More sacrifices to the 2nd Amendment

[Phil1111 911]

Packing the USSC with conservatives is a big hurdle for reforms.In other court gun related news. "The victims of the 2017 mass shooting at a church in Sutherland Springs, Texas, in which 26 were killed, have reached a "tentative agreement" with the Justice Department to settle a case against the federal government for $144.5 million. "

Plus For victims of fatal firearm injuries, medical costs totaled $290 million in 2020 and cost an average of $9,000 per patient, with much of the cost paid for by public health insurance providers such as Medicaid and " firearms-related injuries cause 30,000 initial in-patient hospital stays, each of which result in average treatment costs of $31,000, and 50,000 initial ER visits that run an average of $1,500 a piece, according to the report, which cited a study by the Government Accountability Office.  "

Is it too late to sue the founding fathers for this curse on the public. Fostered by the constitution? Evidently a character by the name of Madison is mainly responsible.

[gowlerk 1,914]

1 hour ago, Phil1111 said:

Evidently a character by the name of Madison is mainly responsible.

Lock him up, lock him up.

[timski 80]

9 hours ago, billvon said:

Agreed.  And the soft spot is the thinking that by adding guns, gun deaths will go down.

What part of school shootings and it being a trend don't you understand? I've asked you directly, what your solution(s) are. You passed the buck with some lame ass response deflecting to BIGGUNS post... You're not going to get any satisfaction protecting innocent children without MORE GUNS. Welcome to America, we have our own special way of dealing with our problems. 

Seriously though Bill, the guns are the problem. The guns are here to stay. Sooo. The CURRENT solution IS more guns. At least I have a plan that works and can be implemented yesterday.  You keep hoping for stronger background checks...and other passive BS backdoor solutions and let us all know how that works out.  

[lippy 773]

6 hours ago, wmw999 said:

I don’t, however, extend the castle doctrine to a vehicle, outbuilding, or Treehouse.

Wendy P. 

Or to the mall whilst under the threat of some dipshit YouTuber who thinks he's funny:

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/local/virginia/dulles-center-mall-shooting-victim-says-he-was-recording-youtube-video-before-gunshot/65-62e40a24-847c-4d01-8696-0d9696bcbcba

[billvon 2,400]

1 hour ago, timski said:

What part of school shootings and it being a trend don't you understand?

?? I am the one saying we have to understand it.  You are the one saying "just add more guns."

Quote

I've asked you directly, what your solution(s) are. You passed the buck with some lame ass response deflecting to BIGGUNS post...

Yes, because he did a better job than I did.  But if you prefer my approach:

• Limits on magazine size
• A "gun owner responsibility" law.  If your gun is used in a crime, you go to jail for a minimum of ten years.  Even if it's stolen.  Even if you lost it.  Even if it's your 18 year old son who takes it.  Period.
• An end to the gun show loophole.  Everyone gets a background check.  Everyone.
• A law that allows police to rapidly confiscate guns from people with mental health issues.  They can then go to court and get them back, after (for example) being examined (and potentially treated) by a doctor.

Quote

You're not going to get any satisfaction protecting innocent children without MORE GUNS. 

I could care less about "satisfaction."  I care about dead kids.  Why the f*ck is that so hard for you to understand?

Quote

Seriously though Bill, the guns are the problem.

Finally you say something that makes sense.  Yes, they are THE big part (not the only part, but the biggest part) of the problem.  They are the tool used in all school shootings.  They are why shooting deaths are now the #1 killer of kids.  Their lack is why other countries don't have even 10% of the school shootings we have.  If all school killers had to use knives, slingshots or compound bows there would be a lot fewer dead kids.  And again, that's the goal.

Quote

The guns are here to stay. Sooo. The CURRENT solution IS more guns. At least I have a plan that works . . .

Child deaths due to shootings are up over 50% in the past 25 years.  That's how well your solution is working.  Want to go for 100%?  With enough guns that's quite possible.  Forgive me if I don't root for you achieving that.

I prefer Australia's approach myself.

[JoeWeber 2,299]

8 hours ago, gowlerk said:

Half of all the people are of below median intelligence. And not just in the USA.

Would that mean that half of all truck drivers, and not just in the USA,  are out of their depth,?

[gowlerk 1,914]

15 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

Would that mean that half of all truck drivers, and not just in the USA,  are out of their depth,?

Most truckers are to the right of the median most of the time.

[Phil1111 911]

16 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

Would that mean that half of all truck drivers, and not just in the USA,  are out of their depth,?

 

4 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

Most truckers are to the right of the median most of the time.

Joe has been kinda feisty ever since his Panama canal transit. Perhaps it was just the reminder that the US built it. Panama took it away and Americans don't even get a free pass for all that trouble. Not to mention that US troops saved Panama from President Noriega.

Wasn't it another Joe...Joe DiMaggio who coined the famous American phrase "I get no respect"

[JoeWeber 2,299]

1 hour ago, Phil1111 said:

 

Joe has been kinda feisty ever since his Panama canal transit. Perhaps it was just the reminder that the US built it. Panama took it away and Americans don't even get a free pass for all that trouble. Not to mention that US troops saved Panama from President Noriega.

Wasn't it another Joe...Joe DiMaggio who coined the famous American phrase "I get no respect"

Gotta say, you've pinned me to the wall.

[kallend 1,625]

6 hours ago, gowlerk said:

Most truckers are to the right of the median most of the time.

Not in Australia.

(I'm in Melbourne right now; beautiful, clean city, gun death rate  about 1% of US rate.  Ask an Aussie if they lack freedom on account of their  gun laws and they look at you like you're a moron).

[BIGUN 1,053]

3 hours ago, kallend said:

Not in Australia.

(I'm in Melbourne right now; beautiful, clean city, gun death rate  about 1% of US rate.  Ask an Aussie

In the late 1990's one man killed 35 people at once which kicked off their NFA for all weapons and buyback program. I was down there in the early 2000's and can tell you the government confiscation had left many an Aussie seriously pissed off about government intervention.

Having said that, It's been a whole generation since that happened, so over time and the next generation _doesn't know what they're missing_ so they don't miss it. If memory serves, their NFA had a provision for people that lived outside of town in the country. 

Their initial confiscation resulted in ~600,000 guns which they calculated at 20% of all guns. Here in the US, that 20% would equal about ~80,000,000 guns off the street.

So to your point - it takes time. Also, keep in mind that Australia had no constitutional barriers. 

3 hours ago, kallend said:

and they look at you like you're a moron).

Ummm . . . taps fingers on desk . . . nope. Have a good time, John.  

Edited April 6, 2023 by BIGUN

[gowlerk 1,914]

39 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

So to your point - it takes time. Also, keep in mind that Australia had no constitutional barriers. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_of_Australia

 

As of 2011 and 2012, pistols and semi-automatic pistols were traded on the black market for ten to twenty thousand dollars.

This is what happens when supply is limited. Criminals don't have weapons because they just can't afford them. Australia also has little federal power over guns. The laws are the result of agreements between the states and the feds. There is strong public support for the current set of laws which are not a ban on gun ownership, but a series of controls. This is what enforcing responsible ownership actually looks like. 

Public opinion[edit]

In 2015, Essential Research performed a poll regarding the support for Australia's gun laws. The demographic-normalised poll found that 6% of Australians thought the laws were "too strong", 40% thought "about right" and 45% thought "not strong enough".^[74]

Essential Research repeated the poll a year later and found 6% thought the laws were too strong, 44% thought "about right" and 45% thought the laws were "not strong enough". It also found these views were consistent regardless of political party voting tendency for Labor, Coalition or Greens voters.^[75][76][77]

 

 

 

[gowlerk 1,914]

This is an example of how the rest of the world views the US on this issue. God has indeed blessed America, but at the same time She has cursed it as well. As the saying goes, "it's complicated."

 

In his autobiography Lazarus Rising: A Personal and Political Autobiography, Howard expressed his support for the anti-gun cause and his desire to introduce restrictive gun laws long before he became prime minister. In a television interview shortly before the 10th anniversary of the Port Arthur massacre, he reaffirmed his stance, "I did not want Australia to go down the American path. There are some things about America I admire and there are some things I don't. And one of the things I don't admire about America is their... slavish love of guns. They're evil." 

[Phil1111 911]

42 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

... There is strong public support for the current set of laws which are not a ban on gun ownership, but a series of controls. This is what enforcing responsible ownership actually looks like.

 

 

 

Yet they can still hunt. Still have guns to "protect" themselves. In the UK, The Vast Majority of U.K. Police Don't Carry Guns. Here's Why.

"London's Metropolitan Police carried out some 3,300 deployments involving firearms in 2016. They didn't fire a single shot at a suspect." Thats the rest of the world in a nutshell.

In America for every two citizens wanting gun control. There is a Brent or Tim who won't budge on the issue. IMO the USSC, the 2nd and the importance of guns for GOP support. Will result in at least another twenty years of the status quo.

[BIGUN 1,053]

8 minutes ago, Phil1111 said:

Will result in at least another twenty years of the status quo.

There is a growing movement to change:

https://twitter.com/stillgray/status/1643787733205409792

 

[Phil1111 911]

3 hours ago, BIGUN said:

There is a growing movement to change:

https://twitter.com/stillgray/status/1643787733205409792

 

He sounds as pissed off on this issue as normiss is. But all those ideas die. Because a minority of US states have veto power over rational statute amendments.

Popular vote in the US don't mean squat. Because small pro- gun states with little population can outvote the majority.

Edited April 6, 2023 by Phil1111

[normiss 622]

12 hours ago, timski said:

What part of school shootings and it being a trend don't you understand? I've asked you directly, what your solution(s) are. You passed the buck with some lame ass response deflecting to BIGGUNS post... You're not going to get any satisfaction protecting innocent children without MORE GUNS. Welcome to America, we have our own special way of dealing with our problems. 

Seriously though Bill, the guns are the problem. The guns are here to stay. Sooo. The CURRENT solution IS more guns. At least I have a plan that works and can be implemented yesterday.  You keep hoping for stronger background checks...and other passive BS backdoor solutions and let us all know how that works out.  

The next generation being raised in combat environments, a.k.a. "schools", disagree with this approach.

Thankfully they WILL change this.

Hopefully before the child sacrifice for guns in America impacts us ALL personally.

[JerryBaumchen 1,048]

2 hours ago, normiss said:

The next generation being raised in combat environments, a.k.a. "schools", disagree with this approach.

Thankfully they WILL change this.

Hopefully before the child sacrifice for guns in America impacts us ALL personally.

Hi Mark,

According to my local tv news last nite, they were out in force yesterday.

They just need to keep it up & not lose direction. *

Jerry Baumchen

*  It's called voting the gun-nutz out of office.

 

[billvon 2,400]

18 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi Mark,

According to my local tv news last nite, they were out in force yesterday.

And republicans are panicking.

The protest in Tennessee included three State democratic legislators.  The State house is now going to vote to expel them.  

So these are three legally elected state representatives who were exercising their First Amendment rights at a protest.  And they are being expelled by the opposite party for exercising those rights.

I'm honestly not sure what I hope to happen here.  Part of me hopes the republicans fail miserably and realize that they are not dictators.  But the other part of me hopes they do get expelled - and become modern-day Rosa Parks.

[BIGUN 1,053]

14 hours ago, billvon said:

An end to the gun show loophole.  Everyone gets a background check.  Everyone.

I'm going to add - every sale including private get's a background check and registered at that time. Your local dealer can help with this. When you go to a gun show and purchase a weapon from a dealer from another state; you must go to a dealer in that state to transfer the weapon and do a "yellow sheet" + either dealer has to do a background check. This can usually be done at the gun show. Most in-state dealers will have a sign over their table saying "$15.00 fee" for being the receiving dealer.

The rest of your post was most eloquent, Bill.   

Edited April 6, 2023 by BIGUN

[BIGUN 1,053]

On 4/5/2023 at 8:39 PM, timski said:

The CURRENT solution IS more guns. At least I have a plan that works and can be implemented yesterday. 

There's 331 million people in the US and approximately 352 million guns in circulation. How many more you need? 

[gowlerk 1,914]

8 hours ago, BIGUN said:

There's 331 million people in the US and approximately 352 million guns in circulation. How many more you need? 

The gun distribution in the US is very unfair. The 1% ers have far too many leaving vast numbers of vulnerable "gunless" Americans unarmed and therefore potential victims. What is needed is a fair gun program to even out the killing field. A "gunicare program" if you will. Starting of course with "gunicaid" so that no children are left out of feeling secure and subsidised guns for the over 65 crowd who are surviving on meager pensions and may only have access to rimfire pistols.

[JoeWeber 2,299]

8 hours ago, BIGUN said:

There's 331 million people in the US and approximately 352 million guns in circulation. How many more you need? 

Another 100 million should be enough of a deterrent to keep China out of Taiwan and Kamala Harris out of the White House, and kids out of grooming school. Like seriously, what is your problem? 

[BIGUN 1,053]

Children killed in/by vehicles. 

We've been hearing this argument for awhile.  Kids and vehicles is thrown out as a debate point and it's always bothered me. I couldn't quite put my finger on it, but yesterday I watched a video by a young female active duty Staff Sergeant when she said:

"Vehicles are designed and manufactured for travel and pleasure. Weapons are designed and manufactured to kill."

If we take that a step further; I think it's safe to say, They both do their job 99% of the time. It goes to intent. Apologies, I went back to find the vid to cite her as a source, but it got lost in the social media noise. 

   

[gowlerk 1,914]

20 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

If we take that a step further; I think it's safe to say, They both do their job 99% of the time.

Yes, those sort of arguments are just attempts at distraction. You could even take it another step and say that everyone is going to die anyway so who cares if a bullet is the agent and the person is young? God's will be done.