* Just, y’know, sometimes they needed to be reminded of their place. So you’re in good company.

 

* Literally exactly what they said.

[winsor 187]

46 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi Winsor,

Re:  Since the reading comprehension here is abysmal, likely clouded by righteous indignation, let me walk you through this.

You were doing great until you started with this.

Jerry Baumchen

Since I have been accused of sentiments I neither espouse nor conveyed, I should respond with a "bless your heart" and let it go.

[Phil1111 921]

21 minutes ago, winsor said:

Since I have been accused of sentiments I neither espouse nor conveyed, I should respond with a "bless your heart" and let it go.

A couple weeks ago I tied into you about some subject or another. I can't be bothered to go back to find the actual posts. John Kallend and Billvon leapt to your defense espousing your intelligence. So I decided to actually start reading your essays again thinking that perhaps I was wrong.

Now you've done it again and shown your smarts when you said "and let it go." I thought that the hole might be getting deeper and deeper. Brent would have kept digging, so bravo.

I feel so lucky now to have survived driving through LA. Totally unaware how close I came to the end of it all. Mississippi! Although I've never been there I'll have to study the situation more as to how it came to be a bastion of the easily confused and naturally very violent killers.

Crikey!

Edited July 25, 2023 by Phil1111

[winsor 187]

If someone has something worthy of consideration, great.  There are people with whom I disagree, but I appreciate their input.  Having said that, dialogue too often is disingenuous from the start 

Too much of what crops up in this forum is ad hominem or raw abuse, so the killfile is a nice touch.  Thus I'll have to take your word for who said what.

I apologize for expressing exasperation over being expected to defend positions I don't support.  If nothing else, it's pointless.

 

BSBD,

Winsor 

[wolfriverjoe 1,359]

9 hours ago, gowlerk said:

Probably the worst most sickening post I have seen here in a very long time. Worse than Ron's copy and paste "coon" post because you actually wrote it yourself. 

Are you surprised?

It's what he does.

[SkyDekker 1,150]

40 minutes ago, winsor said:

If someone has something worthy of consideration, great.  There are people with whom I disagree, but I appreciate their input.  Having said that, dialogue too often is disingenuous from the start 

Too much of what crops up in this forum is ad hominem or raw abuse, so the killfile is a nice touch.  Thus I'll have to take your word for who said what.

I apologize for expressing exasperation over being expected to defend positions I don't support.  If nothing else, it's pointless.

 

BSBD,

Winsor 

Blaming the victim is rarely if ever a strong rebuke of the crime or act. Just like claiming to have a black friend is rarely if ever evidence one isn't racist.

[gowlerk 1,939]

24 minutes ago, wolfriverjoe said:

Are you surprised?

It's what he does.

And now he is acting all insulted and claiming that what he says does not reflect what he feels. Also what he does.

[billvon 2,446]

3 hours ago, winsor said:

Making a wrong turn in Los Angeles and trying to ask directions can be fatal.  This is hardly 'victim blaming' the hapless motorist for turning into a gang dominated cul de sac, and this does not put me on the side of the gang.

Agreed - as long as you didn't label what the motorist did as "suicide."  If you did that, you would in fact be blaming him for his own death, since that's what a suicide is.

If this is your way of making a halfhearted apology, good for you.

[JoeWeber 2,333]

1 hour ago, billvon said:

Agreed - as long as you didn't label what the motorist did as "suicide."  If you did that, you would in fact be blaming him for his own death, since that's what a suicide is.

If this is your way of making a halfhearted apology, good for you.

Just because Winsor apparently believes we are inarticulate and uncomprehending dimwits doesn't mean he's by necessity wrong to point out that knowingly putting ones self in a situation where harm might suddenly arrive ain't none too smart neither. 

[gowlerk 1,939]

7 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

Just because Winsor apparently believes we are inarticulate and uncomprehending dimwits doesn't mean he's by necessity wrong to point out that knowingly putting ones self in a situation where harm might suddenly arrive ain't none too smart neither. 

You mean like skydiving and flying in questionable aircraft?