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stratostar

Longmont City Council will take up skydiving noise

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Although funny, maybe not the best move to do the direct mailer. These folks don't believe in letting Mile High Operate and will use this to help make more enemies for Mile High.

Matt
An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

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Although funny, maybe not the best move to do the direct mailer. These folks don't believe in letting Mile High Operate and will use this to help make more enemies for Mile High.

Matt



+1

I operated a DZ on a municipal for a few years and found the climate to be politically charged on every issue all the time. A move like this could serve to put some airport board members or city council folks on the other side of the argument, especially given that the DZ has some very vocal opponents.

We've all seen what happens when the right people decide a DZ isn't worth the perceived hassles it brings, so I'm not sure why Frank would want to feed that.
Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

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Although funny, maybe not the best move to do the direct mailer. These folks don't believe in letting Mile High Operate and will use this to help make more enemies for Mile High.

Matt



Yes. I agree that it is pretty funny, if you are on the side of the airport and have a sense of humor about ths situation. For the "I hate airplane" crowd however...

It's more of a shoving it into your face.

I do, however love Kim's comment that the city needs to realize that it has the authority to regulate the noise coming from the airport.

No. They don't. It's regulated by the FAA.
"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

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Although funny, maybe not the best move to do the direct mailer. These folks don't believe in letting Mile High Operate and will use this to help make more enemies for Mile High.

Matt



Yes. I agree that it is pretty funny, if you are on the side of the airport and have a sense of humor about ths situation. For the "I hate airplane" crowd however...

It's more of a shoving it into your face.

I do, however love Kim's comment that the city needs to realize that it has the authority to regulate the noise coming from the airport.

No. They don't. It's regulated by the FAA.



The DZ can still hand out the Bumper Stickers and let their Patrons display them.

The DZ could use the stamped bills for change method, but stamp every bill, not just the $2 ones. Every bill with a stamp will start to circulate through the community and then the City will see the DZ's impact on the local economy.

Matt
An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

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From Facebook:

Longmont Airport
FYI: This page is maintained by more than one person. So for those in the "Quiet Skies" group apparently calling for it's admin (and current airport advisory board chairman) Chris Rodriguez to delete it and the main website LongmontAirport.com ... last time we checked...the 1st amendment is still allowed under the law :)

:D:D:D

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Hey Grant,

This is similar to what you were getting at in the thread on swoop ponds. Skydivers are their own worst enemies. Like a little kid that keeps teasing the dog and cries when he gets bit. [:/]

Sparky
My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

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last time we checked...the 1st amendment is still allowed under the law :)



What an idiot. All he is doing is stirring the pot….There is not freedom of speech on the net unless you happen to own the site.

Sparky
My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

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The dropzone sent a nice bumpersticker to the people that have been fighting their very operation. They did not send them feces, enroll them in the sex-toy-of-the-month club, or sign them up for Jehovah's Witnesses to come by and discuss their personal relationship with God.... they sent them little stickers that the person could toss in the trash.

Not exactly what I would call a huge prank or hurtful. And given past experiences with what skydivers are known to do this was a blip on the radar.

I would have sent them all industrial earplugs.....

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Jump more, post less!

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Do you think it was a smart move that would help strengthen their postion? Even if the Council can’t throw them off the airport they are in a postion to make his life miserable.

As a board member I am surprised at you attitude.

Sparky
My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

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what we do over here in Switzerland is try to get the best Airfield/neighbourhood communication and relation possible. Regularly keep them informed on what we do for noise abatement, show them how we regulate ourselves to try and limit flight related disturbance, sometimes also invite them to our parties, and organize a yearly "neighbourhood dinner". Also sometimes try and talk them into coming for a flight in the plane or a tandem jump. Keeps the good relations, they understand better our point of view, even if some have strong political agendas.
scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

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The dropzone sent a nice bumpersticker to the people that have been fighting their very operation. They did not send them feces, enroll them in the sex-toy-of-the-month club, or sign them up for Jehovah's Witnesses to come by and discuss their personal relationship with God.... top



I'm with you on this, however, why give these Yahoos reason to look harder to make our lives miserable. If they want to, they will eventually find a way to shut us down. Better to (as my wife says) "kill them with kindness". :)
Birdshit & Fools Productions

"Son, only two things fall from the sky."

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what we do over here in Switzerland is try to get the best Airfield/neighbourhood communication and relation possible. Regularly keep them informed on what we do for noise abatement, show them how we regulate ourselves to try and limit flight related disturbance, sometimes also invite them to our parties, and organize a yearly "neighbourhood dinner". Also sometimes try and talk them into coming for a flight in the plane or a tandem jump. Keeps the good relations, they understand better our point of view, even if some have strong political agendas.



What a concept. But not nearly as satisfying as pissing in their Wheaties. (sp ?)

Sparky
My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

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http://www.dailycamera.com/...es-over-prank-i-love

Stupid move by Mile high.....




not sure about "Stupid"....... but certainly not real wise..
the last thing you should do , once you've identified a hornets nest....[:/]
is to go over and bang on it with a stick....
:S

that tends to piss OFF the hornets....... ya' Know?????




here is hoping, that the DZ can reach a sensible conclusion , to this issue.

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http://www.dailycamera.com/...es-over-prank-i-love

Stupid move by Mile high.....



Maybe, maybe not.

It certainly exposes the "Quiet Skies" dipsticks as loudmouth whiners who complain about everything -- including getting a bumper sticker in the mail.

I think Frank ought to do a follow-on to the bumper sticker gambit and pull a Rush Limbaugh* on them:

Form a "Quiet Meetings" group dedicated to reducing noise pollution at city council meetings by whining weasels with nothing better to do with their time (and those of others at the meetings) than bitch about businesses that pre-date their residence near-to by years and decades.

44
B|

* Rush Limbaugh created "Rush Babes for America" to counteract the National Organization for Women, and in 48 hours far exceeded the NOW membership rolls. Regardless of your feeling towards the guy and his politics, it was a brilliant move and Frank should see similar results because I think there are far - far - more people in that community who are much more sick of whining weasel noise than they are of airplane noise.
SCR-6933 / SCS-3463 / D-5533 / BASE 44 / CCS-37 / 82d Airborne (Ret.)

"The beginning of wisdom is to first call things by their right names."

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Oops... first one got lost in the ether, so I re-posted... and both showed up.

But as long as I'm here, here's a pic I found on the web of Kim Gibbs. Doesn't do her justice, of course, but not bad.

44
B|
SCR-6933 / SCS-3463 / D-5533 / BASE 44 / CCS-37 / 82d Airborne (Ret.)

"The beginning of wisdom is to first call things by their right names."

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Maybe, maybe not.

It certainly exposes the "Quiet Skies" dipsticks as loudmouth whiners who complain about everything -- including getting a bumper sticker in the mail.



It also shows mile high to be antagonistic. So before when the dorks at quiet skies were saying the plane was buzzing them, I tended to think the dorks at quiet skies were full of it. But now that mile high has shown an antagonistic streak..... I may believe the QS folks a bit about MH's actions being antagonistic.

So, MH has lost some of its deny-ability and QS has gained some believability. None of this might matter in the end, but a poor winner gloating is never a good move.
"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

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Maybe, maybe not.

It certainly exposes the "Quiet Skies" dipsticks as loudmouth whiners who complain about everything -- including getting a bumper sticker in the mail.



It also shows mile high to be antagonistic...



Or just standing up for itself in the face of would-be bullies trying to game the system.

I mean really, think about the responses this generated from the "Quiet" loudmouths:

"The conclusion we come to at this point is that Mile-Hi is very proud of being one of the biggest noise producers in Boulder County." --Quiet Loudmouth Ron Korsch to the Longmont City Council.

"I do think it sends a very clear message to me from Mile-Hi that they are untouchable and that they have the city in their back pocket." -- Chief Quiet Loudmouth Kim Gibbs

Frank got one loudmouth to draw a ridiculously over-the-top and obviously incorrect 'conclusion'" -- and another to publicly insult the city's entire leadership.

Seems to me that he did more good than bad for the DZ and the airport, airport manager Barth's handwringing notwithstanding.

Having said that, neither of us are there on the ground dealing with these dipsticks face-to-face, so we're both just launching liquid into the wind. As the Chinese farmer said, "We'll see."*

44
B|

* A Chinese farmer's son finds a beautiful white stallion and brings it home.

"What a lucky man you are," said his neighbors.

"We'll see," said the farmer.

The next day, the son breaks his leg trying to ride the stallion, thereby depriving his father of his help for the harvest.

"What an unlucky man you are," said his neighbors.

"We'll see," said the farmer.

The next week, the king came through the village on his way to war and conscripted all of the young men except the farmer's son, who had a broken leg.

"What a lucky man you are," said his neighbors.

"We'll see," said the farmer.
SCR-6933 / SCS-3463 / D-5533 / BASE 44 / CCS-37 / 82d Airborne (Ret.)

"The beginning of wisdom is to first call things by their right names."

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http://www.dailycamera.com/...es-over-prank-i-love

Stupid move by Mile high.....



Maybe, maybe not.

It certainly exposes the "Quiet Skies" dipsticks as loudmouth whiners who complain about everything -- including getting a bumper sticker in the mail.

I think Frank ought to do a follow-on to the bumper sticker gambit and pull a Rush Limbaugh* on them:

Form a "Quiet Meetings" group dedicated to reducing noise pollution at city council meetings by whining weasels with nothing better to do with their time (and those of others at the meetings) than bitch about businesses that pre-date their residence near-to by years and decades.

44
B|

* Rush Limbaugh created "Rush Babes for America" to counteract the National Organization for Women, and in 48 hours far exceeded the NOW membership rolls. Regardless of your feeling towards the guy and his politics, it was a brilliant move and Frank should see similar results because I think there are far - far - more people in that community who are much more sick of whining weasel noise than they are of airplane noise.



As a 20-year veteran as on-air talent in the radio business, I can say with a pretty high degree of confidence that your assessment is incorrect. Rush's success is predicated on such moves as an obviously controversial media personality. In that game controversy spurs listenership on both sides of the argument and can't put you out of business as long as there are sponsors waiting for their turn to write checks - which Rush has truckloads of.

In the case of a DZ with pissed off neighbors, stirring controversy has no positive outcome. The whiners will only see the DZ's actions as rubbing the issue in their faces, prompting a predictable reaction. Some folks in town may see that response as whiners just whining louder, but to those who matter - airport board members, city council members and city management - the whiners are citizens of the community who vote.

The primary goal of city officials is to dispose of the issue and hopefully make everyone happy - or at least not angry - in the process, which the DZ's actions are not helping them do. Even if city officials agree with the DZ in this case, they are extremely sensitive to the wishes of the voters, and the squeaky voting wheel gets the municipal grease. Also remember that many if not most of the jumpers live outside the city and don't vote in city elections. ALL the whiners are city residents that vote for city officials.

Rush is in the entertainment business where sponsors can be replaced with others salivating to buy a finite amount of commercial airtime. Mile High is in the skydiving business on a municipal airport managed by people who need to ride the political fence for their own self-preservation.

Two totally different creatures with nearly polar opposite tactics for success.
Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

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http://www.dailycamera.com/...es-over-prank-i-love

Stupid move by Mile high.....



Maybe, maybe not.

It certainly exposes the "Quiet Skies" dipsticks as loudmouth whiners who complain about everything -- including getting a bumper sticker in the mail.

I think Frank ought to do a follow-on to the bumper sticker gambit and pull a Rush Limbaugh* on them:

Form a "Quiet Meetings" group dedicated to reducing noise pollution at city council meetings by whining weasels with nothing better to do with their time (and those of others at the meetings) than bitch about businesses that pre-date their residence near-to by years and decades.

44
B|

* Rush Limbaugh created "Rush Babes for America" to counteract the National Organization for Women, and in 48 hours far exceeded the NOW membership rolls. Regardless of your feeling towards the guy and his politics, it was a brilliant move and Frank should see similar results because I think there are far - far - more people in that community who are much more sick of whining weasel noise than they are of airplane noise.



As a 20-year veteran as on-air talent in the radio business, I can say with a pretty high degree of confidence that your assessment is incorrect. Rush's success is predicated on such moves as an obviously controversial media personality. In that game controversy spurs listenership on both sides of the argument and can't put you out of business as long as there are sponsors waiting for their turn to write checks - which Rush has truckloads of.

In the case of a DZ with pissed off neighbors, stirring controversy has no positive outcome. The whiners will only see the DZ's actions as rubbing the issue in their faces, prompting a predictable reaction. Some folks in town may see that response as whiners just whining louder, but to those who matter - airport board members, city council members and city management - the whiners are citizens of the community who vote.

The primary goal of city officials is to dispose of the issue and hopefully make everyone happy - or at least not angry - in the process, which the DZ's actions are not helping them do. Even if city officials agree with the DZ in this case, they are extremely sensitive to the wishes of the voters, and the squeaky voting wheel gets the municipal grease. Also remember that many if not most of the jumpers live outside the city and don't vote in city elections. ALL the whiners are city residents that vote for city officials.

Rush is in the entertainment business where sponsors can be replaced with others salivating to buy a finite amount of commercial airtime. Mile High is in the skydiving business on a municipal airport managed by people who need to ride the political fence for their own self-preservation.

Two totally different creatures with nearly polar opposite tactics for success.



LOL... that's why I prefaced my response to "stupid move by Mile high....." by saying "Maybe, maybe not."

Can't quibble with a thing you said and after briefly pondering what you said, I still won't say the Mile-Hi move was stupid, but you make a very sound argument indeed that they should have just let lying dogs sleep.

Thanks for the insight.

44
B|
SCR-6933 / SCS-3463 / D-5533 / BASE 44 / CCS-37 / 82d Airborne (Ret.)

"The beginning of wisdom is to first call things by their right names."

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